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cpl_hicks
22-06-2013, 21:41
The bizzare thing with paying these ridiculous prices for these Ltd ed things is that in 4-8 years time they will be completely obsolete, both in rules and more than likely fluff. It strikes me as odd that people paying these prices on ebay don't see all the 4th/5th ed warhammer and 2nd/3rd/4th ed 40K books going for 3-5 tops. "Normal" Ltd ed stuff is just that and it is unlikely that further updates to that thing will occur, here though it's just rinse and repeat every 4 or so years.

The above quote comes from the eBay thread, and its been something that I've been thinking of over the last couple of days. In Games Workshops sphere of work how rare is rare?

Games Workshop is a multinational organisation which produces a lot of product, but from my own perspective has a lot of churn of players, with people joining playing for a couple of years and then selling up and leaving, which seemingly would would leave a constant stream of product on the market. The production of limited edition items for a company of GW's size will still be quite large, even games day only products must be made in the thousands.

So when we say something is rare how are we defining it, people will have stuff in their lofts, but a lot of stuff will have just been binned. I'm also not aware of any star wars esc shipping containers in a tip occurrences, but I would guess that Rogue Trader and 2nd edition stuff was produced to a smaller run than 6th edition now is, but could there be hundreds/thousands of RTB 01 marines out there that are waiting to be discovered?

IJW
22-06-2013, 21:51
With RTB01 Marines it's more like hundreds of thousands. They're not that rare* in the first place, they're just sought after. I used to know a GW staffer who had a whole Chapter of them and I've probably sold 400 or so myself over the last 3-4 years.

*With a bit of an exception for complete 1991-dated sprues or complete sprues in rarer colours.

Bob Arctor
23-06-2013, 01:17
I have a whole company of RT era marines myself (some of which I got from IJW) and the prices have fluctuated a lot for them over the years (mostly lower prices now FW are doing pre-Heresy stuff). Some old Marines are definitely rarer than others, such as the Devastator with tripod-mounted multi-melta, or the Rhino-riders/casualties. I'm guessing its because they were bought less at the time.

The really rare GW stuff in my opinion are the kits from long ago that were expensive by GW's standards back then (so weren't bought in large amounts) and probably most stuff from before the mid-eighties. On top of that I would add a whole bunch of products (mostly specialist games ones) that were only available for a limited time, like the Warhammer Quest Pits & Traps expansion, or the Warmonger Titan.

After that, there is a whole class of models that aren't that rare, but it is unusual to see them still unpainted/unassembled/boxed/etc. RT era Rhinos are quite common, but one still sealed in its original packaging is quite uncommon.

Abaraxas
23-06-2013, 09:09
If its Ebay we are talking about, rare isn't very rare at all-just like pro painted often refers to a miniature being shot by Homer Simpson's makeup gun.

(Of course not all sellers/stores are guilty of this, IJW most certainly is not)

A.T.
23-06-2013, 10:38
The really rare stuff tends to be the direct order/mixed blister bits that few people picked up - i'm still kicking myself that I never build up my corvus battlegroup as they are worth a fortune these days.

The general gameplay models are always semi-common because people built their armys from them, with those poorly represented in rules or incredibly ugly usually being harder to find.

jack da greenskin
23-06-2013, 11:22
What's really rare in this hobby is to see a fully finished, well painted army, played by a nice guy who doesnt care about winning/losing.

Much less, "Rare" doesnt account to rare. There arent many relics in this hobby, that can't be bought without money (I can only think of a handful) so the best way to have something no one else has is to convert and kitbash.

Oh, and the only thing rarer than the above is a mordian iron guard army.

EmperorNorton
23-06-2013, 13:45
The only limited edition mini that I've read a concrete production number for is the Tzeentch Sorcerer on Disc (http://www.solegends.com/citle2000/promotions/pr412tzeentch/index.htm) that was sold in Germany and Italy in 2006 for the occasion of GW's 10 year anniversary in those countries. The number that was given in White Dwarf (IIRC) was 2000, which should mean that it is quite a bit rarer than, say, a Games Day mini. Despite that it does not fetch an astronomical price and I've had ten or so go through my hands, with three currently in my possession.

Miredorf
23-06-2013, 16:20
Your numbers of painted models are completely insane emperor! much more so than those buyed hehe.

That special ed sorcerer is very cool, btw. I didnt even know of it existance.

JWhex
24-06-2013, 06:28
The models that are really rare are often subject to counterfeit. I would not buy any rare model on ebay and even some not so rare but high in demand figs are fake.

