PDA

View Full Version : Eldar rumors via Faeit 212



TheDoctor
03-03-2013, 07:02
Hey all, didn't see another thread like this on the page, so feel free to delete if necessary:

http://natfka.blogspot.fi/2013/03/eldar-rumors-get-jump-start.html?m=1

Hendarion
03-03-2013, 07:12
Yeaaa, yeaaa... we heard so much stuff... I want my promised Eldar-flyers from February!

Thanks for your link though.

TheDoctor
03-03-2013, 07:17
Yeah, i figure its so far out lots of salt is necessary. But im an optimist at heart...

eldargal
03-03-2013, 07:27
Seems like a lot of stuff we have heard before with just a few new things sprinkled in, I'd like to believe it is because things are firming up with 6-7 months to the (rumoured) codex release but more likely it is just rumour chinese whispers. Happy to be wrong though, especially with that bit about Banshees.

nosebiter
03-03-2013, 07:37
Yeah, dont believe much of it. Although it sounds nice.

All we would need on top of those items are: 18/24" shuriken catapults, better phoenix lords and some ground based AA

Hendarion
03-03-2013, 07:46
Well, Banshees being fixed in combat is one good thing. But if GW doesn't invent a glorious way how to deliver them there, I don't see that as good rumours. Banshees not only suffer from being lackluster, but also from not getting there on foot or in Wave Serpents. Hearing them to become glass-canons ain't making it better.
Interesting is the bit about psychers in groups being better than alone.
Avatar getting buffed... dunno what to think about that, my opponents still hate him eating through their terminators. Dunno how he should be buffable unless he can fleet and gets feel no pain on top of the current stuff. And that would be both quite crazy.

RandomThoughts
03-03-2013, 07:50
I think this is pretty much a summary of what most Eldar players are hoping for - which means it's pretty unlikely to happen, I'm afraid... :(

Grot
03-03-2013, 07:57
Avatar getting buffed... Dunno how he should be buffable unless he can fleet and gets feel no pain on top of the current stuff. And that would be both quite crazy.

They could just have given him a very open-to-interpretation 'immune to fire' rule, sort of like the generously worded plasma syphon.

On a personal note, these rumours don't help me get over my fear of nerfed wraithlords and poorer wraithguard.

geoffkemp
03-03-2013, 08:08
Well, Banshees being fixed in combat is one good thing. But if GW doesn't invent a glorious way how to deliver them there, I don't see that as good rumours. Banshees not only suffer from being lackluster, but also from not getting there on foot or in Wave Serpents. Hearing them to become glass-canons ain't making it better.


I don`t think that Banshees are broken at all. If anything 6th fixed them from their broken form in previous editions, as now they are no longer the "I win" button for Eldar and makes the Eldar player think a bit more based on army selection and placement etc. Banshees are still very good units in the right situations. One of my circle who plays eldar and I have discussed this and great length, and both feel that one change is that it makes Striking Scorpions a lot more of an attractive choice. Some one will no doubt prove us wrong, but intutivily feels that both units are in a good place as far as the bigger picture goes at the minute.

The Dude
03-03-2013, 08:42
For those who can't click through:


via an Anonymous Source from the Faeit 212 inbox
Just read your report with your new elder army.

A couple notes that you might find interesting:
As of 03/01/2013

- Autarchs take Paths. These represent completed paths they have walked and are tied to the various aspects. By taking a path you make the respective aspect warrior a troop choice (the exception are reapers who just become scoring)

- Overall point cost reduction (guardians see it the most, aspect warriors see it the least, but are instead a fair margin better with only a minor cost decrease for two of the schools).

- new special rule that influence how howling banshees interact in combat. It's current iteration really makes them feel like glass cannons that are amazing at what they're designed to do.

-Seer councils have brotherhood of psykers (the farseers still cast their own abilities in addition, but two farseers together cast more than 2 farseers separately)

- in general, aspect warriors are hyper focused and hyper successful if used properly
- No new aspect
- 2 new flyers
- lots of units get access to skyfire
- new tank (on falcon chasis)
- Avatar is buffed a lot
- Two new special characters
- exarchs are all really good in duels in different ways
- farseers are still awesome psykers
- warlocks improve deny the witch.
- falcon/wave serpent point reduction
- way to make some of the craftworld specific lists
- additional rules for allying with dark eldar
- expanded fluff on the war in heaven

Radium
03-03-2013, 08:47
Looking forward to the new codex! Most of the rumours match what we asked for in the various wishlisting threads, so let's just hope these pan out!

murgel2006
03-03-2013, 09:17
I don't buy it all especially the council.
The current incarnation rely on seercouncil for CC already, thus most people have ´em seers and warlocks in numbers, buffing them would not generate big sales.
I can see us not getting a new aspect. FW has covered the most things we would need (W-Hunter, Specters ...) but GW does not have a big history of bringing in the good FW stuff.
And why give us a less expensive option? GW/FW would be bad businessmen if they offered us a W-Hunter for 40€ instead of 45€. I mean it would generate massive sales but I don't see it.

I know I may sound bitter, but the last 2 incarnations of Eldar were all a nerf from their predecessor so I expect a "nice" hardcover book with excellent pictures and a comfortable place for my Eldar on the shelf.

eldargal
03-03-2013, 09:21
I don`t think that Banshees are broken at all.
Banshees themselves are not broken, power weapons are still nice, they are just somewhat underpowered for the price. The issue is that with no assault vehicle and not being able to disembark and assault anymore there is no way to effectively deliver them. So it does make a lot of sense for GW to be considering a way to revamp them (they are supposed to be the CCpower armour killers of the codex afterall) so it isn't unreasonable to see a rumour like this. The problem is it is also something oft wishlisted.


I don't buy it all especially the council.
The current incarnation rely on seercouncil for CC already, thus most people have ´em seers and warlocks in numbers, buffing them would not generate big sales.
I can see us not getting a new aspect. FW has covered the most things we would need (W-Hunter, Specters ...) but GW does not have a big history of bringing in the good FW stuff.
And why give us a less expensive option? GW/FW would be bad businessmen if they offered us a W-Hunter for 40€ instead of 45€. I mean it would generate massive sales but I don't see it.
I know I may sound bitter, but the last 2 incarnations of Eldar were all a nerf from their predecessor so I expect a "nice" hardcover book with excellent pictures and a comfortable place for my Eldar on the shelf.
There is no reason to assume that we won't see new GW kits for eldar just because FW sell some, quite the contrary. We won't see direct ports of the FW kit to plastic though. Eldar actually NEED this, the army list has barely changed in twenty years we need new units and new aspects wouldn't go amiss either. I've no doubt we will see a lot of new options if the last run of GW releases are anything to go by.
The last two incarnations of eldar (3rd and 4th) were a nerf because they are extraordinarily OP in 2nd edition. So far the 6th edition codices have all been very well balanced against each other (so have the 8th ed WFB army books) so I see no reason to be too pessimistic over the future of eldar. Though I freely admit GW have comprehensively managed to screw the old 4th edition codex up lately.

Having said all that, I still think these rumours are false.:)

silverstu
03-03-2013, 09:28
I have my doubts- I think this is just rehashed earlier[and inaccurate] stuff. It is too early to hear about rules for starters- I don't think we have had rules much in advance of any recent releases. Plus no mention of the large walker, new wraith guard - not really that much on new units at all- which I kind of expect 3-4 new additions.
I think the only thing we can expect is Eldar this year, with a flyer, large walker and wraith guard with a cc option. New bikes in a possible later wave.

Rick Blaine
03-03-2013, 09:41
via Faeit 212
Stopped reading there.

Malagor
03-03-2013, 09:53
Nothing about proper transports.
Maybe they will fix the wave serpent.
Still the rumours sound a bit too good to be true.

Ace Rimmer
03-03-2013, 10:32
Whilst I expect these rumours to be mostly rehashed versions of the previous rumours there are some bits that are bound to happen.

