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aim
14-09-2012, 10:16
Hi all,

Hope this is in the right place as I'm not asking for tactics or a list, more some advice.

Basicly, what is the best (and, if different, most cost effective) XV8 loadout for killing marines in your opinion?

Marine players, which battlesuits give you a headache? (I know theres a million and one marine players so there should be nice fedback from this)

I have the codex and FAQ's and what not so no points or anything are needed, just equipment, weapons and config names if you have them.

Cheers lovies xxx.

ehlijen
14-09-2012, 10:30
That is very much opinion. None of the crisis suit weapons are perfect for that role.

Plasma is the obvious candidate, but it's actually a TEQ killer and is costed as such: too high to be cost effective vs MEQs in cover.
Missile pods are nice, but not AP3 and part of the S goes to waste.
Burst cannon are cheaper and get plenty of shots, but don't go through the armour and using one will leave you in bolter return fire range.

The most commonly suggested ones are Missile+Plasma+multitracker and Fusion+plasma+multitracker. But I reckon TL Plasma + BS upgrade or BC + plasma + Multitracker are also decent at that job. It really depends on what secondary role you want for them.

aim
14-09-2012, 10:34
Cool, opinions are fine, I like choices. As for a secondary role, they don't have one. They are purely for killing marines / Termies. I'll have rails for tanks and whatnot.

Just playing a game with some friends tonight and I'm only going to be fighting against marines.

ehlijen
14-09-2012, 11:01
Killing termies is a seperate role from killing meqs, in which case plasma + fusion blaster is your best bet.

riotknight
14-09-2012, 11:21
My go to for basically all comers its FireKnife. That is: Plasma, Misskle Pod and Multitracker.

2 unots of this, 1 of deathrain(tl missile pod and ta's) can deal with armor and MEQ effectively. Even better with marker support.

Like the rest odd the tau army it does not stand alone, need to support it with the appropriate army composition.

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totgeboren
14-09-2012, 14:29
Boringly the Fireknife is your best bet. Plasma+missile pod+multitracker. The thing with marines is that they tend to come in Rhinos, and the missile pods are great for opening up rhinos. The plasma is great for killing the MEQs that come out of the Rhinos the missiles pop, though somewhat expensive, but it works just as well vs termies too.

If you are facing a horde of marines, a twin-plasma with bs upgrade might be better, but really, missile pods make the suits fill a role the rest of the army struggles with (killing AV 12 things, which you often don't want to waste your railguns on), so a missile and a plasma gives you a great suit that complements the rest of your army nicely.

VeGaS1986
15-09-2012, 07:52
Alot of people will mention the fireknife, but let me tell you, if you want to kill marines (not terminators, the 3+ kind) you cant go wrong with the Firestorm (generic name I know but oh well). Basically three suits with twinlinked flamers and drone controller with gun drones. The drones give them added firepower, but are mostly for wound absorption on the way in. Now I know you may be thinking, flamers arent THAT good, but when you have three of them, rerolling to wound, its gonna sting...alot. When I see this unit being used it regularly manages to kill 7-8 marines in one big SWOOSH. Ofc the main reason this setup works is the cost. For your investment they can do alot of killing and if nothing else absorb a good amount of enemy fire.

Doesnt hurt that they are even better vs the likes of orks and guard.

Stonerhino
15-09-2012, 15:47
Fire Warriors and a bucket of dice. Unless they are fnp MEQs.

riotknight
15-09-2012, 20:28
Alot of people will mention the fireknife, but let me tell you, if you want to kill marines (not terminators, the 3+ kind) you cant go wrong with the Firestorm (generic name I know but oh well). Basically three suits with twinlinked flamers and drone controller with gun drones. The drones give them added firepower, but are mostly for wound absorption on the way in. Now I know you may be thinking, flamers arent THAT good, but when you have three of them, rerolling to wound, its gonna sting...alot. When I see this unit being used it regularly manages to kill 7-8 marines in one big SWOOSH. Ofc the main reason this setup works is the cost. For your investment they can do alot of killing and if nothing else absorb a good amount of enemy fire.

Doesnt hurt that they are even better vs the likes of orks and guard.

7-8 seems way to high...

The fact they take an elite spot away from deathrain or fire knife when the army sorely needs their support more than the flamers is reason enough to skip it.

