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Rovient
09-01-2014, 09:55
Interesting news if true. I expect this has a lot to do with the fact that WD is leaked online without fail each month, spoiling the goodies inside and ensuring that few people even bother to buy it.

http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2014/01/the-monthly-white-dwarf-magazine-is-dead.html

williamsond
09-01-2014, 10:04
Would love to see this as an opportunity to have a mag about gaming again, instead of a bunch of photos of this months new models. Hope this turns out to be a good thing, but fingers crossed.

StraightSilver
09-01-2014, 10:08
Hmmm, I hope this isn't true but I suspect it might be.

It's actually a very clever move by GW, although I suspect it will up their costs a fair bit.

The reason I think it's a clever move?

I live in London, where there are shops absolutely everywhere!! However each month I cannot White Dwarf on release date unless I go to a GW store or Darksphere, as they seem to be the only places you can buy it now!!

Some Newsagents do stock it but don't have it on sale until about 3-4 days after release, in which case it is pointless me buying it as it's already been all over the internet.

So once a month I travel to Darksphere to get my WD, and then end up buying a load of stuff to justify the cost of my travelcard.

Producing the magazine weekly will mean I will now make this trip once a week.

Now I know I could just not buy it. I know it's not a great magazine, has very little actual content and the painting sections are pointless for me, but I do actually like buying it, it is useful for reference and passes away a couple of days worth of crap commutes and boring lunchtimes which I need living in London!

And I could buy the electronic version. But I hate reading off a tablet, or my phone, and living in London and reading it on the bus I will get mugged!

But I also enjoy the little ritual of going into a game store once a month and getting my hobby fix, with WD being the excuse to do this.

And I'm sure I'm not alone. It will increase footfall into their stores as a lot of other people I am sure do the same (and yes we're all sheep etc, it's sad as I know I do it...).

I'm just not sure I will be able to do it on a weekly basis, and doing it once a month made it more fun. I suspect now I will have to cave in and get a subscription....

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 10:14
Interesting news if true. I expect this has a lot to do with the fact that WD is leaked online without fail each month, spoiling the goodies inside and ensuring that few people even bother to buy it.

http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2014/01/the-monthly-white-dwarf-magazine-is-dead.html

Completely the wrong forum for this, but... the reason people don't buy it isn't that it's leaked online, but that because it has NOTHING in it but new releases which are up on the GW website the same day the magazine comes out, it's devoid of purpose. You don't have to search the web for blurry shakycam shots to spoil what's in it... all the new release details are available online for free from GW, the very same day the magazine is released.

People would buy it if it had... y'know... content. Not just full page photos of new releases screaming "BUY ME NOW".

Fable
09-01-2014, 10:18
The reasoning and concept sound well thought out and reasonable. Somehow that makes it feel less likely to be true.

nosebiter
09-01-2014, 10:19
Yeah. I will believe the greater "hobby" focus when i see it. The company pitch from GW is: Collect our models.

I expect nothing positive, but yet more blingy overpriced contentless garbage.

Novafix
09-01-2014, 10:26
Completely the wrong forum for this, but... the reason people don't buy it isn't that it's leaked online, but that because it has NOTHING in it but new releases which are up on the GW website the same day the magazine comes out, it's devoid of purpose. You don't have to search the web for blurry shakycam shots to spoil what's in it... all the new release details are available online for free from GW, the very same day the magazine is released.

People would buy it if it had... y'know... content. Not just full page photos of new releases screaming "BUY ME NOW".

This is true. When the sisters army was released in WD I bought both copies. That was the first White Dwarf I'd purchased in about 10 years. Why? It had content and not just a load of adverts.

Rovient
09-01-2014, 10:36
I think the most disappointing part of WD these days is how the battle reports slowly devolved into a story, rather than a report. Models are referred to as their names ("The Maw of Death" rather than "the Trygon") which made them incredibly difficult to follow, along with the lack of diagrams showing unit movements and firing etc.

Shame.

quantumcollider
09-01-2014, 10:38
Assuming this is true, what would that mean for my subscription (yes I have one, yes I know it is mostly pretty pictures of new models, and it arrives one week after I can buy it from a magazine rack, but I regret nothing)?

If February it the month of the last White Dwarf, then they still owe me six issues.

