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Elian
07-06-2012, 08:44
So I wanted to try an all-cavalry empire list and this is the final version (2502 points)... any comments will be much appreciated

Lords:
Archmage (Lvl4 life, Pegasus, talisman of preservation, dispel scroll)

Heroes
BSB (plate armour, barded horse, Lance, Dawnstone) ->with the ICK
Warrior Priest (heavy armour, enchanted shield, barded horse)-> with the ICK
Captain (Pegasus, Plate armour, charmed shield, Lance)

Core:
13x Inner C knights (lances, full command, steel standart)
5x Knights (Mus and stand)
5x Knights (Mus and stand)

Special:
Demigryph knights x6 (mus and eternal flame stand)
Pistoliers x5 (mus)
Pistoliers x5 (mus)

Rare:
Steam Tank
Steam Tank
Hysh luminarch


Battle Plan:
Stanks Hold and damage enemy units (aided by lore of life and 6+ ward)
Captasus as usual
DGK and ICK do the actuar killing (The archmage keeps them alive).
Knights can act as flankers, kill weak units...
Pistoliers are just general nuisance.
Luminarch provides ward to tanks, DD, and bound spell.

So, any obvius flaws? (yes, watchtower I know! but i guess there is no way around that)
Would you substitute the luminarch with a mounted lvl1 or 2 wiz? (this also frees some points) or a doomrocket battery.

ftayl5
07-06-2012, 11:31
Being a combat army I'd substitute the Luminarc for a celestial thing. That +1 to hit...
You could have knights hitting on 3's with a re-roll and wounding on 2's.
6+ ward is nice too but I prefer to capitalise on strengths rather than trying to cover every possible weakness.
Either way I just don't think the luminark fits the army and even a level 1 beast wizard would be better just to get some wildform here and there.
Otherwise I like this quite a lot.

mike20
07-06-2012, 13:28
why 6x demigryphs? from my understanding, the second rank of beasts DO NOT get any supporting attacks, just the riders, so you lose much of their strength...i would split it into 2 units. I would stick with the 6+ Save buff, as it has been proven to have a greater effect than +1 to hit. (besides, your protecting your 25 pt models, as opposed to making it easier to hit enemies which are likely 5-10 pt models). I would also exchange the pistoliers for outriders, which are fantastically better for 3 points, and allow you do deal with enemy chaff much more effectively.

cheers

Gaargod
07-06-2012, 15:27
I would stick with the 6+ Save buff, as it has been proven to have a greater effect than +1 to hit. (besides, your protecting your 25 pt models, as opposed to making it easier to hit enemies which are likely 5-10 pt models).



I actually agree with your point about which to take, but what on earth are you going on about with that bolded comment? How in the name of god would you prove that a 6+ wardsave is effective than +1 to hit? They're completely separate things! That's like saying Mystifying Miasma has been proven to have a greater effect than Pit of Shades. You literally cannot compare the two just like that - at times one is clearly going to be better than the others.

Sorry, but that makes no sense...

Elian
07-06-2012, 22:03
The six DGK unit is there bacause that way they can fill the roll of proper combat unit (The will need 3 casualties to loose hitting power and will be doing a lot of damage), Of course that still need to be proved but using them is the only way to do that. U

I wanted to try pistoliers since the army will probably be constantly moving, but I may change to outriders if they do not perform well.

I am also not completely sure about the luminark but i guess that will need to be tested (My main isue with the hurricanum is that the tanks wont benefit from it so I thought this may be one those times where luminark is better)

Elian
07-06-2012, 22:04
The six DGK unit is there bacause that way they can fill the roll of proper combat unit (The will need 3 casualties to loose hitting power and will be doing a lot of damage), Of course that still need to be proved but using them is the only way to do that. U

I wanted to try pistoliers since the army will probably be constantly moving, but I may change to outriders if they do not perform well.

I am also not completely sure about the luminark but i guess that will need to be tested (My main isue with the hurricanum is that the tanks wont benefit from it so I thought this may be one those times where luminark is better)

ftayl5
08-06-2012, 00:33
Six demigryphs can charge a unit of 24 khorne warrior halberdiers in the front and win combat three times consecutively and then run the unit down. Using maths of course.
There is not another single (ie. unsupported by anything) unit in this army that can do that and 3 demigryphs certainly cannot.
This is discussed here (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=42635.0) (the empire forum)

mike20
08-06-2012, 01:06
I actually agree with your point about which to take, but what on earth are you going on about with that bolded comment? How in the name of god would you prove that a 6+ wardsave is effective than +1 to hit? They're completely separate things! That's like saying Mystifying Miasma has been proven to have a greater effect than Pit of Shades. You literally cannot compare the two just like that - at times one is clearly going to be better than the others.

Sorry, but that makes no sense...



There was a thread on warseer or dakka dakka about 6+ ward vs +1 to hit over several different combats and for almost all the scenarios you would save more of your points with the 6+ ward then you would kill of the enemies point with +1 to hit. In any case, 6+ ward is beneficial to stanks, pistoliers and everything else, the +1 is only suited to combat units.

Cheers

Jezbot
08-06-2012, 07:44
Six demigryphs can charge a unit of 24 khorne warrior halberdiers in the front and win combat three times consecutively and then run the unit down. Using maths of course.
There is not another single (ie. unsupported by anything) unit in this army that can do that and 3 demigryphs certainly cannot.
This is discussed here (http://warhammer-empire.com/theforum/index.php?topic=42635.0) (the empire forum)

You know what I really, really don't get about that argument - why not run the unit with 4 in the front rank, and 2 in the rear? It might look a little messier than 3x2 but it means you've another DMG in the front rank killing stuff.

Lord Solar Plexus
08-06-2012, 07:55
You do not realize that the argument to field a unit of 6 has nothing at all to do with their formation. That is an assumption you make but it's not something someone has proposed as an absolute must. In fact, rothgar13 on W-E (where I argued against it) said "The reason I haven't fielded them as 4-wide with 2 ablative wounds is that it's exposing you to more aggression from certain units, but against 5-wide guys, it's definitely an option to be had."

Jezbot
11-06-2012, 03:34
You do not realize that the argument to field a unit of 6 has nothing at all to do with their formation. That is an assumption you make but it's not something someone has proposed as an absolute must. In fact, rothgar13 on W-E (where I argued against it) said "The reason I haven't fielded them as 4-wide with 2 ablative wounds is that it's exposing you to more aggression from certain units, but against 5-wide guys, it's definitely an option to be had."

It is not an 'assumption I make' - it's an observation that talk on taking 6 DMG knights has so far been tied to an assumption that they're to be taken in 3x2. It's one of a few signs that thought about the idea has been really limited so far, in fact it's basically been stuck at 'according to one piece of mathammer they work well'.

You, for reasons that appear beyond the understanding of mortal men, seem really, really opposed to expanding that conversation at all, including your snippy response to me above, when all I was doing was pointing out there hadn't been any talk yet of deploying 6 demigryphs in a non-regular formation.