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cornonthecob
23-08-2012, 14:00
I have this irritating issue wherin I seem to choose difficult to use armies in most games, the latest was a proxied High Elf army. After a sound defeat (due to me being a terrible player) I realised I might need something a little easier to use.

T10
23-08-2012, 14:03
Easiest army ?
Slaanesh girsl are easy.

On a serious note: Lizardmen armies have no weaknesses, so they are your best choice.

-T10

UnknownAspect
23-08-2012, 15:40
What was your high elf setup and what army did you face? I don't necessarily think high elves are hard to play, but like with all armies, if you want to use them to the best of their abilities, you need to understand their weaknesses more than their advantages.

I know when I first started I was always thinking about what my army could do and where to cause the most damage, but I completely avoided thinking defensively and that cost me. High Elves are a low toughness army, so they are pretty fragile, but they have "Always Strikes First". So you've got to think about where you want to hit the enemy, and you want to make sure you can put out enough damage before taking heavy hits.

I'm currently just starting to build a high elves army, starting with the Island of Blood figures, I intend to also pickup a battallion and a BSB. I need a solid block of spear elves on the defensive to hold off the heavy hitters with the BSB. While I keep a small group of archers with my mage to peck at approaching groups, and have seaguard near them to counter any advances while also providing a hail of fire. Meanwhile the Ellyrian reavers harrass groups and try to redirect, where my swordmasters are used as a heavy hitting unit to flank and hit threats. My strategy may not be great, but I'd like to hear what yours is.


If you are dead set on not doing high elves though, I'd suggest a Warriors of Chaos army. The have tough elite troops that are hard to break and hit hard. Certainly a good force for someone just learning tactics.

IcedCrow
23-08-2012, 16:07
until you play someone good ;) warriors of chaos have simpler tactics but are not easy to use as your army is small and can be lead around the board by its nose if you aren't careful.

StygianBeach
23-08-2012, 16:23
Yeah, high elves are not easy to use.

Ogres are pretty easy to use. Lizardmen and Skaven are easy for similar reasons. Dark Elves with pendant Lord on pegasus is easy to use.

Warriors and Beastmen are easy if you can overcome their lack of mobility using Knights with Warriors and redirectors with Beasts. Dwarfs are easy if you can be patient.
Orcs and goblins, Vampires, Brets, Wood Elves, High Elves and Tomb kings are all tricky to use.

Empire (new) I dont know and not sure about Demons being easy or not.

DareX2
23-08-2012, 17:22
Warriors of Chaos are fairly easy to use. They can be extremely tough while still being relatively killy, have access to some strong magic, and their list has enough variety to have fun with. Their downside is that they lack a strong shooting phase, and many options are expensive.

Ogre Kingdoms can be easy to use as well. They're relatively tough, can put out a ton of damage and can deal with virtually anything the opponent my put down on the field. Their downside is that they cost a fair bit of points, and leadership is average.

Lizardmen are fairly easy in that they have access to a ton of poisoned shooting, incredible magic, strong infantry, and great monsters. Cold blooded means they will fail very few leadership checks. They're expensive points-wise and have no "middle ground" infantry.

Beastmen aren't bad in that they have a ton of high toughness infantry blocks. They lack shooting, so the plan is generally to try and get into combat as soon as possible. Leadership isn't stellar.

Dwarfs aren't bad because they're tough with high leadership, but their lack of traditional mobility can make them frustrating to play with (and, to a degree, against).

Orcs and Goblins and Skaven can be challenging but rewarding to play, due to their low leadership and general tendency to injure themselves as much as the enemy. Both are horde armies with solutions to overcome the leadership problems, though, and as a result can allow time to recover from some mistakes.

The human factions - Empire and Bretonnians - aren't bad, but they do require good synergistic use of your units to pull a victory.

I would stay away from either of the undead factions, because crumbling can be a challenge to deal with if you're not good at picking your fights well. I would also stay away from the elves, because they are generally fragile and few in number, which means that mistakes will get severely punished.

