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scubasteve04
16-03-2012, 04:59
Here is my new 2500pts Tzeentch list. Tried the hordes of 50 GW Marauders, and not too crazy about them. Already played a horde army and I want to keep my list as elite as possible.


Lords
Daemon Prince, Level 4 MoT, Tendrils of Tzeentch- 535pts

Heroes
Exalted Hero, BSB, MoT, Shield, Dragonbane Helm, Sword of Strife- 200pts

Core
23 Chaos Warriors, MoT, FC, Flaming Banner- 428pts <-----BSB Here
24 Chaos Warriors, MoT, War Banner, Musician- 457pts
5 Chaos Warhounds- 30pts
5 Chaos Warhounds- 30pts

Special
10 Knights, MoT, Banner of Rage, Musician- 485pts

Rare
Hellcannon- 205pts
Chaos Spawn, MoT- 65pts
Chaos Spawn, MoT- 65pts

Morax
16-03-2012, 18:41
How sold are you on the deamon prince? In a list with a double hellcannon and a doom totem I always suggest going with a death wizard lord for doom and darkness. A total -5 to panic checks can wreck any unit's day, even when using the general's leadership and BSB reroll. Add in that these two are often next to each other in the same unit, you can panic that unit first and the second hellcannon doesn't need the doom and darkness as your opponent's units don't have a general or BSB to rely on anymore. This would free up a sizable amount of points for you to make a unit of chaos warriors into an anvil unit, unit size 23-24 or so for 5 ranks with the BSB and/or sorcerer lord, and a blender unit armed with halberds, 6x3 works for that.

scubasteve04
17-03-2012, 03:43
Don't think I wanna do the doom totem+dual hellcannon, so I edited the list a bit.

Sexiest_hero
17-03-2012, 04:06
This list looks cool and fun.

Galley
17-03-2012, 15:25
Chaos Spawn are worse than "Not great but fun" units - they're just plain unreliable and terrible. I'd cut them, and also change your daemon prince to a cheaper, more effective Sorcerer Lord and give your BSB some weapons instead of mediocre casting skill with the book.

scubasteve04
17-03-2012, 21:43
Replacing the spawns with warhounds to squeeze in a puppet caddy. Daemon Prince is one of the models I want to use no matter what the effectiveness so it stays.



Lords
Daemon Prince, Level 4 MoT, Tendrils of Tzeentch- 535pts

Heroes
Exalted Hero, BSB, MoT, Talisman of Preservation, Halberd- 194pts
Sorcerer, Level 1 MoT, Charmed Shield, Infernal Puppet- 145pts

Core
23 Warriors, MoT, Shields, FC, Flaming Banner- 428pts
23 Warriors, MoT, Shields, FC- 418pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts

Special
10 Knights, MoT, Banner of Rage, Musician- 485pts

Rare
Hellcannon- 205pts

Morax
19-03-2012, 14:48
You currently have 2 anvils, one hammer and some chaff supported by a sorcerer lord and a warmachine. Not a bad set up for an army low on elite units, but you are playing WoC. I'd swap an anvil for a hammer and take a blender unit of warriors. Keeping within the theme would be fine as MoT warriors with halberds don't preform quite as well as MoK warriors with halberds but ehh, who cares. A unit of 18 should be enough for that formed up 6x3. Id take the extra points saved and give the puppet caddy a second level and the third eye of tzeentch. +3 to cast one of your opponent's wizard's spells can be game changing as most often they will include a wizard lord.

scubasteve04
20-03-2012, 01:54
Meh, Daemon Prince is out the window. My displeasure with its rules has now far outweighed my love for the model and fluff so he is gone. Paltry toughness and wounds and total lack of armor save is not enough for a 500+ all-your-eggs-in-one-basket model. Replacing with disc lord. Also adding spawns to soak up some ranged fire and tackle hard to charge units like fast cav.

As far as hammers go, I played Empire, so to me WS 5 2A Str 4 is a hammer unit in my eyes. With the 3+/5++ they may not break units on the charge, but they can sure grind. 18 Tiz shield warriors hitting one of my 50 halberdier unit is a death sentence for the halberdiers (even if it takes 4+ rounds of combat). I guess I need to play WoC more to motivate myself to get some materials to convert the unit into Halberds (how do you do this anyway?)