AndrewGPaul
09-01-2014, 11:01
I think the most disappointing part of WD these days is how the battle reports slowly devolved into a story, rather than a report. Models are referred to as their names ("The Maw of Death" rather than "the Trygon") which made them incredibly difficult to follow, along with the lack of diagrams showing unit movements and firing etc.

Shame.

Funnily enough, my favourite battle report was an old one - Dwarfs vs Bretonnians - which was presented entirely as a narrative. Other than the introduction and explanation of the scenario, there was no "game" discussion at all. I always wanted them to do more like that.

vargojones
09-01-2014, 11:21
http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2014/01/the-monthly-white-dwarf-magazine-is-dead.html

Dunno what to make of this... apologies if in wrong place.

Endobai
09-01-2014, 11:28
The reasoning and concept sound well thought out and reasonable. Somehow that makes it feel less likely to be true.

Well, I can confirm that overall.

Not sure about details, but there are changes to be expected.

Frankly it is been an entire decade since I've read the magazine for aything more than some details.

lbecks
09-01-2014, 11:36
Please bring back EM Masterclass.

lbecks
09-01-2014, 11:37
I just want them to bring back EM Masterclass.

Deamon-forge
09-01-2014, 11:37
it prob work out more money than a current WD mag. well guess thats saved me some money now

Voss
09-01-2014, 11:46
Completely the wrong forum for this, but... the reason people don't buy it isn't that it's leaked online, but that because it has NOTHING in it but new releases which are up on the GW website the same day the magazine comes out, it's devoid of purpose. You don't have to search the web for blurry shakycam shots to spoil what's in it... all the new release details are available online for free from GW, the very same day the magazine is released.


Indeed. This is actually the first I've ever heard about white dwarf being leaked online, because there really isn't any point. A lot of early model pictures never leave digital formats and I can't see anyone taking the time to reproduce the articles. A change or cancellation of wd would have minimal impact.

Astraeos
09-01-2014, 11:46
More hobby related content sounds good, but do they need to make it weekly? More chances of missing an issue there!

Spiney Norman
09-01-2014, 11:51
So they are going to be refunding subscribers that have already paid their year subscription right?

At the end of the day it is Faeit, so it could well be just bunk, however I am somewhat curious to see how much they would charge for a weekly magasine...

Novafix
09-01-2014, 12:10
Funnily enough, my favourite battle report was an old one - Dwarfs vs Bretonnians - which was presented entirely as a narrative. Other than the introduction and explanation of the scenario, there was no "game" discussion at all. I always wanted them to do more like that.

Was that the one where the Slayers ended up in a cave or something? If it was then I really liked that one also.

Poncho160
09-01-2014, 12:29
With the amount they charge for WD, I'm not surprised no one appears to buy it. Especially as it appears to contain nothing more than photos of new models.

On a side note, my local tesco always put the new WD up fir sale usually two days before it's general release. As of this month, they have stopped selling it though??

jimbo1701
09-01-2014, 12:35
will have to wait and see of course but I find it hard to believe there'll be more useful content for gamers and hobbyists seeing as everything which back in the day was a an article in wd is now charged for through digital releases. short stories, unit profiles, painting guides, new rules etc etc. my sub is up for renewal this month so might be time to jump ship, especially as the new format has far from wowed me this past year.

Herzlos
09-01-2014, 13:05
This would deal with the leaks pretty effectively, and maybe opens up the possibility of having multiple releases a month.

Since they already struggle to fill a monthly, I'm wondering what they'll do with weeklies, but if it's only £1 (any more than £1.30/week and it's another price rise) I'll give it a go.

I'm assuming that the monthly visions is just going to be a compendium of the months weekly issues?

Camman1984
09-01-2014, 13:05
I worry about the quality if they are going to be banging them out once a week. i would like to see old style battlereports with in depth maps and descriptions. Now they just seems to be splashes about selling the latest release. And many of them are weighed so heavily toward the flavour of the month it is unreal.

BigBarryJazz
09-01-2014, 13:09
Couldn't comment on the reliability of the rumour-monger, but from over on Dakka:



From my own source, what is happening is that the new release stuff goes into the weekly magazine, whilst the Painting guides, Armies on Parade and so-on stays in the monthly mag, which is going to 240 odd pages.

According to my source, it will be going up to ~$20 AU, will have a yearly subscription, and if for some reason you have a WD subscription it will tick over into the new monthly mag, but not the weekly one. I can additionally confirm the new names.

