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Koraath
09-06-2005, 22:37
Apart from the 4 temples (evesor, callidus, culexus and vindicare) that are mostly seen if thats the right word there are two other major temples of the officio assassinorium and I was wondering if anyone had any info on them?

athamas
09-06-2005, 22:42
one is the Venenum Temple

The Venenum Temple of the Officio Assassinorum emphasizes the use of poisons and non-technical weapons to kill their foes. They use poisoned swords, daggers, and projectiles fired from weapons using highly-compressed air to be silent. They are masters of disguise and stealth, and they are masters at hand to hand combat. They are especially chosen for agility and their ability to stay totally silent when needed but also to have the ability to mimic the mannerisms and characteristics of others.
The Venenum temple stresses subtlety and cunning. The silent kill is always the best kill. The unknown Assassin is always the most effective Assassin. They shun weapons that cause noise or that leave easily traced evidence. They strike from the unknown and they disappear again into the unknown.
All the Assassins of the Venenum temple are trained in the use of Polymorphine, and only the Callidus approach their mastery of this drug. The Venenum Assassin may masquerade as any humanoid they choose, from a beautiful woman to a crippled old man, to aliens such as Orks and Eldar. They are the masters of disguise and mimicry. In addition to Polymorphine, they use a range of implants created by the Medicus Adeptus of the Imperium to change their size, shape and physical appearance. They also have implants that will allow them to mimic the sound and speech patterns of those they are replacing. It is only when they are injected with Polymorphine that these implants react to stimulants within the drug and transform the Assassin to mimic the encoded shapes needed to take the place of those they choose to replace.
The Venenum Assassin will be landed behind enemy lines to take the place of a trusted underling of their intended target, and then they will only reveal themselves when they attack their target at the crucial moment of battle.


there is another, im looking for it now!

Koraath
09-06-2005, 22:46
that sounds almost exactly the same as callidus i was hoping they might be a bit different

athamas
09-06-2005, 22:59
Vanus
thats the other one!

bit more info on the two
Venenum
Many Assassins favour poison to dispatch a foe, and there are many poisons available to a would-be assassin. However, they are pale in comparison with the sheer destructive force of the Venenum, master of poison and biological warfare.

Armed with complex bioweapons, containing the most deadly poisons the Imperium can create, Venenum Assassins are walking death. They can kill with a touch, their bodies filled with toxins that only they are immune to, and more than one victim has died to the kiss of a beautiful stranger...

On the battlefield, the Venenum make use of their less subtle equipment. Virus Bombs spread viral death through the enemy, while the Venenum's deadly Venom Blade drips with nano-virals capable of corroding bulkheads, and Needlers that spit ranged death, turning mighty warriors into bloated, rotting

Vanus
There are many foes to the Imperium, and for them, the galaxy is a dangerous place. A lift may plummet, their vehicle may crash, they may stumble across a long forgotten minefield, or be vapourised in the overload of a ship's Plasma Reactor. Often such accidents are caused by the unseen terror that is the Vanus.

Vanus Assassins favour espionage, sabotage and other covert activities. They are master sappers and engineers, able to rig almost any object into a fatal booby trap. For those hunted by the Vanus, nothing is safe, and even if some trap does not snare them, a silent Bolt-shell will...

Typheron
09-06-2005, 23:21
i would think that these temples act in a less frontal manor than the 4 we see on the table top.

from what i remember of a short report about the poison temple one of there agents arrived at the target pplanet to find that they had been stuck in the warp for a considerable period of time and the target, a corrupt govenor, was already dead and a anti imperil comity ruled in his stead. The assasin then spent several days poisoning all the chairs in the meeting chambers of the council before there next meeting.

they promptly all died.

Delicious Soy
10-06-2005, 07:34
athamas: Vanus sounds very familiar to the Officio Sabatorum. hough i ijagine that the departmento Munitorum likes to keep a few assassins and such for themselves.

geoffkemp
10-06-2005, 10:08
Venenum sound too close to the Callidus, Though I agree from what I`ve heard they use posion, such as psiking a drink, posioning water sources etc.

Wasn`t there also a temple that specialed in "dis-information". or something close, again, close to callidus, but not quite.

BTW athama, where did you get that info form ???

He Who Laughs
10-06-2005, 10:21
BTW athama, where did you get that info form ???

