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Lord Squidar
14-09-2013, 17:47
Hi Guys,

So one of the players in my group has brought a new tau army and its absolutely destroying us out of hand on the battlefield. I really need to learn the rules for the army, every time I do something he counters it with some nonsense sounding rule which is actually in the rulebook!!! Today I experienced some Morlock thing which is 4d6 deny the witch within 12 of a riptide, pretty much made his army immune to powers (although I am using two rune priests so its about the same I guess).

The thing that really gets us is the combination of shoot marker lights, shoot riptide at something, scoop up handful of models regardless of save, rinse repeat. No cover no nothing! I've tried keeping my wolves in reserve, he just blasts them with a 5 point interceptor upgrade. When I finally make it to his lines, the crisis suits all link guns in overwatch and I am left exploded on the field from a million plasma guns :cries: The two riptides he is running are dead hard to kill and attract jaws of the world wolf like flies on nurglings, but thats not reliable because of the deny the witch thing. Its getting a bit frustrating because all of this happens from 60 inches away and drop podding is a very bad idea because of interceptor.

So how do I do it? Its driving me mad. I know to target anything with a marker light first, but if he goes first and i am not completely out of line of sight, i am doomed. My other armies are orks and daemons, I guess daemons would have the best shot, fast moving MCs with funky abilities to take them out, but we have just started a new campaign and I kind of want to stick with my wolves through it although if each game is going to be like this its going to be tedious.

The bearded one
14-09-2013, 17:59
Could you give a short breakdown of his list? It sounds to me he's running a Farsight enclaves list, as that's where that amulet granting better DtW rolls is from.

Lord Squidar
14-09-2013, 18:10
Its two riptides, a commander loaded up with missiles. some fire warriors (they dont even feature in the game, minmaxed squads for troops or something). 3 crisis teams, each with 2 of each weapon (2 x plasma, 1 fusion team) and flamers as the third hard point, broadsides loaded with missiles and necron allies (command barge and immortals, fliers have been seen in the box).

I usually run 2x grey hunters with all the tools, njal, runepriest on bike (for flank jawsing riptides, it doesn't work), 15 bloodclaws + wolf priest and outflank, 2 longfang packs, razorback and then can add in landraider and storm raven (we allow it in our group) at higher points levels, this would be when he is using the crons.

Axeman1n
14-09-2013, 18:27
Ran into this. A bunch of Lascannon too one down, the 2nd one smashed my face in. I was IG. By turn 3 he wasn't even using his markerlights anymore because he already knew he was going to table me.
Sounds like some good ol' Terminators with Storm Shields will do the trick. No need for a cover save. You can even get some Bastions to help block LOS.

Marshal
14-09-2013, 18:58
Could be worse, could be running 5 riptides... (O'vesa, 3 for elites, and 1 for allied tau)

Couple things I'd like to point out to you though, Ion Accelerators don't have 60" range, they actually have 72" range. Ion Cannons only have 60" range but they're only available on Hammerheads. The second thing is if he's playing farsight enclaves, make sure he's paying the bonding tax on all his models. While it only increases those with access to it by 1 point, it still adds up over an army. The Talisman of Arthas Moloch is a signature system, so make sure only 1 model has it. He is allowed to take signature systems on his riptides though, something regular tau can't do. It's 4D6 and pick the highest, not add them together, not sure if you knew this, it's not fully explained in your post. It still means he needs a 6 to be rolled in order to deny it. Riptides and anything tau related can be smoked by Jaws. It's feared heavily.

Anywho, as one who plays tau and regularly runs 3 of them here's my suggestions. More rune priests! Throw them in pods with a couple plasma guys and basically overwhelm them. He can't shoot them all down and although he might try, he shouldn't be able to do it. Put the priest in the unit as far away from whatever is going to be intercepting them with a clear line to the riptides you want to kill. If one survives, it should have 2 solid turns to Jaws stuff down before those giant guns are able to come back for a second go at him. You're able to get 4 in an army, take it, but make sure you have enough pods that at least 3 of them are coming down on the first turn. Keep them cheap though in case they do die and make sure they have axes in case a riptide decides it wants to jump into combat for some reason. It won't be able to target them out of the squads so you have a chance to wound the sucker on a 5+ instead of just on a 6 and can force weapon the crap out of it. Put them in a cheap squad of Grey Hunters with a plasma gun or melta gun (the melta has a better chance of wounding but the plasma has a chance to cause more wounds). The other nice thing that you can do it termies in pods which no other marine can do. Thunder Hammer/Storm Shields in pods are your friends. It's expensive, I know, but a couple like this should make short work of anything that comes close to it. Put a couple fang squads out with a couple lascannons or plasma cannons (whichever is cheaper, not sure, don't play wolves) and purchase them pods also (they don't have to start in them and can come in empty later, this will offset your pods so you're able to drop in more of them first turn). The rest of the army can be taken at will really, whatever you'd like.