The logical shout for the "new" falcon chassis tank would be the Firestorm or an equivalent as 6th edition is the flyer edition, which I'd expect in a Wave Serpent/Falcon/Firestorm re-cut kit to maximise the kit to shelf-space ratio.

Pair that with a dual flyer kit, new jetbike/shining spear kit and either new guardians with both options or a dual aspect kit (scorpions/spiders maybe pg 62 style?)
Add in the 1-2 new SC's and some new fine-cast sculpts of existing options (avatar/autarch/farseer) and you've got a full release for the codex without rocking the boat too much.


Wham, bam, shut up GW and take my money.

MajorWesJanson
03-03-2013, 13:01
- Autarchs take Paths. These represent completed paths they have walked and are tied to the various aspects. By taking a path you make the respective aspect warrior a troop choice (the exception are reapers who just become scoring)/B]
Makes sense, and makes Autarchs useful. Fits with the various codices with upgradable HQ options like Heralds or Chaos Lords with Marks.

[B]- Overall point cost reduction (guardians see it the most, aspect warriors see it the least, but are instead a fair margin better with only a minor cost decrease for two of the schools).
Some eldar units really needed it. Guardians and the transports especially.

- new special rule that influence how howling banshees interact in combat. It's current iteration really makes them feel like glass cannons that are amazing at what they're designed to do.
Not sure about this. Maybe something like generating extra hits or wounds?

-Seer councils have brotherhood of psykers (the farseers still cast their own abilities in addition, but two farseers together cast more than 2 farseers separately)
Brotherhood of Psykers for Seer councils is a great idea.

- in general, aspect warriors are hyper focused and hyper successful if used properly
Makes sense.

- No new aspect
Not that many niches left that need filled, so I can see this.

- 2 new flyers
AA and Strike versions of a fighter most likely.

- lots of units get access to skyfire
Dark Reapers, Firestorm, support/heavy weapons platforms, maybe war walkers are my guess.

- new tank (on falcon chasis)
On the New Falcon chassis tank, I agree that a firestorm fits the bill easily. Not only is it a new tank, it is an AA unit, and would allow the falcon turret sprues to be recut into a single larger sprue with the new options, just like they did with the Fire Prism, where they added the Night Spinner. I don't expect the wave serpent to be added though.

- Avatar is buffed a lot
Well, looking at the new GD stats, probably a bump to 5 wounds, an extra 1-2 Init, extra attack or two, and maybe going from 3+/4++ to 2+/5++ and some changes to a few special rules.

- Two new special characters
New Phoenix Lord and a named Autarch?

- exarchs are all really good in duels in different ways
I can see this happening

- farseers are still awesome psykers
Probably base ML2 with option to buy to 3 for a quarter, and several runes options.

- warlocks improve deny the witch
Good use for them.

- falcon/wave serpent point reduction
They needed it. Other transports have been getting them.

- way to make some of the craftworld specific lists
Through the Autarch path system?

- additional rules for allying with dark eldar
Could be interesting

- expanded fluff on the war in heaven
Necron fluff has changed somewhat too, so this makes sense.

Hendarion
03-03-2013, 13:39
I don`t think that Banshees are broken at all. If anything 6th fixed them from their broken form in previous editions, as now they are no longer the "I win" button for Eldar and makes the Eldar player think a bit more based on army selection and placement etc. Banshees are still very good units in the right situations. One of my circle who plays eldar and I have discussed this and great length, and both feel that one change is that it makes Striking Scorpions a lot more of an attractive choice. Some one will no doubt prove us wrong, but intutivily feels that both units are in a good place as far as the bigger picture goes at the minute.
Excuse me? Banshees are crap since 3rd Edition. Now with changed transport rules (can't assault if you disembark) they are even more crap. I really don't know what kind of "win-button" you are talking about, most Eldar players aren't using banshees for like 10 years or more.

de Selby
03-03-2013, 14:17
Yeah, dont believe much of it. Although it sounds nice.

All we would need on top of those items are: 18/24" shuriken catapults, better phoenix lords and some ground based AA

I'm going to go out on a limb and make a prediction: GW will not fix shuriken catapults. When do they ever fix things just because they're obviously daft? The usual practice is to just shake everything up so much every few years with new units and edition changes that the old balance issues stop mattering; they'll make everything cheaper this codex so Guardians might get a helping hand there, but they likely don't even think there's an issue to be addressed. Last edition they went as far as introducing an entirely new weapon profile for Dire Avengers just to avoid fixing shuriken catapults.

It's the same as waiting for Lictors to be 'fixed' or any other unit that never performs like it should; it's just not a priority for the design studio.

We never get rules rumours this far out anyway, so we'll have to wait and see.

Rick Blaine
03-03-2013, 15:00
Faeit made a bunch of bogus predictions about Daemons on the 25th, that's just 6 days go. Just saying. To think he has something solid on a book that is months out is delusional.

Quark
03-03-2013, 15:13
Faeit's problem is that he's not an actual source and doesn't bother protecting himself. Have different sources, don't even label them with pseudonyms. Then when half are right and half are wrong (less at this point since he became more popular and thus troll bait) he complains about how unfair tracking everything is.

Simply labeling his sources would make it a much better rumor site.

Fable
03-03-2013, 15:32
At this point Faeit could say it's raining and I wouldn't believe it if my shoulders were wet. That said from this point on we can expect a few more batches of fake rumors that will probably have some things right by virtue of luck and a couple close misses, also by virtue of luck.

My personal thought is that the studio got well ahead of the release schedule with the big gap of 6th edition and anyone claiming these are rules for testing being done now are trolling.

Ryougi
03-03-2013, 15:48
Some interesting stuff regardless if true or not. I'll take something to think over rather than nothing. No new aspect would be disappointing. Something along the lines of the Slicing Orbs of Zandros would be interesting, though how those would fit in is questionable.

Malagor
03-03-2013, 16:11
Truthful or not, I'm just happy to see something of rumours atleast.

Chrysalis
03-03-2013, 16:27
IF this is true (and I'd pour a good bucket of salt on those rumors), I wouldn't like ties to the DE becoming too important. I'm already fed up with all those cookie-cutter lists of mandatory Eldar + Dark Eldar, I don't want it to become an official thing. I want my Biel-Tan Eldar to be able to slash their own xenophobic way without the help of the dark kin, and more generally, I want "Craft World Eldar" to simply become the default Eldar without needing DE or even Tau.

Otherwise, as a Biel-Tan player I'm glad about the good news concerning the scoring aspects and cheaper transports.

It also sounds like the rumors we had earlier in 2012 (the leaked list) were wrong, which is a good thing because it means we'll get nothing awfully named "xentarch".

Aryllon
03-03-2013, 16:29
Interesting. I'm most keen on new jetbikes / return to 2x Wraithguard variants / flyers / assault Serpents / better autarchs. For the most part this rumour makes me happy.

Aspects as troops... with a points reduction? That could get interesting... two autarchs, one with Spider path & one with Banshee path - multiple Surprise Assault combats on the shootiest units, let Banshees get on with the party (glass cannon ain't so glass if you can't shoot it, hehe) :D

Really curious about warlord traits, psychic powers and hopefully getting some 'named' special wargear (like Skalathrax / Lion's Roar etc). But that can wait.

I am sad to not hear anything about a Solitaire or other additional Harlequin options mind :(

Eldarsif
03-03-2013, 16:37
I don't buy it all especially the council.
The current incarnation rely on seercouncil for CC already, thus most people have ´em seers and warlocks in numbers, buffing them would not generate big sales.
I can see us not getting a new aspect. FW has covered the most things we would need (W-Hunter, Specters ...) but GW does not have a big history of bringing in the good FW stuff.
And why give us a less expensive option? GW/FW would be bad businessmen if they offered us a W-Hunter for 40€ instead of 45€. I mean it would generate massive sales but I don't see it.

