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William The Conqueror
30-03-2012, 12:57
I'm making my own space marine chapter, but need help picking a symbol and name for them. The idea I've had for a symbol so far is a pair of cross keys. The little M shape on the end is a kind of homage to the University I'm attending, and I really like how easily it is to throw roman numerals, little skulls, and what-not around it for what ever reason you might want to, and it still looks decent. however, the catholic church's symbol is also a pair of crossed keys, and I don't want to get into a debate everytime I try to play. Do you think that would be an issue? also, what kind of name could I give them. I was thinking if I went with the keys design, possibly something like "the gate keepers," but whenever I hear that I think of ghost busters...

I'd appreciate any ideas you have that you think could help

Bubble Ghost
30-03-2012, 14:12
If any of your opponents moan about misuse of Catholic imagery, they really haven't thought through the game they're playing - the whole of 40K's background is basically the Catholic church in space. I wouldn't have thought many of the believers who do play this game are likely to be ones who'd have a problem with your borrowing a fairly generic symbol. I definitely don't think it's crossing any sort of line, anyway, and if you ever did run into a problem with it, the offended party would be the one who was being unreasonable, not you. I wouldn't worry about that.

As far as names go, keys can be metaphors for all sorts of things, you can go outside the box with it a bit rather than referring literally to something to do with locks or keys. Gatekeepers is pretty meaty and pompous-sounding though, and that's what you want in a chapter name (and I wouldn't worry about the Ghostbusters thing, the word is much broader than that - it might occur to people, but no one's going to think it's too 'Ghostbustersy' to be a chapter name). It could be for some reason as literal as their homeworld guarding a particularly treacherous or important passage of space, or it could be something more symbolic - maybe they're rabidly anti-psyker or anti-Chaos or something and see themselves as the 'gatekeepers' of the soul. Or you could have them all mysterious and arcane, guarding the 'gate' to the knowledge they felt was too dangerous for others. You get the idea.

Konovalev
30-03-2012, 14:38
I'd be surprised if many people would recognize the keys as St. Peters keys in Catholic symbology so I wouldn't worry about that. Besides, as said above keys are fairly generic symbols in their own right.

Expanding on the "gatekeeper" name idea, what about something like "Guardians of Eternity"? Consider also being a little more abstract with the key idea, so you're not just limited to gates, doors, chests, locks etc. But the purpose of such things: guard, guardian, keeper, protector. or what might be in/beyond whatever the keys unlock: knowledge, power and so on.

Have fun painting crossed keys on anything smaller than a banner though... maybe paint locks on marine shoulders/vehicles to tie into it?

Charistoph
31-03-2012, 06:27
What does the "M" on the key signify, if we may ask? That may help narrow things down for a name as well.

If you don't mind getting a little "toony" you could model one of the keys like Kingdom Hearts keyblades, or reverse that and use crossed chainswords with the "M" on the handles.

Depending on your stylistic preference, you could then either go Crusader with the Black Templar tabard or Monk with the Dark Angel robes to keep up with some of the older Catholic themes as well (or heck, use both!).

Aliarzathanil
01-04-2012, 07:34
Rift Wardens
Iron Castellons
Oathsworn Brothers

William The Conqueror
02-04-2012, 13:37
Sorry for not responding, was very busy this weekend. I definitely think being more abstract with the name could help. I guess it's probably a matter of keeping the name meaty and pompous sounding, as bubblr ghost said, to keep the cool factor, but also making it distinct enough that it can convey some kind of story.

I know it would be really tought to paint on the mini's, especially with my butter fingers. I was actually planning on getting some transfer paper and making my own decals to apply.

As for the M's on the keys, they are kind of distorted Block-M's. It's an homage to the university of Michigan, where I'm going to school.

actually, considering that the M represents my university, maybe I should base my fluff around the collection or protection of knowledge?

William The Conqueror
02-04-2012, 21:01
What does the "M" on the key signify, if we may ask? That may help narrow things down for a name as well.

The M's are distorted block M's. Block M's are the symbol or logo for the University of Michigan, Where I'm going to school. as far as game fluff, it has no meaning. yet.

Paul 8v
03-04-2012, 19:42
The logo looks good but as above it'll be a real pain to paint. Maybe somewhere will be able to make transfers. The ghost buster thing never popped into my head until you mentioned it so I wouldn't worry about that.

