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Morax
23-04-2013, 15:09
I wanted to turn my WoC models that have been sitting unused into an army that looked good on the field and preformed well at the same time. I'm still waiting for GW to come out with better looking models for some of these but I figured I'd like to have a list ready just in case they do. So...

Daemon Prince 530 pts
General, LVL 4 (Lore of Death) Mark of Nurgle, Chaos Armour, Daemonic Flight, Sword of Striking, Charmed Shield, Dragonbane Gem, Soul Feeder, Flaming Breath, Scaled Skin

Throgg 195 pts

Exalted hero 240 pts
BSB, Mark of Tzeentch, Daemonic Mount, Third Eye of Tzeentch, Talisman of Preservation, Enchanted Shield

17 Chaos Trolls 595

5 Chaos Warhounds 40 pts
Vanguard

5 Chaos Warhounds 40 pts
Vanguard

18 Chaos Warriors 362 pts
Standard Bearer, Champion, Mark of Nurgle, Halberds

3 Skullcrushers of Khorne 254 pts
Standard Bearer, Ensorcelled Weapons, Banner of Eternal Flame

3 Skullcrushers of Khorne 244 pts
Standard Bearer, Ensorcelled Weapons

2500 on the dot.

The BSB and the Daemon Prince use the Trolls as a screen from cannons if needed and will act as hard hitting flankers or road blocks for targets that need to be stopped. The Vanguarding hounds are used to find the likely home of the Banner of Eternal Flame for the Daemon Prince to rip apart. Most of my units have enough punch to go toe to toe with anything they come across but trouble units can easily be combo charged. I have a fortitude of 6 for blood and glory (a concern in my area) which I find to be more than enough, and trolls supported by Throgg or the unit of warriors to take watchtowers (again a concern in my area).

Things I'm questioning is the lack of the chaos familiar on the Daemon Prince and the choice of Death over Nurgle for lores. Death has a load of useful spells for me to roll (Soulblight, Doom and Darkness, Purple Sun), and Spirit Leech to sub out for, which should leave me with a useful magic phase but would the extra spell really go to waste? Or better yet, is it needed? The killing potential of a Purple Sun in the flank of a horde is immense but is it big enough to take Death over Nurgle? Character sniping is going to be a big part of my game to delete characters with flaming attacks or enemy wizards with initiative test spells, but could I not just charge those casters with the Prince and kill them in combat?

Still lots of things to play test but I'm waiting for a plastic box of Chaos Trolls to come before collecting this list anyway. Any questions, comments or helpful critiques are more than welcome.

philsnow
24-04-2013, 17:07
IDK what the chances of plastic chaos trolls are, the closest thing I have seen was on forge world,
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer/Warhammer_Monsters/NURGLE-BILE-TROLLS.html

MeatGrinder
25-04-2013, 20:59
Its a pretty nice list, though I'm quite impartial to Chimairas at the moment, dropping a unit of SC for one might be worth a test. I also seriously reccomend the chaos familliar on the DP, an extra spell and 5+ channel is amazing.

Also, Im planning to use the forge world Skin Wolves for my trolls, with the ltd edition one as throgg. They cost about the same.

Morax
29-04-2013, 15:51
IDK what the chances of plastic chaos trolls are, the closest thing I have seen was on forge world,
http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer/Warhammer_Monsters/NURGLE-BILE-TROLLS.html

Yes I had seen the Nurgle Trolls, but I find forgeworld models not so easy to modify. I don't quite like that the unit would just be 6 repeats of the same 3 models. I like a bit more flexability in the modeling aspect so that the models, at least upon first inspection, all appear unique. Thanks for the advice though.


Its a pretty nice list, though I'm quite impartial to Chimairas at the moment, dropping a unit of SC for one might be worth a test. I also seriously reccomend the chaos familliar on the DP, an extra spell and 5+ channel is amazing.

Also, Im planning to use the forge world Skin Wolves for my trolls, with the ltd edition one as throgg. They cost about the same.

Yeah I had considered the Chimeras as an option, I just feel that they are way too expensive for what I'm likely to get out of them, particularly in my local meta. At over 250 points for a regenerating one, it's just too risky for that many points to be on a toughness 5, 4 wound model with only a 4+ conditional save to protect it. The Skullcrushers have 9 wounds, more attacks (even when taking the thunderstomp into account), and a better/equal save most of the time. If anything, I'm thinking of taking the first unit of Skullcrushers to 4, dropping the second unit, then spending the rest of the points on more warriors to beef the unit up to around 26 models.

I don't really like the look of Skin Wolves as I don't like to proxy models for special characters. Thanks for the comment though.

Korpacz
29-04-2013, 23:25
looks like a fun list to play. I actually played a similar list in a tournament, so I can tell you from experience you're going to need more than 6 deployment drops otherwise you're going to be finished deploying just before your opponent places his best and most important units, so you're always going to be at a disadvantage in terms of match-ups. While your units are all rock solid, a good general should be able to exploit bad match-ups, especially since you have 2 units that are frenzied.

