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SkavenJB
12-12-2013, 22:13
I'm still learning basics and the books can be confusing sometimes with the way they list or word things. Anyways I'm looking at the profile for my storm vermin in the Skaven book. I feel like this is common sense but I just have to ask. Their strength is at 3 and in the equipment section it says
Equipment:
. Hand Weapon
. Halberd
. Heavy armor

The first question is do they get +1 to their strength since they are carrying halberds? Also why does it say hand weapon when they also have halberds? I just looked and I think I can answer that last question, I see they have an option for shields and the halberd is a 2 handed weapon so you get to choose nvm.

If the above question is answered I can probably answer this one. On the plague monks profile they get one attack, but in their equipment section it says 2 hand weapons, and there is no option for shields or anything so wouldn't they get 2 attacks?

Thanks in advance for the help.

3eland
12-12-2013, 22:19
You must always use the better weapon when fighting. So in the case of Skaven Stormvermin you must always use the Halberd. The reason they also have a hand weapon is in case for some odd reason they were to lose the Halberd. The shield upgrade is only for shooting, since the halberd is two handed.

You get +1 attacks if you have two hand weapons

boli
12-12-2013, 22:52
Plague monks also get a 3rd attack from frenzy; although that special rule has its own drawbacks.

Yersinia Pestis
12-12-2013, 22:54
You must always use the better weapon when fighting. So in the case of Skaven Stormvermin you must always use the Halberd. The reason they also have a hand weapon is in case for some odd reason they were to lose the Halberd. The shield upgrade is only for shooting, since the halberd is two handed.

You get +1 attacks if you have two hand weapons

Somehow i have always been told you get to choose what you use but have to nominate it once in combat, so in this case, it would be either hand weapon and shield or fighting with the halberd (choosing in fact for +1 armour save or +1 strength in combat).......
Anyone? Am i right or wrong? I'm actually doubting...
And yep, if two hand weapons ==> two attacks and if they have frenzy another attack to add :D (but yes, frenzy has drawbacks)

3eland
12-12-2013, 23:18
Page 88-89 of mini rulebook under special weapons. Since a halberd counts as a special weapon you cannot choose to fight with a hand weapon.
"We use the term 'special weapon' to cover anything that isn't a hand weapon. [...] If a model carries a special close combat weapon, he must fight with it in the Close Combat phase - he cannot elect to wield his hand weapon instead". The only way you get to choose is if the model has two special weapons, like a halberd and a great weapon.

Yersinia Pestis
12-12-2013, 23:25
Page 88-89 of mini rulebook under special weapons. Since a halberd counts as a special weapon you cannot choose to fight with a hand weapon.
"We use the term 'special weapon' to cover anything that isn't a hand weapon. [...] If a model carries a special close combat weapon, he must fight with it in the Close Combat phase - he cannot elect to wield his hand weapon instead". The only way you get to choose is if the model has two special weapons, like a halberd and a great weapon.
thanks for pointing that one out! I appreciate it!

Charistoph
12-12-2013, 23:25
Keep in mind that the Skaven book is written to work in both 7th and 8th Edition and there are some differences which change how some things work.



The first question is do they get +1 to their strength since they are carrying halberds? Also why does it say hand weapon when they also have halberds? I just looked and I think I can answer that last question, I see they have an option for shields and the halberd is a 2 handed weapon so you get to choose nvm.

They get +1 Str to their close combat attacks, not as a permanent upgrade. This is important to remember as some spells and special rules will be based on their profile's stat.

The reason they have the Shield option is two fold. In 8th Edition, this allows them extra protection from ranged weapons. I will go over the other a little later.


If the above question is answered I can probably answer this one. On the plague monks profile they get one attack, but in their equipment section it says 2 hand weapons, and there is no option for shields or anything so wouldn't they get 2 attacks?

They would. The stats are a baseline and do not list any modifications created by equipment or Special Rules. And as Yersinia pointed out, Frenzy would allow for 3 Attacks!


Somehow i have always been told you get to choose what you use but have to nominate it once in combat, so in this case, it would be either hand weapon and shield or fighting with the halberd (choosing in fact for +1 armour save or +1 strength in combat).......
Anyone? Am i right or wrong? I'm actually doubting...

You are wrong. In 7th Edition, you could choose between the weapons you had access to. This would make Shields a big bonus to Stormvermin as they could choose to be offensive with Halberds (as if rats weren't offensive enough) or defensive with sword and board. In 8th, this was changed requiring you to use another weapon aside from the Hand Weapon if available. Now, your local meta may have chosen to disregard this part locally, and so chose to tell/teach you that or they may have even not even noticed it in the first place.

Yersinia Pestis
13-12-2013, 02:58
Keep in mind that the Skaven book is written to work in both 7th and 8th Edition and there are some differences which change how some things work.



They get +1 Str to their close combat attacks, not as a permanent upgrade. This is important to remember as some spells and special rules will be based on their profile's stat.

The reason they have the Shield option is two fold. In 8th Edition, this allows them extra protection from ranged weapons. I will go over the other a little later.


They would. The stats are a baseline and do not list any modifications created by equipment or Special Rules. And as Yersinia pointed out, Frenzy would allow for 3 Attacks!



You are wrong. In 7th Edition, you could choose between the weapons you had access to. This would make Shields a big bonus to Stormvermin as they could choose to be offensive with Halberds (as if rats weren't offensive enough) or defensive with sword and board. In 8th, this was changed requiring you to use another weapon aside from the Hand Weapon if available. Now, your local meta may have chosen to disregard this part locally, and so chose to tell/teach you that or they may have even not even noticed it in the first place.

Probably the local meta.... Just like the local rule that if you chase something off the table, the unit will stop 1" off the table's edge and will not leave the table (where the official rule states clearly it will leave the table)... Also had to find this one out the hard way on an official tourney and look like a total *****....