I know I may sound bitter, but the last 2 incarnations of Eldar were all a nerf from their predecessor so I expect a "nice" hardcover book with excellent pictures and a comfortable place for my Eldar on the shelf.

Depends entirely on what models they are bringing in that might sell. If they finally provide a kit to make a seer council on jetbikes(as well as normal council with all variations) I believe it will sell quite well. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if the Seer council would get a model upgrade seeing how many of the models are really old.

Voss
03-03-2013, 18:28
The Autarch rumour is probably the most interesting one. But we'll see if any of these darts even have a target, let alone fly true.

MikeyB
03-03-2013, 21:07
The new codex needs to do 4 things for me to not put my eldar on ebay:

Increase the range of catapults
Give us an assault vehicle
reduce points
Take stuff out of the heavy support slot

if it does all of those i'll be on the way to being happy

Voss
03-03-2013, 21:31
The new codex needs to do 4 things for me to not put my eldar on ebay:

Increase the range of catapults
Give us an assault vehicle
reduce points
Take stuff out of the heavy support slot

if it does all of those i'll be on the way to being happy
I rather suspect you're going to be unhappy:
Its been almost two decades since they took that range away. They (rather grudgingly) gave part of it back to dire avengers, I don't think they're give more on that score.
Assault vehicles- unless they do the non-spikey version of the Venom, I don't see this happening.
No idea what would actually be justified moving out of the HS slot. _maybe_ wraithlords to elites, but everything else is more or less exactly what the HS slot is for.

Points reductions are pretty much a given, however. They need a drop on a lot of models in 5th, and the 6ed books seems very happy to give point drops.

Malagor
03-03-2013, 21:34
I think they will make the Wave Serpent an assault vehicle. While it won't fix the banshees it will atleast be something.

IcedAnimals
03-03-2013, 21:45
Faeit made a bunch of bogus predictions about Daemons on the 25th, that's just 6 days go. Just saying. To think he has something solid on a book that is months out is delusional.

Correction. Someone mailed him a bunch of incorrect rumors after claiming they had the codex. Then the next day Faeit was the first source with actual correct rumors. He just reports what he is given. It is no different than if someone was to get on warseer and throw out a bunch of fake rumors.

Now with this particular batch of rumors it really sounds like someone is just making educated guesses. We have...
HQs that change FoC? Check.
Changes to a staple monstrous creature? Check.
Wishlisted changes to iconic units? Check.
Fliers and skyfire added? Check.
Generic "new units added"? Check.

You can say that about pretty much every codex. I can tell you right now with having no idea when the sisters of battle codex comes out. That there will be an HQ that changes the FoC. There will be some new units. Some iconic units will get new rules. And we will gain some kind of flier and skyfire will be added in somehow. Give me 10 minutes and I can turn those into some easily believed but not so broad rumors. "Exorcists now have skyfire but shoot d3+1 missiles instead of d6". Even the more specific rumors in this list are most likely educated guesses. Who here doesn't think that a "council" of "seers" is going to gain the brotherhood of psykers rule? and that warlocks which are psykers will improve a units DtW.

Voss
04-03-2013, 04:30
I think they will make the Wave Serpent an assault vehicle. While it won't fix the banshees it will atleast be something.

I can't see this as feasible. I just can't. Unless they redesign the kit (for no reason) so that if you build it upside down (al la necrons) the backdoor faces the opposite direction of the engines. While sometimes models and rules aren't all that connected, the idea that an assault vehicle would drive up, troops would calmly exit the rear hatch, walk around the vehicle and then get assault bonuses just seems too unlikely.

Though I have to thank you, because you reminded me of this Farscape quote:


As blessings many in the stars save one lamented curse -- that Sixteenth Rygel, glory me! Must travel in reverse!

The Dude
04-03-2013, 05:49
Just a reminder, if your post is about what you think will happen, it's not really fit for the rumour forums ;)

Lets keep this out of Wishlist territory please.

The Dude
The Warseer Inquisition

samzor
04-03-2013, 09:55
Nice.

Even if this list is made up its mostly logical. Indeed everyone seems to be good at spotting the obvious problems in the older codexes.

Makes sense that the banshee and avatar will get redone to fit the background again. *though im not complaining about how the avatar already performs for 155 points! Perhaps he wil get more expensive and awesome. Interesting ;)
Banshees need to work again. Very finnicky to field them even for eldars level of finesse!

Autarchs getting aspects into troops will be awesome for people wanting to finally field their biel tan lists, unusual builds etc.

Also... NOW IS THE TIME TO PAINT!
paint all your aspect warriors, extra guardians, vypers falcons etc etc. I am hoping to have another 1000 points of stuff ready (that i dont normally play) by the time the codex hits the shelves!

titilititi
04-03-2013, 12:51
Hate those rumors. First it's too close from what we have filled our threads since the last three years... Second, it' been too long we've been told rumors about Eldar, I don't believe them anymore. Third I hate the idea of a point reduction, I prefer a point increase and better skills. Forth it seems there is nothing new here.

totgeboren
04-03-2013, 13:00
Why are people taking these rumours even half seriously? He said "- lots of units get access to skyfire", which is obviously not going to happen. Why would they reduce sales of the new Eldar fliers by giving units people already got skyfire? Just look at DA and CSM. It seems the only reason why CD got skyfire on the Soulgrinder is because they didn't get any filers anyway.

Malagor
04-03-2013, 13:10
If true then it would be all units that can take the missile launchers which to be honest we do have plenty of those.
So there is some sense that those units can get flakk missiles.
And the fliers in question could be very good at anti-ground which would make them worth it.

Symrivven
04-03-2013, 13:37
I want to believe, really.

But nothing I've seen recently is any indication rules will be known this far ahead. And half of these rules are things anyone that vaguely understands this hobby can guess.

loveless
04-03-2013, 13:53
Eh...someone mixed in the wishlist thread with a bit of common sense and mailed it to Faeit. It seems too easy to put wrong information into his inbox.
I don't really see anything to get excited about.

Haravikk
04-03-2013, 14:02
The rumoured changes sound plausible, if a bit light on detail; I mean most of it is stuff that we just expect to happen, i.e - Eldar get better psykers, lots of stuff cheaper, flyers etc. are all stuff that I'd be more surprised not to see in the final release.

Tolvek
04-03-2013, 17:45
3 Things you don't talk about amongst freinds: Religion, Politics, and validity of Warhammer rumors; all three start wars.

Anyway, these rumors come out very similar to what GW did to the Chaos Codex (not sure about DA haven't read the book since I don't play them). It also seems very in theme with how GW is writing the books now as well so, if it is an educated guess, it's because of that. I don't play Eldar but my best friend whom I game with on a regular basis does and I absolutely enjoy fighting against them. In that light, I really hope some of these are true and the army becomes more competitive.

TheBearminator
04-03-2013, 18:38
Excuse me for not reading through the whole thread. But has anyone seen any new eldar models? I've seen a prototype jet bike, same style as the old one but less laid back driver. Anything more?

Malagor
04-03-2013, 18:43
Nothing yet from what I can recall.

buddy_revell
04-03-2013, 18:58
the shuriken catapults will more than likely stay the same; their stats are printed in the big rulebook, so its unlikely theyll change them. maybe theyll give guardians access to 12" shuriken catapults/lasblasters. dunno if avenger catapults are printed in the rulebook though...

Hendarion
04-03-2013, 19:00
Stop guessing please. I think the mods made that clear enough.

TheBearminator
04-03-2013, 19:02
Don't know if this was the right place to ask. Very rigid forum rules in this section. But I figured pictures must be considered a kind of rumour as they more often than not are anonymous blury low resolution mobile camera pics that could be the new model or a big hoax. Remember the pictures of the new leman russ that turned out to be a half done conversion for example.

