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View Full Version : Chaos Ogre Kingdom army - advice would be appreciated



graeme27uk
02-11-2013, 14:14
Hello,

I've recently got back into WHFB after many years away and I have decided to pick up Ogres as my army. However, loving converting models and something different from the norm, I thought I would start a Chaos Ogre themed force.

So far I have the battalion box and some gnoblars. I've scratch-built a butcher as my leader.

However, I am not sure how to continue. Few things perplex me....

1) How "big" should I make ogre units? I was thinking of a unit per power. The ones I have done at the moment are pretty much Nurgle-like and so I would be looking at now building units for the other three? But how big is a typical unit of bulls? I have the idea of converting a musician and standard bearer for each as well so that I have those options covered.

2) Leadbelchers are great, though converting them is a bit more of a challenge. The ones I have are ok, but are they chaoticy enough.... If I work out how I may post pictures.

3) The Firebelly says Tzeentch to me so I would convert one who focuses on him. Would the flames from the Burning Chariot flamer be useful for a fiery breath?

4) How big are the pink horror heads compared to ogre heads? Would swapping those out (with a bit of GS) work? They have the big toothy mouth look that I think chaos ogres would have.

5) I've seen some great chaos ogre armies on google but any general tips or hints?


Also.... on a gaming front. I've played 4 games so far. 2 500 pts and 2 1000 pts.

50% success

Against Chaos Warriors I got obliterated. Kept failing LD tests and fleeing and getting charged. Leadbelchers vs chaos warriors / chosen didn't really do very much. Ironblaster did nothing but got charged by his warshrine and then sat there.... What advice is there for Ogres vs WoC?

The Ironblaster seems underwhelming. I was all excited when I could use one but then it hasn't really done anything worthy of note. What's the best way to use it? March up into grapeshot range? Stand back and lob hopefully successful cannon-balls? Seems with cannons you need to be pointing flank-ways on with the enemy which is hard to achieve or otherwise the units I have seen are only 3 models deep at most.

What's the general concensus on Firebelly vs Butcher? Lore of Great Maw has some good buffs in it whereas the Lore of Fire seems more offensive. Getting Trollguts for the LotGM is a game changer I find.

Is it worth taking the ironfist or the additional hand weapon on ogres? I have chosen the later for more attacks as the 5+ armour seems worthless generally. So far I don't think I've been in a situation where I would get armour saves. Being shot by handgunners or longrifles or hit by high strength models in melee.

Again, I've read various tactical info about ogres but is it better to take basic ogres or ironguts? I guess its a question about fewer more elite models or a few more less elite. The great weapon initiative reduction seems unimportant since ogres generally strike last anyway.


What's the best way to deal with a chaos warshrine? The one I faced had a 3++ save on top of its normal chariot save and I simply couldn't touch it. If I did manage to wound it then it saved! So it marched all over my unit and won combat on combat resolutions. Caused Fear which I kept failing so I was always hitting on 5+... this held up my units and when they did break they fled causing panic which again I failed...

Ironblaster hit it but again a one-shot hit was saved. And when it was in combat then it couldn't use its cannon to fire.


Finally, considering magic. From the looks of it Ogre magic is about buffing/debuff. The direct damage is a bit pap and so this is the route I have taken. I've always used the signature spell and when allowed to choose chosen more buffs. Is this correct? Are the other Lores worth considering?

Scammel
02-11-2013, 14:27
The Ironblaster seems underwhelming. I was all excited when I could use one but then it hasn't really done anything worthy of note. What's the best way to use it? March up into grapeshot range? Stand back and lob hopefully successful cannon-balls? Seems with cannons you need to be pointing flank-ways on with the enemy which is hard to achieve or otherwise the units I have seen are only 3 models deep at most.


The Ironblaster is great. Use it to target tough solo characters/monsters/chariots and don't waste time firing at infantry (especially not with grapeshot). The mobility allows it to stay out of harm's way, hiding from reprisal fire or dodging out of charge arcs - yours should definitely have had more than one shot against the Shrine! There's a reason 99% of competitive Ogre armies take 2.