Soundwave
23-08-2012, 19:12
Try some "tenacity" stick with an army,no matter the choice,weigh up the pro"s and con"s and adapt a "feel" then gauge a choice from there? Losing is a part of the road to becoming successful!

Phazael
23-08-2012, 19:30
Really, any gunline army is going to be the easiest to use, because the only decisions that you need to make are those of target priority in the shooting/magic phase. For combat armies, any army built around T4 infantry with descent leadership is going to be much simpler to play, just because it will be far more forgiving. Warriors are a good example, as are Lizards and Ogres. You can make a bad choice, tactically and grind your way out of it with those armies. Strictly speaking, any army built around medium to large sized infantry blocks with good leadership is going to be a solid newbie choice and when expert players DO beat you, you will learn a lot in the process.

theDarkGeneral
23-08-2012, 19:38
I always recommend either The Empire or Warriors of Chaos to players just starting out.

With the Empire you get a chance to play with all the different phases of the game: Movement, Shooting, Magic and Close Combat. The Empire excels in the Shooting phase and depending upon list builds, can but forth a hell of a Magic show! With access to sooooo many different unit types and upgrades and characters, etc., and being mostly "average" stats across the board most players can learn a lot from their flexibility.

As for the Warriors of Chaos, the models look much cooler, but are dead killers in Close Combat! With many good speed/movement units that hit hard and a variety of infantry types you really get a feel for the different ratios of Close Combat and maneuvering! Their characters are some of the most powerful in the game, which is often backed by some nasty Magic (except for us Khorne players!). Little to no shooting has always plagued them, but the Hellcannon is more then enough firepower for most Warriors of Chaos Armies. Better stats including the all important Ld and T factor help them be a much more forgiving army.

gorblud
23-08-2012, 20:10
I switched armies with a friend of mine just a few hours ago. I usually play Vampire Counts and he plays dwarfs, but now I played his dwarves and he played my VC. We built our own lists though.

We played 2 games (2000 points) with the same lists and terrain setup.

First game he didn't score a single point. Second game he got around 120 points, because I rolled a misfire, then rerolled another misfire, and then rolled a 1 so the cannon blew up.

I feel dwarves were really easy to play, and it showed in our games. Basically all I had to do was shoot at the right targets and not care what unit he charged since all dwarves have very similar stats and equipment.

List building was easy aswell, take a couple of war machines, some magic defence and two or three hordes. I played a horde of longbeard rangers with throwing axes for core (this unit was the only tactical challenge I had since I could either put them in my own deployment for protection, or close to his for offence. I played the first game with them in offence and the second in defence), and a horde of hammerers for special. 2 cannons and 2 grudgethrowers. A bsb thane, a runelord and a runesmith.

My friend took 20 black knights, a vampire, a master necromancer, 5 hexwraiths, a varghulf, a mortis engine (without the upgrade) and some skeletons, zombies and dire wolves. It showed pretty well that he had no clue what he was doing :) He didn't keep any important units within march bubble or spell range, and after a few turns his master necromancer (general) left his zombie unit and got a direct hit by a grudge thrower. All his units started crumbling and lost significant ammount of wounds/models.

I had never played Dwarves before and he had never played Vampire Counts, though we have played against eachother alot. We started playing warhammer on the same day, our first game was against eachother after both of us had read through the rulebook.



I don't have much experience of other armies but this is what I can tell you:
Vampire Counts may be a challenge for someone who hasn't thoroughly read through the book, and even after reading the book some experience might be needed. You can pick a list from the internet but not know what each unit is there for.

Dwarves are really easy to play and it's easy to build a list. Shoot every monster/ethereal you can see, accept any charges from any unit, reform from 10 wide to 5 wide when you're not sure you'll win combat and you might need steadfast. Just keep the hammerers in horde formation all game, they have amazing stats and are stubborn, for only 12 points each. Dwarf war machine crew are stronger than dire wolves and many other small but fast units, so don't worry too much about them charging the machines. Especially if the machine has an engineer.

