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murgel2006
02-06-2013, 21:25
The codex is here and it has been done well. Not brilliant, mind blowing, auto-cheesing but well.
It has been done with some creativity and a good view on synergy between units.

Now, we all have already read a "few" complains and I wanted to collect them, the reasoning why there is a complain and the suggestions to fix the perceived problem.
Here is an example for the formate.

Complain:
Neither the Hemlock nor the Nightshade are feasible because they are overcosted.
Reasons:
With AV10 they will go down fast, maybe even at entering the field.
Fix:
reduce basic points by 40

I look forward to seeing your issues.
My complains will be posted separately.

Iron_Lord
02-06-2013, 21:27
Just how overcosted are they compared to other AV10 flyers? The Ork Dakkajet, the Phoenix, the Tau Remora, and so on?

murgel2006
02-06-2013, 21:47
So, here are my primary "complains", except for everything but Banshees better call them "would have been nicer"

Complain:
The Banshees have intentionally been kicked again.
Reasons:
They lost grenades rule, Ini boost was poorly substituted, counter attack was lost, the mask no longer works in first round of combat but only on charge.
Fix:
easiest fix IMO is two part
a) Errata allowing mask to reduce enemy ini to zero.
b) Errata making it first round of combat again.

Complain:
Rangers have lost to much of the previous kick they had.
Reasons:
a) Pathfinders are no longer generally available.
b) the loss of AP1 on sixes is worth more than the points reduction.
Fix:
a) Errata, giving back the AP1 on sixes
or
b) Errata, Ranger long rifle to assault 1, sniper


Complain:
My poor Mandiblasters. The basic idea is great, an attack before the actual fight. However S3??? :eyebrows:
Reasons:
These are tech-toy-guns, you could have made them any S you want. S4 would have been sufficient, S5 absolutely brilliant but S3 is underpowered IMO
Fix:
Errata "ups it's S4. Bad mistake, sorry".

You can see with this minor complains I like the codex.

Starchild
02-06-2013, 22:05
I think it's rather funny how Phil Kelly got our hopes up about the Banshees in WD. He made them sound like the best Eldar assault unit ever. I'm convinced that he unintentionally left out a sentence or two regarding a plasma grenade effect for the Banshee Mask. I'm sure an FAQ will sort them out one way or another.

Voss
02-06-2013, 22:09
the ranger long rifle is still sniper, so rends on 6s. At their cost, they are probably one* of the better sniper units in the game (they certainly make SM scouts look sad).

*though they lose to the kroot's weight of numbers.

Minsc
02-06-2013, 22:23
A Crimson Hunter Exarch would be crazily underpriced if he became 40 pts cheaper, as would a regular Crimson Hunter. They would cost less than fully kitted Dakkajets! :rolleyes:

Banshee's would be very easy to fix though:

Acrobatic: In addition to +3" to their run, they treat all transports as assault vehicles.
Bansheemask: In addition to -5 enemy initiative, they count as equiped with plasmagrenades when they charge. (I don't mind the mask only working when the banshee's charge actually, it makes more sense.)

MagicHat
02-06-2013, 22:30
I disagree with basically everything you said...
IMO:
The fliers need defensive capabilities, not a cost reduction.

The Banshees in general don't need the mask when charged, since they are I5 and strikes ahead of most anyway. I0 is wonky like hell; better to just give the grenade effect. However, they have more problems then their mask.

There is nothing wrong with the Rangers right now. Pathfinders might be a bit expensive. Maybe allow Ranger squads to upgrade a member to a Pathfinder with Shroud/sharpshooter for, say, 25 points. Or allow them to to use battlefocus with sniper riffles. Assault is a bit powerful, AP1 is kinda broken at current costs.

The new mandiblaster is better then the old one for rank and file scorpions. Worse for the Exarch and Autarch, but it is not something that needs to be fixed.

I don't think we will see any groundbreaking FAQ.

Not entirely happy about the lack of a cheap transport. Wave serpents are pretty boss, but you won't buy one for everyone.
Lack of defense against perils/psychic defenses/low Ld for casting powers is kinda baffling for the psyker race.
Warlocks splitting off before rolling for powers is giving me a headache just thinking about it. That or fatigue. Should probably go to bed now. That might be FAQ'ed actually.
Warlocks not joining Wraithguard/aspect warriors come think of it. I would go out and buy warlocks if they could.