Azazel
14-09-2013, 20:26
Without knowing how many points you play or what is in your list, all I can suggest is that you ignore them best you can.

Get first blood then wipe out his scoring units.

wbravenboer
14-09-2013, 21:50
In my last battle, my opponent had 3 Riptides and a WraithKnight, with a skyshield, 3 skyrays, a nasty commander and some kroot.... My two Riptides did pretty well, but with enough AP2 and Distort weapons you really can bring them down.
Try to ignore them as much as possible and kill all scoring units, if you have access to force weapons, those are the best way to kill all MC. An earlier battle saw a kitted out Librarian kill a Riptide with one blow, so it can be done.
Also I had a fight against orks, Riptide or not, the boyz really swarmed my Tau troop and in the end I had no scoring units left... Riptide was only survivor...

nosebiter
14-09-2013, 21:52
I have found that a hammer works wonders.

Or a massive inquisitive dog also does the trick!

The bearded one
14-09-2013, 22:08
Or ally with marines and grab some of them funky grav cannons :cool:

Borgomos
14-09-2013, 22:23
The riptide is really a dud magnet who doesn't deserve the firepower you throw at him. Get his markerlight units and all he is left with is a giant mecha who has a laughable BS3

Israfael
14-09-2013, 22:24
Or ally with marines and grab some of them funky grav cannons :cool:

This is sound advice. You can always drown them in some grav-weaponry, via allies.

That, or as you noted that you play Daemons, run a few massive blocks of flesh-hounds, and watch as he's overrun by turn three in daemonc canine-tarpits.

Ironbone
14-09-2013, 23:23
The riptide is really a dud magnet who doesn't deserve the firepower you throw at him. Get his markerlight units and all he is left with is a giant mecha who has a laughable BS3
Sadly, BS 3 matter little when comes to using blasts :p. Two weeks ago, i tried my IG + tau aliance with riptide, against SW+ DA. I have 9 markerlights, and lost all but 2 in enemy first turn ( he started ). I scored maybe 3 markerlight hits during entire game, but riptide still was amazing. Its hard to kill, shoots super good, and to my biggest suprise, can also do something in close combat ( well, for IG player any ability to do some damage in CC is something absolutly wonderful ).

And how to kill riptide ? You may try instant-killing weapons, lots of plazma ( not the best solution, as Riptide is quite moblie, and usually have FnP, so you need on average about 26-27 shots to kill one ), jaws ( Riptide is only I2 ), or simply tieing up in cc, especialy with Twolf cavalary or bikes.

Lord Squidar
15-09-2013, 20:32
Thanks for the advice guys! So for now if I got it all right, ignore the rip tides and send everything with a markerlight to kingdom come, and then either ignore them or pick on them one at a time and just deal with the fact that non shielded terminators and marines and everything weaker will be scooped up in droves. i'll give it a bash next game!

maze ironheart
15-09-2013, 20:53
The riptide is really a dud magnet who doesn't deserve the firepower you throw at him. Get his markerlight units and all he is left with is a giant mecha who has a laughable BS3

really it dose great in shooting and is not a slouch in combat kicked my poor typhus like a foot ball (Got revenge with great unclean one 3 dead rip tide's).

Losing Command
15-09-2013, 21:50
If you drop pod in, it also pays off to land as close as possible to his own units. That way he won't be able to place the blast marker, and then he can shoot down a maximum of 3 guys with each Riptide with intercept. So if you drop in 2 units of 9 grey hunters with runepriest and place 6 guys in front as meat shields you should be able to keep your most destructive guys alive.

Lord Squidar
16-09-2013, 06:16
If you drop pod in, it also pays off to land as close as possible to his own units. That way he won't be able to place the blast marker, and then he can shoot down a maximum of 3 guys with each Riptide with intercept. So if you drop in 2 units of 9 grey hunters with runepriest and place 6 guys in front as meat shields you should be able to keep your most destructive guys alive.