HurrDurr
23-08-2012, 22:57
From my experience, empire is not the easiest army to play. It's the easiest army to create answers to problems, but flexibility makes up for it's more broad and less acute strengths, to be honest it reminds me a lot of a skaven army the way it's set up is oriented around lots of infantry and a good number of inexpensive toys. Usually from what I've seen an empire army needs to spend a lot of focus on one aspect/plan/phase to crush it, and then can spend points padding the other phases, but not dominating them all.

HalfBlood
24-08-2012, 02:51
I am surprised that people give a variety of choices.

I have alwways found Skaven to be the more simple army. Take a cheap unit (slaves) lock in combat with strong unit. Then drop artillery/magic on the engaged unit.

Following this I would say armies that involve a gun-line (empire/Dwarves) may be simple to play, however their is much stronger armies with stronger builds

Trains_Get_Robbed
24-08-2012, 06:54
Armies that walk forward/stand still and delete the enemy, fresh meat can play them and win: Dwarfs, Lizardmen, Skaven, Ogres, WOC

Armies that require a strategies, compilable lists and a understanding of the rules: Dark Elfs, Empire, Demons, Orcs and Goblins, Vampire Counts

Armies that need tactical insights, heavy rules acclimation, great target priority, good lists, and strategies, and some luck: Wood Elves, Tomb Kings, Beastmen, High Elves (without Teclis), Bretonia

Out of these armies comparing to the tournament meta none of the top armies are in the lowest category. Dark Elves and Demons are considered top tier, while WoC and Dwarfs are considered top tier with only certain builds, all of the armies have some forgiveness when playing -part of the reason why they're top tier.

Nymie_the_Pooh
24-08-2012, 07:55
I think it really depends on what your long term goals are. There is no simple answer to easiest army. So much of that depends on your local players and metagame. I think the best ones for learning the game are Empire and Greenskins as both have a wide variety that cover every aspect of play, but easiest would be a bit of a stretch for either. Since you were able to proxy a High Elf army then I suggest doing the same with other armies that strike your fancy. Unfortunately for you, there is no army that can consistently win over time if you don't play it enough to learn how it plays.

Iniesta
24-08-2012, 09:51
Dont forget that some 8. edition rulebooks are going to get new books the next year, that can and will change what is considered good within those lists. I would therefore choose an arny that have been updated already in 8th or an army that isn`t expected real soon. The current rumors on release order are: woc, doc, HE and lizards within a year(ish). If you choose one of them you will need to adapt your playstyle and buy new toys to be more competitive when the book comes, so at least if you consider warriors of chaos wait a couple of months and get the book before you decide to buy models, same i would go with deamons. But as roumors are less trustworthy now than before and gw keeps this wery well hidden i would not take what is currently estimated on releasescedule as 100% certain beyond first 2 (maybe3) releases.
If you want a point and click army you can do well with now and know things wont change in near future i would pick ogres. Empire can be good, but require a lot of tactical skill in 8th. Same with VC/TK or o/g. Of those i would rate o/g before VC, then TK as most difficult to get a consistent winning army of the new books.
I dont agree on DE being difficult to master, same with skaven and deamons (they are currently wery strong in the magic phase that can be wery OP in 8th edition. But then again i think deamons will loose loremaster at 25points, and multiple scrolls. Its just too good in 8th edition setting.

Desd
25-08-2012, 18:52
Lizardmen are a blast!

-Totenkopf-
25-08-2012, 19:51
I think that an army is easy to use if it suits your style of play.. otherwise you are always fighting your instincts.. MY buddy is a very good player. Plays ogres, WOC and tons of 40k.. He really never won a game with is Lizards.. I absorbed his Lizards and went on a tear.. A lot of people say lizardmen are easy to play.. I really disagree, you really need to know how to use them and have a good understanding of the movement phase.. My tomb kings are an unconventional list and are really only batting around 500 but that is because, while I like the way the army plays, it is counter intuitive at times and has its tactical quirks.. The key to being successful is understanding your army and have it work the way you do..

