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King Arthur
28-04-2013, 12:02
Just a thought if the Loremaster of Hoeth were to go into a wizards tower would he know all 8 lores from the rule book or just the one?

Bodysnatcher
28-04-2013, 21:39
Wait and see what the exact wording in the book is.

NitrosOkay
28-04-2013, 21:51
Wait and see what the exact wording in the book is.

The exact wording is in the white dwarf.

"They do not generate spells following the normal rules but instead always know the eight signature spells from the Lores of Battle Magic in the Warhammer Rulebook."

Voss
28-04-2013, 22:14
Hard to say. It could be argued that he doesn't have any 'chosen lores.' But we shall see, I'm not convinced the brief summary in WD is the complete text

theunwantedbeing
28-04-2013, 22:36
Hard to say. It could be argued that he doesn't have any 'chosen lores.' But we shall see, I'm not convinced the brief summary in WD is the complete text

It looks like instead of his chosen lore(eg. fire), he gets every signature spell from the 8 lores.
So the wizards tower would give him the rest of the spells from whichever his chosen lore was(eg. fire).

It would certainly be better to wait untill the book is actually released before questioning things though.

NitrosOkay
28-04-2013, 22:43
Hard to say. It could be argued that he doesn't have any 'chosen lores.' But we shall see, I'm not convinced the brief summary in WD is the complete text

It's not a brief summary, it's a preview of a page from the army book. That's the exact wording of the rule along with "Loremasters of Hoeth are level 2 Wizards."

Glen_Savet
29-04-2013, 13:51
I think that the Loremaster would become a Loremaster of every lore he knows. Precedent to cite is the Orc and Goblin Shamans; they don't "choose" their lore of magic, they are assigned it. Similarly, a Firebelly, a Vampire Counts, Ogre Kingdoms or Tomb King army with a single caster. None of them are given the "choice" of their lore.

Kalandros
29-04-2013, 14:02
Lets see.. a Loremaster becoming Loremaster of nothing while close to a Wizard's Tower would be a bit ridiculous.
But getting all 8 Lores would also be a bit over the top.

I'm expecting a FAQ with "Choose one lore yourself when he meets the conditions".

FatTrucker
29-04-2013, 16:55
I'm expecting a FAQ with "Choose one lore yourself when he meets the conditions".

Seems a balanced way to play it until its confirmed or FAQ'd

Glen_Savet
29-04-2013, 17:37
I'm not really sure why people are worried about the Loremaster knowing entire lores at once; it's still only a level 2, and they'll still be limited by the power pool. If it fails casting once, knowing 50 spells won't help at all.

EDIT: And that's IF you manage to roll a Wizard's Tower, which hardly happens all the time anyway!

Iraf
29-04-2013, 18:13
I'm not really sure why people are worried about the Loremaster knowing entire lores at once; it's still only a level 2, and they'll still be limited by the power pool. If it fails casting once, knowing 50 spells won't help at all.

EDIT: And that's IF you manage to roll a Wizard's Tower, which hardly happens all the time anyway!

That's not really the point of the Rules forums. It's not whether its likely to come up, but how to properly play it should it arise.

Avian
29-04-2013, 18:46
I think that the Loremaster would become a Loremaster of every lore he knows. Precedent to cite is the Orc and Goblin Shamans; they don't "choose" their lore of magic, they are assigned it.
How is that a precedent of anything? :wtf:

O&G Shamans know only spells from a single Lore, so that's not even remotely the same situation.

Glen_Savet
29-04-2013, 19:04
The precedent being they don't get to choose their lore. The Loremaster of Hoeth doesn't choose a lore either. Will you argue that the Orc and Goblin shaman do not gain Loremaster of the Big and Little Waaagh lores, simply because they didn't "choose" their lore? That was the arguement I saw earlier in the thread; the Loremaster didn't "choose" a lore, so cannot gain a benefit from Wizard's Tower, because the tower has the words "chosen lore" in its rules.

Laniston
29-04-2013, 19:24
I would probably randomize a single lore. This question also makes me wonder how he would work in Storm of Magic since knowing all the cataclysm spells from the 8 lores would be stressing towards game breaking.

Knowing all the spells from all the 8 lores is just ridiculous even if he is only level 2. There's a game-balancing reason why individual mages can only use one lore at a time. We can't have a loremaster casting throne of vines on himself and then being able to six-dice Okkam's or Purple Sun etc. without fear.

Avian
29-04-2013, 19:43
The precedent being they don't get to choose their lore. The Loremaster of Hoeth doesn't choose a lore either. Will you argue that the Orc and Goblin shaman do not gain Loremaster of the Big and Little Waaagh lores, simply because they didn't "choose" their lore?
No, you can have something of yours that is chosen, even if you didn't choose yourself. What the Loremaster doesn't have is a (singular) chosen Lore (again, singular). One of (nearly) everything is not ONE choice.

The issue concerns itself with having spells from multiple Lores and potentially getting Loremaster from each one. As nobody from the O&G book can do that, there is no precedent. Nobody (worth listening to) is getting hung up on the "choice" part.

decker_cky
29-04-2013, 23:42
Haven't people been playing that a Grey Seer (with spells from both lores) near a wizard tower gets 13 spells?

Truthsayer can also have double lores.

Blkc57
29-04-2013, 23:45
Haven't people been playing that a Grey Seer (with spells from both lores) near a wizard tower gets 13 spells?

Truthsayer can also have double lores.

When that situation came up in our club we just had the Greyseer pick one of the two Skaven lores. Most likely I think we may do the same with the Loremaster, just have him choose one the 8 lores, of course I am saying this without actually seeing how the Loremaster's rules are worded.

sholcomb
11-08-2013, 23:44
It seems that some people here are arguing that the Wizard's Tower is intended to only give Loremaster to one lore (such as with a Skaven Grey Seer). However, the rule of the Wizard's Tower is quite clear about that issue. It says, "he is treated as knowing all the spells from his chosen lore(s) of magic for that phase." By the "(s)" behind the word "lore", it is quite clear that if a wizard knows spells from more than one lore, they now get all the spell of each lore.

mjungledog
14-08-2013, 16:19
This question came up at a tournament I just ran. I ruled that since the Loremaster does not have a chosen Lore, he does not get every spell in the battle magic deck...

Everyone seemed ok with that.

Phazael
21-08-2013, 22:47
The way our league is playing this (since it has come up with the Rainbow Slaan), is that if a multiple lore model, like the Loremaster or Grey Seer, get the Loremaster ability in game, they may select one single lore they have access to in their repertoire and be loremaster of that one particular lore for that magic phase, selecting a different one next magic phase if they wish. I think that is fair but not unbalancing.

Glen_Savet
21-08-2013, 23:43
So, what happens now that a Slann with High Magic can trade for another spell from another lore? Would it gain that entire lore when it rolled for a new spell?

decker_cky
22-08-2013, 00:09
So, what happens now that a Slann with High Magic can trade for another spell from another lore? Would it gain that entire lore when it rolled for a new spell?

His chosen lore is high magic. He'd regain access to any spells he had traded away though.