EmperorNorton
24-06-2013, 06:31
The models that are really rare are often subject to counterfeit. I would not buy any rare model on ebay and even some not so rare but high in demand figs are fake.

I bought a ForgeWorld Slann on ebay and I have my doubts if it is real or fake, something I did not even consider until after I had it in my hands. No way for me to be certain, though. And in the end ... I can't say that I really care if it is fake or not. I wanted the mini and now I have it.

Herzlos
24-06-2013, 07:55
There are rarely any production numbers mentioned so it's hard to tell exactly how rare something is.

I picked up last years Black Library Games Day Anthology which claimed to be a run of 3000. Paid something like 15 for it at Games Day and sold it on ebay 6 months later for about 2, so even items with a known limited run aren't necessarily in that much demand.

blongbling
24-06-2013, 11:57
One could argue that a 43% margin isn't a bad return on a prodcut

IJW
24-06-2013, 12:25
2, six months later.

shelfunit.
24-06-2013, 12:33
2, six months later.

For literature of the quality GW put out this could be considered a good return :p

Herzlos
24-06-2013, 12:51
2, six months later.

Yeah, this is what I meant. I didn't realise it could be read both ways when I wrote it :)

BigbyWolf
24-06-2013, 12:52
I don't know about rare stuff in general, but it's taken me a couple of years to get my hands on this model:

172989

Which is the most effort I've had to put into finding any model yet.

Herzlos
24-06-2013, 12:52
For literature of the quality GW put out this could be considered a good return :p

In hindsight I probably wouldn't have paid much more than 2 for it. But I was overcome with limited edition frenzy and it caught me out pretty badly :p

shelfunit.
24-06-2013, 13:11
I don't know about rare stuff in general, but it's taken me a couple of years to get my hands on this model:

172989

Which is the most effort I've had to put into finding any model yet.

I fluked a heavily paint encrusted dragon from that kit (although no rider) for about 4.50 on ebay not that long ago, nice model.


In hindsight I probably wouldn't have paid much more than 2 for it. But I was overcome with limited edition frenzy and it caught me out pretty badly :p

Live and learn, it's the only way :D

Sheena Easton
24-06-2013, 13:28
Sometimes stuff is only perceived to be rare despite being fairly common, therefore commands a higher price than it should - and all to often there isn't enough of a demand for some items that are actually rare.

Limited Edition I wouldn't deem rare, unless it is a limited edition of under 100 - and even then it can seem to be common as muck due to constant reselling. One offs, unreleased and very poorly selling models (whether due to price at the time or just being a flop release) are stuff I'd call rare


I don't know about rare stuff in general, but it's taken me a couple of years to get my hands on this model:

172989

Which is the most effort I've had to put into finding any model yet.

I saw one of those in a Hobby Store while travelling and wished I had picked it up as I always wanted it when I played HE in 4th Ed but could never fit it into a list which was already character heavy and when I eventually tried ordering it, they had stopped making it. I did manage to get one of these (http://www.solegends.com/citcat1992/c92427marhelordeagle-02.htm) from Mail Order though, but it was slightly miscast (I ended up painting and using it anyway and annoyingly managed to do my best ever paintjob on it) - but trying to pick up another one in all the years since has been incredibly difficult. I've also been trying to get the Wizards Of Morcar Necromancer but it only ever shows up in a horribly overpriced box or as a dodgy recast.

BigbyWolf
24-06-2013, 14:10
I fluked a heavily paint encrusted dragon from that kit (although no rider) for about 4.50 on ebay not that long ago, nice model.

:mad:

I could tell you how much I paid for it, but as it was a lot more than what you paid for it, I would then have to kill you, and everyone else who reads the post.

As that's a lot of effort, I'm just going to stick with this:

:mad:

















(:p...all's fair in love and Warhams...)


I saw one of those in a Hobby Store while travelling and wished I had picked it up as I always wanted it when I played HE in 4th Ed but could never fit it into a list which was already character heavy and when I eventually tried ordering it, they had stopped making it.

It was the first model that I ever stopped to look at in a GW, but I never got round to buying it, so when I started my current aim of getting as many of the old metal monsters that I could, this was top of my list. Luckily I'm not overly concerned with the riders, as all I could find was the dragon on its own.

EDIT- Which I'm hoping wasn't at one point heavily encrusted in paint and sold for 4.50. :mad:

EmperorNorton
24-06-2013, 15:21
Heh. I bought that model, too, a while ago. I believe it cost me something like 15-20€ incl. the rider, but missing the back of his seat.
What is it with people losing their monster's riders?