Lords
Sorcerer Lord, Level 4 MoT, Disc, Charmed Shield, Talisman of Preservation, Infernal Puppet, Bloodcurtling Roar- 415pts

Heroes
Exalted Hero, MoT, BSB, Doom Totem, Shield- 225pts

Core
23 Warriors, MoT, Shields, FC, Rapterous Standard- 438pts
18 Warriors, MoT, Shields, Flaming Banner, Musician- 336pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts


Special
10 Knights, MoT, Banner of Rage Musician- 485pts

Rare
Hellcannon- 205pts
Hellcannon- 205pts
Chaos Spawn, MoT- 65pts
Chaos Spawn, MoT- 65pts

GodlessM
20-03-2012, 02:16
Spawns are the only weak links here, though they aren't expensive enough for the overall army to suffer too much. Sorcerer Lordcould do with some retooling however, namely a ward save and Third Eye (both self-explanatory).

scubasteve04
20-03-2012, 03:02
It was a typo, he had a 3+ ward worked into his points.

As for the spawns, what alternatives are out there? For a pure close combat army, it seems to be pretty problematic to take on tricky armies like shade heavy DE or wood elves. I played Malorians wood elves today, and I didn't roll a single close combat attack the entire game. It was pretty much my 2 hellcannons and the Daemon Princes magic that could score points. Need that random movement T5 unbreakable unit to pin down the fast movers so my warriors can actually make it into combat with anything mobile. With the disc lord and 2 spawns on the field, that's statistically 267 BS4 shots to neutralist all three threats before even starting on the hellcannons.

What are the alternatives? For my Empire it was just castle up and go to town with warmachines and magic.

Dreadlordpaul
20-03-2012, 08:04
2 things come to mind MARAUDER HORSEMEN AND EXALTEDS ON STEEDS OF SLAANESH

Darnok
20-03-2012, 09:04
I guess I need to play WoC more to motivate myself to get some materials to convert the unit into Halberds (how do you do this anyway?)


GW does a WoC halberd bitz pack (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440124a&prodId=prod1570033).


2 things come to mind MARAUDER HORSEMEN AND EXALTEDS ON STEEDS OF SLAANESH

And these are fitting with the theme of this army... how exactly? I also fail to see what those units add in the tactcs department.

Dreadlordpaul
20-03-2012, 09:06
they enable him to play the wood elves at their own game plus disc heroes could do the same as the slaanesh exalteds

BigbyWolf
20-03-2012, 09:59
they enable him to play the wood elves at their own game plus disc heroes could do the same as the slaanesh exalteds

I'd have to agree with Darnok- Slaaneshi-marked characters and marauder cav don't really follow the theme of an elite Tzeentch army.

OP- Lookin at your list, I'd consider trying to squeeze a further disk-monted character in there for games against Woodies, gives you a bit more flexibility, even if it is just a Lev 2 mage or an Exalted with a cheap magic weapon.

scubasteve04
20-03-2012, 17:26
Just dropping the spawns for more warriors. Worried about model count with no Marauders, so beefing up the flaming unit to 24. Magic and the hellcannons and the Knights alone should carry me through a fight against a WE or similar army I hope.

Nice thing I learned if you deploy the hellcannons forward, if they botch a rampage LD check they should catch a unit with their 3D6 random movement charge.


Lords
Sorcerer Lord, Level 4 MoT, Disc, Biting Blade, Enchanted Shield, Talisman of Preservation, Infernal Puppet, - 410pts

Heroes
Exalted Hero, MoT, BSB, Doom Totem, Shield- 225pts

Core
23 Warriors, MoT, Shields, FC, Flaming Banner- 428pts
24 Warriors, MoT, Shields, War Banner, Musician- 447pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts
5 Warhounds- 30pts


Special
10 Knights, MoT, Blasted Standard, Musician- 490pts

Rare
Hellcannon- 205pts
Hellcannon- 205pts

Morax
21-03-2012, 13:24
If you are already taking double cannons, a doom totem and a wizard, that wizard should have lore of death or shadow. It would make it a pretty standard double cannon list but that is the standard for a reason, it works. Shadow works for Miasma to slow fast units down so the cannons have more time to fire and death works with doom and darkness for extra leadership reducing. Lore of Tzeentch can proxy a bit with pandemonium but it is not as effective as doom and darkness as the unit housing the general and bsb still get to use those buffs with pandemonium. If you were to take that route you would drop the MoT, Disc, and the Roar and take more hounds to replace them. It would give you more drops and more chaff to better control your opponents movement phase.