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View Full Version : The issue of pidgeon bombs...



MasterSplinter
09-08-2013, 05:12
Hi guys,

After having a few games against two of my friends (which play allied demons and empire) the past time this issue came up several times.

Whats up with these pidgeon bombs? THe consensus seems pretty clear on this but only in the army specific subforum for empire, so i wonder if this problem has occured to other players as well and maybe they already have thought about this.

Pidgeon bombs are used in the shooting phase, therefor they are shooting weapons. Right?
SO the premise ist that you can only target enemy units per the ordinary shooting rules barring the special rules stated in the AB... my empire opponent severely claims that he can pick any target (does this wording of the rule is right, means you can even choose models in units? That i can understand) but EVEN if a unit is engaged in combat, which is a little hard to see for me because of my presumption that these bombs are indeed shooting weapons, they may have no profile, but the are used in the shooting phase, and are used instead of another shooting weapon of the Engineer.

I tell you sometimes it really grind me, when i have to face two of these guys in any list (not to mention a few greatcannons and hellfire guns). I dont want to complain, i do fairly strong lists myself, but it seems that i am at the end and need some help :)
Oh, by the way, the abillity of the engineer for letting a warmachine reroll its artillery dice - is this even possible when the engineer has used his pidgeon bombs?

Baraqiel
09-08-2013, 07:18
This might help a bit:

Q:Is the pigeon bomb classified as a Missile Weapon as opposed to a
special attack that occurs during the Shooting phase (like the Tomb
Banshee’s Ghostly Howl)? (p31)
A: Yes.

So unless it says otherwise, the usual rules apply.

MasterSplinter
09-08-2013, 07:57
Thank you Baraqiel, i assume that you cant pick targets in cc, now.

Wesser
09-08-2013, 09:10
Yes, well basically you pick a target like you would for a stone thrower, aka you place the template within range, with the hole centered on a model of your choice and subject to normal targeting restrictions meaning you can't target units in combat. And since Pidgeon Bombs cannot scatter there's no accidental hits either.

Of course you can't fire it if you are in close combat. Amusingly you can't fire it if you marched unless your engineers join some huntsmen in which case he can march and shoot because he now has the skirmisher rule. He'll however have to shoot the same target as them

bigbiggles
09-08-2013, 23:11
And I don't think he can use it if he also allowed a reroll this turn

furrie
10-08-2013, 06:47
And I don't think he can use it if he also allowed a reroll this turn
It depends on the rules of the engineer, but its probably either shoot with a weapon or use the reroll ability. So probably not

MasterSplinter
10-08-2013, 09:26
Ok, thank you very much all of you guys :)
I will clear that up the next time we play. If we played it wrong i will bite my own tail, because i cant blame the others, they just got back into warhammer since a long time ago.

Figment187
10-08-2013, 10:11
No, you cannot target a unit in close combat.

Yes you can use the reroll and fire a pidgeon bomb in the same round. The reroll is a special ability and the pidgeon bomb is a shooting attack. They have nothing to do with each other.

MasterSplinter
10-08-2013, 11:08
Figment187, it seems that you are not right in this case. I managed to lend the empire armybook of a friend *cough* today, and the rule text of the engineer says that he can use his abillity during the shooting phase instead of using one of his firearms. The pidgeon bombs are used also instead of a firearm so i think you cannot use both in the same turn.

BlackPawl
10-08-2013, 13:29
Yes, it is very clear written that you can do the one or the other in one shooting round, not both together.