Some upgrade costs. PW on Storm guardians, Firepike, some (most) of the remnants of glory, eldar missile launcher on everything, flakk, and the cost for starstrikes on Reapers.
Lack of Skyfire in the codex. Only 1 flier and 1 heavy support option that can bring a serious amount.
Maybe add 3" to every shuriken weapon, just for the lulz.

Shamana
02-06-2013, 22:34
Eh, I'd say both rangers and scorpions are quite decent. For the regular scorps, the mandiblaster hit is just a bit better than a sword attack, and at max initiative. For the exarch, it isn't, but exarch have other toys. Rangers are cheap snipers, my only issue is that I'd rather not be pigeonholed by 1 named SC to play a unit typical for Alaitoc, but actually as per previous fluff affiliated with other craftwords as well. Then again, that's the only way marine players can play various chapters, so I don't consider it a huge issue.

My biggest issues:

- I'd like to see guardian jetbikes as an upgrade for storm guardians, allowing them to retain grenades, pistols and CCWs and represent a more assault-oriented jetbike army. Not for free, of course.
- I'd prefer a shuriken catapult at 18 inches both for guardians (whose main job is fire support, not point-blank range) and vehicles. If not, I'd like an option to put lasblasters on guardians. If shuriken catapults stay 12 inches, I'd like to see an option to merge them with flamers and meltaguns, other short-range weapons. Ideally, there should be one guardian entry with a lot of options - aspects may be thematically specialized, guardians do what needs to be done.
- I'd like to see the autarch with some more specialized coordination and control wargear, for example something like the PGL that allows the entire unit with him to benefit from his plasma grenades on the charge, or something to reduce scatter for a unit he's with or make it scoring.
- I'd like a way to make eldar psykers more reliable. Control and defense was their trademark before, so how come warlocks are among the most unreliable psykers now? I'd like to see +1 LD for warlocks and spiritseers (either innate or an upgrade specifically about casting roles), possibly at the cost of -1 I or a few more points.
- As spiritseers are lesser psykers than farseers, and more support-inclined, I'd like to see the option of purchasing more than one per slot like how DE can purchase haemonculi. For example, there could be a ML spiritseer for 50 and Master spiritseer (the current one)at 80.
- The Avatar is the living god of all eldar, but to the aspects it is something more: it is their god, their idol, the pinnacle of their craft. To them, it should be something much more than for the rest of their kin. I'd like it if aspects received additional buffs within the avatar bubble, i.e. preferred enemy (everything) or rage, possibly as purchaseable upgrade to the avatar or as an inbuilt ability
- Banshees are currently not just unable to cope well with the majority of enemies in melee but are unable to lead the assault against an entrenched foes. I think a serious buff is in order to make them frail, but hard-hitting as well. I'd like to see acrobatic allow assaulting out of vehicles, banshee masks ignore cover and mitigate/weaken overwatch (i.e. by forcing successful overwatch hits to be rerolled if the exarch mask works) and/or furious charge.
- Harlequins are supposedly masters of strange, exotic arts and the greatest foes of Chaos, yet they alone of the army do NOT get any buffs fighting She who Thirsts, and their hallucinogen weaponry is downright laughable compared to that of the GK. I'd like for hatred or PF (slaanesh) as an inbuilt ability, and better hallucinogen grenades as a possible purchaseable wargear. Maybe not as crazy as the GK ones, but something with more wow factor.
- speaking of which, harlequins are supposed to be the unmatched masters of navigating the webway, more even than the dark eldar. As a possible alternative to mechanized forces or putting warlocks on nigh everything, I'd like a WWP as a purchaseable upgrade on the troupe master.

Most of these aren't about automatically making the eldar better (I realize many should also cost something), just closer to how I see the army. LMK what you think.

murgel2006
02-06-2013, 22:53
I would like to point out, that the Flyer was an EXAMPLE.
Personally I feel it is absolutely ok, no it is really nice and awesome in air-to-air work. (however I will stick to my Nightwing, because I already have it at home.)

- I would love the idea of a jetbike upgrade to stormguardians called a Stormbike. Specially designed to be controlled by weight-shifting and food-work only for CC purposes.
To upgrade EJB to Stormbike, substitute the TL catapults with a grenade disperser and a single shuriken catapult.