Charistoph
04-04-2012, 00:36
Apparently the word Michigan means large water after going through a couple languages. The mascot for the school is the wolverine. Combining all that with a key concept could be interesting.

Any thoughts on a color scheme? Stick with the schools colors, or branch out?

As for the fluff, going with knowledge seekers is good, and keys were often associated with those who secured the forbidden. Could also make them fleet-based and/or obsessed with vehicles (Detroit tie-in).

S_A_T_S
04-04-2012, 01:18
Love the logo, very cool. I'd keep the references to real places really subtle - it feels less imaginative and a bit lazy, also makes it harder for the reader to get into/believe the story if they are thinking of some present day town.

Gatekeeper/protector of knowledge idea is also great, makes me think Knights Templar/Eldar Harlequins, which are both very cool and secretive. Can't wait to see a plog!

Paul 8v
04-04-2012, 12:16
How about having a special chapter specific vehicle called the wolverine to tie in with the Michigan thing?

Paul 8v
04-04-2012, 12:20
Before anyone says, I know there's a real one called the wolverine but I can't see William making much use of a mobile space marine bridge...

Arthanor
04-04-2012, 14:58
How about something like: the "Gate Smashers" or the "Gate Breakers", depending on whether you want violent marines (smashers) or tactical ones (breakers). Your chapter are the keys, they are the ones who open up Xeno/Heretic defenses.

Daniel36
04-04-2012, 15:27
You could create a very intriguing background story with such a logo and basic idea. It all feels a bit Templarish, a bit Dan Brownish.
I would go for a successor chapter to the Dark Angels, perhaps tie your story with theirs in some way. After all, they also have some pretty dark secrets right there, perhaps one of those secrets is guarded by your chapter?

William The Conqueror
05-04-2012, 01:03
I love all these ideas. I especially like the idea of a Dark Angels successor chapter. If I do decide to go with the whole "protection of knowledge" thing, this would probably be the best fit.

And, as weird as it sounds (especially with the Michigan M in the logo), I was thinking of painting my marines in a green and white color scheme simply because I really like the scheme I came up with, and I refuse to let my hatred of little brother sully my love of the color green. (though it does feel very heretical and blasphemous. #^$* state!).

as for army type, I plan on using large amount of infantry with cc weapons and bolt pistols (power sword bits, used as cc weps) all in rhinos with terminators to deep strike in. very "in your face," I think. so, maybe I'll use the templars codex, to fit the fight style, and incorporate some aspects of the black templars, but make the chapter a successor of the Dark angels in terms of fluff.

Possible color scheme below. Think using michigan state's colors might make too little sense?

Charistoph
05-04-2012, 03:23
Looks good. As a warning, a good white can be difficult to pull off, good luck!

Are you planning on something with the aguila on the chest? You may want to continue the green there, but it's your army.

Grimdesign
05-04-2012, 05:25
I love all these ideas. I especially like the idea of a Dark Angels successor chapter. If I do decide to go with the whole "protection of knowledge" thing, this would probably be the best fit.

And, as weird as it sounds (especially with the Michigan M in the logo), I was thinking of painting my marines in a green and white color scheme simply because I really like the scheme I came up with, and I refuse to let my hatred of little brother sully my love of the color green. (though it does feel very heretical and blasphemous. #^$* state!).

as for army type, I plan on using large amount of infantry with cc weapons and bolt pistols (power sword bits, used as cc weps) all in rhinos with terminators to deep strike in. very "in your face," I think. so, maybe I'll use the templars codex, to fit the fight style, and incorporate some aspects of the black templars, but make the chapter a successor of the Dark angels in terms of fluff.

Possible color scheme below. Think using michigan state's colors might make too little sense?


Seeing as how you like the protectors angle, you could go with the following:

Warden (they guard the guilty, or guard xyz)
vindicator (avenger/protector of xyz)
guardian (self explanatory)
sentinel (keeper, protector)
Cerberus (guardian of Hades, the underworld)
Praetorian (were the corrupted protectors of Rome)
Shepard (watches the flock)
guard (self explanatory)
Deacon (conceals truth, knowledge)

of course you have to add either a prefix or a suffix to really make it distinct. The first choice is often a color (grey knights) or you can add something flavorful like a mood or emotion or a planet etc etc.
Green (Green Guardian sounds very DC, Marvel to me)
Grim (Grim Wardens, The Vindicators Grim, The Grim Shepards, Etc)
Emerald (Emerald guard, Emerald Deacons, etc)
savage (Savage Guard, The Deacons Savage)

that's all I have at the moment.

