PDA

View Full Version : Lizardmen Gor'Rok



gorblud
25-06-2012, 15:50
Hey!

The special character Gor'Rok always counts as defending an obstacle (wall), does this also apply to the unit he is with?

Mr_Rose
25-06-2012, 16:00
Check the current version of the Lizardmen AB Rules Update on the GW site; it has the following amendment:
Page 67 – Gor-Rok, The Shield of Aeons.
Change to “Shield. In close combat, Gor-Rok always counts as defending an obstacle (wall). This means that cavalry, monstrous cavalry and chariot models that charge Gor-Rok must take a Dangerous Terrain test. Also, any chargers will also suffer a -1 to hit him in the turn they charge.”

That doesn't seem to include any hangers on in it's effect to me.

gorblud
25-06-2012, 16:01
ah, you're right

Glen_Savet
26-06-2012, 05:14
He's part of the unit, so if they're charging the unit, they're charging him as well.

gorblud
26-06-2012, 09:59
yeah but cavalry and such won't take dangerous terrain unless they're in b2b with Gor'rok. Also, the unit won't be protected by -1 ti hit

dms505
28-06-2012, 14:07
The Obstacle rule states that a "model" going over an obstacle or charging an enemy against an obstacle, not a unit. So since the shield would only be in front of Gor'Rok then only models touching his base would take the test.

However further rule digging shows that any UNIT IN CONTACT with an obstacle counts as defending it. So the WHOLE UNIT would get the defensive bonus first turn (or rather a negative to the attackers).

Going by those too rules together it makes it good but not overpowered I think.

Artinam
28-06-2012, 14:50
He can always make way should he not be in combat.

AntaresCD
28-06-2012, 17:44
The Obstacle rule states that a "model" going over an obstacle or charging an enemy against an obstacle, not a unit. So since the shield would only be in front of Gor'Rok then only models touching his base would take the test.

However further rule digging shows that any UNIT IN CONTACT with an obstacle counts as defending it. So the WHOLE UNIT would get the defensive bonus first turn (or rather a negative to the attackers).

Going by those too rules together it makes it good but not overpowered I think.

Only Gor'Rok counts as defending an obstacle, per the rules quoted above. Therefore all the relevant penalties only apply to models in b2b with him. So any model that charged that round that is in b2b with Gor'Rok take Dangerous Terrain tests (if Cavalry, Monstrous Cavalry, or Chariot) and get a -1 to hit in combat this round (the -1 to hit also counts for any model making supporting attacks behind a model in b2b with Gor'Rok). So while only Gor'Rok counts as defending, per the rule, the parts of the unit near him can technically benefit, since the -1 to hit does not specify that it has to be against a model defending, only that you have a -1 to hit if you are in b2b with the obstacle. So other models are "protected" after a fashion, but the unit does not benefit, as a whole, by default. Essentially, the easiest way to visualize it within the normal obstacle rules is as if Gor'Rok has a wall segment as wide as his base immediately in front of him that he is in b2b with (i.e. is defending).

As far as defending obstacles in the general case goes, only models that end up in base contact with the obstacle being defended (or supporting behind a model in base contact with it) take the penalties (on the round they charged) as per page 122 of the BRB, Obstacles and Combat, third paragraph. So it doesn't technically matter how much of your frontage is behind an obstacle, it matters how much of the enemy's frontage is touching the obstacle.

Aergren
02-07-2012, 06:05
So while only Gor'Rok counts as defending, per the rule, the parts of the unit near him can technically benefit, since the -1 to hit does not specify that it has to be against a model defending, only that you have a -1 to hit if you are in b2b with the obstacle. So other models are "protected" after a fashion, but the unit does not benefit, as a whole, by default. Essentially, the easiest way to visualize it within the normal obstacle rules is as if Gor'Rok has a wall segment as wide as his base immediately in front of him that he is in b2b with (i.e. is defending).

I don't agree with that part. The lizardmen rules says that Gor'Rok always counts as defending an obstacle, not that he is a obstacle. So technically we should only be looking at the rules for defending an obstacle, defending any obstacle says nothing about a -1 to hit, because there is not type of obstacle. So RAW the only benefit to Gor'Rok is that Cav, Monstrous Cav, and Chariot take a DT test. No I don't think this is what they meant but it was written for 7th not 8th. To be fair I would say that only Gor'Rok gets a -1 to be hit.

Mr_Rose
02-07-2012, 06:51
Gor-Rok is defending a wall. I quoted the relevant errata earlier.

dms505
02-07-2012, 11:37
Agreed I was incorrect on the "whole unit" defense. So your looking at probably 1-3 models that may have to take a terrain test and 1-3 models that will gain -1 to hit for the first round of combat. The rules don't actually give the defending troops including Gor any positives or negatives.

I think this is what was intended as he can't help protect a couple of guys to his sides with his fat shield but that's about it.

AntaresCD
02-07-2012, 17:17
I don't agree with that part. The lizardmen rules says that Gor'Rok always counts as defending an obstacle, not that he is a obstacle. So technically we should only be looking at the rules for defending an obstacle, defending any obstacle says nothing about a -1 to hit, because there is not type of obstacle. So RAW the only benefit to Gor'Rok is that Cav, Monstrous Cav, and Chariot take a DT test. No I don't think this is what they meant but it was written for 7th not 8th. To be fair I would say that only Gor'Rok gets a -1 to be hit.
As Mr_Rose pointed out, the current rule is that he is defending an obstacle of type wall. You -1 to hit is found under the entry for a wall in the obstacle section.

Ximinipot
03-07-2012, 20:56
Page 67 - Gor'Rok, The Shield Of Aeons
Change to " Shield. In close combat, Gor'rok always counts as defending an obstacle(wall). This means that cavalry, monstrous cavalry and chariot models that charge Gor'rok must make a Dangerous Terrain test. Also any chargers will suffer a -1 to hit him in the turn the charge.

It affects only Gor'rok, not him and his unit. His unit isn't the obstacle, his personal shield is.
It sucks since in 7th it affected him AND his unit. As a Lizardmen player, it sucks. It cuts down on his usefulness a bit, but don't forget he is great for taking challenges(Immune to Killing Blow and re-roll to wound) and hard combat unit that is Stubborn isn't anything to forget about. Drop Flesh To Stone on his unit, and you're looking at a Toughness 7, maybe 9 Hero that just soaks up wounds in challenges.