Shakkara
02-06-2013, 23:30
Complain:
Regular Warlocks can no longer join wraithguard/blade units
Reasons:
cause GW wants to sell spiritseer models
Fix:
Warlocks should be able ot join wraithguard/blade units

Complain:
Warlocks have unreliable psychic powers
Reasons:
Leadership is 8 and powers cannot be chosen
Fix:
Increase Ld to 9 and allow players to choose their powers

Iron_Lord
02-06-2013, 23:32
Complain:
Warlocks have unreliable psychic powers
Reasons:
Leadership is 8 and powers cannot be chosen
Fix:
Increase Ld to 9 and allow players to choose their powers

No other 6e codicies have allowed psykers to choose their powers, it must be said.

Spare Change
03-06-2013, 03:02
No other 6e codicies have allowed psykers to choose their powers, it must be said.

I don't see why anyone would assume that Eldar would be the exception to this. Random powers removes any responsibility of balance for the designers; thus it's here to stay.

Ssilmath
03-06-2013, 03:05
I don't see why anyone would assume that Eldar would be the exception to this. Random powers removes any responsibility of balance for the designers; thus it's here to stay.

Or it shifts the winning skills away from list building and towards how well the player can use their army, random elements and all. But hey, never waste an opportunity to shake your fist at GW.

JWhex
03-06-2013, 03:28
Posting suggestions on how to fix things in this and similar threads seems rather futile to me, GW are not reading this and are disinclined to make changes after a codex is printed unless something really has gone horribly wrong in their opinion or causes widespread confusion.

Spare Change
03-06-2013, 03:29
Or it shifts the winning skills away from list building and towards how well the player can use their army, random elements and all. But hey, never waste an opportunity to shake your fist at GW.

We all know that you're the resident Games Workshop apologist Sslimath; but on the off-chance that you're just unable to see that it's blatantly lazy game design, take a moment to really consider how absurd the idea behind it is. I'll wait.

That said, by your logic, maybe we should also roll a D6 for faction, codex, and our wargear next. Step-up our tactical skills. :rolleyes:

Craftworld
03-06-2013, 03:33
That said, by your logic, maybe we should also roll a D6 for faction, codex, and our wargear next. Step-up our tactical skills. :rolleyes:

I laughed.



On topic, I'm a teensy bit disappointed that the range of most weapons wasn't increased. That's it though, really.

Ssilmath
03-06-2013, 03:37
We all know that you're the resident Games Workshop apologist Sslimath; but on the off-chance that you're just unable to see that it's blatantly lazy game design, take a moment to really consider how absurd the idea behind it is. I'll wait.

That said, by your logic, maybe we should also roll a D6 for faction, codex, and our wargear next. Step-up our tactical skills. :rolleyes:

Eh, that's what I did with Warmachine.

Sorry I can't be one of the cool kids, but I see things from a different perspective. Maybe if the internet forums weren't a seething bed of rage, GW might actually be inclined to pay attention. As it is, I can't blame them for ignoring you all.

Spare Change
03-06-2013, 03:49
Eh, that's what I did with Warmachine.

Sorry I can't be one of the cool kids, but I see things from a different perspective. Maybe if the internet forums weren't a seething bed of rage, GW might actually be inclined to pay attention. As it is, I can't blame them for ignoring you all.

Oh no, it's us 'cool-kids' that wish we could be you. I mean, you're the guy who runs warp-talons and 'wins all the games!'.

Your 'different perspective' is always defending mediocre design, poor rules creation, and mediocre fluff. We have a name for that stance- it's called an apologist.

The bearded one
03-06-2013, 03:54
Okay kids, do I have to pull this car over?

Voss
03-06-2013, 04:03
I don't see why anyone would assume that Eldar would be the exception to this. Random powers removes any responsibility of balance for the designers; thus it's here to stay.

It doesn't though. It makes balance more important, since all of the powers will be used, not just the good ones while the bad ones are just ignored, costing little more than the wasted ink on the page.

ehlijen
03-06-2013, 04:04
We all know that you're the resident Games Workshop apologist Sslimath; but on the off-chance that you're just unable to see that it's blatantly lazy game design, take a moment to really consider how absurd the idea behind it is. I'll wait.

That said, by your logic, maybe we should also roll a D6 for faction, codex, and our wargear next. Step-up our tactical skills. :rolleyes:

And we now all know that you're letting axe grinding get in the way of polite posting. Maybe the two of you should take it to pm?

