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T10
28-05-2013, 07:32
The idea of the Terra Nova Interregnum seems to have been a relatively recent introduction (5th ed. rule book). How do you think this played out for the Space Marines? Did they all remain loyal to the High Lords of Terra? Did they divide with separatist aligning themselves with the Ur-Council? Did they continue to fight for the Imperium as a whole, independent of either party?

It seems to me this period is great for allowing loyalist Imperial forces to fight each other without one side having "fallen" or due to miscommunication or clerical errors.

-T10

Iron_Lord
29-05-2013, 11:50
According to the Daemon Hunter Dark Heresy book, the Inquisition at least stepped back and left them to it, focussing entirely on external threats.

MajorWesJanson
31-05-2013, 19:43
Much like the early Age of Apostasy, the Mechanicus and Astartes probably just forted up and continued doing what they usually did, pretty much ignoring the events on Terra until it started to interfere with them directly.

A.T.
31-05-2013, 20:15
Much like the early Age of Apostasy, the Mechanicus and Astartes probably just forted up and continued doing what they usually did, pretty much ignoring the events on Terra until it started to interfere with them directly.The mechanicus was in the mist of a civil war (or two) at the time, the Moirae schism (M35).

The Interregnum started around mid M34 and was relatively low key for much of the time. Looking at the timeline it would have kicked off not long after the howling, a lot of lost ships and astropaths (following on around a millenia or so from the astropath wars).

There aren't actually many official marine chapters listed by that point either, the 8th founding was mid M34 - given the scale of the imperium the marines could have been pretty thin on the ground and tied up, especially with the both the 4th black crusade and the blackstar crusade in M34. There was also the whole pale wasting affair around the ghoul stars which tied up at least one marine chapter (the novamarines) and suggests that others may have been completely destroyed in the conflict.

----

Actually the whole period of time from the start of M34 through M36 is arguably the strongest point of the 40k background in terms of interesting events many of the core factions getting in on the action and a constantly shifting imperium.

dokfm
09-06-2013, 02:17
Actually the whole period of time from the start of M34 through M36 is arguably the strongest point of the 40k background in terms of interesting events many of the core factions getting in on the action and a constantly shifting imperium.
You know, it's probably bad, but I'm not particularly ​interested in the Horus Heresy and Warhammer 30k... I want Warhammer 35k.

MajorWesJanson
10-06-2013, 04:26
You know, it's probably bad, but I'm not particularly ​interested in the Horus Heresy and Warhammer 30k... I want Warhammer 35k.

We do need more stuff about the M34-M36 timeframe. Nova Terra Interregnum, Age of Apostasy, Moriae Scism, the Cataclysm of Souls, the Abyssal Crusade, and the Occlusiad.

quantumcollider
10-06-2013, 11:23
There is a piece of background material on the Nova Terra Interregnum in Codex: Dark Angles. It mentions how one of the driving forces of the Nova Terra council was in all probability one of the Fallen.

I highly dislike this piece of background. Before this the Nova Terra Interregnum was like a counter-movement against the increasingly theocratic rule of the Ecclesiarchy, and perhaps even an attempt to bring reason back into the Imperium. A highly interesting concept.

Now it's like "Chaos infiltrated the Imperium (again) to cause rebellion (again)... Must be tuesday (again)".

dokfm
10-06-2013, 12:49
I highly dislike this piece of background. Before this the Nova Terra Interregnum was like a counter-movement against the increasingly theocratic rule of the Ecclesiarchy, and perhaps even an attempt to bring reason back into the Imperium. A highly interesting concept.

Now it's like "Chaos infiltrated the Imperium (again) to cause rebellion (again)... Must be tuesday (again)".
But, since the Codexes are (apparently) from the perspective of the factions, how do we know it's not just the Dark Angels lying to themselves? I mean, they're certainly paranoid enough to believe any insurrection is caused by the Fallen...

The Warmaster
10-06-2013, 22:24
But, since the Codexes are (apparently) from the perspective of the factions, how do we know it's not just the Dark Angels lying to themselves? I mean, they're certainly paranoid enough to believe any insurrection is caused by the Fallen...

Not to mention that Fallen doesn't necessarily mean Chaos, and their involvement doesn't have to invalidate what quantumcollider said at all. In fact, the idea that some of the non-Chaotic Fallen are opposed to the way the Imperium developed since the Great Crusade makes perfect sense - they came from the age of the Imperial Truth, after all. In fact, Astelan justifies some of his actions in Angels of Darkness as being due to exactly this.

And if it was Cypher that was behind it (he's suspected to have been on the Ur-Council, after all, along with at least one other Fallen), then that makes things very interesting, as it could go either way.