Yeah, I've always known the names of the two you've mentioned - but never read any fluff associated to them both. Where is all this tantalising information coming from?

athamas
10-06-2005, 10:34
some of it comes from my {shifty look} 'Black library info store'

and some of it comes from searching!

its amazing what you can find with only 1 or 2 key words!

Nazguire
10-06-2005, 10:41
one is the Venenum Temple

The Venenum Temple of the Officio Assassinorum emphasizes the use of poisons and non-technical weapons to kill their foes. They use poisoned swords, daggers, and projectiles fired from weapons using highly-compressed air to be silent. They are masters of disguise and stealth, and they are masters at hand to hand combat. They are especially chosen for agility and their ability to stay totally silent when needed but also to have the ability to mimic the mannerisms and characteristics of others.
The Venenum temple stresses subtlety and cunning. The silent kill is always the best kill. The unknown Assassin is always the most effective Assassin. They shun weapons that cause noise or that leave easily traced evidence. They strike from the unknown and they disappear again into the unknown.
All the Assassins of the Venenum temple are trained in the use of Polymorphine, and only the Callidus approach their mastery of this drug. The Venenum Assassin may masquerade as any humanoid they choose, from a beautiful woman to a crippled old man, to aliens such as Orks and Eldar. They are the masters of disguise and mimicry. In addition to Polymorphine, they use a range of implants created by the Medicus Adeptus of the Imperium to change their size, shape and physical appearance. They also have implants that will allow them to mimic the sound and speech patterns of those they are replacing. It is only when they are injected with Polymorphine that these implants react to stimulants within the drug and transform the Assassin to mimic the encoded shapes needed to take the place of those they choose to replace.
The Venenum Assassin will be landed behind enemy lines to take the place of a trusted underling of their intended target, and then they will only reveal themselves when they attack their target at the crucial moment of battle.


there is another, im looking for it now!



This is probably why the Venenum was scrapped. Way too similar to Callidus to warrant any expansion in detail, as is the Vanus. It seemst these two forgotten temples were absorbed and moulded into the Callidus background that already existed.

athamas
10-06-2005, 10:51
i think that particular aspect was absorbed, however the whole biowarefare bit was not!

thats a very old quote if i remember correctly, the slightly newwer stuff is the bio weapon idea!

venusianfurs
10-06-2005, 13:10
Where did the info about the Vanus come from, as I've never heard of them? And who are the Officio Sabotorum?

Typheron
10-06-2005, 13:28
in one of the older codexes theres a little report on the various assasin temples, think it might have been the 2nd ed codex, and within it then other 2 temples are mentioned. They both seam to be less combat orientated then the others, dealing mainly with the disposal of induviduals during cold war situations before everything gets hot.

Lostanddamned
10-06-2005, 14:55
Isn't when there another temple that specialises in the use of garrotes?

Lady Bastet
10-06-2005, 16:06
The problem is the only place I recall seeing the Venenum background was on a site with a history of making up their own background. Not that there is anything wrong in such actions, I simply wish to know where fact ends and theory begins.

Nagothrand
10-06-2005, 16:35
Isn't when there another temple that specialises in the use of garrotes?

Not that I recall in any official GW fluff. And in any case the entire shrine that uses garrottes seems over-specialized to me.

Forgotmytea
10-06-2005, 16:55
To be quite honest I actually had no idea about those two! But, the Venenum temple sound so cool :D *digs out old Skullz assassin (http://www.torchlight.org.uk/Scans/Assassin_Classic.jpg) model & includes a Venenum/Callidus assassin in his Salamanders army*. But, sadly, I can see why they weren't used nowadays on the tabletop. Shame - the rules for booby-trapping stuff with the Venus assassins would be so funny :p. Unless, of course, you're on the recieving end :eek:.

-Forgotmytea

venusianfurs
10-06-2005, 17:01
Shame - the rules for booby-trapping stuff with the Venus assassins would be so funny :p. Forgotmytea Huh - I did what now?

How about the shrine mentioned on the old Portent, that specializes in killing lots a people at a time, like a one-person order of Exterminatus of variable scales?
(Or to put it another way, a one-man population explosion!)

Nagothrand
10-06-2005, 17:07
Huh - I did what now?

How about the shrine mentioned on the old Portent, that specializes in killing lots a people at a time, like a one-person order of Exterminatus of variable scales?
(Or to put it another way, a one-man population explosion!)