There is a middle ground between 'roll a d6 to see if you want to play a game' and Go. And I think random abilities on models with fairly free deployment options are near that.
Yes, psychic powers are random. But with most lores being fairly themed towards one task, the primaris swap (though I guess the rules for when to decide that could be loosened up a bit) and being able to stick an IC anywhere in your force afterwards (and even warlocks having options in that regard), random powers are more about forcing some flexibility into people's armies than about random for random sake.

You can't finetune your psyker's potential anymore, but in a dice based game, you were never meant to be able to do that.

On the other hand the random event table in the deamons codex is just annoying. Neither player will know what's coming, there is nothing that can be done from deployment onwards to safeguard against it and even the player who chose not to play as daemons is forced to deal with the outcomes.

Some random elements that allow control over how they are then used in the game spice things up by making players think about different choices every game. Rolling to see if the world explodes every turn simply takes away from the meaning of any choice the players make. There is a difference and a good balance point between randomness and control.

Scribe of Khorne
03-06-2013, 04:12
We all know that you're the resident Games Workshop apologist Sslimath; but on the off-chance that you're just unable to see that it's blatantly lazy game design, take a moment to really consider how absurd the idea behind it is. I'll wait.

That said, by your logic, maybe we should also roll a D6 for faction, codex, and our wargear next. Step-up our tactical skills. :rolleyes:

Holy **** this had me roaring in laughter.

Swordsman
03-06-2013, 04:16
I laughed.


Holy **** this had me roaring in laughter.

I know, right? Ssilmath poked the wrong forum-goer, it seems.

Grndhog89
03-06-2013, 04:17
Flame-baiting is afoot in this thread.

Ssilmath
03-06-2013, 04:18
I know, right? Ssilmath poked the wrong forum-goer, it seems.

It would seem so, I had no idea just how much rage would be unleashed. Oh well, at least something entertaining has come out of this thread. I must admit, it gave me a good chuckle as well.

Inquisitor Samos
03-06-2013, 04:21
Flame-baiting is afoot in this thread.

Indeed. It might be a really good idea to cool it down, before the local Inquisition shows up.

Scribe of Khorne
03-06-2013, 04:21
Its Sunday folks, let the rage flow before we call get back to the weekly grind. ;)

wyvirn
03-06-2013, 04:31
Okay kids, do I have to pull this car over?

Voss keeps putting his arm on my side of the car!

The Orange
03-06-2013, 04:43
Or it shifts the winning skills away from list building and towards how well the player can use their army, random elements and all. But hey, never waste an opportunity to shake your fist at GW.

Honestly I've always hated the random factor GW likes to throw into games. You make a good point, but a think there are plenty of people who see something like that and think like me, i.e. "nope nope nope, never going to use it". Scatter lasers used to be D6 shots, no one ever used them, now their a solid 4 shots, now people use them occasionally. I remember the Chaos Possessed random table (last book iirc), most of it was a random power that affected their hth ability, that's not too bad, but then one of the powers was getting wings...."oh look i bought them a transport for no freaking reason now". List building is part of the game, not to mention sometimes it's about building something thematic, I don't understand why GW things we like going into a game, not knowing what a unit will do. Between spending the points on something that can be either useful or useless depending on the dice roll, to just choosing something I know I can use, i'll go with the safe bet every time.

I haven't had a good look at the Eldar Codex yet, hopefully it's not that bad, but I simply detest random tables.

Ssilmath
03-06-2013, 05:05
And I do agree with you, Orange. Army building is a big part of the game, and it should be. But 5th had a serious problem with games being all but won before a model had been moved. Warlord traits and random psychic powers throws just enough uncertainty into the mix that skill in the use of the tools at your disposal becomes important as well. The powers in the Eldar codex are pretty solid (I can find a use for even Death Mission, but that one is a bit out there), so it isn't like the Eldar player is going to be randomly stuck with something useless.

Now, the Warpstorm chart is a bit over the top. I like it from a fluff bunny perspective, I like the idea that it represents. I think the implementation could have been better than acting as Daemon artillery with a chance to completely hose either player. Less fist of god, more switching to Night Fight, giving tablewide FNP, that sort of thing. I can live with it though.

Half Breed
03-06-2013, 05:08
The psychic lores were done pretty poorly in my opinion. Add one strong ability, one 'decent', then make the rest garbage that can completely negate your psykers intended use- oh, and then a so-so primaris power, for some of the trees.. 'balanced'!

TheDungen
03-06-2013, 05:50
I usally agree with the random factor, because it makes listhammer harder. That said I think eldar should be the exception, they are the psychic race in wh 40k, also they should be about order tactics and if played right should be able to woop the enemy, eldar are a classic case of army that should take skill not luck to play.

