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Nitrous
09-09-2012, 17:09
Hi Everyone,

I'm new to Warhammer and any helpful advice is really appreciated!

This is my first list and I've been collecting the models that I mention below since last Christmas.

The armies I will be playing against locally are High Elves, WoC, Dark Elves and Vampire Counts.

Lords

Orc Warboss (General)
Talisman of Preservation
Enchanted Shield
Great Weapon
171 pts

Savage Orc Shaman
Level 4 Upgrade
Lucky Shrunken Head
Fencers Blades
290 pts

Heroes

Orc Big Boss
BSB
Boar
Charmed Shield
Great Weapon
107 pts

Night Goblin Shaman
Level 2 Upgrade
Dispel Scroll
110 pts

Core

40 Night Goblins
Musician
Standard
Nets
Single Fanatic
210 pts

36 Savage Orcs
Musician
Standard
Additional Hand Weapons
Upgrade to Big 'Uns
416 pts

5 Goblin Wolf Riders
Musician
Short Bows
65 pts

Special

30 Black Orcs
Boss
Musician
Standard
Shields
425 pts

Orc Boar Chariot
Extra Member
90 pts

6 Trolls
210 pts

Rare

Rock Lobber
Bully
95 pts

Doomdiver
80 pts

Mangler Squig
65 pts

Mangler Squig
65 pts

2399 Point Total

SimaoSegunda
09-09-2012, 19:06
Fairly solid list. Why have the BSB on boar though? It means he won't get LoS. The only reason I can see for mounting him is so that he can lead the troll unit without reducing it's movement, but a generic boss would work just as well, without leaving your BSB exposed.

I'd consider knocking him off the boar and sticking him in a unit. Take the Bully out of the Lobba, and you'll have saved enough points to take an extra fanatic.

My other question is, is the Great Weapon on the Warboss really worth it? He's already S5, S6 in the first round of each combat, which is more than enough to damage Elves, and against Vampire Counts (except actual vampires themselves), you're wasting the opportunity for him to be striking first. Also, it makes having the Enchanted Shield a bit of a waste, since he won't get to benefit from it in combat (As great weapons require two hands). I'd consider the Gold Sigil Sword (Strike first against most enemies, and deny High Elves their re-rolls to hit, while keeping the "Choppas" bonus, and is also a Magic Weapon, which will avoid him being pinned by Ethereals.)

One final suggestion: Give the general's unit the Standard of Discipline, the Ld10 bubble is really useful. 1/4 of your opponents causes Fear, rising to 3/4 for your Goblin units.

Crube
09-09-2012, 19:28
I'm not normally a fan on mixed O&G lists, but this looks really good...

Couple of things I'd add...

firstly, how mny wolf riders?

and

I'd personally drop the netters and increase the size of the NG unit. They die very easily so more bodies is always handy....

SimaoSegunda
09-09-2012, 19:35
I'm not normally a fan on mixed O&G lists, but this looks really good...

Couple of things I'd add...

firstly, how mny wolf riders?

5, for that points cost.



I'd personally drop the netters and increase the size of the NG unit. They die very easily so more bodies is always handy....

Good call, I agree. The best use of Netters is for when you have Characters in the unit, otherwise the points are usually better spent on more Gobbos! Oh, on the NGs, I assume they have spears?

Nitrous
09-09-2012, 20:37
Fairly solid list. Why have the BSB on boar though? It means he won't get LoS. The only reason I can see for mounting him is so that he can lead the troll unit without reducing it's movement, but a generic boss would work just as well, without leaving your BSB exposed.

I'd consider knocking him off the boar and sticking him in a unit. Take the Bully out of the Lobba, and you'll have saved enough points to take an extra fanatic.

My other question is, is the Great Weapon on the Warboss really worth it? He's already S5, S6 in the first round of each combat, which is more than enough to damage Elves, and against Vampire Counts (except actual vampires themselves), you're wasting the opportunity for him to be striking first. Also, it makes having the Enchanted Shield a bit of a waste, since he won't get to benefit from it in combat (As great weapons require two hands). I'd consider the Gold Sigil Sword (Strike first against most enemies, and deny High Elves their re-rolls to hit, while keeping the "Choppas" bonus, and is also a Magic Weapon, which will avoid him being pinned by Ethereals.)

One final suggestion: Give the general's unit the Standard of Discipline, the Ld10 bubble is really useful. 1/4 of your opponents causes Fear, rising to 3/4 for your Goblin units.

Thank you for your quick response!