BigbyWolf
24-06-2013, 16:43
What is it with people losing their monster's riders?

Preparing people for Storm of Magic? :shifty:

cpl_hicks
24-06-2013, 18:03
I wouldn't really count any model as being rare as in most cases it must have had a large production run for it to be worth the effort of making it. Though the exception to this would be any thing produced while GW was still uk only, these would have only been produced for a small uk market.

I don't really like a lot of the older models though, I don't know if it's the dodgy 80s paint job everything gets but if I could see 80s models painted in a modern way I might be converted

What I do count as rare are codexs/rulebook as these unlike models are superseded and likely to be chucked into a bin when the new one is released

reddevil18
25-06-2013, 03:28
If its Ebay we are talking about, rare isn't very rare at all-just like pro painted often refers to a miniature being shot by Homer Simpson's makeup gun.

Sigged :)
Words for the Word God

shelfunit.
25-06-2013, 06:25
I don't really like a lot of the older models though, I don't know if it's the dodgy 80s paint job everything gets but if I could see 80s models painted in a modern way I might be converted

Harry's plog should sort out thoses worries ;)

MusingWarboss
07-11-2013, 01:37
There used to be this old joke that GW's limited editions were limited only to those who wanted to buy them ;)

With eBay I think you could tag on "or make a quick profit".

Some really old stuff will be more limited, as will the unpopular but it'll be a long long time for the vast majority of their products to become genuinely rare if we're talking about scrapped/broken/junked commonplace items. My friend picked up a completely sealed as-new blister pack of Squats up on eBay about two months back for about 5, he's also picked up several other similar RT era bits - so the stuff is still out there waiting to be sold on. Some items get pricey because they're popular, or become popular - WFB 3rd is getting that way thanks to the Oldhammer movement.

I notice that GW has a bit of a manic episode on at the moment in that it constantly churns out limited runs of things, often things that'd sell well anyway if they were in general release. So odd that they'd choose to go for the short expensive run, rather than the longer probably still as expensive run.

The oddest one recently I can remember was them making all of the templates required to play 6th Ed. Apocalypse limited runs, plus the bombardment dice. I imagine you can photocopy one from the book (not seen or got a copy) but its odd as there are no general clear templates available. After a big write up in WD too. So you can buy the rulebook, just not the new templates.

AndrewGPaul
08-11-2013, 19:36
It was the first model that I ever stopped to look at in a GW, but I never got round to buying it, so when I started my current aim of getting as many of the old metal monsters that I could, this was top of my list. Luckily I'm not overly concerned with the riders, as all I could find was the dragon on its own.

EDIT- Which I'm hoping wasn't at one point heavily encrusted in paint and sold for 4.50. :mad:


To be fair, while the dragon is excellent - the best High Elf dragon until the current plastic kit - the rider is terrible, like every other High Elf from Marauder in the early 90s.

TonyFlow
09-11-2013, 10:05
Heh. I bought that model, too, a while ago. I believe it cost me something like 15-20€ incl. the rider, but missing the back of his seat.
What is it with people losing their monster's riders?

I have two of those dragons. Both without the rider :D

Senbei
11-11-2013, 11:49
A couple of weeks ago I finally managed to get the late-80s Gretchin Freebooter with the horned, visored helm and quad-barreled shotgun. The one with the flaming torch and blunderbuss was in the same lot. The rest or that range are easy to get, but that helmeted guy... I've only seen him turn up twice on e-bay in 3 years.

There's a range of metal prototypes GW produced for MB game's Space Crusade. They're pictured on the side of the box but were never in it. :P

Those guys are REALLY rare (and pretty bad too in some cases :D). I've seen the Android once, when the sculptor cleaned out his loft, and the gretchin only on a collecting wiki, never for sale.

williamsond
11-11-2013, 15:32
The squats that got released mail order only prior to them getting eaten by nids seem to go for insane amounts of cash but there weren't alot of them sold at the time, so not many out there in the world so i would expect them to be sought after minitures.

Senbei
11-11-2013, 16:40
The squats that got released mail order only prior to them getting eaten by nids seem to go for insane amounts of cash but there weren't alot of them sold at the time, so not many out there in the world so i would expect them to be sought after minitures.

True, but this (and the fact that Squat prices have been artificially inflated by a few unscrupulous e-bay sellers) causes a lot of re-casts to be kicking about. There have been tons of Squat air-cars on e-bay this year, and those were pretty obscure and never sold well for GW.