T10
03-06-2013, 05:54
Complain:
Warlocks have unreliable psychic powers
Reasons:
Leadership is 8 and powers cannot be chosen
Fix:
Increase Ld to 9 and allow players to choose their powers

I think it's refreshing to see psykers that aren't completely reliable but instead make up for it with numbers. I'm looking forward to see how they work in the game, as opposed to how I would imagine them to.

When life (read: the codex) serves you lemons (read: warlocks), look around for some sugar (read: units that are going to benefit from having warlocks attached, but don't absolutely need them), because straight-up lemon-juice kinda sucks.

-T10

Shadeseraph
03-06-2013, 06:26
When life (read: the codex) serves you lemons (read: warlocks), look around for some sugar (read: units that are going to benefit from having warlocks attached, but don't absolutely need them), because straight-up lemon-juice kinda sucks.

-Insert obligatory Cave Johnson quote here- (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8ufRnf2Exc)

Spell_of_Destruction
03-06-2013, 06:31
I don't mind that warlocks need to roll for their powers or even that they are now forced to cast on ld 8 but I would have liked it if this had been offset by allowing them to be assigned to a larger range of squads.

Thrax
03-06-2013, 06:54
You can't finetune your psyker's potential anymore, but in a dice based game, you were never meant to be able to do that.



Sorry, but this makes absolutely no sense.

ehlijen
03-06-2013, 07:18
Sorry, but this makes absolutely no sense.

What any character can achieve always depended on the dice. Now psyker's need to roll one more dice, but regardless of how that dice turns out, they will have some capability. Their total value hasn't really changed, assuming your army can benefit from the variety of buffs could grant, but your ability to plan his contribution out during list planning is reduced.

Garrtok
03-06-2013, 07:42
Do you really think that GW changes anything via errata?!

ihockert
03-06-2013, 08:06
The only thing that definitively needs help in the Eldar Codex is Howling Banshees. Make the mask negate cover and overwatch, and perhaps give an Exarch the ability to let them assault from a transport and they would be solid. The Crimson Hunter may need some form of survivability upgrade of some sort. Though it would never happen I would love a special rule like this: Advance Aerial Acrobatics: The Crimson Hunter may not be targeted by weapons with the interceptor rule on the owning player's turn and may not be targeted with vector strikes.

As far as the Warlock issues are concerned, in general I think it is a non-issue. The primaris power is the most useful for the vast majority of units that to which warlocks can be attached and warlocks are not the first psykers this edition that have to deal with being leadership 8, as Heralds of Nurgle and Slaanesh are also leadership 8 psykers (if you take the upgrade), and I'm supposed to believe Warlocks are better at manifesting powers than beings composed of warp energy.

MagicHat
03-06-2013, 08:07
Do you really think that GW changes anything via errata?!

Check out the DA errata.

Fear13
03-06-2013, 08:43
I love the new codex. I have no issues with the random psyker table. Just means you have to go ulthwe style for psychic domination, 1-2 farseers, big seer council squads. This way you get your abilities and control. Only problem is the picking of powers before you split them off to different squads, that might be errata'd.

Banshees have become slightly worse, but I still see them as viable. Would love to have seen acrobatic allow assault from vehicles (there is a lovely grav tank picture in the codex of a wave serpent bombing through the air, with the ramp down and a guardian stood looking out across the skies) but can live without. Was never in favour of them receiving a buff to strength but would liked to have seen them receive master crafted power swords, ( the effect of the mask makes it easier to hit), and on the charge the banshee scream to negate over watch some what.

I certainly don't feel they are terrible, and am happily thinking of ways to make them as effective a possible. Thinking along the lines of the old refused flank, and disembarking the same turn that my deep striking hawks, and other grav tanks cargoes unload in the enemy deployment zone.

Do feel some points costs for vehicles are strange. Guardian power weapon and fusion guns make the guardian cost more than the aspect equivalent. Weapons on vehicles look great but unsure why the missile launcher is so expensive. The only thing I can think of is the synergy opportunities, hemlocks, rangers, pinning and the lowering of leadership. I imagine in theory you could be really slowing down an enemy, which with our speed could be great.

daveNYC
03-06-2013, 11:15
1) Warlocks: By most readings of RAW, Warlocks roll for powers after being assigned to squads. You can see how that might be annoying, not to mention somewhat silly from a fluff standpoint. Also too, LD8. Though the power generation vs squad assignment is worse.