You're spot on with saying the Orc Boss on the Boar was for looking after the Troll unit. My theory was that he would babysit and, if needed, be able to get away and help elsewhere.

Great advice about the Gold Sigil Sword, I'd always planned to be led by a Black Orc Warboss so when I put Great Weapons on both I guess I was compensating for "Armed to da Teef".

Which unit would be best for the General? The Black Orcs can generally take care of themselves and if I put him into the Savages along with the Savage Shaman I would think the enemy would go straight for that unit - rather than the Squigs.

Thank you Crube for your suggestion on Netters, I'll consider buying another box of NG's, and Simao is correct the NG units is using spears.

SimaoSegunda
09-09-2012, 21:01
I figured that was why you had him with the trolls, because I did the same when I first started! It works at low points values, but the higher the points the more vulnerable he becomes. A lot of that depends on how your meta plays, but I would recommend babysitting them with a regular boss, or even just try to keep them in the General + BSB bubble to make them more controllable. Oddly enough, Trolls usually work better either unsupported, because with two ranks you'd hope to get enough kills to overcome static combat res, but if the enemy has softer targets than the trolls to attack, that can swing a combat, or going in alongside a horde to get the full combat res bonuses.

I love the Sigil Sword, I use it in every OnG list I make.

Whichever unit you pick for the General is going to become a target. I notice you haven't gone for a Boss in the Savage Orc unit. Obviously, that is where the Shaman is going, but he has no-one to accept challenges on his behalf. Therefore, I would recommend guarding him with your Warboss. If you're still considering having a Black Orc Warboss, then it becomes even more important to have them together. If your Savage Orcs fail animosity, there is a good chance the Shaman will be unable to cast. Having a Blorc in the unit removes this risk.

I hope some of my suggestions are useful to you.

Nitrous
09-09-2012, 21:46
I figured that was why you had him with the trolls, because I did the same when I first started! It works at low points values, but the higher the points the more vulnerable he becomes. A lot of that depends on how your meta plays, but I would recommend babysitting them with a regular boss, or even just try to keep them in the General + BSB bubble to make them more controllable. Oddly enough, Trolls usually work better either unsupported, because with two ranks you'd hope to get enough kills to overcome static combat res, but if the enemy has softer targets than the trolls to attack, that can swing a combat, or going in alongside a horde to get the full combat res bonuses.

I love the Sigil Sword, I use it in every OnG list I make.

Whichever unit you pick for the General is going to become a target. I notice you haven't gone for a Boss in the Savage Orc unit. Obviously, that is where the Shaman is going, but he has no-one to accept challenges on his behalf. Therefore, I would recommend guarding him with your Warboss. If you're still considering having a Black Orc Warboss, then it becomes even more important to have them together. If your Savage Orcs fail animosity, there is a good chance the Shaman will be unable to cast. Having a Blorc in the unit removes this risk.

I hope some of my suggestions are useful to you.

Again excellent advice.

My thoughts on taking the bully was to eliminate the risk of Elvan fear, but if I drop the Bully, Netters, two great weapons and the Boar that free's up 83 points.

That gives me the 45 points required for the upgrade to a Black Orc Warboss/35 points for Big Boss, 15 for the Sigil Sword and 15 for the Standard of Discipline. Plus a little change to play around with.

haveyouseenaduck
12-09-2012, 19:26
The BSB is on the boar for the +2 armour save. I'd keep on it.

Spiney Norman
12-09-2012, 21:30
5, for that points cost.




Good call, I agree. The best use of Netters is for when you have Characters in the unit, otherwise the points are usually better spent on more Gobbos! Oh, on the NGs, I assume they have spears?

I'll agree to disagree on this one then, Netters are absurdly awesome and should be taken in every Night Goblin unit you want to put into combat, you effectively make the entire unit T4 for 45pts

The only thing that really stands out to me is your combo of shields and great weapons is a bit of a waste because you can't use them both at the same time.

Nitrous
12-09-2012, 23:07
I'll agree to disagree on this one then, Netters are absurdly awesome and should be taken in every Night Goblin unit you want to put into combat, you effectively make the entire unit T4 for 45pts

The only thing that really stands out to me is your combo of shields and great weapons is a bit of a waste because you can't use them both at the same time.

Yeah the Great Weapons are gone. It's nice to have a different view though, cheers for the post.

whitespyre
16-09-2012, 20:40
One final suggestion: Give the general's unit the Standard of Discipline, the Ld10 bubble is really useful. 1/4 of your opponents causes Fear, rising to 3/4 for your Goblin units.

Is the General in with the savage Orcs? How do you get the L10with the SoD?