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View Full Version : Fearless!!! (vs orks)



Sithlord
13-07-2012, 14:58
So how are you gonna be fare when fighting (with your dedicated cc unit) against the huge number fearless orks now that the no retreat rules is gone :(

Latro_
13-07-2012, 15:02
That huge number will take a mauling from shooting and the I step thing and 3" will ensure you'll rarely be attacked by all of em.

Lord Damocles
13-07-2012, 15:03
Most decent dedicated close combat units will mulch through a big unit of Orks anyway.

Sons of Lorgar
13-07-2012, 15:08
Well, chainaxes on berzerkers and lightning claw terminator champions of khorne will still munch through orks in short order.

Corvus Corone
13-07-2012, 15:11
I'm going to laugh as I kite and tarpit them with my gaunts of great justice. Come hither, greenskins, get shot, then overwatched, then assault me through my venomthrope cloud into my poisoned counter attacking gaunts who'll be striking first and need killing to the last because they too are fearless (all being well, which usually it is).

If they prove a nuisance I'll just have to send something nastier their way.

RandomThoughts
13-07-2012, 15:44
So how are you gonna be fare when fighting (with your dedicated cc unit) against the huge number fearless orks now that the no retreat rules is gone :(

What dedicated cc units? I play Eldar, my CC just got crushed. Which is exactly why I'm going to get some Ork mercenaries and let them do the fighting for me. :)

Theocracity
13-07-2012, 16:45
Ah, a proper panzee - letting the greenskins do his fighting for him :).

Ork hordes are not unbeatable, even with the fearless changes. But I'm not going to lie - I'm really excited about getting properly stuck in, instead of dying from heart attacks.

Dwane Diblie
13-07-2012, 17:26
Damn no rule book at hand, but I find it funny when you can get a warlord, with the Trait Enemys must use Lowest LD, within 12" of a 30 Ork mod and then successfuly cast Terrify on them. LD 7 moral check comming right up. If they pass that then you only have to do 8 wounds to make them roll another one. Oh and if you are going to assault them in addition to all this, then LD 7 Fear Check or its WS1 orks :D. Sure you can not actualy pan an intire game around this tacktic but its funny when you can pull it off.

Oh and before some git trys to tell me that mob rule would atleast make them leadrship 10. Mob rule is optional and if you have to use your lowest LD then any mod of 7 or over will be LD 7. Whats realy funny is that any mob under 7 models will then be forced to use the mob rule for its LD as it will be lower than the models LD.

Dangersaurus
13-07-2012, 17:54
I plan on making sure they aren't fearless by the time they get to me, and if necessary charging them first. Furious charge may be nerfed, but it's still scary enough.

...or if I'm playing orks myself, I'll just rolla them.

Ulrig
14-07-2012, 00:54
Damn no rule book at hand, but I find it funny when you can get a warlord, with the Trait Enemys must use Lowest LD, within 12" of a 30 Ork mod and then successfuly cast Terrify on them. LD 7 moral check comming right up. If they pass that then you only have to do 8 wounds to make them roll another one. Oh and if you are going to assault them in addition to all this, then LD 7 Fear Check or its WS1 orks :D. Sure you can not actualy pan an intire game around this tacktic but its funny when you can pull it off.

Oh and before some git trys to tell me that mob rule would atleast make them leadrship 10. Mob rule is optional and if you have to use your lowest LD then any mod of 7 or over will be LD 7. Whats realy funny is that any mob under 7 models will then be forced to use the mob rule for its LD as it will be lower than the models LD.

Sorry your logic is not sound. In a mob of 30 boys for instance, there is no model with "lowest leadership" you can pick from, to make them take the test off of, other then leadership 10. There is no lowest leadership as you say. People like you interpreting the rules like this is what ruins the game.

Mob Rule
"Ork Mobs may always choose to substitute the number of Orks in their mob for their normal Leadership value. If an ork mob numbers 11..."

Intimidating Presence
"Enemy units within 12" of the warlord must use their lowest Leadership value, not the highest."

Also don't forget in the main rulebook it says
"Where advanced rules apply to specific model, they may always override any contradicting basic rules" It even has an example of moral checks....

Below that is says
"On rare occasions, a conflict will arise between a rule in this rulebook, and one printed in a codex. When this occurs, the rule printed in the codex always takes precedence"

So you make me take a leadership test on my lowest value. I respond to always choose to use the model count as my leadership value
If the orks had seperate leadership values, you would be right.

lantzkev
14-07-2012, 01:14
Codex still trumps big book except where the big book has updated their codex entries.

Mchagen
14-07-2012, 01:16
The no retreat rule was broken, it's good that it didn't make it to 6th. I regularly play against orks, and it was laughable how fast a mob of boys died in cc.

Exarch Eldrid
14-07-2012, 01:21
Well i dont have many experience in 6th but i think will work is sniping the big green ork ( that with the nasty weapon ) with some reapers or pathfinders, then send a wraithlord to the party and enjoy

2nd place
14-07-2012, 01:25
you take IG and here is how you do it...

1 psyker battle squad, 8 psykers, 1 overseer in a transport...
1 prymeris psyker, with psychic scream from the BRB...

your turn, PBS reduces the mobs LD to 2, the pry psyker then casts scream, take a LD test please... oh and you need snake-eyes, anything more and you start feeling the pain...

