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View Full Version : Ogre kingdoms without the gutstar?



Kingrick
08-11-2013, 21:05
I was thinking of getting back into ogre kingdoms, but I really hate the idea of using gutstars and things like that, I would prefer to use smaller units of 6 to 9 ogres backed by some rare choices. I was wondering if anyone has had success this way or not?

SkawtheFalconer
09-11-2013, 09:48
I was thinking of getting back into ogre kingdoms, but I really hate the idea of using gutstars and things like that, I would prefer to use smaller units of 6 to 9 ogres backed by some rare choices. I was wondering if anyone has had success this way or not?

I think the most common non-Gutstar lists tend to stock up on shooting (Ironblasters, Leadbelchers, Sniping Poisoned Maneaters, firebellies).

In my (fairly limited) experience of Ogres, you actually need to go all out in one phase (i.e. shooting or combat) to win. Small units of Bulls just don't have the stopping power.

yabbadabba
09-11-2013, 10:26
I was thinking of getting back into ogre kingdoms, but I really hate the idea of using gutstars and things like that, I would prefer to use smaller units of 6 to 9 ogres backed by some rare choices. I was wondering if anyone has had success this way or not? It's called playing normal games. If you need to be uber competitive then things like the gutstar are a must, but for me I always plum for what looks and sounds good in relation to the background, as the first priority, followed by if it plays any good.

Kingrick
10-11-2013, 00:27
Thanks for the replies. I will playtest a few games with them and try the different styles and see if they are for me.

Kayosiv
10-11-2013, 00:53
Ogre Bulls have a near identical statline to Saurus warriors, who I frequently run without any characters and they do fine. a unit of 9 in 3/3 formation gets an identical number of attacks as the saurus that are 6 wide. The biggest difference is the saurus are slightly more defensive with 1 more armor, but the bulls do have impact hits and stomps to help mitigate that with more damage output. I would most certainly say that because the saurus do fine, win combats on their own, and are often critical to my victory, a unit of 9 or so bulls should also be able to do fine. They can't do everything and of course are going to need some some support sometimes, but they'll be far from a useless unit.

It's still a unit that would be better with with 3 characters in the front. The state of things is such that bruisers with additional hand weapons can form a unit with 3 bruisers that have 15 attacks at strength 5, with weaponskill 5, and strength 5 stomps. That is significantly better than 19 attacks at strength 4. They'll have less innate combat resolution, but also give up less because they're toughness 5 and will take less wounds. What's even better is a unit of 3 bruisers IN a unit of ogres, to give them combat resolution, and of course, what is even better than that is 3 bruisers in a unit of ironguts so you get 9 supporting attacks at strength 6.

A unit of bulls/ironguts filled with characters is easier to use. It protects the unit, adds offensive punch, and helps mitigate the dangers of flank charges. But it does put more of your units and points in a single place. It may be easier, but it is not better in all situations. 2 units that are weaker are going to be harder to work with effectively, but are going to be much more tactically rewarding if you use them both well.

mypantsarefree3
10-11-2013, 17:11
When I played OK I had 11 ogre bulls w/bsb and 11 ironguts w/slaughtermaster & +1 LD banner. It spread out target saturation, brought the heat, and didn't make feel dirty inside. I never had more than one character in a unit in any game, and I did fine.

Kingrick
12-11-2013, 00:46
That is a lot of good points, I appreciate the incite.

Kingrick
12-11-2013, 00:47
I like the strategy. that is similar to what I have been thinking.