Paul 8v
05-04-2012, 12:17
How about something like: the "Gate Smashers" or the "Gate Breakers", depending on whether you want violent marines (smashers) or tactical ones (breakers). Your chapter are the keys, they are the ones who open up Xeno/Heretic defenses.

Gate Smashers sounds a bit too Keith Lemon...

The colours look good, I've used the new shades or washes or whatever you want to call them and they work really well with white so it might be worth having a look into them

terradax
05-04-2012, 12:46
Haven't had time to read all the posts, so I might be stealing someones ideas :P
Really liked the "Gatekeepers" name, and maybe they could be a crusading force without a homeplanet, and their main base of operation is the Cadian Gate (see what I did there?).
Of course, for your Chapter Master, captains and maybe even sergeants you should get a lot of small keys. There are several in the Empire flagellant set.
You could even go as far as sculpting a key sword for your captain like this one (http://www.google.no/imgres?um=1&hl=no&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:nb-NO:official&channel=s&biw=1920&bih=977&tbm=isch&tbnid=KBUn7s-dJ9XmsM:&imgrefurl=http://www.freewebs.com/norstar1/animeswords.htm&docid=-CBKQxx8E5e8iM&imgurl=http://webzoom.freewebs.com/norstar1/SW-110a.jpg&w=400&h=300&ei=hJN9T_izOMKL4gTF2NzxDA&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=364&vpy=165&dur=359&hovh=149&hovw=199&tx=165&ty=75&sig=113017091725321450720&page=1&tbnh=149&tbnw=199&start=0&ndsp=49&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0,i:65).
Good luck to you!

William The Conqueror
05-04-2012, 13:25
Haven't had time to read all the posts, so I might be stealing someones ideas :P
Really liked the "Gatekeepers" name, and maybe they could be a crusading force without a homeplanet, and their main base of operation is the Cadian Gate (see what I did there?).
Of course, for your Chapter Master, captains and maybe even sergeants you should get a lot of small keys. There are several in the Empire flagellant set.
You could even go as far as sculpting a key sword for your captain like this one (http://www.google.no/imgres?um=1&hl=no&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:nb-NO:official&channel=s&biw=1920&bih=977&tbm=isch&tbnid=KBUn7s-dJ9XmsM:&imgrefurl=http://www.freewebs.com/norstar1/animeswords.htm&docid=-CBKQxx8E5e8iM&imgurl=http://webzoom.freewebs.com/norstar1/SW-110a.jpg&w=400&h=300&ei=hJN9T_izOMKL4gTF2NzxDA&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=364&vpy=165&dur=359&hovh=149&hovw=199&tx=165&ty=75&sig=113017091725321450720&page=1&tbnh=149&tbnw=199&start=0&ndsp=49&ved=1t:429,r:1,s:0,i:65).

Good luck to you!


Really like the idea of adding small keys all around, that could really help to tie everything together. unfortunately I'm not so good with greenstuff yet, so a key-sword might have to wait a little while.

William The Conqueror
05-04-2012, 13:36
Gate Smashers sounds a bit too Keith Lemon...

The colours look good, I've used the new shades or washes or whatever you want to call them and they work really well with white so it might be worth having a look into them

Yeah, I tried using their old washes but it never came out quite right on white. always made it too grey looking and left that film. Eventually I resorted to just going over the repainting the flat surfaces white after applying a wash, but it takes so much effort. Maybe their nuln oil shade will work a little better.

Of course, I'm new to all this, so I could just be using the shades/washes wrong. how do you apply it on white?

Dr.Clock
05-04-2012, 14:09
I say stick with Gate Keepers. It rolls off the tongue well and is descriptive without being overly specific. When you start over thinking just for the sake of sounding erudite, you can easily end up with a bit of a silly name. I think it's best to think of names heraldically, that is, where you have to convey alot of information in a very small space, using symbolism more than outright description. For this reason, Gate Keepers has a great ring to it... everyone knows exactly what you mean.