TheMav80
14-07-2012, 01:40
Seeing as how I play Tau, I guess I will just shoot them. :cool:

Nurgling Chieftain
14-07-2012, 01:48
I think the cap comes after all modifiers, so if you reduce a mob of 30 Orks' leadership by 9, they become leadership 21, capped at 10. :p

Anyway, I think a lot of you are going to find that not only is close combat with Orks more of a problem, but the shoota boyz can outshoot you, too, and only lose half their efficacy to snapshots rather than being reduced to a third or a fourth like most armies.

Stinkfoot
14-07-2012, 01:49
you take IG and here is how you do it...

1 psyker battle squad, 8 psykers, 1 overseer in a transport...
1 prymeris psyker, with psychic scream from the BRB...

your turn, PBS reduces the mobs LD to 2, the pry psyker then casts scream, take a LD test please... oh and you need snake-eyes, anything more and you start feeling the pain...

So you spend 200+ points to deal, on average, a little more damage than a 50 point unit of rapid firing guardsmen?

2nd place
14-07-2012, 01:49
with tau it's easy, i hit you on 3+ (providing you get at least 1 markerlight hit) and i wound you on 3+, no armour saves, all from 30" away... you will get 2-3 good turns of shooting at them before you have to overwatch... it could not be simpler

@stinkfoot, yep, as was once said by a wise man, you dont fight 500pts with 500pts if you want to win, you fight 500pts with 1,000pts...

Stinkfoot
14-07-2012, 01:55
@stinkfoot, yep, as was once said by a wise man, you dont fight 500pts with 500pts if you want to win, you fight 500pts with 1,000pts...

That's a good strategy, but if you took 200 points of guardsmen instead of IG's second-rate psykers you'd deal 4 times as much damage.

Sithlord
14-07-2012, 02:25
okay then, maybe if a space marine armies dealing with orks are easier with their 3+ saves, how bout with dark eldar wyches? (I play dark eldar)

Haddock
14-07-2012, 04:29
it seems to me the thing most of you are forgetting is yes you will gun down 30 orks as they come to you but what about the other 90? Im sorry but tau guard and marines dont have enough fire power to kill 120 orks.

Mikial
14-07-2012, 04:37
When you play Nids, you look forward to Orks. After all, it's always much more convenient to have your food delivered instead of having to go pick it up. :cool:

MasterDecoy
14-07-2012, 04:39
besides, 15 uber hormagaunts should be more than enough to clear the kill zone and pile in zone preventing the orks from retaliating at all on the charge (which they will probably get, being they're so fast and all).

Mikial
14-07-2012, 05:02
Not to mention 'Stealers with rend, scything and toxin. That's a really short fight no matter who the opponent is.

2nd place
14-07-2012, 05:05
it seems to me the thing most of you are forgetting is yes you will gun down 30 orks as they come to you but what about the other 90? Im sorry but tau guard and marines dont have enough fire power to kill 120 orks.

I dont know, my guard army pumps out alot of shots... 450 per turn at 1,500pts, and almost all of them render your armour useless... still think 120 orks is enough..?

the easiest way to deal with it is 3 leman russ punishers with hull mounted heavy bolter, heavy bolter sponsons and a pinital heavy stubber for good measure... thats 31 shots per tank...

Haddock
14-07-2012, 05:21
from my experience, yes that is enough. 120 orks is just at 1200 points, there's room enough for other things. math hammer never works out. you telling me 3 leman russ tanks can kill 120 orks? in my 5 years of playing it has never happened. And yes I play against guard regularly. tyranids on the other hand, yes its a fight. those games tend to go either way for me.

Sithlord
14-07-2012, 10:44
Dude, gaunts within synapse range can overwhelm orks anyway :p but as for dark eldar, we don't have enough guns (or bodies for that matter) to deal with current fearless orks (on 5th, I pretty much depend on my wyches/incubis to force them to take additional damage from losing combat)

Theocracity
14-07-2012, 14:04
Dark Eldar lack for anti-infantry firepower? Pull the other one, it's got bells on.

Incubi are the kind of elite melee that hordes are designe to ground down. Venoms are what you need.

Xerkics
14-07-2012, 14:25
Genestealers with poison Also cost like 3 orc boys even boyz overwatch will kill genestealers with that many shots and youll find that hormagaunts are massively inferior to boys to make them better you have to pay lot more and that defeats the point. Boyz get more str on a charge and like 4 attacks each and higher toughness and ws than hormagaunts to start with and all that for free also if you dont want your gaunts to stay and fight and not run away you want them within synapse so no rage. id rather shoot orcs with barbed stranglers and such.... Guard is probably best equiped to deal with orcs due to all the large blasts tau less so if you have battlesuit spam but tanks can still shoot str 6 blasts?

Mushkilla
14-07-2012, 15:15
Even easier then that get 3 squads of 10 reavers, and inflict 30-90 S4 blade vane auto hits every turn whilst avoiding any for of retaliation thanks to 48" move and 3+ jink save, and 5+ feel no pain (costing 660pts). The Dark Eldar lawn mower.

Of course games are not in vacuums (unless they are in space!), but it would be fun. :D

ChaplainCharlie
14-07-2012, 17:04
Or the now cheap and cheerful Armored battlegroup with 2 Pie plates per tank per turn. Nom. Eradicators just got nasty. Even though I'd still take LRBTs. XP

Damocles8
14-07-2012, 17:16
What dedicated cc units? I play Eldar, my CC just got crushed. Which is exactly why I'm going to get some Ork mercenaries and let them do the fighting for me. :)

Why not just use dire avengers, get him in range, shoot, shoot again if you can, then bladestorm as Overwatch.....