That sounds like the Eversor shrine... ;)

venusianfurs
10-06-2005, 17:13
No, it was definately a different one - it may have been the Vanus they were thinking of, maybe, but the name and details no-one had to hand.

Inquisitor Samos
10-06-2005, 18:30
Difference between Callidus and Venenum Assassins:

The Callidus are masters of virtually undetectable disguise and infiltration...... poison is just a sidelight to their "main act." The use of polymorphine to totally impersonate another person or even another race is a trademark of the Callidus. They are close combat-oriented, as the game rules show.
The Venenum, on the other hand, are the consummate masters of toxics. They do what they do by stealth, of course, but don't necessarily rely on polymorphine for getting at the target, and they apparently aren't close combat-oriented.

gunhed
10-06-2005, 20:28
from what i remember of a short report about the poison temple one of there agents arrived at the target pplanet to find that they had been stuck in the warp for a considerable period of time and the target, a corrupt govenor, was already dead and a anti imperil comity ruled in his stead. The assasin then spent several days poisoning all the chairs in the meeting chambers of the council before there next meeting.

I've read that story. I think it was in the 2nd ed codex, and from what I can remember, I'm sure it was a Callidus Assassin.

She'd spent about 500 years in the warp before arriving at her target.

x-esiv-4c
10-06-2005, 22:05
Have there ever been reports of assassins working for Chaos or in service of the foul orders?

gunhed
11-06-2005, 10:58
It's possible I suppose, but I'd imagine that if it happened, it'd be more likely that the assassin was doing it without knowing it, on the say so of a corrupted planetary governor perhaps, or in =][= working towards his own agenda.

athamas
11-06-2005, 11:02
at one point the assasins 'rebeled' which is why all the tempels were split up and spread around

i cant remember the ditails though!

WLBjork
13-06-2005, 21:18
Yeah, that was one cool battle. Overly simplified, and with dire spelling:

The Grand Master of Assassains was a Vindicare. Everyone thought it would be a (male) Callidus, but the Callidus was in the EoT and presumed lost. He comes back and starts plotting with one of the High Lords - Vandire IIRC, the chappie who caused the Age of Apotsay - to take over the Assassainorium.

The Grand Master got wind of the plan and used another Callidus to disguise as himself, then the evil Callidus bloke killed her and disguised himself as the Grand Master. The real Grand Master unleashed the Eversors and opened all the weapons bunkers in a bitter civil war of his faction against the traitors, all confined in the Assassainorium. The showdown was in the Grand Masters office, when he grabbed an "ornamental" Exitus pistol from the wall display and blasted the bad Callidus with it, then he disapeared and the Inquisition moved in.

Kahadras
13-06-2005, 23:09
I'm sure it was a Callidus Assassin.

No it was a Venenum. I remember reading it and thinking that there were more than four types of assasin because of it. The Callidus assasin story was the one about her kidnapping this planetary goveners son by swallowing him whole and just waltzing out of the palace.

Kahadras

GavT
14-06-2005, 10:40
I'm not sure where a lot of that Venenum stuff came from I wouldnt suggest we muddy the waters by advocating anyone but the Callidus use polymorphine. They're poisoners pure and simple. I believe the Vanus were supposed to be a 'terminate with extreme prejudice' sort of Temple kill you, your family, your dog, your dog's family, blow up your house, the dog's kennel. your family's houses, your dog's family's kennels, etc. Over the top displays of the Imperium's power are the order of the day for these psychos 'look what we can do to you when you least expect it' sort of thing :D

GAV

athamas
14-06-2005, 10:46
ahh yes, nbut with the Vanus, they would not claim it was them,


you would be the victim of several 'unfortunate' accidents!

Hellebore
14-06-2005, 14:36
ahh yes, nbut with the Vanus, they would not claim it was them,


you would be the victim of several 'unfortunate' accidents!


The vanus and venenum temples were in both the 2nd and (free) 3rd ed codex assassins, describing the original temples that formed after the horus heresy.

It never specified what they did, although the codex does have a short story about a venenum operative:

"THe Morisha Incident
Urhua Thereaux, Assassin of the venenum temple, was despatched in 563.M37 to assassinate the renegade Governor Yawell, ruler of the planet Morisha on the eastern fringe. during transit, the starship was caught in a warp rift, holding the vessel in a temoral stasis for some six hundred and ninety eight years. Not knowing that this had occured, Thereaux proceeded to her target, only to find Yawell long since dead and replaced by an anti-imperial democratic committee, consisting of some 1,000 members, Faced with such an extreme task, Thereaux only succeeded in killing the committee members after spending three days poisoning all the chairs in the council's auditorium, before a meeting of the full committee."