From a pronunciation standpoint, you've got one syllable followed by two, so it comes off as Da-Dade... this puts you in the company of the Dark Angels, World Eaters, Black Templars, Black Consuls, Black Dragons, Blood Angels, Blood Ravens, Flesh Tearers... etc.

Symbol is great. Go with it.

Colour scheme is likewise good. I'd still advise a metallic to go along with the green and white, though, just to keep visual interest and to breakup some of that white. I'd suggest either boltgun metal or dwarf bronze on the exhausts (put green on the top backpack panel above the head?), aquila, unarmoured inside joints, and of course the mouth grille. It also might be nice, although a little more time intensive, to swap colours on the kneepads and elbows, just to avoid making the model seem overly segmented (green knees, white elbows. All in all, I'm sure you'll work it out.

Cheers,

The Good Doctor.

Paul 8v
05-04-2012, 15:07
Yeah, I tried using their old washes but it never came out quite right on white. always made it too grey looking and left that film. Eventually I resorted to just going over the repainting the flat surfaces white after applying a wash, but it takes so much effort. Maybe their nuln oil shade will work a little better.

Of course, I'm new to all this, so I could just be using the shades/washes wrong. how do you apply it on white?

The one I used was a green shade over a white basecoat on a high elf, litterally just put it on the shield and it ran into all the detail leaving a green tinge, it looked really good. I'm not sure what the staff at Games workshop are like in your neck of the woods but where I am they'll hapilly give you a tutorial on how to use it, just ask next time you're in store (NEw paints are out here on Saturday, not sure when you'll get them)

William The Conqueror
05-04-2012, 15:20
The one I used was a green shade over a white basecoat on a high elf, litterally just put it on the shield and it ran into all the detail leaving a green tinge, it looked really good. I'm not sure what the staff at Games workshop are like in your neck of the woods but where I am they'll hapilly give you a tutorial on how to use it, just ask next time you're in store (NEw paints are out here on Saturday, not sure when you'll get them)

No games workshop in michigan as far as I know. I know of a local games shop that mostly deals in 40k and warhammer, but no demos or anything. If I want the new shades Ill probably have to order from the website and pray they work well. Did the white get kind of a greenish hue though? or did all the pigment work its way into the detail?

William The Conqueror
05-04-2012, 15:24
I say stick with Gate Keepers. It rolls off the tongue well and is descriptive without being overly specific. When you start over thinking just for the sake of sounding erudite, you can easily end up with a bit of a silly name. I think it's best to think of names heraldically, that is, where you have to convey alot of information in a very small space, using symbolism more than outright description. For this reason, Gate Keepers has a great ring to it... everyone knows exactly what you mean.

From a pronunciation standpoint, you've got one syllable followed by two, so it comes off as Da-Dade... this puts you in the company of the Dark Angels, World Eaters, Black Templars, Black Consuls, Black Dragons, Blood Angels, Blood Ravens, Flesh Tearers... etc.

Symbol is great. Go with it.

Colour scheme is likewise good. I'd still advise a metallic to go along with the green and white, though, just to keep visual interest and to breakup some of that white. I'd suggest either boltgun metal or dwarf bronze on the exhausts (put green on the top backpack panel above the head?), aquila, unarmoured inside joints, and of course the mouth grille. It also might be nice, although a little more time intensive, to swap colours on the kneepads and elbows, just to avoid making the model seem overly segmented (green knees, white elbows. All in all, I'm sure you'll work it out.

Cheers,

The Good Doctor.

on some of the test models I painted the the aquilas silver or gold metalic, but It just didn't work, I think it drew too much attention to the center of the mini. what I'm trying now is dry brushing a little silver over the soft armor, to give it a slightly worn mechanical look. but I do like your idea of alternation knee/elbow pads. Perhaps I could used different elbow/knee pad colors or segmentation as a way to distinguish between different squads?

Paul 8v
05-04-2012, 19:43
No games workshop in michigan as far as I know. I know of a local games shop that mostly deals in 40k and warhammer, but no demos or anything. If I want the new shades Ill probably have to order from the website and pray they work well. Did the white get kind of a greenish hue though? or did all the pigment work its way into the detail?

