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DarKolia
12-09-2012, 20:25
Hi

I will have a match in a few weeks against one of my friend's brand new Ogre Kingdom pirate themed army (I am bit jealous because he got a grip on all these fantastic models from Titan-forge before me...)
I wanted to use my usual WE army but it seems to be a so bad matchup, that I decided to switch to high elf:
Here is the list I plan to play:

General 360 pts
Lvl 4 Death Magic +Folariath Robe+Preservation Talisman+Silver Wand

Heroes
Lvl 2 Shadow magic + Seerstaff of Saphery + Sword of Fear + Courage Gem 185 pts
BSB + GW+Caledor Armor+ Opal Amulet+ Ironcurse Icon 163pts

Core
20 archers Full Command + Flaming banner 255 pts
20 archers Full Command 245 pts

Special 690 pts
39 White lions Full Command + Skeinsliver+ Banner of sorcery

Rare 100 pts
2 eagles

So the main idea is to use Debuff from lore of shadow (I want to choose them so there is the seerstaff wand) and death and snipe characters (ironblaster) with lore of death
Archers over spearman so that they can focus on a debuffed unit and have a counter charge fire (over the extra rank) Armor will be useless moreover...
White lions horde because I have one I want to play!

All this was before I learnt a bit about mournfang (I don't have the army book) Are they really 1+ AS?
What else should I fear... it seems that OK have powerful mages now?
Should I switch the lore of the two mages?
Any counsel(s) will be welcome...
Sincerely,

DarK

Valden
12-09-2012, 20:41
I have played vs Ogres with my HE, and I also have an OK army, so I may be able to help you!
Firstly, they are really painful for us Elves, its an uncomfortable truth. Lots of Stomps and Impact hits are just what ****s us up, they get to avoid our good WS and take advantage of our T3. However, I think you are largely on the right track using shadow, OK's need debuffing! The horde of WLs is also one of the best things you can do imo, they will dish out some serious pain even to Ogres.

My advice is as follows:

Lose the Mage and give Shadow to your archmage. Also lose the cloak on your archmage; he already has a 4+ WS. Also cut down the WLs to 34. This should give you an additional 300 points to muck about with.

Also lose the Eagles and the Skeinsliver; Eagles are fairy useless against Ogres. Add these points onto the 300 you already saved and you can get a block of phoenix guard to go with your lions. This will be a tough combo to break even for Ogres.

Just my thoughts, hope it helps

DarKolia
12-09-2012, 20:50
My ideas with the eagle was to use the double flees tactics (cf. video by MrMallorian or TmRichards I don't remember) to prevent a direct charge on the WL...
Do you think that the saved points could be used in a DP unit (do they stand a chance against mournfang?)
I have some PG and I considered using them but they are not ready so I will have to assemble them (and I miss some halberds they are the OOP metal ones with removable halberds)
That may be worth a try thought (all least that will give me a modelling goal ;))...
Thanks

PS: death seems cool against mournfangs Ld 7 ... so I may just sweep the two lore and add DP ... Also I was wondering if the -3Cd debuff could be useful (or asking differently will I win any combat?)... also they are low I so the two big spells with I test from the two lores could useful and in the list I proposed I am pretty sure I will get one (Can I choose the spells from the seerstaff after rolling the other spells... that was the idea...)
Also What about High Magic... because of shield, curse (+ debuff), vaul (against hellheart)

Kalerith
12-09-2012, 23:27
Against Ogres I believe Shadow is the better option manily because of strength debuff. Because I belive that when the Ogres S are reduced the stomps and impacts will hurt you a lot less. I also think that the secound mage aint all that great in this list. The PG`s are the better option I believe.
Or else yuo could just go cheesecake mode and grab life and book of hoeth. You dont even need to put your archmage oustide your WL. After all he will be 3W with T7 and preferably 4+ regen xD In a prolonged combat where you are buffed you will win. Mainly if the Ogres dont break you in the round they charge their chances of sucess decreases sharply in the secound round. So for your own part I think eagles are a good choice if it means you can manage to rob the ogres of their charge vs your WL.

If your friened have some knowlegde of how ogres work in a tournament setteing you could risk facing the "Deff Fister". (Or Defffister, I like spelling it with three f`s, just cus :3 )

(Seasoned Ogre or tournament players may skip this part.)
Basicly what this means is that you need to kill his magelord. (Only weird people field tyrants anyways). Basicly he will take the lore of death which the name implies and he will take a item which grants a 6+ wsave and 1+ strength. Also if he saves attacks with this save magic weapons become mundane. But here comes the important part, each time he infilcts a "hit" the mage hit will loose a magic level. A hit is not only in close combat, but also works on the Caress of Laniph and Fate of Bjuna spells. (Not the signature spell). So if you get hit by one of these spells you will loose a magic level. (Even if the spell doesnt hurt you).

So if yes on the question I asked then you might consider preparing for this build. In addition Mournefangs are 2+ not 1+. (But they get parry even when mounted!)

DarKolia
13-09-2012, 15:48
You have a -1S -1T debuff in death magic too...

(thanks for the info anyway... I am not sure he will run such an optimized list... maybe I will bring Teclis for the revenge if he does...;)...)