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NitrosOkay
16-06-2012, 05:01
If Krell, Lord of Undeath is wounded multiple times by a magic weapon and passes one but not all of his armour saves, is he affected by the weapon's debilitating effects (instant death, losing attacks and so on)?

If so, if the attacker gains attacks for unsaved wounds (I.E. Red Fury) and causes more unsaved wounds are these wounds resolved simultaneously or would the weapon no longer be magical at that point?

Valaraukar
16-06-2012, 08:42
Timing in combat is normally done via initiative steps and all elements within an initiative step are assumed to happen simultaneously so IMO this would mean that he does suffer the special effects of magical weapons as all hits are resolved simultaneously, likewise red fury additional attacks are resolved at the same time so would also benefit from their magical weapons properties. However I don't have access to the Tomb Kings book so don't know the exact wording of his rule, other similar rules often say when they are resolved such as the Warriors of Chaos magic armour which can do the same specifically says at the end of the round of close combat.

Dahmon999
16-06-2012, 21:21
Timing in combat is normally done via initiative steps and all elements within an initiative step are assumed to happen simultaneously so IMO this would mean that he does suffer the special effects of magical weapons as all hits are resolved simultaneously, likewise red fury additional attacks are resolved at the same time so would also benefit from their magical weapons properties. However I don't have access to the Tomb Kings book so don't know the exact wording of his rule, other similar rules often say when they are resolved such as the Warriors of Chaos magic armour which can do the same specifically says at the end of the round of close combat.

Sequencing is covered on page 10 of the BRB, rules that happen at the same time are placed in order on who evers player turn it is

Hell Storm
16-06-2012, 21:41
Sequencing is covered on page 10 of the BRB, rules that happen at the same time are placed in order on who evers player turn it is

So if someone is attacking him with a Sword of Bloodshed, and hits 5 times out of 8, then wounds all of them how would you resolve it? Do one save then say you must re-roll all of your other attacks because you just lost 3 attacks and we don't know which ones were the weapon's extra attacks? You can't have him do his attacks one at a time because they are all resolved at the same time. It would be like removing a casualty in the front rank then saying that one of the enemy models is no longer in b2b so you must redo the rest of the attacks/wounds.

This is one of those situations where you have to look at what is the most reasonable solution. Resolve all of the attacks and saves then apply the armor's effect. If he succeeded and failed at least once each, then he will suffer the effects and also stop the weapon from functioning for the remainder of the game. This is the easiest and fairest solution.

Dahmon999
17-06-2012, 02:34
So if someone is attacking him with a Sword of Bloodshed, and hits 5 times out of 8, then wounds all of them how would you resolve it? Do one save then say you must re-roll all of your other attacks because you just lost 3 attacks and we don't know which ones were the weapon's extra attacks? You can't have him do his attacks one at a time because they are all resolved at the same time. It would be like removing a casualty in the front rank then saying that one of the enemy models is no longer in b2b so you must redo the rest of the attacks/wounds.

This is one of those situations where you have to look at what is the most reasonable solution. Resolve all of the attacks and saves then apply the armor's effect. If he succeeded and failed at least once each, then he will suffer the effects and also stop the weapon from functioning for the remainder of the game. This is the easiest and fairest solution.

There are rules for rolling attacks, Krell's armor and the Vampire ability Red Fury have there own set of rules. I provided the sequencing rule, its a rule that my group uses when there is an argument on timing of rules from army books (or a roll off).

However I do aggree with the way you would handle this situation.

Valaraukar
17-06-2012, 12:00
Which is exactly what I proposed above and you disagreed with, you cannot interrupt a simultaneous series of attacks and you cannot infer that any one happens before another therefore if he fails ANY of his saves he will suffer the ill effects, thereafter the weapons magical properties will be removed for the remainder of the game. Attacks at an initiative step happen simultaneously regardless of whether you roll them one at a time or all at once, this is quite separate from sequencing which deals with events which both happen for instance 'at the start of close combat' or 'the start of the magic phase' in which case you are quite right the player whose turn it is decides on the order (ridiculous and lazy as this is!).