The one I used worked it's way in nicely. It hink the trick is to paint it where you want the shade to be rather than over the whole model. To be honest I'm not the worlds greatest painter, there's probably some guys that can advise better than me. i think the idea behind the new paints is it's an easier system to use if you're a novice, they've got colour systems that work well together so there will be a set of complimentry paints to do white as far as I can work out

Paul 8v
05-04-2012, 19:47
No games workshop in michigan as far as I know. I know of a local games shop that mostly deals in 40k and warhammer, but no demos or anything. If I want the new shades Ill probably have to order from the website and pray they work well. Did the white get kind of a greenish hue though? or did all the pigment work its way into the detail?<br><br>The one I used worked it's way in nicely I think the trick is to paint it where you want the shade to be rather than over the whole model. To be honest I'm not the worlds greatest painter, there's probably some guys that can advise better than me. I think the idea behind the new paints is it's an easier system to use if you're a novice, they've got colour systems that work well together so there will be a set of complimentry paints to do white as far as I can work out

Brother Muninn
06-04-2012, 09:29
Two things:
1: I kid you not, as soon as I read about the symbol you chose I thought "Gate Keepers"
2: I'm Catholic, and I'm not familiar with the crossed keys motif, so I wouldn't be too worried about it. (I do however associate crossed keys with Navy Storekeepers (http://www.medalsofamerica.com/ItemImages/Large/sk3.jpg))

As for the color, I like the green & white, although I'm fond of the Spartans myself (sorry). I can see why you might be hesitant to up the UM colors though since blue is done to death and Yellow is tough. Although if GW is to be believed, the new Yellow glaze could be an easy application over a white primer.

The only game store I know is in Lansing too (21st Century games), so that's probably of no help to you, but the website says there's a Games Workshop store in Hampton Village about 40 miles to your NE.

~Muninn

Daniel36
06-04-2012, 10:07
I will just go ahead and put in another "aye" for Gate Keepers (if you haven't already decided on it). I am glad you liked the idea of the Dark Angels tie. I think it would work well, and seeing as you incorporate green in your army, it makes for an even better fit.

And I bet there is a gate somewhere to a dimension or planet or whatever that the Dark Angels, nor anyone else, want opened, so there you have it, Gate Keepers. Who are your regular opponents? If it's Daemons and Chaos Marines, you have your setting right there as well. Plus, imagine the possibilities for scenery building, if you want a themed board.

And as far as keys go in terms of modeling, ask around if people have some Flagellant key bits left. They have the PERFECT key for it, especially for flat surfaces, though I am sure with a bit of work you could bend them as well.

William The Conqueror
06-04-2012, 10:37
Two things:
1: I kid you not, as soon as I read about the symbol you chose I thought "Gate Keepers"
2: I'm Catholic, and I'm not familiar with the crossed keys motif, so I wouldn't be too worried about it. (I do however associate crossed keys with Navy Storekeepers (http://www.medalsofamerica.com/ItemImages/Large/sk3.jpg))

As for the color, I like the green & white, although I'm fond of the Spartans myself (sorry). I can see why you might be hesitant to up the UM colors though since blue is done to death and Yellow is tough. Although if GW is to be believed, the new Yellow glaze could be an easy application over a white primer.

Yeah, hampton village is actually more like 1:15-1:30 away depending on how traffic is, and that's just too far out of the way for some painting demos. It'd be easier to just try and learn on the fly.
The only game store I know is in Lansing too (21st Century games), so that's probably of no help to you, but the website says there's a Games Workshop store in Hampton Village about 40 miles to your NE.

~Muninn

Yeah, I feel like anything painted in maize and blue would be a little too close to ultramarines for comfort. Being original is the point of making a chapter, and the ultramarines are kind of the antithesis of original, so yeah, blue is completely overused.


I will just go ahead and put in another "aye" for Gate Keepers (if you haven't already decided on it). I am glad you liked the idea of the Dark Angels tie. I think it would work well, and seeing as you incorporate green in your army, it makes for an even better fit.

And I bet there is a gate somewhere to a dimension or planet or whatever that the Dark Angels, nor anyone else, want opened, so there you have it, Gate Keepers. Who are your regular opponents? If it's Daemons and Chaos Marines, you have your setting right there as well. Plus, imagine the possibilities for scenery building, if you want a themed board.

And as far as keys go in terms of modeling, ask around if people have some Flagellant key bits left. They have the PERFECT key for it, especially for flat surfaces, though I am sure with a bit of work you could bend them as well.

