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View Full Version : Heavy Flamers on tanks - any point in taking them?



boogle
25-06-2013, 20:39
I know that tanks are very vulnerable in 6th ed, but are heavy flamer sponsons worth taking on tanks in this day and age?

War Corgi
25-06-2013, 20:49
With the amount of Xenos currently running around the meta, I think that you can find a use for heavy flamers on any platform. Outflanking IG Chimeras can do a lot of damage to a Tau gun line, certainly more that a snap shot heavy bolter could do. You do raise a good point about survive ability though. Just don't expect those Chimeras to stay around long.

Gossipmeng
25-06-2013, 20:51
Depends on the vehicle really - if you are talking a relatively cheap transport like the chimera then yes.

Gives you the extra utility that a few extra heavy bolter shots won't.

More expensive heavy support options though? Probably not as you'll want them hanging back and shooting with everything they got.

dooms33ker
25-06-2013, 21:01
The Land Raider Redeemer's Flamers can be quite useful because of the all around armor 14.

Scammel
25-06-2013, 21:07
There are an awful lot of units out there that really don't like speedy heavy flamers and even Marines won't enjoy the number of saves a well-placed template can force. If they come for free they're a nice bit of utility and worth considering as an option if you have points to play with. I think even basic flamers are fairly underrated.

Haravikk
25-06-2013, 21:10
The Land Raider Redeemer's Flamers can be quite useful because of the all around armor 14.
I'm not sure they really count as regular flamers, as S6 AP3 is useful against practically anything :)


For Heavy Flamers though, they're about as useful as on infantry, except that many vehicles can get them quite cheaply. For example, a Dreadnought swapping for his storm bolter is very cheap, but can do way more damage.

boogle
25-06-2013, 21:32
I ask as i have 2 Russ chassis with heavy flamer sponsons and was wondering if it was worth keeping them as such or taking them off and replacing them with Heavy Bolters.

Gooner
25-06-2013, 21:45
Heavy bolters for sure, you can snap shot them every turn almost they are in range. Heavy flamer would be useful maybe once every two or three games. In the end though neither really matters as they are mostly out of range or need to snap shot.

Angry SisterOfBattle Nerd
25-06-2013, 21:47
Only interesting in fast vehicle, I think. I've changed all my immolators back to rhino. But that may also be due to inept pricing.

iamtheeviltwin
25-06-2013, 22:06
I run one of my Razorbacks with the Heavy Flamer turret...I find I often use it to dump a tac squad near an objective and then spend the rest of it's lifespan flaming away any threats to the squad. I would kill for a flamer on a fast chassis (like the Baal), but it is what it is. I find it works well on any unit that is going to spend some time close to enemy infantry. Is it worth the point cost? That is the real question.

Jericho
25-06-2013, 22:10
Heavy flamers on tanks, probably not worth it in most cases. Especially if the primary weapon is ordnance!

Heavy flamers on highly mobile platforms, like Fast skimmers or Dreadnoughts w/ pods, that's another story.

*Lovingly strokes Furioso with frag cannon and heavy flamer*

Jackmojo
25-06-2013, 22:14
I always take them on my chimeras, since I'm not inclined to sit still and instead push forward aggressively.

ColShaw
25-06-2013, 22:27
On Chimeras, they're solid. I wouldn't recommend them for Russ chassis, in general.

captain strongfist
25-06-2013, 22:37
Hell yeah! No body is sacred of a single heavy bolter, but a heavy flamer makes anything other than marines get very nervous. Also it gives you options. In a recent game I had a basalisk rush forward and cleanse the objective of fire warriors.

boogle
25-06-2013, 22:40
looks like a cut and slot job on the 2 Russ Chassis i have then.

A.T.
25-06-2013, 22:44
On a fast, cheap tank like the blood angels razorback the heavy flamers can be quite effective following a tank shock to push models into a bunch. It's a bit of a suicide run in 6th but it can work as a distraction.

On slow tanks it's hard to get into a decent firing position.



I think. I've changed all my immolators back to rhino. But that may also be due to inept pricing.The current immolators are the same as the vanilla heavy flamer razorbacks - aka the least used unit in the whole game.

