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Minigiant
25-09-2012, 20:39
I was wondering is there any titan sized daemon engines?

Herman the Heathen
25-09-2012, 21:22
You have the Khorne Lord of Battle. I think that's the biggest one. About the height of a Warhound but far bulkier.

You find all the engines here:

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Daemon_Engine

Chem-Dog
25-09-2012, 21:44
Titan size is a funny quantity. Since oldschool Epic days the scale has skewed quite a bit, none more so as when Forgeworld started to bring them into the believable scale they're using. So, there are a few machines that would have been considered acceptable as a rough displacement equivalent of a Titan, but they might not bear up as such in newer thinking.

Khorne had the Tower of Skulls, Lord of Battle, Brass Scorpion, Cauldron of Blood, Death Dealer, Doomblaster, and Brass cannon. Each of which would probably be a Superheavy of some type and thus put them in at least the lower end of the "Titan sized" scale.

Nurgle rocked in with the Plague Tower and the Contaigon.

Slaanesh had the Subjugator and Questor which were essentially possessed and warped scout titans.

Tzeench had the Silver Tower of Tzeench and the Fire Lord. Both of which were floaty-flying things.

There was also the Banelord Titan, a corrupted Warlord and there was even a variant of the Imperator turned to chaos but in both these instances they are possessed vehicles, not Daemon Engines.

Still Standing
25-09-2012, 22:02
Well a demon engine is essentially a possessed vehicle... Therefore eventually most Chaos vehicles seem to become possessed...

Chem-Dog
25-09-2012, 22:56
I'd argue that. A Daemon engine, to date, has been exclusively a machine specifically built for purpose of housing/containing a Daemon, this implies that it requires a Daemon to be functional where as a possessed vehicle is generally something that can function without a Daemon but just happens to currently contain a Daemon., a Titan, A Predator or Vindicator can do their thing quite happily without a warpspawned entity inhabiting it, a Daeon Engine can't. And even then, it's the crew of the vehicle who are possessed initially, the vehicle becomes corrupted as the Daemon's influence over it increases.

Still Standing
25-09-2012, 22:59
A Soul Grinder is a possessed Defiler...

unwanted
26-09-2012, 00:00
A Soul Grinder is a possessed Defiler...

But a regular Defiler is fuelled by Daemons too, or am I misremembering?

MajorWesJanson
26-09-2012, 00:08
A Soul Grinder is a possessed Defiler...


But a regular Defiler is fuelled by Daemons too, or am I misremembering?

Yep. A defiler is created by summoning a daemon and binding it inside by force to keep it controllable. A Soul Grinder is what happens when daemons themselves take a wrecked defiler and bond with it, possessing it without the sorts of runes and wards used by the Dark Mechanicus to exert control over Defilers.

twistedmarine
26-09-2012, 00:10
But a regular Defiler is fuelled by Daemons too, or am I misremembering?

A soul grinder is a daemon machine. Defilers are possessed machines.

ss_cherubael
26-09-2012, 00:12
Chem-dog is right, demon engines are made on demon worlds within the warp and have demons slaved into them to power them. While a possessed vehicle was originally crewed by mortals and became overcome by a demon. I guess it comes down to the original intention behind making the vehicle.

Wishing
26-09-2012, 14:17
A soul grinder is a daemon machine. Defilers are possessed machines.

Not sure I agree, as I agree with Chem-Dog that a possessed vehicle has to originally have had crew and the ability to function without being possessed. If a Defiler has no space for crew, then it must be built specifically for daemonic control, which makes it a daemon engine. From what I read here, the Soul Grinder sounds (and looks) more like a big daemon that just happens to have given itself some mechanical parts, which by my logic makes it no more a vehicle than a marine with a bionic leg is a vehicle.

To answer the original question again, the Lord of Battles is the original daemon engine to have a titan damage grid when they were first introduced. Later on, the Slaanesh scout engines and the Nurgle Plague Tower (the Firelord too?) had titan damage grids too, as I recall. Those were smaller than a Reaver titan, about the size of Warhounds, and there were no daemon engines bigger than them.

AlphariusOmegon20
26-09-2012, 19:03
Not sure I agree, as I agree with Chem-Dog that a possessed vehicle has to originally have had crew and the ability to function without being possessed. If a Defiler has no space for crew, then it must be built specifically for daemonic control, which makes it a daemon engine. From what I read here, the Soul Grinder sounds (and looks) more like a big daemon that just happens to have given itself some mechanical parts, which by my logic makes it no more a vehicle than a marine with a bionic leg is a vehicle.

To answer the original question again, the Lord of Battles is the original daemon engine to have a titan damage grid when they were first introduced. Later on, the Slaanesh scout engines and the Nurgle Plague Tower (the Firelord too?) had titan damage grids too, as I recall. Those were smaller than a Reaver titan, about the size of Warhounds, and there were no daemon engines bigger than them.

IIRC, according to fluff, none of the titans actually have a crew anymore, up to and including the Banelord. Therefore, they would be Daemon Engines also, by that account.

Wishing
28-09-2012, 09:26
IIRC, according to fluff, none of the titans actually have a crew anymore, up to and including the Banelord. Therefore, they would be Daemon Engines also, by that account.

I'm not sure I understand. Chem-Dog stated (and I agreed) that a vehicle that was originally designed to have crew, but then was possessed by a daemon instead, is a possessed vehicle. A vehicle that was built with no way to contain crew, and which can therefore only work by daemonic power, is a daemon engine. You saying that chaos titans don't have crew anymore is just saying that they are possessed chaos titans, who once had crew but now have daemons. That specifically defines them as possessed vehicles and not daemon engines.

tdh6002
28-09-2012, 12:46
This is the biggest one with official rules: http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1181499_Chaos_Space_Marines_Datasheet_-_Banelord_of_Khorne.pdf

Killgore
28-09-2012, 13:19
It could be argued that the Tzeentch Firelord has been remade into the new Heldrake model :)

Out of all the Daemon Titan engines Khorne has the coolest, Banelord with a giant Assault cannon pointing out its mouth :D

Wishing
28-09-2012, 13:32
The Banelord is a possessed chaos titan, not a daemon engine. But daemon engines did used to be an exclusively khorne thing, the other powers only got theirs much later. My favourites were the Lord of Battles and the tzeentch Silver Tower and Firelord, though I would say that in terms of size, it must be the Doomwing that is now the Helldrake.