Yeah, I think I'm probably gonna go with Gate keepers. Most people seem to think it works, and it was the first idea that came to me (and apparently to Muninn also, haha) so that's gotta be worth something.

Also, I'm planning on ordering a bunch of those keys from thewarstore.com. I was thinking that on a commander, rather than adding those roman looking leather strips around the should pad, I could have a bunch of keys/chain hanging there. I think it'd be really cool looking and not too hard to do either. what do you think?

Daniel36
06-04-2012, 15:24
I think it would work easily. So you are going to order the key bitz online, right? No Empire players in your area? I think you get quite a couple in each Flagelant set and most people will have bought at least four sets for a regiment. But I suppose ordering them online takes the hassle of hoping for it away. Good luck. Do show us pics when you have some ready.

William The Conqueror
06-04-2012, 16:57
I think it would work easily. So you are going to order the key bitz online, right? No Empire players in your area? I think you get quite a couple in each Flagelant set and most people will have bought at least four sets for a regiment. But I suppose ordering them online takes the hassle of hoping for it away. Good luck. Do show us pics when you have some ready.

Not a lot of anything players in my area. besides, for $1 per key (plus 7 or 8 other flaggalent bits) I wouldn't mind ordering them, atleast for the chapter master. you I definitely will, maybe Ill start a project log, not sure though, I'm absolutely new to minis and I think my painting is kind of rough.

William The Conqueror
07-04-2012, 00:15
What I've got so far:

Name: I'm going to stick with "gate keepers." The consensus seems to be that the name fits. People have said that it fits the symbol well, Is vague enough for a good story to be attached to it without being overly descriptive, and that It has that "meaty and pompous" quality that chapter names should have.

Symbol: I'm going to stick with the symbol as well. Every seems to like it, plus it's not something you really see with a ton of space marines, as opposed to say... fists, so It seems fairly original, atleast for a chapter symbol.

Paint scheme: the first person I play who mentions MSU is gonna get a complimentary can of whoopass... probably not, but I am going with the green and white. It's simple enough that it should be fairly easy to paint, but I am going to have to practice my painting, white armor is being a paint in the ass.


Chapter origin: Dark angels successor

Now, there are still a few things I need to decide on. The first, is the way in which I should distinguish between squads. I was thinking, It could be cool to incorporate roman numerals into the chapter emblem on the left shoulder pad (Examples below). I know a lot of people go with knee pads, but I'm not sure that would work well with the paint scheme, and I also think the logo really lends itself to this kind of thing. what do you all think?

Also, I'm not sure about what kind of fluff to add to my army. I'm definitely leaning towards the idea of protecting something, perhaps an area of space or some kind of forbidden or dangerous knowledge, but I'm not sure exactly what.

Dr.Clock
07-04-2012, 05:29
If they are Unforgiven (DA successors) then of course they'll be protecting the knowledge of the Fallen.

I do like the idea of them protecting a certain stable region of space from incursions, either from the Eye or other enemy region.

There was a lot of emphasis on the area around the remains of Caliban during the 13th Black Crusade as I remember. You could have your chapter guarding a region between the eye and Caliban, ostensibly on sentry duty hunting the Fallen that come out through small stable warp tunnels.

In sum, with the DA background, you can easily do BOTH.

Cheers,

The Good Doctor.

lantzkev
07-04-2012, 05:55
Defenders of terra guarding the "gate to the warp" that is the emperor?
or maybe galactic space wardens =p

Keys should actually be easy enough to find I'd imagine...

not sure why this reminded me of it, but the scene in dune where they have plugs to their hearts... like they all have keys to each others geneseed or something strange like that, armor housing the geneseed or something with a lock on it..., or in the chest etc (ala grey knight terminators, but rather than a book, whatever you wanted)

KtL
08-04-2012, 00:09
Ok given the Dark Angels succession and the key symbol, you could go with something pertaining to the Roman god Janus. Janus was associated with doorways and beginnings and often also associated with duplicity (he was pictured with 2 faces) which would fit in rather well with the Dark Angels.