Chapters Unwritten
25-06-2013, 22:56
I don't like the heavy flamer for the simple reason that much of the time you can't fire it, as the vehicle can only fire one weapon if it moves. This is a conundrum for a weapon with a range like the flamer template; it's almost always going to have to move at least a little to get into a worthwhile position. You can't snap fire template weapons, so essentially, unless it's the only weapon you are firing it's worthless.

On walkers, it's a bit of a different story.

Worldeaters
25-06-2013, 23:26
On walkers, it's a bit of a different story.

Except the defiler, if you build it straight out the box your losing 2/3 of the template on itself. Did see a nice conversion making one look like a baby brass scorpion with the flamer and reaper in the claws.

NurglesRot
25-06-2013, 23:36
Dark Angels can take Land Speeders with 2 Heavy Flamers, 3 of them costs 180 points. Throw in a Dark Shroud for some increased cover saves and they are a real pain.

infamousme
26-06-2013, 00:25
I almost always take at least one heavy flamer on my land speeders and have always found them to be useful there.

Ssilmath
26-06-2013, 00:44
I have the on my Basilisks and Manticores. There are times when the enemy is too close to friendly targets to risk ordnance shots, but close enough to move up and apply some fire. And since it's a free upgrade, no reason not to.

Kakapo42
26-06-2013, 03:34
Could they not find a use on a Leman Russ Demolisher? I imagine the short range of it's main gun would make the heavy flamers less of a drawback there, as it's wanting to close with the enemy anyway.

War Corgi
26-06-2013, 03:39
Could they not find a use on a Leman Russ Demolisher? I imagine the short range of it's main gun would make the heavy flamers less of a drawback there, as it's wanting to close with the enemy anyway.

The problem there is the Demolisher Cannon is an ordnance weapon, meaning that you can only snap fire other weapons when you shoot it. As always, template weapons can not be snapped fired.

Laniston
26-06-2013, 04:27
It's a tank that breathes fire. You're just a pair of wings away from a dragon. What other reason do you need? Flamers on all tanks. Do it.

Angry SisterOfBattle Nerd
26-06-2013, 13:43
The current immolators are the same as the vanilla heavy flamer razorbacks - aka the least used unit in the whole game.
Well, the immolator has a 6++. Is it more expensive than the vanilla razorback ?

A.T.
26-06-2013, 13:57
Well, the immolator has a 6++. Is it more expensive than the vanilla razorback ?Nope, not until 6th ed vanilla comes out and it gets dropped 10pts in line with the DA dex.

ehlijen
26-06-2013, 14:25
Flamers on IG tanks are either their primary weapon (sentinels), complementing their primary weapon (banewolf, maybe hellhound) or used as emergency backups when the primary weapon is unsuited to the task (devildog, arty pieces etc).

You don't really want them on a tank that has a different mission but would want to fire the main gun even outside those missions (demolisher, executioner etc). If you wouldn't fire them instead of your main weapon on appropriate targets, get a weapon that either matches your main gun better or fills a niche you're actually lacking in.

Angry SisterOfBattle Nerd
26-06-2013, 16:28
So there is actually a tank that is objectively worse than the immolator ? Woaw !

A.T.
26-06-2013, 17:03
So there is actually a tank that is objectively worse than the immolator ? Woaw !I stand by what i've said in the past - that the old heavy flamer razorback is perhaps the least used model in the entire game, a total non-starter even in an edition of the game that favoured tanks piling into infantry.

Ward/GW seemed to cotton on to the shortcomings of a non-fast heavy flamer vehicle when he made the fast BA version cheaper, but then they went straight back to high cost slow moving vehicles in C:GK and C:SoB.


The flamers work slightly differently as secondary weapons on guard chimera chassis as they used more as reactive and opportunistic weapons (and its a free upgrade).

Marshal_Loss
26-06-2013, 19:03
Yeah they are definitely useful, but if it isn't on a fast vehicle (like a land speeder) be prepared to have to think carefully to get the most out of your weapon.

Retrospectus
26-06-2013, 23:30
it's a free upgrade. I put them on any tank that intends to spend the game hanging out at the back like artillery or standard russes. it's handy for deep strikers and outflankers who get too close to safely use the main gun