Malagor
04-03-2013, 19:27
well rumour-wise the codex isn't set to be released until November so there is quite alot of time before that. Images of models tend to show around a month before I think.

Rick Blaine
04-03-2013, 19:44
Stop guessing please. I think the mods made that clear enough.

It's funny how we aren't allowed to guess, but copy/pasting guesses from other websites is fine (and pretty much the only thing that drives traffic into Warseer's N&R these days)

Sildani
04-03-2013, 20:35
Given how rumormongers are treated here, are you surprised?

Anyway, I think these rumors are generic enough to come true. One thing I've noticed: what WE consider problems that need to be addressed and what GW think are problems are usually vastly incongruent. One thing I will applaud is if GW have the restraint to NOT include any new Aspects. All 8 we have now can cover virtually every battlefield role imaginable, save utterly implacable turtle-like defense, which I'd argue should be a Wraithguard "thing" in any event. Let's work on what we already have, hmm?

Azazyll
04-03-2013, 21:17
Well, with everything we've seen in the past few years, there will likely be remakes of old kits (wraiths, spyders, chosen, raptors, ravenwing bikes, deathwing terminators), new flyers are a given, and probably brand new units (Catacomb command barge/annihilator, daemon engines), resculpted units with dual option to new unit (immortals/deathmarks, lychguard(replacing Pariahs)/praetorians, Deathwing/command/knights, ravenwing/command/knights), and/or new character types (crypteks, dark apostles, warpsmith). So I think a variety of these, and possibly all of them are possible.

The ones we know for sure are happening, if not in the initial wave (although I see no reason they wouldn't be), are jetbikes, which we've known since the videos talking about the DEldar range were shown, and they revealed both bikes were conceived at the same time, or at least so that the basis of new CW Eldar would mesh with the DEldar design. Presumably that would entail new Shining Spears, possibly a dual-kit. It would also be a great time to release a Farseer council mounted on bikes - if this option exists, they will most likely model it immediately, as it appears to be recent policy to make sure no units lack models.

Other than that, who knows? A new flyer, certainly. Possibly two (Dark Angels and Necrons received two, but CSM did not), although DEldar are still waiting on their second one.

Aryllon
04-03-2013, 21:26
Yeah it would make sense for GW to not release new aspects and instead focus on those we have.

Increasing tactical options via the Autarch paths, updating their rules & points and updating a couple of the outdated sculpts would in itself suffice for Aspect Warrior attention.

I'd much rather that, than get new aspects without giving the existing guys due attention. PLENTY of options for other new stuff anyway (let's face it, at least one flyer is a given as is at least one new multipart infantry sprue box). Add long-awaited jetbikes (yes GW do release updated kits for existing units, they just don't do vice versa) and you've got the bulk of a release already.

Avian
04-03-2013, 21:26
I think GW are regretting not making the DE flyers two variant builds from the same kit, that would surely have cut down on the costs.

silverstu
04-03-2013, 21:45
I think GW are regretting not making the DE flyers two variant builds from the same kit, that would surely have cut down on the costs.

They are probably holding it back for a later revenue hit in a particular quarter.

Thing with these rumours - they don't add, in terms of models certainly, the visual flavour or character that the eldar, after 20 odd years, now need. Yes existing units need fixed but the army needs freshened up- the model line is good but I think needs more of that eldritch feel brought back in- the pure tech feel is now a Tau thing. You can see it in the design of the new fire prism kit- and it was what got me excited about the eldar rumours about the boxes allegedly seen in the warehouse. Wether that rumour was accurate or not I thought it matched what the eldar range needed and breathed life back into the faction which i have had since rogue trader days. I'm not sure these rumours have that feel at all [although I do like the idea of syncing farseers].

The Dude
04-03-2013, 22:52
Thing with these rumours - they don't add, in terms of models certainly, the visual flavour or character that the eldar, after 20 odd years, now need.

This is the most telling bit to me. Going by these rumours you're looking at 2 new kits (technically 1 and a half); 1 dual-build flyer and 1 new turret for the Falcon. This is in no way a new Codex release wave, which all seem to consist largely of a bunch of brand new units. Unless GW considers the Eldar line chock-a-block full of units and wants to simply plasticise existing units, which is not going to move as many units as making entirely new things will.

I'm surprised whomever dropped this lot didn't include the oft-wishlisted Combat Wraithguard or at least one new plastic Aspect.

SlaughterSun
04-03-2013, 23:01
This is the most telling bit to me. Going by these rumours you're looking at 2 new kits (technically 1 and a half); 1 dual-build flyer and 1 new turret for the Falcon. This is in no way a new Codex release wave, which all seem to consist largely of a bunch of brand new units. Unless GW considers the Eldar line chock-a-block full of units and wants to simply plasticise existing units, which is not going to move as many units as making entirely new things will.

I'm surprised whomever dropped this lot didn't include the oft-wishlisted Combat Wraithguard or at least one new plastic Aspect.

This!

Going by the recent release trend, GW would likely include some new units and some new "must have" kits (flyers, new tank). I find it funny that the rumours don't mention the Exodites (if i recall the release list that circulated a while ago, these were mentioned).

The lack of "bigger-MOAR-killy" kits /units makes me very suspicious of these rumours.

Being an eldar player, i am really looking forward for their codex release. However, i can0t take these rumours too seriously.

Sildani
04-03-2013, 23:08
Dunno if they could make other Aspects plastic; their armor styling and details like Aspect runes are different enough that a dual kit would probably make both Aspects lose some detail and flavor, if you take my meaning. They'd be bland in order to be able to make both with the same legs and torsos.

I feel they're redoing some of the oldest minis in all GW - the Warlocks, Warp Spiders, Jetbikes and Avatar, and Wraithguard. Why those didn't get listed I don't know - perhaps they're keeping the current SKU numbers, and as such they wouldn't appear on anyone's radar.

The Dude
04-03-2013, 23:33
Dunno if they could make other Aspects plastic; their armor styling and details like Aspect runes are different enough that a dual kit would probably make both Aspects lose some detail and flavor, if you take my meaning. They'd be bland in order to be able to make both with the same legs and torsos.

I didn't say anything about dual kits ;)

Avengers aren't dual kits.

murgel2006
05-03-2013, 07:51
All Aspects with armour 4+ could share the basic body.
That would make a single box for Banshees, Avengers and Hawks just with different heads, backpacks, arms and small add on pieces. It will not come IMO, however the number of options would be great. But the Avengers are still very good, no need to redo them if nothing significant changes.

Hendarion
05-03-2013, 08:00
All Aspects with armour 4+ could share the basic body.
They never did and never should.

Malagor
05-03-2013, 08:04
Well it would create more diversity tho you must admit.
Mean we would get female dire avengers/fire dragons/swooping hawks etc

The Dude
05-03-2013, 08:23
Okay, I'm at least partially responsible for that one, but we can all agree that discussing what COULD be done is not discussing rumour.

Avian
05-03-2013, 08:39
Well it would create more diversity tho you must admit.
Mean we would get female dire avengers/fire dragons/swooping hawks etc
When they actually get around to making all Aspects in plastic (which is going to happen eventually), it should be relatively easy to mix and match components from different kits. It's not the current trend to reuse the actual same bodies. They tried that at the start of 3rd edition, but it wasn't a very effective use of the sprues and it didn't look all that great. Thus nowadays Scourges aren't Warriors with a wing sprue, for example.

Herkamer63
05-03-2013, 19:14
don't be surprised, however, if they are released after space marines. i'd like to see, though, a new type of aspect warrior. maybe a new phoenix lord.

Aryllon
05-03-2013, 19:49
Having thought about it, there is some sense here (even if it is just common sense manifesting itself as rumours...).