Edit.. A good friend of mine picked up the hobby last year. Plays dark elves and after several escalation campaigns and games of all sizes and advice from all of us old dogs, has only won a single game... The army just doesn't perform the way he wants to play the game...

Berk
25-08-2012, 23:13
List building was easy aswell, take a couple of war machines, some magic defence and two or three hordes. I played a horde of longbeard rangers with throwing axes for core (this unit was the only tactical challenge I had since I could either put them in my own deployment for protection, or close to his for offence. I played the first game with them in offence and the second in defence), and a horde of hammerers for special. 2 cannons and 2 grudgethrowers. A bsb thane, a runelord and a runesmith.


I may be wrong, but that list does not sound legal to me. If I remember correctly, in order to have more Longbeards than Warriors you need a Lord, so to have a single unit of Longbeards and no Warriors you need a Lord (and not a Thane) in the list to use their Royal Blood rule.

snyggejygge
26-08-2012, 00:07
Skaven Ogres or Lizardmen are easiest armies to play currently.

innerwolf
26-08-2012, 00:24
I don't think Lizardmen are as easy to play as some people say if you aren't fielding one of the cookie-cutter netlists.
Cold One riders, Terradons and Stegadons, for example, need to be used carefully. Not loading on power-combos (for example Cupped Hands of the Old Ones+six-dicing nukes) nor spamming the best units (chameleon skinks, salamanders) make the army more challenging.

I hope next year the new armybook brings balance by buffing the weak units, toning down the overused units and increasing list diversity overall (nowadays every competitive Lizardmen army looks the same).

Kahadras
26-08-2012, 00:33
I'm certainly of the opinion that Ogres are pretty easy to pick up. They've got quite a few choices that stand out in their army book as being fantastic choices (Butchers, Ironguts, Maneaters, Mornfang cavalry and Ironblasters) meaning that it's easy to build a decent list without needing too put much research/playtesting in. The army itself handles pretty well as it's fast and can really dish out damage when it gets into combat.

The main concern with the Ogres is their mediocre leadership which can require the use of a BSB and pressing the attack quickly to avoid the danger of taking too many panic checks. The crown jewel has to be the Butcher though as he provides you with a general who has a great number of wounds, a good toughness and the ability to heal back wounds when he casts spells. In all my games I've played against Ogres I'm still waiting to see a Butcher who dies from something else other than being caught as part of a fleeing unit.

Kahadras

gorblud
26-08-2012, 00:44
I may be wrong, but that list does not sound legal to me. If I remember correctly, in order to have more Longbeards than Warriors you need a Lord, so to have a single unit of Longbeards and no Warriors you need a Lord (and not a Thane) in the list to use their Royal Blood rule.

When upgraded to rangers longbeards doesn't apply to the warrior - longbeard ratio anymore, it's in the faq.

poppabear
26-08-2012, 00:46
Depends on what you define as 'easy'. But if your meaning an army which you can just move your stuff with out carring, rule dice and watch armies blow up in front of you, I'd choose Chaos Dwarfs, Lore of Hashut is just crasy good, and K'daaii Destroyer can destroy armies all on his own, or die turn one/two, really its one of those two what defines the game

Sh4d0w
26-08-2012, 06:46
I have this irritating issue wherin I seem to choose difficult to use armies in most games, the latest was a proxied High Elf army. After a sound defeat (due to me being a terrible player) I realised I might need something a little easier to use.

Well playing an army for the first time and losing on your first game doesn't really mean anything...

Warrior of Chaos
29-08-2012, 03:18
Try some "tenacity" stick with an army....Losing is a part of the road to becoming successful!

^This. Don't just give up on an Army because you have had a bad experience. As to the OP question I'd say try Dwarfs for simplistic rules and few unit choices. They are tough and do well, but you won't be bogged down by a magic phase and can focus on CC and Shooting. Just my two cents...