MadmanMSU
09-01-2014, 13:12
I think the most disappointing part of WD these days is how the battle reports slowly devolved into a story, rather than a report. Models are referred to as their names ("The Maw of Death" rather than "the Trygon") which made them incredibly difficult to follow, along with the lack of diagrams showing unit movements and firing etc.

Shame.

The reasoning for that is that 40k is a roleplaying game now, not a wargame. It's all about telling a story, and rules don't really matter. You practically need a GM at this point.

Deamon-forge
09-01-2014, 13:16
im on the 3 month pay sub i think yea i pay for book full of picture but then i like pictures. also the year sub is still on the GW store....... so i do wonder what they will do for people who have already subbed etc

Angelwing
09-01-2014, 13:21
WD has been effectively dead for a decade at least. This news would be an ideal time to rethink WD.

BigBarryJazz
09-01-2014, 13:22
im on the 3 month pay sub i think yea i pay for book full of picture but then i like pictures. also the year sub is still on the GW store....... so i do wonder what they will do for people who have already subbed etc

Before this thread gets booted to GW general, I'll repeat the quote from Dakka I put in the other thread:


From my own source, what is happening is that the new release stuff goes into the weekly magazine, whilst the Painting guides, Armies on Parade and so-on stays in the monthly mag, which is going to 240 odd pages.

According to my source, it will be going up to ~$20 AU, will have a yearly subscription, and if for some reason you have a WD subscription it will tick over into the new monthly mag, but not the weekly one. I can additionally confirm the new names.

So your sub will be shifted over to the new monthly mag. That's if this is accurate, of course.

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 13:28
The "new" White Dwarf (which was, what, two years ago now? Or just a year? I forget) was an unmitigated disaster in every conceivable way. They took a bad magazine, promised to make it better, and made it much, much worse.

Suffice to say I will not be holding my breath to see whether its replacement (if indeed this rumour is true) is any better.

TheFang
09-01-2014, 13:42
Weekly would be a surprise for a paid GW magazine. Only stuff with a fairly large circulation like tv and gossip seems to come out every week.

scoopdeta
09-01-2014, 13:45
So it seems that White Dwarf will be officially coming to an end with an expected announcement coming in the next couple of days. It will be replaced with a weekly web version and a monthy subscrition called "Warhammer: Visions". The move is apparently an attempt to rekindle interest in the publication of the monthly magazine which has been faltering, largely due to the content of the magazines focusing more on selling product rathe rthan promoting the hobby. If rumors hold true the new weekly and monthly will focus more heavily on the hobby and the players rather than the product pitch side of the house.

With the new dataslates and the way GW has been moving I can see this as being a real possibility. Especially with the combination of the GW/FW sites into a newer more interactive site...seems like GW could be attempting to rebrand a bit and regain some of their old support.

I expect to see some of the old GW bashing here, but these moves seem to me to a be a step in teh right direction. The first step of fixing a problem is admitting taht you have one, which it seems that they have.

draccan
09-01-2014, 13:51
There are already at least two other threads on this

AlexHolker
09-01-2014, 13:55
WD has been effectively dead for a decade at least. This news would be an ideal time to rethink WD.
Not a decade, but yeah, for a long time. A decade ago they still had articles full of new rules, backstory and modelling projects.

Akkaryn
09-01-2014, 14:25
I suspect that the weekly magazine will focus purely on the release of that week. Be it fw/bl/40k/fanatsy or hobbit.

It also opens up options of throwing in new units not in a codex on a whim and simply including the rules in that mag or an e.version. £2.40 isn't a lot to drop when you're not getting it every week. While at the same time those that buy wd every month now will likely buy the monthly version for £7.50.

Makes perfect sense in my mind.

Poncho160
09-01-2014, 14:27
If there is a new magazine, I'm not expecting any new hobby content at all.

GW have figured out that people are willing to download and pay for army lists, painting guides, tactic articles, additional game content and all the other stuff that used to appear in WD.

Why would they start giving it away for free?

Melkanador
09-01-2014, 14:31
Apparently the weekly WD (~28 pages) will be 3,20€ and the monthly one (same size as now) 10€.

Normally I´m a very optimistic person but considering GW´s past actions and caring for the hobby lead me to guess the following:

- the weekly version is the WD daily articles printed
- the monthly one will contain even less article content
- EMMC won´t return
- the new GW onlinestore containing FW & BL is just around the corner.

Poncho160
09-01-2014, 14:48
For example Codex: Inquisition would have only a few years ago, been released through WD.