Judging by the way new releases are tying in with Black Library (in part at least), this bit sounds plausible regardless whether it's true or not:
- Autarchs take Paths. These represent completed paths they have walked and are tied to the various aspects. By taking a path you make the respective aspect warrior a troop choice (the exception are reapers who just become scoring)

In the Eldar Path trilogy, Alaitoc's three Autarchs don't wear traditional craftworld-colour armour.
Yeah the head Autarch wears bright blue (although I don't remember any mention of complimentary yellow), but of the other two one wears light sky blue... and the other wears red.
So, same-craftworld Autarchs who've completed Avenger, Hawk and Dragon paths (at least), right there.

I can also believe in the 'lots of units get skyfire' idea. If it works the same way as CSM & Dark Angels (units who can take a missile launcher (x points) also get optional skyfire upgrade (extra x points)), then in terms of firing platforms with access to the right weapons (EML) Eldar already have the walkers, wraithlord, Falcon, Serpent and Guardian defender squads. Additionally, it may be that it becomes available to Reapers via an exarch power (maybe that's the Eldar thing replacing 'tech' this time around; aerial superiority... which in turn would support the theory of the extra falcon-chassis being a Firestorm).

If Guardians (as is sorely needed - and in all probalility will happen) do get a points decrease as rumoured, I can't see their in-game value then being infantry blobs (too un-fluffy) nor shootiness (which would require changing the range of the catapults). To make them viable it would make more sense for them to literally be purpose-made Defenders (in-keeping with the 'every unit is a specialist' theme) by way of cheap rapid fire troops who sit on objectives, 'concealed by a warlock', often providing further AA support etc.

Wishlist alert - the above 'Defender' role would be even more "cinematic" with the addition of some sort of Warlock buff to improve overwatch to 5+... :angel:

Chapters Unwritten
05-03-2013, 20:52
Also... NOW IS THE TIME TO PAINT!
paint all your aspect warriors, extra guardians, vypers falcons etc etc. I am hoping to have another 1000 points of stuff ready (that i dont normally play) by the time the codex hits the shelves!
Why would you do this to yourself? The troop costs are going to be cut in half and force you to buy more and odds are anything good you have will be invalidated by a similar but better piece.

Not that it's bad to paint your stuff but I fear you might be upset with the decision come codex day. :)

samzor
06-03-2013, 19:10
Why would you do this to yourself? The troop costs are going to be cut in half and force you to buy more and odds are anything good you have will be invalidated by a similar but better piece.
Not that it's bad to paint your stuff but I fear you might be upset with the decision come codex day. :)

Thats my point. Paint the average and bad stuff if you already have it ;)

It will either become great or become playable again. (especially if there's an aspects to troops path in the codex as this rumour indicates).

I have been given a bunch of eldar models in the last 12 months from people quitting 40k, getting rid of unused armies etc etc.
So there are a nice assorted pile of guardians, harlequins, dark reapers, shining spear kit all in the draw ready to get some attention.
I really like painting :cool:

titilititi
07-03-2013, 02:22
As I don't see what kind of actual equipment or what kind of unit (except maybe the Storm Guardians or the Phoenix Lords, but it would be a great surprise for those lasts) could be invalidated by a new Codex, I don't think you'll loose time painting your stuff. Maybe there'll be some better choices in that new codex but you'll already have a solid basis.

For my part, the only thing I fear a little is that they reduce the number of Aspect Warriors you can take in one unit, as I've painted mine ten by ten.

When it switched from 2nd to third Edition, the Guardians lost all the wargear options they had (power sword, power gauntlet, lasgun, etc...) which forced me to paint new Guardians units. Maybe in the next Codex they'll have more stuff, but adding some new members to pre-existing units is not a big problem. I just hope they will still have heavy-plateform included.

Hendarion
07-03-2013, 05:29
Too much wishlisting and speculation, too few rumours :(

Malagor
07-03-2013, 08:05
Well if it's coming in november then there won't be any rumours for quite a while, especially more reliable ones.
And must say that the idea of your autarch making elites to troops is an idea that I don't really like to be honest.
Seems every codex and their grandmother does that now.
A little more original thought would be nicer.

Symrivven
07-03-2013, 08:26
For what its worth, they dropped this at Bols:


Then we got some followups of our own from the voices in the wind.


-New Eldar "large tank" is being worked on (not the same as the new falcon variant)
-Guardian/Storm Guardian combo plastic box
-Guardian jetbikes/Shining Spear combo box

I think I heared the large tank before, and the other two seem rather logical. So I'd say they are decent educated guesses not necessarily rumours.

Malagor
07-03-2013, 08:33
Think we saw the combo boxes on the model list that was posted like 6 months ago, not sure.

Spring heeled Jack
07-03-2013, 09:01
- new special rule that influence how howling banshees interact in combat. It's current iteration really makes them feel like glass cannons that are amazing at what they're designed to do.

In second edition there was overwatch, and the banshee mask negated the opponents ability to fire over watch against Banshees. Aswell it made it where the enemy could not attack in CC the first round either. I would expect something similar to the second edition rules for the new codex regarding banshees. In 4th edition they have war shout which drops the enemy to WS1 if they fail a moral check, So in my opinion of this rumor it would be something along the line of negating overwatch and war shout combined.

MajorWesJanson
07-03-2013, 11:09
For what its worth, they dropped this at Bols:



I think I heared the large tank before, and the other two seem rather logical. So I'd say they are decent educated guesses not necessarily rumours.

Large tank is possible, like an Eldar take on the Land Raider.
Guardian/Storm Guardian kit I see as unlikely, as guardians are already plastic, and there are plenty of other kits that need plastic more.
jetbikes/shining spears does seem a given, since there have been repeated statements about redesigning the Eldar Jetbike.

Azazyll
07-03-2013, 14:59
I could see redoing Guardians, actually. Aren't they one of the older plastic kits out there? I think marines have been redone at least once since they came out.

Does anyone have the link to the enormous model list? We should probably start keeping tabs on that, as we're approaching the period when it's supposedly coming into effect.

MajorWesJanson
07-03-2013, 16:00
Guardians, maybe if there weren't a rather large number of other eldar infantry models that could use a plastic kit period. Jetbikes being redone is one thing, since they have spoken about that several times, with the DE Jetbike as the base (likely just different fins, nose, and weapon options with the body and engine of the jetbike the same) But guardians already have a plastic kit, and there would probably be more value out of converting some of the many aspect warriors kits into plastic.

Azazyll
07-03-2013, 16:15
But which would they choose? Has there ever been a triple plastic kit? Perhaps Scorpions/Dragons and Banshees/Hawks? For their relative differences in armor and posing (hawks and banshees leaping, scorpions more skulky). Not wishlisting, just honestly trying to imagine how they would do it. I suppose Reapers/Spiders is an option too, but I couldn't see that before the other four. And since we can assume we're getting a jetbike/spears kit, plus at least one flyer kit, and presumably something for a new unit, that doesn't leave room for more than one other plastic kit.

While I would like to see everything in plastic, what unit "deserves" a plastic kit isn't really a factor in their decision, as we've seen time and again.

GreySeerZ
07-03-2013, 16:16
Could definitely see them redoing guardians as a combo kit for storm guardians as well. If the rumor is true and the point cost on guardians is reduced, they will be expecting to sell boatloads of these.

Could see them doing bikes too, especially if still a troop. Everyone loves bikes!

Could also see Autarchs unlocking troops. Almost every recent codex has it, it's coming. Even though this is a rumor, I can believe that part at least 99.99%.

Aspect warriors. Yup, they will most likely be finecast. Looking at CSM release, everyone was expecting a revamp of oblits/maulrers and cult marines. But no, lots of new shiny things, old things with new arms, throw all metal into finecast etc. I don't even think there was a unit in the CSM release that was redone in plastic.