What's the general concensus on Firebelly vs Butcher? Lore of Great Maw has some good buffs in it whereas the Lore of Fire seems more offensive. Getting Trollguts for the LotGM is a game changer I find.


The breath weapon, flaming attacks and scalable nature of Fireball makes the 'Belly a better choice most of the time, LotGM is fantastic on a Slaughtermaster though as he's almost guaranteed to get TG (a few of the spells are a bit naff, meaning a LotGM Butcher is a risky venture).


Is it worth taking the ironfist or the additional hand weapon on ogres? I have chosen the later for more attacks as the 5+ armour seems worthless generally. So far I don't think I've been in a situation where I would get armour saves. Being shot by handgunners or longrifles or hit by high strength models in melee.


AHWs give you diminishing returns the larger the unit is so IFs are generally seen as the way to go. They're generally taken for the Parry save over the armour, but against weak infantry such as State Troops or Undead (both are absolutely ideal targets for Ogres) the armour should help out quite a bit. I don't know if you're from a 40k background where such saves really are worthless, but in Fantasy a 5+ isn't too bad if it isn't modified.


Again, I've read various tactical info about ogres but is it better to take basic ogres or ironguts? I guess its a question about fewer more elite models or a few more less elite. The great weapon initiative reduction seems unimportant since ogres generally strike last anyway.


Ironguts outclass Ogres pretty handily. The real problem ordinary Ogres have is that S4 just doesn't cut it all that much when you're only WS3 whilst Ironguts can bank on very favourable 'To wound' rolls against most units in the game. Where Ogres do have a niche is in being more cost-effective against the aforementioned weak infantry, but IG can happily pulp any of those anyway.

Forse
02-11-2013, 22:13
I figure the ogres would be most susceptible to Slaanesh. That's the theme I would go for. I mean, they are such gluttons, which falls under lust. But they are a varied bunch and could probably follow any or all of the chaos gods.

mypantsarefree3
03-11-2013, 01:33
I think it's in the new WoC fluff that described ogres as being prime to join warbands. I can see the ogres not caring about the god consciously but instead enjoys all aspects.

Khorne: what ogres don't like to fight?
Slaanesh: lavishing in gluttony? Yes, please.
Nurgle: ogres are disgusting.
Tzeentch: ogres can be very whimsical and somewhat magically inclined.

Oh, don't choose additional hand weapons for ogres as the supporting attacks are limited to the standard ogre 3, so the extra is wasted on non-front rank models.

graeme27uk
08-11-2013, 21:19
My 1000pts Ogre army list:

1 Level 2 Firebelly with great weapon
5 ironguts with standard bearer
8 leadbelchers with bellowers (2 units of 4)
27 gnoblars with trappers
1 ironblaster

Experiences so far. Leadbelchers can be great or rubbish... Ironblaster same. Ironguts get chewed up by shooting and run away easily. Gnoblars.... if they get there then they may do something.. generally not a lot though.


What do you think of that army list?

I'm moving to 1500 pts so need to add another 500 pts to the army.

I was thinking.

BSB - bruiser 105 pts + 25 Bsb = 130

Leadership seems terrible for ogres and my army has lost two games due to running and panic tests.


Should I add more leadbelchers? Another Ironblaster? Mournfangs?

Any advice to build the army up?


Options I am considering:

Thundertusk - big monster, great model, stonethrower, freezing ASL attack, ranged attacks, good in melee, big point sink though....

Ironblaster #2 - another big cannon / chariot

More leadbelchers - expand to 2 units of 6 - 6d6 shots should hurt stuff

More ogres / ironfists - get into melee (if they don't run away!) - should stomp everything

Mournfang - faster than above, but more expensive - small unit more likely to run away - could give them Heavy armour and Ironfists for a 2+ / 6++ save to make more survivable.


Do I get a unit with the Dragonhide banner now?

Do I take another wizard? A butcher to buff the army?