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Threeshades
15-09-2012, 21:58
7-8 seems way to high...
Way high indeed,you'd need to get a lot of very well placed templates for that. You'd need to get around 10 or 11 hits per template to come out with 7 or 8 marines dead on average. so you have to get REALLY close and since we are talking about a class of infantry that never comes in units larger than 10 you also need to be placed perfectly to hit the entire squad with each one.

riotknight
15-09-2012, 22:01
Way high indeed,you'd need to get a lot of very well placed templates for that. You'd need to get around 10 or 11 hits per template to come out with 7 or 8 marines dead on average. so you have to get REALLY close and since we are talking about a class of infantry that never comes in units larger than 10 you also need to be placed perfectly to hit the entire squad with each one.

I was gonna run the numbers but I'm on my phone and that makes it a pain, but that unit would probably average maybe 2 dead marines if each template hit 3

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Charistoph
15-09-2012, 22:33
Might I suggest the Cyclical Ion Blaster for the Team Leader? 5 Rending shots (against non-vehicles) can potentially do wonders against them.

ehlijen
16-09-2012, 03:39
Battlesuit team leaders don't get to take CIBs. They are restricted to special issue wargear (unlike commanders or bodyguards, which have access to special issue 'systems'). Also, if you're taking a CIB it should be on a higher BS commander model.

red_drake
16-09-2012, 03:45
Battle suit team leaders can be upgrade to shas'.... Vre? That can take special issue stuff

And you get .25 dead marines per model covered by the template.
(if my math is correct: .75 chance to wound with twin liked and .33 chance to fail a save)

We also have to remember that he's buying drones with these suits do each drone has a .12 chance of killing a marine... >.>

Murphey
16-09-2012, 04:39
My build, which has served me very well (only lost 2 games out of about 40+ over the years) has been with the "Team Inferno" army. The idea being that they are cheap, effective, and all comers.

It's TL flamers + Missile pod on battlesuits, with team leader going with Plasma rather than missile pod, 2 shield drones, and a multi-tracker. Total squad is extremely cheap, and extremely effective. (made all the better with the ability to pre-measure in 6th.) Get 3 teams of those, plus a similarly equipped bodyguard team with your commander, and you have a very mobile, versatile force.

Now, to be honest, the crisis suits are not the best route for killing MEQs in general (although cracking transports and laying down the flamers is hilarious). For that, I'd recommend the Ion Cannon for your hammerhead. I've actually never went with the railgun on my hammerheads, too expensive for the effectiveness. The ion cannon though allow you to have an extremely powerful, MEQ killing/light vehicle killing, very difficult to kill tank. Ion cannon + burst cannons + disruption pods comes out to 120 pts I think. (Although I like the target lock as well) Point for point, one of the best vehicles of it's type in the game.

Now, for a little mathhammer, let's say that I can snag an average of 5 marines per template with my Inferno team: 5*3=15 hits. 0.75 wounds per hit: 15*0.75=11.25 wounds. 33.33% save failure on 3+: 11.25*0.33333=3.75 dead marines from just the flamers. Factor in the plasma gun: 0.5*0.833333*2=.83 additional wounds. So, on average, you're doing 4.58 wounds to a MEQ squad with a conservative flamer estimate of 5 hits per template. That is honestly quite good compared to most armies, especially when factoring in the cost, resiliency, and maneuverability of the unit. Also, you need to factor in the fact that, when out of range of flamers, the Inferno team is launching missiles at any vehicle or armor 4+ or worse enemy they can see. I would highly recommend the build.

Mathhammer Tau Number Extravaganza!
Rapid fire range, 10 deep unit of firewarriors on MEQ unit: 2.22 wounds.
As above with 1 markerlights: 2.96 wounds.
As above with 2 markerlights: 3.7 wounds.

Hammerhead described above with full weapons on MEQ unit: 2.55 wounds.
As above with 1 markerlight: 3.19 wounds.

Point for point, the Hammerhead is your best bet, especially taking in their immunity to small arms fire and insane cover save. Other honorable mention for the job:

Plasma upgraded, multi-tracker broadsides with no vehicles on the field to target (5.63 wounds, also INSANE on overwatch)

ehlijen
16-09-2012, 09:12
Battle suit team leaders can be upgrade to shas'.... Vre? That can take special issue stuff


Only special issue wargear, not systems (ie only things from the far right column in the suit armoury that are special issue).

red_drake
16-09-2012, 15:47
Well, I've never actually noticed that the bodyguard and shas'vre entries differ o.o

ehlijen
17-09-2012, 00:59
Easy mistake to make. Most special issue systems were much better on the commanders than a 'vre anyway.