Based on recent releases and model releases this is how I see it. Revamp maybe 1/2 OLD models/kits in new plastic. Take everything else and throw it in finecast. Release a second wave a year later replacing some of those finecast releases with plastic. Having just bought a load of CSM stuff, it is the same approach they are taking there, and will probably be the norm for the next couple releases (although Tau could be different, since it's been a while since a revamp for them. Even with tau though, I see them keeping the old suits, and releasing new suits that cost more points.)

MajorWesJanson
07-03-2013, 16:22
But which would they choose? Has there ever been a triple plastic kit? Perhaps Scorpions/Dragons and Banshees/Hawks? For their relative differences in armor and posing (hawks and banshees leaping, scorpions more skulky). Not wishlisting, just honestly trying to imagine how they would do it. I suppose Reapers/Spiders is an option too, but I couldn't see that before the other four. And since we can assume we're getting a jetbike/spears kit, plus at least one flyer kit, and presumably something for a new unit, that doesn't leave room for more than one other plastic kit.

While I would like to see everything in plastic, what unit "deserves" a plastic kit isn't really a factor in their decision, as we've seen time and again.

Hawks seem likely to me, as GW has been putting the jump/flying infantry into plastic for a while now- Storm Boyz, Gargoyles, Scourges, Raptors, basically everything past SM Vanguard vets.
I'm not sure if aspect warriors will be dual-kitted, but if they are, I could see Fire Dragons/ Dark Reapers sharing a similar heavy body and legs, with different heads and arm weapons. Also Banshees/hawks could share running/leaping legs and bodies, and do like DE with a mix of male and female bodies.

MajorWesJanson
07-03-2013, 16:23
But which would they choose? Has there ever been a triple plastic kit? Perhaps Scorpions/Dragons and Banshees/Hawks? For their relative differences in armor and posing (hawks and banshees leaping, scorpions more skulky). Not wishlisting, just honestly trying to imagine how they would do it. I suppose Reapers/Spiders is an option too, but I couldn't see that before the other four. And since we can assume we're getting a jetbike/spears kit, plus at least one flyer kit, and presumably something for a new unit, that doesn't leave room for more than one other plastic kit.

While I would like to see everything in plastic, what unit "deserves" a plastic kit isn't really a factor in their decision, as we've seen time and again.

Hawks seem likely to me, as GW has been putting the jump/flying infantry into plastic for a while now- Storm Boyz, Gargoyles, Scourges, Raptors, basically everything past SM Vanguard vets.
I'm not sure if aspect warriors will be dual-kitted, but if they are, I could see Fire Dragons/ Dark Reapers sharing a similar heavy body and legs, with different heads and arm weapons. Also Banshees/hawks could share running/leaping legs and bodies, and do like DE with a mix of male and female bodies.

Hendarion
07-03-2013, 16:46
I don't see how you would units Reapers and Dragons. Especially the legs are vastly different from one another.

Ace Rimmer
07-03-2013, 17:09
I think the way to get around the Aspect issue is to make the details separate pieces on the sprue. You could easily make separate aspect warrior symbols/adornments slotted into the gaps on the sprues so they legs/torso/arms are fairly bland apart from the standard gems you've come to expect. A lot of the newer kits have little details slotted in.
I could see them doing say Swooping Hawks / Howling Banshees as they'd share dynamic legs, Striking Scorpions / Warp Spiders as they could be posed for an ambush like the pic in Pg 62 in the codex. I'd be inclined to put Fire Dragons with Dire Avengers, but they already got a new kit previously so thats unlikely, but that only would only leave 2 aspects in Finecast. I think kits from recent releases like the Necrons show they are easily capable of designing dual purpose kits which share very few details.

RandomThoughts
07-03-2013, 17:24
Well if it's coming in november then there won't be any rumours for quite a while, especially more reliable ones.
And must say that the idea of your autarch making elites to troops is an idea that I don't really like to be honest.
Seems every codex and their grandmother does that now.
A little more original thought would be nicer.

Truth be told, I think the whole concept of scoring troops has oulived its usefullness. Make that scoring infantry, and make the troops section good/cheap enough that they get taken on their own merit.

I never understood why that Wraithgaurd here can hold a vital battlefield objective and the other Wraithguard over there can't. It's ab artificial and pretty arbitrary distinction.


I don't see how you would units Reapers and Dragons. Especially the legs are vastly different from one another.

Not yet...

But yeah, I think it would make sense to combine Aspects with equal armor save - Scorpions and Reapers with their heavy plate armor, etc.

Atrum Angelus
07-03-2013, 17:42
They don't necessarily have to redo guardians to make it a duel kit. They could simply make a storm guardian sprue and add it to the box. Boom, duel kit.

Aryllon
07-03-2013, 18:31
CSM Raptors moved to plastic...

New CWE bike isn't so much 'based on' the DE one; they were developed around a single concept and the DE variant was just released first. The only pre-production sculpt we've seen has been the CWE version.

I'm not sure about jetbikes and spears in the same kit... or rather I can't see the rumour being correct if it's saying there will be only one jetbike kit comprising just regular jetbikes and spears. Where would that leave warlocks and seers? Makes more sense to either have two boxes (standard bikes in one, dual fancy variants in the other - like Ravenwing) or make a triple kit (like Deathwing Knights / Terminators / Command Squad). Probability would suggest the former, I guess.

If we're limited to 4 boxes I can't see how even the more conservative release rumours / shoe-ins fit in. But I don't think we're necessarily limited to 4... Dark Eldar and Necrons may be 'whole range' exceptions, but that just proves there are exceptions, while Daemons have had at least 17 new releases since the last Eldar book (off the top of my head, only counting multi-kits once each, and not including the plastic Daemon Prince). Blood Angels got 10 exclusive releases plus lots of the newest SM vanilla stuff imported (redeemer, drop pod, sternguard etc). Wolves got same treatment, Tyranids had tons of new models & kits too...

Poseidal
07-03-2013, 18:47
Dark Eldar Scourges and Wyches (for example) are completely plastic, and not dual kits with anything else. There is no need for standardised armour for Aspects really.

titilititi
07-03-2013, 18:54
you have my point

Voss
07-03-2013, 19:27
Dark Eldar Scourges and Wyches (for example) are completely plastic, and not dual kits with anything else. There is no need for standardised armour for Aspects really.
Dark Eldar also have far fewer infantry units, and fewer still with a size cap of 10 models. Those factors matter a lot more than how they packaged models for a different army.
Number of SKUs, costs, and how they want to sell 9 units (including all aspects, guardians and storm guardians) will matter a lot more than how they packaged 3 boxes for a different army.

It is also worth noting that Darnok posted something via birdy over in the Fantasy Release thread.

Every 3-4 months, as an independent retailer, we get a list of items that must be stocked. These are changed in advanced so we don't order old stock, and to give us a change to sell off old stock before new items turn up. The last one in about October / November added a few basic Marine items but dropped Tau Battlesuits, which would tie in with concepts of new battlesuits and new Tau for Spring / Easter.

Yesterday I got the new list, which had a lot of changes in the Fantasy sections. I no longer have to stock High Elves Spearmen, Wood Elves, Bret Knights or Dwarf Warriors. It can therefore be reasonably speculated that these core troop choices will be relaunched in the next 6 - 8 months. The only change in 40k was I no longer have to stock any Eldar (not even DA or Guardians).
That last bit made me sit up and take notice. Maybe it is just a repack/rebox, but to no longer require an entire line may indicate something major afoot.

TabulaRasa
07-03-2013, 19:41
Hawks seem likely to me, as GW has been putting the jump/flying infantry into plastic for a while now- Storm Boyz, Gargoyles, Scourges, Raptors, basically everything past SM Vanguard vets.
I'm not sure if aspect warriors will be dual-kitted, but if they are, I could see Fire Dragons/ Dark Reapers sharing a similar heavy body and legs, with different heads and arm weapons. Also Banshees/hawks could share running/leaping legs and bodies, and do like DE with a mix of male and female bodies.