Morax
02-05-2013, 13:46
looks like a fun list to play. I actually played a similar list in a tournament, so I can tell you from experience you're going to need more than 6 deployment drops otherwise you're going to be finished deploying just before your opponent places his best and most important units, so you're always going to be at a disadvantage in terms of match-ups. While your units are all rock solid, a good general should be able to exploit bad match-ups, especially since you have 2 units that are frenzied.

Thanks for your reply. I was actually thinking of taking a drop out of the list, instead of adding more. Although I can realize that the trolls can have some bad matchups against most units carrying the flaming banner, I have tools for finding that and engaging it. Namely the vanguard hounds and the Daemon Prince. After that I'm not left with many bad matchups for most of the units in my force. The list is largely written with mobility in mind to correct anything deployment brings. Sure I'm a bit concerned with frenzy units being lead around by the nose, but leadership 8/9 and a bsb go a long way towards controlling them.

Spree
03-05-2013, 14:40
Great list. I am a bit uncertain about the BsB as it is - why not on foot in the Warriors' unit?

Korpacz
03-05-2013, 23:10
Thanks for your reply. I was actually thinking of taking a drop out of the list, instead of adding more. Although I can realize that the trolls can have some bad matchups against most units carrying the flaming banner, I have tools for finding that and engaging it. Namely the vanguard hounds and the Daemon Prince. After that I'm not left with many bad matchups for most of the units in my force. The list is largely written with mobility in mind to correct anything deployment brings. Sure I'm a bit concerned with frenzy units being lead around by the nose, but leadership 8/9 and a bsb go a long way towards controlling them.

The problem is frenzy is not the test you have to take, it's the mandatory overrun that occurs. If someone puts a great eagle one inch away from your skullcrushers at a 90 degree angle you have 2 options (1) sit there all game staring down the eagle, or (2) charge it and overrun off the board edge or somewhere far away from where you want to be.

The other benefit of chaff is that it is used to determine when and who you fight. If that unit with the flaming banner is coming at your trolls from the right, just throw some dogs in front of them at an angle to slow them down for a turn or two until you're ready to deal with them.

Morax
06-05-2013, 12:44
Great list. I am a bit uncertain about the BsB as it is - why not on foot in the Warriors' unit?

The reason the BSB isn't on foot is I wanted another mobile unit that has some punch. I was thinking of dropping the enchanted shield and finding some points for a greatweapon and barding for the mount. Currently he kicks out 6 strength 5 attacks and a strength 5 stomp with a 1+/3++ rerolling 1's on the ward with toughness 5 and 3 wounds. With the new build he'd have 4 strength 7 attacks, 2 strength 5, and a strength 5 stomp with a 2+/3++ rerolling 1's with toughness 5 and 3 wounds. He costs more but has more offensive punch. Either way, he has enough punch to kill chaff, warmachines, and some monsters. He can also threaten flanks and brings me the all important stupidity reroll.


The problem is frenzy is not the test you have to take, it's the mandatory overrun that occurs. If someone puts a great eagle one inch away from your skullcrushers at a 90 degree angle you have 2 options (1) sit there all game staring down the eagle, or (2) charge it and overrun off the board edge or somewhere far away from where you want to be.

The other benefit of chaff is that it is used to determine when and who you fight. If that unit with the flaming banner is coming at your trolls from the right, just throw some dogs in front of them at an angle to slow them down for a turn or two until you're ready to deal with them.

Eagle situation, I kill the eagle and thank my opponent for the free 50 victory points.

Flaming banner situation, the vanguarding hounds are there just to find that banner, after that the Daemon Prince goes and has some fun ripping that unit apart with his 2++. Aren't many units that can carry a magic banner and avoid a big flying monster like him.

Frenzy doesn't create such problems for me and my play style. Points denial makes those sacrifices on my opponent's part cost him more and more as the game goes on. Many opponents in my local meta were taught in tounaments that winning by 100 points is all I need to get 1st place as it counts as a massacre if my opponent gets 0 from me.

BattleofLund
06-05-2013, 20:27
I was thinking of dropping the enchanted shield and finding some points for a greatweapon and barding for the mount.

Do it, that build is great. My opponents have learned to accept they can't really kill him with shooting, and he will hew large chunks out of anything he fights. The trick most favoured now is hexing his unit and breaking it, thus killing him.


Flaming banner situation, the vanguarding hounds are there just to find that banner, after that the Daemon Prince goes and has some fun ripping that unit apart with his 2++. Aren't many units that can carry a magic banner and avoid a big flying monster like him.

My experience: Warhounds get charged or shot turn one. When a unit survives, it's because it hasn't come even close to any major enemy assets.

Re: Frenzy. Last game two chaff units (Eagle and two Ellyrian Reavers) sacrificed themselves to lead my Khorne Warriors through a marshland, taking more than 40 Dangerous Terrain tests along the way. (charge partway into swamp, kill, overrun, his turn kill, overrun) It was that or standing idle, but in hindsight I realize how extraordinarily depleted the unit could/should have become. So yes, I think Frenzy has its drawbacks. Still I include frenzied troops, so...
I would at least put a musician in the Skullcrushers, so they could Swift Reform.