MajorWesJanson
11-06-2013, 00:37
There is a piece of background material on the Nova Terra Interregnum in Codex: Dark Angles. It mentions how one of the driving forces of the Nova Terra council was in all probability one of the Fallen.

I highly dislike this piece of background. Before this the Nova Terra Interregnum was like a counter-movement against the increasingly theocratic rule of the Ecclesiarchy, and perhaps even an attempt to bring reason back into the Imperium. A highly interesting concept.

Now it's like "Chaos infiltrated the Imperium (again) to cause rebellion (again)... Must be tuesday (again)".

I thought it was just one of the worlds that provided major support to the Ur-Council, not the council itself?

Iron_Lord
11-06-2013, 11:34
There is a piece of background material on the Nova Terra Interregnum in Codex: Dark Angles.

That sounds more like a book about eldritch abominations :D

raygunsand rocketeers
11-06-2013, 20:54
Terra Nova Interregnum is new (5th ed.)...... GW is laying the groundwork to be able to add new fluff...
this way they can have an excuse when 'new' things pop up in the plot/story line, like new vehicles....
they can now give a back history for the vehicles/ events that dont interfere with the current historical timeline,
for the TNI is relatively undocumented, and therefore useable.....
heck, they could even 'discover' some long lost squat stronghold that wasnt eaten by the Nids...
(opps, Ive done it now lol)

The Warmaster
12-06-2013, 05:54
I thought it was just one of the worlds that provided major support to the Ur-Council, not the council itself?

Everything I've read points to the Ur-Council being the council of Nova Terra. The rebellion was definitely centred on that world, anyway.


Terra Nova Interregnum is new (5th ed.)...... GW is laying the groundwork to be able to add new fluff...

Yup, and I think it's a great thing. The idea of the NTI (for future reference it's Nova Terra, not Terra Nova ;) ) is really interesting, since it shows that the stranglehold of the Ecclesiarchy upon Imperial culture is much less absolute than the propaganda would have you think. It'd be awesome to see if any more about the motivations of the Fallen involved in it (Obidiah Hrakon, possibly Cypher) is revealed, especially if it points less to "Chaos did it" and more "we hated the way the Imperium was going, so it was time to bring back the Imperial Truth".

MajorWesJanson
12-06-2013, 07:34
The DA believe that a member of the Ur-Council is a fallen, and attack, but don't secure any prisoners. They later do assault and capture Hrakon, a Fallen standard bearer who is a ruler of a planet that is supporting the NTI, but it doesn't say if he is part of the council, if the Fallen helped provoke the Interregnum, or if Hrakon is just opportunistically supporting the NTI to further his power base.

A.T.
12-06-2013, 08:54
The idea of the NTI (for future reference it's Nova Terra, not Terra Nova ;) ) is really interesting, since it shows that the stranglehold of the Ecclesiarchy upon Imperial culture is much less absolute than the propaganda would have you think.The Interregnum lasted for nearly a thousand years during which the high lords themselves were trying to curtail the ecclesiarchy, while the ur-council was trying to break away from the high lords.

The efforts of the high lords to infiltrate the higher ranks of the ecclesiarchy eventually led to their power base moving far from Terra to Ophelia VII where, free of the attentions of the administratum, the church was able to consolodate its power and build a huge army.

Around 975.M35 the ecclesiarchy began moves to force the administratum to accept a full theocratic state with the ecclesiarch at the head of the high lords, by stirring up the masses into a frenzy of religious penitence - however it backfired for them as much of humanity set its sights on the Ur council and annihilated them in the name of the ecclesiarchy and the high lords, restoring much of the administratums lost power in the process and setting the stage for the later age of apostasy.


It is new fluff though, back in the 2nd edition sisters of battle dex there are uprising mentioned during that period of time but it was against the heavy tithing of the eccclesiarchy as they built their armies rather than a breakaway faction.

Fangschrecken
12-06-2013, 23:58
Correct me if i'm wrong, but wasn't Vulkan rumored to be on the Ur-Council?

Londinium
13-06-2013, 00:44
Correct me if i'm wrong, but wasn't Vulkan rumored to be on the Ur-Council?

Vulkan disappeared thousands of years before.

dokfm
13-06-2013, 01:01
Vulkan disappeared thousands of years before.
He *cough* disappeared. *cough*
I'm just saying, if they're bringing back the Imperial Truth, somebody would have to explain it to them...
Although yeah, having a giant demigod of war that disappeared thousands of years prior on the council seems like an important thing to mention. Plus he's only gonna come back for the End Times... :shifty:

A.T.
13-06-2013, 08:33
Correct me if i'm wrong, but wasn't Vulkan rumored to be on the Ur-Council?Not that i've ever seen. Corax would be the more likely choice if a primarch was involved.