Reivax26
08-04-2012, 05:24
I agree with everything so far. The name is cool, the color scheme works although like a few other people mentioned a good white is hard to pull off. Being a successor of the Dark Angels would make sense given the colors and the overall theme of the army. I am wondering who your Chapter Master will be? Are you going to theme them after the Dark Angels and use the Space Marine Codex or are you going to use the Dark Angels Codex all around? A version of Deathwing with a bunch of Storm Shields would definetly tie in with the "Gatekeeper" theme. Also if you use the Space Marine Codex you could always model the commander after Lysander.

William The Conqueror
08-04-2012, 15:08
I agree with everything so far. The name is cool, the color scheme works although like a few other people mentioned a good white is hard to pull off. Being a successor of the Dark Angels would make sense given the colors and the overall theme of the army. I am wondering who your Chapter Master will be? Are you going to theme them after the Dark Angels and use the Space Marine Codex or are you going to use the Dark Angels Codex all around? A version of Deathwing with a bunch of Storm Shields would definetly tie in with the "Gatekeeper" theme. Also if you use the Space Marine Codex you could always model the commander after Lysander.

I'm actually Basing my army off what I saw on the cover of the Dark angels codex, Lots and Lots of dudes waving swords around, but using the black templars codex because I feel it is more geared towards the idea of giving a bunch of dudes melee weapons and charging. I'm also magnetizing my entire army, so I can also re equip all my marines if I want, so that strategy is not permanent. I haven't really thought about a chapter master yet. Honestly, I'm completely new to this whole game and am not really sure what will work or not work when it gets to actually playing, so right now I'm just focusing on trying to make an army I'd like to have more than an army that might win a lot. I was thinking of maybe giving my chapter master a chaplains skull mask, that way I can use them as my chapter master, or as a chaplain, depending on what I feel like doing. Can chaplains become chapter masters? Is that possible given the 40k fluff?

And you're right, white is a big pain. So far I've found that it's easier to fill in shadows by going over those areas with a light grey, rather than trying to use washes, but it's still not as quality as I'd like. At this point I have neither the number of paints, nor the skill to paint a model I'd be happy with, but luckily summer is only a week or two away and I'll have the time to work on it.

unfortunately though, I might have to strip the paint from the models I have made at some point so I can redo them. I'll post a photo of one that I've done soon.

Charistoph
08-04-2012, 17:52
It is not standard procedure for Chaplains to become Captains or Chapter Masters. BUT, with 1000 chapters deployed, there's odds that at least one follows that procedure. After all there's an official home grown chapter that allows Psykers to be promoted to that role, so why not the more reliable Chaplains.

Black Templar and Dark Angels are currently the only codecies that allow for a 3 wound Chaplain, so that part can easily match up. Just remember that the BT codex doesn't provide for Librarians, and larger forces must deploy the Champion (in your case, I'd call him either the Keymaster or Lion's Champion).

Wyrmwood
08-04-2012, 18:54
Perhaps each brother is presented with a key upon full initiation into the chapter, and each time he is promoted closer to the Inner Circle* there are tests that he must face; the key not only being abstract, but a required object to progress past these tests. When a brother dies, his key is then presented to whichever new initiate (i.e, once he's ascended past the scout company) was implanted with his geneseed. Until this point, the keys are kept in trust by the chaplains in a reliquary.

Through this, you could work a kind of reincarnation metaphor into your fluff; the 'M' on the key meaning 'millennium' or simply 'thousand', with each key representing a shard of the whole. This whole being something divine, or relating to their Primarch/the Emperor. This does imply a hierarchy limited by genetics, so the Chapter Master has the same geneseed and key as the first etc, and would be groomed for this role by the clandestine Chaplain order.

*Assuming you're going with Dark Angel successors.

On the topic of a Chaplain/Chapter Master, sure. It's non-Codex, but perfectly reasonable if you can justify it. Running with the context of my above suggestion, the Chapter Master (being the avatar of the whole and keeper of the first key) may not only be the premier warrior, but also the embodiment of the chapter's spiritual virtue etc.

I use a similar concept with my Word Bearers, though with 'words' instead of keys.

William The Conqueror
09-04-2012, 13:48
Perhaps each brother is presented with a key upon full initiation into the chapter, and each time he is promoted closer to the Inner Circle* there are tests that he must face; the key not only being abstract, but a required object to progress past these tests. When a brother dies, his key is then presented to whichever new initiate (i.e, once he's ascended past the scout company) was implanted with his geneseed. Until this point, the keys are kept in trust by the chaplains in a reliquary.