2) Banshees: Some way to assault out of vehicles would have been nice. Is it just me or does Kelly seem to have some issue designing CC units. Banshees, Mutilators, and Mandrakes. Some might add Warp Talons in there. He also did Incubi and TWC, but still he seems to have a bit of a blind spot.

3) Pricing on the EML: That thing is pretty expensive no matter what platform it's mounted on, so it's not just an issue with jacking up the cost of Skyfire. Maybe Kelly is trying to get people to specialize, but it's goofy.

4) Skyfire: Only on two units, and one of those units is actually just the Dark Reaper Exarch (who doesn't have split fire, so you'll be tossing the rest of the unit's firepower up on snapshots). The other unit is in the very crowded HS slot. If they're trying to push the Crimson Hunter, then they've succeeded. Allowing Guardians to stick Flakks (and seriously, they have funky names for every Eldar weapon, but they still call their AA missiles 'flakks'?) on the EML heavy weapon platforms they lug around would allow some flexibility and be fluffy. Especially since the Guardians are generalists and supposedly the lifeblood of the Craftworldblahblah, yet are burnt toast if a Heldrake shows up.

5) Wraithknight: Can mount between 3-4 weapons, can only fire two. Yeah... I mean you don't have to take them, but other than a scatterlaser to TL the Sungun, why would you? Each extra gun is basically an additional aspect warrior.

6) Death Mission psyker power: Roughly speaking, it turns your Farseer into a white-hot killing machine. It comes with a number of serious drawbacks, not least of which is that if you get and want to use this power, you'd have really wanted to kit your Farseer out to be a white-hot killing machine already. Not to mention that the token system, if you roll poorly, could have your dude drop dead the turn he casts it. Personally, it probably needs a major rework, or future printings of the codex should just replace it's text with 'just take the primaris'.

Overall it's a pretty good codex. Some of what's in it just feels weird though. Not bad, just that some of the design choices seem arbitrary and they don't flow from other design choices or really from fluff (not that fluff is the end all be all).

One major complaint as a CSM fan. The Eldar codex got two full (7 power) lists, many of which contain dual usage powers for even more flexibility. CSM got three four power tables with no cool flexible powers, and Tzeentch's stuff was especially uninteresting. My working hypothesis now is that Kelly just didn't care that much about writing the CSM codex.

duffybear1988
03-06-2013, 13:21
The only units that are worthless in the entire new codex are prince Yriel (re-rolling 6s for saves sucks, autarch does his job arguably better), banshees (everyone knows why), and the wraithfighter (it doesn't do anything we can't get elsewhere, takes up an important FA slot, costs too much). Everything else can be made to work at some level.

Instead of dropping the cost of the Eldar flyers they should up the vendetta and helldrake as they are the problematic units.

IcedCrow
03-06-2013, 13:24
Prince Yriel's difference is in his wargear and artefacts. His spear and his template that he can drop and fry enemies with. I doubt he'll be taken at all though due to his drawback of re-rolling 6s on saves. I am going to run him next campaign for something different.

Minsc
03-06-2013, 13:26
and the wraithfighter (it doesn't do anything we can't get elsewhere

There are other Eldar-units who are ML(1), knows Terrify at Ld10, and forces everyone within 12" of it to re-roll successful Morale and Pinning-tests?

daveNYC
03-06-2013, 13:34
Wraithfighter: Take DE as allies, slap the whatchamacallit trophies (-1 leadership?) upgrade on all their transports and try to bring them forward at the same time the Wraithfighters come in?

Risky, what with so many armies having morale shenanigans, but it could be entertaining.

Poseidal
03-06-2013, 13:42
The main problem is Banshees. Since Scorpions got a bunch of special rules, I don't see why Banshees don't, so I would do the following (along with Wargear changes to the mask):

Banshees
+2 to points cost per model

Acrobatic: +3" to run and charge moves; may assault on the same turn as disembarking from a transport, but counts as a disordered charge.

Banshee Mask: When charging, it counts as offensive grenades and enemies get -5 Initiative (min 1) and may not shoot until their next shooting phase.

Rage


Hemlock Wraithfighter
Heavy D-Scythes -> Large Blast

May swap both Heavy D-Scythes for Air-mounted Wraithcannon (15 points):

Range: 18", S10, AP2, Heavy 1, Distort