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View Full Version : The Anvil of Doom and Shooting/Combat



Lord Dan
28-11-2013, 17:50
I've been considering adding an Anvil to my army, but want to understand exactly how it works when being attacked. Having read the FAQ, let me spell out my understanding of things so far. Let's say I've upgraded my Runelord to have a 2+ re-rollable armor save:

-Against shooting attacks the Warmachine has T10, a 2+ re-rollable armor save, and a 4++.
-In combat it has T5, a 2+ re-rollable armor save, and a 4++.
-The first two wounds against the machine remove the Anvil Guard models.

Am I correct on these points? If so, what happens in a challenge- does the crew fight as well? Can the rulelord ever be singled out through sniping or assassination spells, or is he effectively one with the machine (a la shieldbearers and, apparently The Matrix)? In combat, assuming the Anvil is at full wounds, would the crew benefit from the Runelord's armor save as they do against shooting? Are there any other weird situations I'm overlooking?

Kalandros
28-11-2013, 18:48
There can be NO challenge against a war machine, even if a character is part of its crew. (See rulebook or dwarf FAQ, I forget)

It is a single model.

theunwantedbeing
28-11-2013, 18:50
You're correct, although as it's a war machine it's not allowed to take part in challenges.

Grim1
29-11-2013, 06:07
for armour save in h2h you take the best save available to any existing model for any attack on the anvil. this is normally a re-rollable save on the runelord.

naloth
02-12-2013, 23:21
-Against shooting attacks the Warmachine has T10, a 2+ re-rollable armor save, and a 4++.
-In combat it has T5, a 2+ re-rollable armor save, and a 4++.
-The first two wounds against the machine remove the Anvil Guard models.

-Against shooting, you use the war machine profile. I don't believe the Anvil has any provision to let it inherit the runes/armor of the Runelord. Besides, normally it's a cannon/catapult being dropped on it where armor won't matter.

-In combat there should be three infantry guys, that you target separately. Crews can't use the war machine's T and I haven't seen any provision for using the highest stats/save of one crew member to defend the whole war machine. It's like saying an Orc Bully would give you all the benefits of being an orc to the goblin crew.

-Yes, from shooting. It's still possible for the Runelord to be directly attacked.



Am I correct on these points? If so, what happens in a challenge- does the crew fight as well? Can the rulelord ever be singled out through sniping or assassination spells, or is he effectively one with the machine (a la shieldbearers and, apparently The Matrix)? In combat, assuming the Anvil is at full wounds, would the crew benefit from the Runelord's armor save as they do against shooting? Are there any other weird situations I'm overlooking?
There's no challenge for war machines (FAQ, I think?), but I don't see any reason why he can't be targeted by sniping spells that can directly single out a profile even as part of a larger model.

Montegue
02-12-2013, 23:50
The anvil benefits from all runes on the Runelord. Commonly, that can include a 2+ ward vs shooting from the rune of shielding! defensive runes! anti magic runes! or event close combat runes.

Kalandros
02-12-2013, 23:56
naloth, no thats not how it works anymore - not since 8th edition.

The war machine and the runelord are ONE model - including the guards.
First two unsaved wounds automaticaly go on the guards, the rest goes on the runelord - all these wounds can be saved, be it shooting, combat or magic - using the best save available, which is the runelords' usually.

naloth
03-12-2013, 03:06
naloth, no thats not how it works anymore - not since 8th edition.

The war machine and the runelord are ONE model - including the guards.
First two unsaved wounds automaticaly go on the guards, the rest goes on the runelord - all these wounds can be saved, be it shooting, combat or magic - using the best save available, which is the runelords' usually.

I guess I see where you can read that into the description from the latest FAQ:
The Anvil receives two attacks for the Runelord, instead of one attack as would normally be the case for a war machine. Use the best Weapon Skill, armour and ward saving throw available to any surviving member of the crew against all wounds that are suffered by the Anvil.

For close combat, you still use majority Toughness (T4) per the basic rulebook, hitting against the Runelord's WS, the crew's T, and the best save then attacks are made by the crew individually using their weapons and stats.

The BRB makes a distinction about war machines benefiting from the crew's armor but not ward save, but I suppose you could take it that the FAQ generalizes such that you can have the Rune of Shielding on the Runelord.... Kinda crazy.

Lord Dan
03-12-2013, 03:38
For close combat, you still use majority Toughness (T4) per the basic rulebook, hitting against the Runelord's WS, the crew's T, and the best save then attacks are made by the crew individually using their weapons and stats.
Is it the majority toughness (T4) or the highest toughness (T5)?

Kalandros
03-12-2013, 04:00
T4 until a guard falls? O:

Lord Dan
03-12-2013, 07:08
T4 until a guard falls? O:

Now my head hurts...

naloth
03-12-2013, 12:56
T4 until a guard falls? O:

There's nothing in the FAQ that says otherwise and the rulebook (p108) specifies majority T. Likewise, if you can hit it with a S or I check, it dies instantly (no saves), since war machines fail everything but T and Ld checks. Go figure.

Fortunately no one has taken the 2++ ranged save and when I've run across it and anvil it usually dies from a catapult/cannon or gets left alone for the whole battle.

Lord Dan
03-12-2013, 14:45
There's nothing in the FAQ that says otherwise and the rulebook (p108) specifies majority T
Right, but Kalandros brings up a really good point: once a guard falls, T4 is no longer the majority toughness. At that point, which one is used?



Fortunately no one has taken the 2++ ranged save and when I've run across it and anvil it usually dies from a catapult/cannon
Which is exactly why I'll be running mine with a 2++ against ranged. :p

naloth
03-12-2013, 19:01
Which is exactly why I'll be running mine with a 2++ against ranged. :p
At which point you just Pit o' Shades or Purple Sun it. Auto fail = death, no saves... Sure, it's just a few armies but it will discourage the others.