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Shidensen
07-10-2012, 21:09
My buddy and I couldn't come to a consensus on this issue while charging:

He charged his unit of Dire Wolves at my Handgunners (he had to make two 45 degree wheels to get around my IC knights) and once they made the charge (he rolled and moved), he declared a charge with his Blood Knights at my IC Knights, when the Blood Knights were behind the Dire Wolves. It looked like this:

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Is this legal? I thought you had to declare all charges first and then you move them in whatever order you want. He could move the Dire Wolves first and then the Blood Knights to make it work, but would he be able to declare that charge with his Blood Knights in the first place?

JDV311
07-10-2012, 21:47
It's legit but know that he only gets 1 wheel to align, move to make contact and then close the door (which is free)

Smogg
07-10-2012, 21:52
A few things.

Only one wheel is allowed when charging. But if you make it into contact with the enemy, you then get an additional free wheel to "close the door". To me it seems like the distance between the dire wolves and then inner circle knights would not allow the direwolves to reach the hangunners in a single wheel. But maybe there was a bit more space on the battlefield.

He has to declare his charge, then you should respond "flee" or "stand and shoot". If you stand and shoot, then that is resolved at once. Then he can declare his next charge with his blood knights against your knights, then you respond with your reaction. Once all charged are declared, then he can move them in the order he prefers.

So assuming the direwolves can reach the handgunners with a single wheel, then he is allowed to declare the blood knight charge as well.

T10
07-10-2012, 22:22
He could move the Dire Wolves first and then the Blood Knights to make it work, but would he be able to declare that charge with his Blood Knights in the first place?

Smogg pointed out the error in your procedure, but I'd like to point you to the section "Can I charge?" on p. 16: It allows for charges to be considered 'possible' even if there is a friendly unit in the way. The rules explain this in more detail.

-T10

Chicago Slim
08-10-2012, 02:10
So, the OP is correct that all charges are declared (with charge responses happening immediately), and chargers are moved only after all charges are declared (and responses are resolved). Once he moves any of this chargers, he's left the "Declare Chargers sub-phase". Locally, we'll often allow for a bit of "Oh, duh, I did that out-of-order", particularly if the late declaration was unrelated to the prematurely-resolved charge (definitely not the case in your example).

Had he made the Blood Knight's declaration before moving the Dire Wolves (or any other charger), the charge declaration would be legal (as T10 is hinting) so long as the Blood Knights had line-of-sight prior to the Dire Wolves moving (which they pretty surely would, since both they and their target are mounted, and thus elevated above the height of the wolves).

Finally, as others have said, chargers can only wheel (at most) once during the charge (though the "closing the door" is essentially a second wheel, which will take place only after base-to-base contact is made). Both the wheel and the close-the-door are effectively "free", since you don't measure movement *during* a charge (you only measure it before moving, to ensure that you're in charge range).

victorvictor6
08-10-2012, 18:29
Continuing on , if the wolves only hit the hand gunners in the middle. After closing the door do you leave half of the wolves models hanging off the edge or move them along to get all models into attack?

Shidensen
08-10-2012, 19:27
I found this picture in my phone from the game - luckily it shows the combat right after the charges. The 10 blue/silver Knights (one of the horses in the back doesn't match) are the ones that got charged, the Blood Knights are the models in contact with them (with two spells on). The Handgunners are against the wall in combat with the Dire Wolves (he forgot the models at home and they have a magic card on them). Unfortunately all of the other units around them also moved, but this picture is definitely during that same turn they charged.

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Based on this, the Handgunners were actually further back than what I had shown, so the Dire Wolves would not have been able to charge them - they would have made contact on the edge at best, if they didn't hit any other units along the way.

Either way looks like the Blood Knights could legally complete the charge so that's good to know. Thanks for the input everybody