I thought of that, which works in a normal Tau army which is supposed to have lots more fire warrior units, but this farsight army with min maxed crisis suits is has a very small foot print on the ground and spread out rather well (in addition to being medium speed) so there are fewer places to land that aren't out in the open.

Edit: I think I have found the solution although I am not proud of minmaxing =) Imperial Guard battle group as allies. Means I can take an HQ vanquisher (always wanted that model) with beast hunter shells, lets see the riptide take a str 8 ap 2 instant death shot from 72 inches away, mwahahahahah! One other russ will be the troop choice, perfect allies!

The Emperor
16-09-2013, 10:53
Edit: I think I have found the solution although I am not proud of minmaxing =) Imperial Guard battle group as allies. Means I can take an HQ vanquisher (always wanted that model) with beast hunter shells, lets see the riptide take a str 8 ap 2 instant death shot from 72 inches away, mwahahahahah! One other russ will be the troop choice, perfect allies!

In what book are these rules found in? I take it it's a Forge World supplement?

Ironbone
16-09-2013, 11:47
Not suplement, "IA1, 2nd edition". Its not that bad option, just watch for scater, as its a blast weapon. And riptide still will have its 5+ inv ( or 3+ if he used nova reactor to power up shield ).

daveNYC
16-09-2013, 12:40
It's also a relatively heavy dose of cheese as it's one of those units that seems to have been designed by someone who had a grudge (in this case it was against 'Nidzilla armies).

Lord Squidar
16-09-2013, 14:03
It's also a relatively heavy dose of cheese as it's one of those units that seems to have been designed by someone who had a grudge (in this case it was against 'Nidzilla armies).

Cheese is sitting on my desk waiting to be assembled. No i am not proud, but we must beat these damn fish heads or else! If its any consolation, its a grot driven counts as armoured company lead by Commander von Scnott (the grot).

And yes its from imperial armour 2

daveNYC
16-09-2013, 14:08
Shouldn't that be Kumanda?

Lord Squidar
16-09-2013, 14:35
Yep, should be =) the new battle tank kit is pretty sweet =)

Bugg13
16-09-2013, 22:52
It's also a relatively heavy dose of cheese as it's one of those units that seems to have been designed by someone who had a grudge (in this case it was against 'Nidzilla armies).

When you're discussing how to deal with 2+ riptides I don't think you need to feel guilty about resorting to cheese...

Ravariel
17-09-2013, 03:14
My regular opponent runs Tau main/Farsight ally with 4 riptides. Honestly Iontides aren't very scary to me. However, the Heavy Bursttide with utility commander, and 2 vanilla commanders all with target lock and 2 markerdrones apiece is the real bullspit. T5 2+/4++ commander sits in front tanking anything that won't ID, and LoSing the rest to the tide makes you fire approximately a million damn shots to kill one model while that one unit will wipe 1-2 units off the board each turn. It is the single most brutal unit I have ever faced. It's honestly so OP it's not even fun to play.

I main Eldar, so he basically ignores every one of my defensive abilities. I get no saves, everything IDs me, waveserpent shields are useless when you can reliably put 5-6 glances on them in a single volley (he can regularly down two in a single round of shooting)... Even running 2 Wraithknights (I'm not dropping any more money for 2 more for Iyanden allies, so shush) doesn't help as the Bursttide can fairly reliably (i.e. 50% of the time) kill one in a single turn (two if your opponent only rolls okay) and easily stay out of tarpit charge range for the 2 turns necessary to neuter your firepower.

Thing is, you HAVE to kill either the utility commander or the riptide in that unit or you will be tabled in 4 turns unless you run and hide out of LoS the entire game. You can't ignore it for markerlights (sitting in back of bomb unit, and good luck (without multiple sniper units) precisioning them down in time) or scoring units (reserved kroot and DSing flamer crisis) because you have to weather two turns of the most brutal shooting ever designed by GW. Throw in the talisman on a tide and you have the best psychic defense in the game pretty much shutting down everything (tried to run Iyanden choir against him a couple times and got denied all but once over two games).

It's busted. There is ONE unit that can deal with it, and I don't play marines, so no Podded TH/SS termies for me. If I had access to a lot of AV14 that would make life hard for him, too... but alas... eldar. It's pretty obnoxious.

Ironbone
17-09-2013, 09:12
Throw in the talisman on a tide and you have the best psychic defense in the game pretty much shutting down everything
Just like old runes. Its so much funier when it happens to someone else, isn't it :evilgrin: ?