Through this, you could work a kind of reincarnation metaphor into your fluff; the 'M' on the key meaning 'millennium' or simply 'thousand', with each key representing a shard of the whole. This whole being something divine, or relating to their Primarch/the Emperor. This does imply a hierarchy limited by genetics, so the Chapter Master has the same geneseed and key as the first etc, and would be groomed for this role by the clandestine Chaplain order.

*Assuming you're going with Dark Angel successors.

On the topic of a Chaplain/Chapter Master, sure. It's non-Codex, but perfectly reasonable if you can justify it. Running with the context of my above suggestion, the Chapter Master (being the avatar of the whole and keeper of the first key) may not only be the premier warrior, but also the embodiment of the chapter's spiritual virtue etc.

I use a similar concept with my Word Bearers, though with 'words' instead of keys.

I like the idea of each initiate or battle brother having a key, it could really tie all the fluff together and also give me a reason to add keys to my models. Yeah, I like the idea of a chaplain chapter master just because it's unique, but I can also imagine that in chapter like the dark angels, where secrecy is o important, or the black Templars, where Chaplains are honored, that it shouldn't be too odd for their to be some successor chapter where they may be chapter masters. I mean, all other titles aside, they are still space marines.

William The Conqueror
09-04-2012, 13:48
Perhaps each brother is presented with a key upon full initiation into the chapter, and each time he is promoted closer to the Inner Circle* there are tests that he must face; the key not only being abstract, but a required object to progress past these tests. When a brother dies, his key is then presented to whichever new initiate (i.e, once he's ascended past the scout company) was implanted with his geneseed. Until this point, the keys are kept in trust by the chaplains in a reliquary.

Through this, you could work a kind of reincarnation metaphor into your fluff; the 'M' on the key meaning 'millennium' or simply 'thousand', with each key representing a shard of the whole. This whole being something divine, or relating to their Primarch/the Emperor. This does imply a hierarchy limited by genetics, so the Chapter Master has the same geneseed and key as the first etc, and would be groomed for this role by the clandestine Chaplain order.

*Assuming you're going with Dark Angel successors.

On the topic of a Chaplain/Chapter Master, sure. It's non-Codex, but perfectly reasonable if you can justify it. Running with the context of my above suggestion, the Chapter Master (being the avatar of the whole and keeper of the first key) may not only be the premier warrior, but also the embodiment of the chapter's spiritual virtue etc.

I use a similar concept with my Word Bearers, though with 'words' instead of keys.

I like the idea of each initiate or battle brother having a key, it could really tie all the fluff together and also give me a reason to add keys to my models. Yeah, I like the idea of a chaplain chapter master just because it's unique, but I can also imagine that in chapters like the dark angels, where secrecy is so important, or the black Templars, where Chaplains are highly honored, that it shouldn't be too odd for there to be some successor chapter(s) where they may be chapter masters. I mean, all other titles aside, they are still space marines.

Dr.Clock
13-04-2012, 14:46
Re: painting white...

Was lurking B&C and came across this... seems pretty simple.

If GW washes aren't working for you, change it up. This guy reviews how to paint a simple white in four passes, using only white and a wash.

http://fromthewarp.blogspot.com/2011/12/white-scars-and-how-to-paint-white.html

Cheers,

The Good Doctor.

William The Conqueror
14-04-2012, 00:34
Re: painting white...

Was lurking B&C and came across this... seems pretty simple.

If GW washes aren't working for you, change it up. This guy reviews how to paint a simple white in four passes, using only white and a wash.

http://fromthewarp.blogspot.com/2011/12/white-scars-and-how-to-paint-white.html

Cheers,

The Good Doctor.

Thanks allot, I actually found this just a few days ago. I need to order some of the wash he uses, I know Les from awesome paint jobs uses the same wash for whites, so it's gotta be okay.
I ended up just going over all the crevices with a medium to light grey. It was better than my previous attempts, but still not satisfying. I've meant to give that method a try, but am going to have to wait till the end of the month. It's final's season and I barely have time to breath as it is, but once summer gets here, the ranks will swell.

Thanks a bunch, the thought is much appreciated. As soon as I have time to get the first one done (and learn how to make my damn camera focus long enough to take a picture) I'll upload a shot so you all can take a look.