The story about the callidus was mother gullet eating the son of a planetary governor (using polymorphine to distort her stomach and oesophagus).

All this was in the 3rd ed of 40k so it isn't really out of date, just not mentioned (as the assassins migrated to the inquisitor codices).

hellebore

gunhed
14-06-2005, 20:35
Not knowing that this had occured, Thereaux proceeded to her target, only to find Yawell long since dead and replaced by an anti-imperial democratic committee, consisting of some 1,000 members, Faced with such an extreme task, Thereaux only succeeded in killing the committee members after spending three days poisoning all the chairs in the council's auditorium, before a meeting of the full committee.

Kind of lucky for her that the rulers were anti-imperial though wasn't it?

It would have been immensely embarrasing had the "new" ruling elite been dedicated imperialist followers wouldn't it?

Imagine the paperwork involved if that had been the case.

DantesInferno
15-06-2005, 00:27
Kind of lucky for her that the rulers were anti-imperial though wasn't it?

It would have been immensely embarrasing had the "new" ruling elite been dedicated imperialist followers wouldn't it?

Imagine the paperwork involved if that had been the case.

The Officio Assassinorum does not do paperwork! :p

Remember everyone is guilty of something (or can be accused to be guilty of something, more to the point). Just say they were secret Chaos worshippers about to sacrifice the entire planet's workers to the Dark Gods, and I doubt you'd find many people prepared to shed tears for them.

The Assassins are all about making a statement - there is no-one nowhere who is beyond the Imperium's reach (well, on Imperial or ex-Imperial worlds anyway). Actual guilt or innocence is rather immaterial, though of course it's more effective if everyone knows the target is a traitor.

gunhed
15-06-2005, 19:56
The Assassins are all about making a statement

But a statement only means something if you know why it's being made in the first place :p, otherwise its got about as much meaning as a country holding a world championship in a sport and the only contestants are from that country.

Killing loyal imperialists and then pretending they were guilty of "something" is an own goal no matter how much they they sex it up.

DantesInferno
16-06-2005, 00:38
But a statement only means something if you know why it's being made in the first place :p, otherwise its got about as much meaning as a country holding a world championship in a sport and the only contestants are from that country.

Killing loyal imperialists and then pretending they were guilty of "something" is an own goal no matter how much they they sex it up.

I don't see why killing a group who seemed to be loyal but were secretly plotting to sacrifice their world to Chaos (at least, allegedly) is necessarily an own goal. I mean, the man on the street isn't going to be too pleased at the notion that he was going to be sacrificed, and there's always the persuasive thought "Well, the Imperium bothered to send an Assassin, so they have to be guilty". The only people who are going to have an idea of the truth are going to be those high up who were close to the victims, and having seen your bosses brutally ripped apart by an Eversor for instance isn't going to boost your confidence enough to start going around making anti-Imperial statements.

Few people are going to be able to tell the difference between a corrupted Governor and a loyal one anyway, especially at the start. So it's not really that much of a departure from what the Imperium does already.

Grand_Marshal_Kazan
16-06-2005, 10:04
Have there ever been reports of assassins working for Chaos or in service of the foul orders?

There are Death cult assassins that are Chaos born. I think most of these are Khorne based.

gunhed
16-06-2005, 12:25
I don't see why killing a group who seemed to be loyal but were secretly plotting to sacrifice their world to Chaos (at least, allegedly) is necessarily an own goal.

You were missing my point. I wasn't coming from the angle that they might have been secret Chaos worshippers, I was just saying that it was lucky that the assassins new targets were anti-imperial. I was just hypothesizing about what would have happened if the new targets had been truely 100% loyal dyed in the wool Emperor worshippers, and she's just gone and wiped them out.

I agree that getting rid of cultists would be good, but in this scenario, I was wondering what would have been the result of her wiping out genuinely true loyalists. That's where the "spin" and sexing up of dodgy dossiers would have come in:

"There is genuine evidence that these Governors were guilty of being Chaos worshippers and were preparing to sacrifice everyone on the planet within 45 minutes".

Sikkukkut
16-06-2005, 12:35
I was just hypothesizing about what would have happened if the new targets had been truely 100% loyal dyed in the wool Emperor worshippers, and she's just gone and wiped them out.