Can't see this thing with multi-aspect-boxes happening. Reapers have always had stockier legs than dragons, so as not to fall on their ass firing those big weapons I imagine. Banshees should be 100% feme while I don't mind seeing other squads having more of a mixed representation of gender. I have an easier time imagining a scorpion spider mix. On the hawk side I think u have a good point.

Azazyll
07-03-2013, 20:23
The Dark Eldar may no be the best example, either, as their aspect warrior equivalent, Incubi, as well as other elites like Mandrakes and Wracks, are all in resin. I could easily see aspect warriors staying resin for another edition. They were updated the last time around, after all. GW would much rather you buy all new units, and the people who need aspect warriors buy them in expensive finecrap. Plasticing shining spears may be all we get. I would not be surprised to see mounted seer councils die, either. They've never had models, so there's little incentive to keep them.

Eldar have a lot of options - the sheer variety of Aspect Warriors is working against them. It can be assumed the GW will want you to buy new things, and this will be given priority. Comparing them to Dark Eldar, who got a complete range overhaul (no one is suggesting that for their craftworld kind) and Necrons, who received an extensive overhaul in terms of both background and units, are not at all necessarily what is going to happen with Eldar. Both had extremely underdeveloped armies and needed a lot of new choices, and therefore minis. Eldar are one of the three or four oldest factions in the game, and they don't need the attention in terms of miniatures that the newer races need.

And frankly, if they were going to update anything, I'd expect it to be the Avatar and the phoenix lords - they're some of the few models that are the same as when I started playing fifteen years ago. Other than a few space wolf characters, that's unprecedented.

Please do not to respond to this based on what you want, but on what makes sense based on what we know of GW.

Sildani
07-03-2013, 21:42
Wonder if the bigger tank is the plastic Scorpion super - heavy that was promised a couple years ago.

As for what makes sense for GW, well, new plastic Wraithguard would make sense since they're ancient sculpts and have recently been repackaged in a Finecast 5-pack; new special characters, a new Avatar I'd say is virtually guaranteed (and might have been sculpted at the same time as the new GDs), new flyer(s), and new jetbikes all make sense. As another poster said, a single plastic Storm Guardian sprue could be made and tossed in the Defender box and job's a good 'un.

It's interesting that one stockist no longer has to keep ANY Eldar models in stock. If that's really 3-4 months out, we're looking at mid to late Summer for the new Eldar.

But, as always, what I really want to know is: will there be elf chicks armed with sniper rifles riding dinosaurs?

Theocracity
07-03-2013, 22:57
The Dark Eldar may no be the best example, either, as their aspect warrior equivalent, Incubi, as well as other elites like Mandrakes and Wracks, are all in resin. I could easily see aspect warriors staying resin for another edition. They were updated the last time around, after all. GW would much rather you buy all new units, and the people who need aspect warriors buy them in expensive finecrap. Plasticing shining spears may be all we get. I would not be surprised to see mounted seer councils die, either. They've never had models, so there's little incentive to keep them.

Eldar have a lot of options - the sheer variety of Aspect Warriors is working against them. It can be assumed the GW will want you to buy new things, and this will be given priority. Comparing them to Dark Eldar, who got a complete range overhaul (no one is suggesting that for their craftworld kind) and Necrons, who received an extensive overhaul in terms of both background and units, are not at all necessarily what is going to happen with Eldar. Both had extremely underdeveloped armies and needed a lot of new choices, and therefore minis. Eldar are one of the three or four oldest factions in the game, and they don't need the attention in terms of miniatures that the newer races need.

And frankly, if they were going to update anything, I'd expect it to be the Avatar and the phoenix lords - they're some of the few models that are the same as when I started playing fifteen years ago. Other than a few space wolf characters, that's unprecedented.

Please do not to respond to this based on what you want, but on what makes sense based on what we know of GW.

I think you have about the right of it, though I'd also expect plastic Swooping Hawks to match GW's trends. A new release needs to have products that both old and new players want; plastic Aspects is a risk, because old players might not be interested in re-buying something they already have. Something new and shiny could potentially lure both demographics - and get the new players to buy the Finecasted Aspects.

I expect a new Eldar dex to be slightly less focused on Aspects, honestly. New codexes tend to break new ground theme-wise, and while I expect they'll stay strong in their roles there will be other army themes that may take a spotlight.

titilititi
08-03-2013, 02:45
The Dark Eldar may no be the best example, either, as their aspect warrior equivalent, Incubi, as well as other elites like Mandrakes and Wracks, are all in resin. I could easily see aspect warriors staying resin for another edition.

They are redone nearly every Eldar Codex. It' true that the 3rd Edition Aspect were not that good and the current Aspect Warriors, for those that have been redone are positively excellent (except maybe Howling Banshees helmets, whose mane is not very well defined on my opinion). What I'd like to happen is that they turn one or two more Aspects to plastic, so that we have a little more conversion options, And I'd justly that Howling Banshees are the ones I'd like to see that happen for). Other Aspect Warriors can remain resin, but I'd just like that they give all their option to the Exarch.

I always found the Bikers Council out of place, except maybe for Siam-Hann. That would be a hard blow for those who have converted their own one, but I think it would be a good thing for the game. But that shall not prevent them from giving us a jet-bike mounted Warlock...

Abbadon, Kâhrn and Ahriman (who have the same problem of small size and "freeze" pose, but in a smaller scale) are not very younger than our Phoenix Lords but they hadn't been redone with last CSM.
I fear it will be the same in our case. The only thing that points for them being redone is that they're sure they're gonna sell lots of some new Phoenix Lords, they've always been very popular models, that people bought even they weren't doing Eldar and it was some kind of achievement for Eldar players to paint the six...

Man lives by hope.

Azazyll
08-03-2013, 03:14
Yes, well, I'd like exodites. I don't think either is going to happen. If anything, warp spiders since their models are eldest, iirc.

Hendarion
08-03-2013, 04:34
I expect a new Eldar dex to be slightly less focused on Aspects, honestly. New codexes tend to break new ground theme-wise, and while I expect they'll stay strong in their roles there will be other army themes that may take a spotlight.
That would be a pure kick in the nuts. That is the entire thing the Eldar are based upon. Even their fluff. I doubt GW would risk changing Eldar that radically.

Voss
08-03-2013, 06:48
New codexes tend to break new ground theme-wise, and while I expect they'll stay strong in their roles there will be other army themes that may take a spotlight.
I'm curious what makes you think so. Sometimes there are major adjustments, but most of the time a new codex is a update tweak, not a new theme. They add to the army, and chase the thing of the moment (flyers now, Feel no Pain in 5th edition). They may do something like make wraithguard more diverse and interesting (as people have often speculated) and add the requisite 6th edition flyers, but I can't see them doing anything to de-emphasize Aspects.

Theocracity
08-03-2013, 13:32
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that the Aspects will be cut out or unplayable. They are still a big part of the army, and I'm sure they will still be a big part of a new codex. I'm just saying that based on GW's releases you should be prepared for the status quo to change in some way.

Aspects are one of the big themes in the current dex, and their model line has sold well over the years while having logistical issues being converted to plastic (less opportunity for dual kits). That means that if GW wants the Eldar release to appeal to a deeper market segment they may put most of their New focus in other segments of the army - bikes, Wraithguard, or more likely a slightly newer shiny concept.

I have no comment on how the Aspect rules will be - as always, the meta will declare things competetive or useless based on its own whims. But I would expect that model-wise the most Aspects will get it will be plastic Swooping Hawks.

DoctorTom
08-03-2013, 16:03
Wonder if the bigger tank is the plastic Scorpion super - heavy that was promised a couple years ago.

Right now if I had to bet on what we'd get, we'd finally be getting the Firestorm out of Forgeworld and over in GW proper. Given all the flyer proliferation, it would make sense for them to bring over the vehicle set up to be anti-aircraft.


As for what makes sense for GW, well, new plastic Wraithguard would make sense since they're ancient sculpts and have recently been repackaged in a Finecast 5-pack;

I can see new models, but it wouldn't surprise me if they went Finecast still with these. I have a feeling that they'd go with Scorpions and maybe Banshees in plastic before Wraithguard, but that doesn't mean they won't do all of them in plastic (though more likely different waves between the wraithguard types and the aspects). If they are making more of a push on the Wraithguard and putting in the different types of Wraithguard (as has been rumored), then it's certainly possible that they'll go with plastic, and likely that the different Wraithguard types will be combo kits.


new special characters, a new Avatar I'd say is virtually guaranteed (and might have been sculpted at the same time as the new GDs), new flyer(s), and new jetbikes all make sense. As another poster said, a single plastic Storm Guardian sprue could be made and tossed in the Defender box and job's a good 'un.

The jetbike makes the most sense. Avatar I could see them going either way (a new sculpt with new rules might make more people use him). It wouldn't surprise me to see the Avatar have a Court of the Young King type HQ choice that doesn't take a slot, or possibly see the Avatar unlock one unit of each type of aspect warrior to be a troop choice. If they go with the unlocking I'm sure that would move a lot of Avatar models.




But, as always, what I really want to know is: will there be elf chicks armed with sniper rifles riding dinosaurs?

I would have said the chances were remote, at least before the Chaos Codex came out with its mechadragons. If they do work in Exodites, they'd probably follow the Coteaz/Inquistor model in the GK Codex for most of the exodites. I really don't see them working in both exodites and trying to do an expanded Wraithguard/lord/seer(?) presence in the Codex.

Fable
08-03-2013, 17:54
I would have said the chances were remote, at least before the Chaos Codex came out with its mechadragons. If they do work in Exodites, they'd probably follow the Coteaz/Inquistor model in the GK Codex for most of the exodites. I really don't see them working in both exodites and trying to do an expanded Wraithguard/lord/seer(?) presence in the Codex.

I don't anticipate Exodites at all. If we see any expansion to a faction beyond Craftworld I think it will be Harlequins. We probably won't see Exodites touched again unless forgeworld broaches that subject like they did Corsairs.

MajorWesJanson
08-03-2013, 19:58
I always found the Bikers Council out of place, except maybe for Siam-Hann. That would be a hard blow for those who have converted their own one, but I think it would be a good thing for the game. But that shall not prevent them from giving us a jet-bike mounted Warlock.

Kit-wise, GW could do say a 5 pack of Wraithguard with shooty and CC options with a warlock minder as a sixth model. Then a Farseer as a plastic monopose farseer, and new guardian bikes/shining spears, and if you want to make a seer council on bikes, you have all the plastic parts to convert it.

titilititi
08-03-2013, 20:55
Now that Warlocks and Farseers are Finecast, cut and weight are less problematic, you just have to sculpt the seers robes on their bike. Notthat it shall prevent them from giving use a jet-bike mounted Warlock...

Azazyll
08-03-2013, 21:02
I really doubt we're getting a mounted seer council. No one would buy more than one, maybe two if they're really overpowered.

But I would love to see exodites. They're more likely than any expansion on the Harlequins, who are now in two codices. And the DE book showed us that they weren't willing to change them, even if it made sense to do so (like giving them access to a transport). It's not in GW's nature to errata something like that, and they'd screw over DE players if they gave extra harlequin goodies to the CWE.

Brotheroracle
08-03-2013, 21:04
I really doubt we're getting a mounted seer council. No one would buy more than one, maybe two if they're really overpowered.

But I would love to see exodites. They're more likely than any expansion on the Harlequins, who are now in two codices. And the DE book showed us that they weren't willing to change them, even if it made sense to do so (like giving them access to a transport). It's not in GW's nature to errata something like that, and they'd screw over DE players if they gave extra harlequin goodies to the CWE.

Well not really as the two dexes are BB's after all.

Voss
08-03-2013, 21:40
I really doubt we're getting a mounted seer council. No one would buy more than one, maybe two if they're really overpowered.

The same justification would have applied to the daemon chariots (which had been heralds only), or Ravenwing 'command squads.' They found a way to fit them in outside the HQ slots and do it anyway.

The Dude
08-03-2013, 22:02
Far too much Wishlisting and speculation.

Thread moved.

The Dude
The Warseer Inquisition

titilititi
09-03-2013, 04:56
It's not in GW's nature to errata something like that, and they'd screw over DE players if they gave extra harlequin goodies to the CWE.

It suffices to make a White Darf update to the DE Codex and it would be done, something like what we had for the Night Spinner... But In my dreams, Harlequins have their own Codex, and are taken both by CWE and DE as allies...

HQ : Grand Harlequin, Grand Shadowseer, and a named character for both of them.

Elite : 0-3 Solitaire, Exhalted Harlequins (better state line, dodge save because of the holofield), Wraith Harlequins (if ever the rumor Wraith Guards having option for assault weapons is true, wouldn't get that hard to convert, after all, and the Harlequin Wraith Lord existed, so why not), Wraith Corypheus (Assault-oriented Wraith Lord with Harlequin stuff, like access to some kind of spinner for the Harlequin's kiss, etc...)

Troops : Harlequins troop(still access to everything they have, options and unit upgrade), blade ballet (Harlequins with Shuriken Catapult, or what else..., access to the same upgrades than Harlequins troop, maybe access to Bladestorm from the Dire avenger AND two close combat weapons), dedicated transport (maybe a fast opened transport with an efficient holofield, able to carry a ten men squad, something near of what DE have at the end...)

Fast Attack : Harlequins troop with Anti-Grav Belt (access to the holofield) Blade Ballet with AG Belt, Harlequins troop on Jet-Bike.

Heavy Support : 0-3 Death Jester, Grand Death Jester, a named Grand Death Jester, Wraith Jester (Heavy support Oriented Wraith Lord, maybe with a weapon near of the Maugetar, as it seems to me they are tributes to the same God...), and a real fire-support vehicle.

I'm not very imaginative, but there's already what to do. Sorry if you find that out of place.

Azazyll
09-03-2013, 13:32
I don't find it out of place (now that the thread has been bumped and we're wishlisting). It's just not realistic to believe GW will expand the Harlequin entry before adding something completely new. It is pure fantasizing to dream of a harlequin codex at this point.

titilititi
09-03-2013, 16:30
In my dreams, my dreams come true, I agree with you...

Aryllon
10-03-2013, 08:14
I can see FW doing something with it.

Not a full list like corsairs, but one or two units as a third-party faction in a book focusing on other races. Kind of like how Wolves got rules for Bran Redmaw in a book primarily about Eldar & Guard.

It would make most sense to put them in as interventionists in a chaos book; the IA rumours were Thousand Sons after Necrons but it would be fluffier to wait for a Slaanesh book and put rules for a Solitaire in there.

Right now you can make perfectly plausible Harlequin lists with both CWE and DE books anyway. I already bought & built the following list using CWE rules & various kits:

High Seer & mimes (Farseer & warlocks)
Avatar (Autarch - the Harlequin Avatar was always a person not a daemon)
3x Troupes
Storm guardians (aspiring Harlies must go through training, they don't just blink into existence!)
Jetbikes
Vypers (there is a curreny army list entry for a harlie-specific venom carrying CWE weapons in the DE book, it's not like they just park up when not carrying passengers)

Everything in the list exists already (now or in the past) as either rules, models or both - except the Guardians which just make sense fluff-wise anyway. I used Wyches with shuriken pistols and gave all of them the fully masked face. They just don't get to wear bright colours until they join a troupe (getting plain, neutral garb and deathmasks instead).

You could also put a Solitaire in, using Jain Zar rules I guess.

titilititi
10-03-2013, 20:05
And I forgot to insert the inevitable Flyer...