To be honest, I suspect that there's rather a lot of that sort of thing going on in the Imperium all the time.


That's where the "spin" and sexing up of dodgy dossiers would have come in:

"There is genuine evidence that these Governors were guilty of being Chaos worshippers and were preparing to sacrifice everyone on the planet within 45 minutes".

:D

But I doubt that dodgy dossiers would be needed. They were executed by the Imperium. Only guilty people are executed by the Imperium. Therefore, they were guilty. And anyone who says otherwise is clearly a criminal seditionist and will be dragged away by the Arbites to face charges of treason.

DantesInferno
16-06-2005, 13:58
You were missing my point. I wasn't coming from the angle that they might have been secret Chaos worshippers, I was just saying that it was lucky that the assassins new targets were anti-imperial. I was just hypothesizing about what would have happened if the new targets had been truely 100% loyal dyed in the wool Emperor worshippers, and she's just gone and wiped them out.

I agree that getting rid of cultists would be good, but in this scenario, I was wondering what would have been the result of her wiping out genuinely true loyalists. That's where the "spin" and sexing up of dodgy dossiers would have come in:

"There is genuine evidence that these Governors were guilty of being Chaos worshippers and were preparing to sacrifice everyone on the planet within 45 minutes".

No, I did get your point, though I may not have been clear as I would have liked. The "allegedly" was meant to convey that they could well be innocent. I knew you were referring to true loyalist victims of the Officio Assassinorum, but still think its unlikely to bother the Imperium at all. I mean, the commoners aren't going to be in a position to know whether their overlords were secret Chaos worshippers or not, and their successors are going to be too freaked out to speak out.

And as Sikkukkut so elegantly pointed out, they were obviously guilty because only guilty people are executed by the Imperium.

gunhed
19-06-2005, 12:01
And as Sikkukkut so elegantly pointed out, they were obviously guilty because only guilty people are executed by the Imperium.

Yes, I get it now; seen from the perspective of the average citizen, if they were killed by the Imperium, and the Imperium clearly only executes the guilty, then they were quite clearly guilty of "something". QED.

charlie_c67
20-06-2005, 11:04
Actually, everyone's guilty of something in their life. It just depends on how/whether you judge things.

Delicious Soy
20-06-2005, 11:48
Really, it's not as if the Officio Assisnorum has a monopoly on sniper rifles, poisons or frothing lunatics. Any loyalist knocked off by an unknown assassin was the target of the foul agents of chaos. It's not as if the High Lords are responsible to an oversight committee :p.

Koraath
21-06-2005, 01:37
once the assassin has his or her target they attack regardless of intervening circumstances. It's hardly like they check in every couple of days with the temple to make sure the target is still legitimate.

Gavmo
04-07-2005, 12:20
Really, it's not as if the Officio Assisnorum has a monopoly on sniper rifles, poisons or frothing lunatics.

Very true.
If you read the Inquisitor story's, Jaq Drako trains up some chick to be an assassin after Meh'Lindi is killed by Jain Zar. (Its been a while since i've read the books.)
True, Jaq was an Inquisitor, but this doesn't make the new chick a fully fledged assassin. It just goes to show that anyone could be trained up to that level.
Hmm, wern't we talking about little known assassin temples? Perhaps I should get back on topic...

Phunting
04-07-2005, 13:21
So does anyone have any concrete source for these temples?

And slightly OT, there was an Inq Ordo that dealt with assassins too wasn't there? Any idea what it was and where it is mentioned?

venusianfurs
04-07-2005, 14:29
Ordo Sicarus: www.goblin-online.net/fortyk/20assass.txt - Inquisitor Jaegar, though? That's a no-no.

Phunting
04-07-2005, 16:50
Cheers. Although still no mention of an official source for all this.

Sai-Lauren
04-07-2005, 17:06
If you read the Inquisitor story's, Jaq Drako trains up some chick to be an assassin after Meh'Lindi is killed by Jain Zar. (Its been a while since i've read the books.)


Chaos Child, and let's see if the spoilers work.

He was obsessed with Meh'Lindi, so when she died, and ran into someone who conveniently looked somewhat like her, and came from a planet where it's inhabitants were able to use polymorphine, he used her as a vessel to bring Meh'Lindi's spirit back from the dead in the webway.
Unfortunatly, she came back utterly deranged, and ripped Draco apart.