These days GW are charging £19.99 for it.

GW aren't going to all of a sudden start giving away free stuff.

They don't even give away free one model plastic sprues with WD anymore, which probably cost pence to produce. I think the last time they did that was when they released the 5th edition boxed set.

Ohman
09-01-2014, 14:55
Sounds like good news to me! If they remove all the new releases from WD they should have plenty of room to fill it with good stuff. No guarantees that they will do this of course but I really can't see it getting any worse so...

Herzlos
09-01-2014, 14:58
Apparently the weekly WD (~28 pages) will be 3,20€ and the monthly one (same size as now) 10€.

Normally I´m a very optimistic person but considering GW´s past actions and caring for the hobby lead me to guess the following:

- the weekly version is the WD daily articles printed
- the monthly one will contain even less article content
- EMMC won´t return
- the new GW onlinestore containing FW & BL is just around the corner.

That's over 0,10€ per page, for what is likely to be a weekly catalogue or a reprint of the WD daily pages? That's... huge, even compared to White Dwarf.

Archibald_TK
09-01-2014, 15:02
I wonder what it will mean for foreign releases if true. A weekly + a large monthly release is a lot to translate into multiple languages so maybe the weekly one will be English only?

Spider-pope
09-01-2014, 15:08
Could be evidence for this rumour, or nothing, but the calender at the back of White Dwarf usually has the release date of the next issue. This month's calender doesn't.

Spider-pope
09-01-2014, 15:16
As i said in another thread on this subject, the calendar at the back of White Dwarf usually lists the next issues release date. This month's doesn't. If the rumours true, i'd have to have a good look at what the new weekly magazine thing is before spending money on it. I don't want to buy five magazines a month instead of one.
The supposed name also brings up the question of The Hobbit and Lord of the Rings. I would assume Warners and MGM wouldn't be keen on the change to "Warhammer Visions". I'd rather see the weekly thing be called visions, and keep White Dwarf as the monthly.


Not a decade, but yeah, for a long time. A decade ago they still had articles full of new rules, backstory and modelling projects.

A decade ago the exact same complaints were being made about the magazine. Paul Sawyer was a dirty word to some people.

Hawkkf
09-01-2014, 15:20
So if my understanding is right, there will be a new monthly version dedicated to the hobby side of things. To be fair these kind of articles do stay useful longer than other types.

Now the weekly magazine will be focused on new releases and advertising. Does this mean the release schedule will change to coincide with the weekly magazine? I could easily see them splitting a release up into two or more parts in a month as thier goal appears to get us into the shops more often.

Lastly, where do gaming articles fit in? Perhaps they will move away from them as they just give us a heads up on what to expect and we buy more when ambushed in the dark.

dalezzz
09-01-2014, 15:22
They could of course just made WD have some actual articles again :p

ah well let's see how it unfolds , weekly has potential then I don't have to look at 40k stuff for as long :)

AlexHolker
09-01-2014, 15:25
A decade ago the exact same complaints were being made about the magazine. Paul Sawyer was a dirty word to some people.
I have heard one person making this sort of complaint starting around issue 210 (just before I started, so I can't compare) but the Paul Sawyer era was pretty good in my eyes, even if what came before was apparently better.

Coldhatred
09-01-2014, 15:27
A decade ago the exact same complaints were being made about the magazine. Paul Sawyer was a dirty word to some people.

Not saying you aren't right, but I'd love to see Paul back at the Helm of White Dwarf. Yes, the issues weren't as good as those that came before, either due to the LotR business moves or rose tinted glasses, but the man got what the magazine should be about.

Confessor_Atol
09-01-2014, 15:33
Is it really so hard to listen to what your customers want? Is it really more profitable to kill a product with twenty years of readership than to make it into something relevant? Every GW business decision these days confuses the hell out of me.

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 15:34
So if my understanding is right, there will be a new monthly version dedicated to the hobby side of things. To be fair these kind of articles do stay useful longer than other types.

Yes, but OTOH, they're exactly the same kind of thing that GW have shown absolutely no inclination to do for the last five years or so (how many times have people demanded "bring back EM Masterclass!!!"?) and now they're going to fill up a magazine twice the size of WD and without the 50 pages of new releases and 16 pages of shop listings with it? They've put almost no meaningful content into White Dwarf for several years, and now they're going to give us nothing but meaningful content, and twice as much of it as they managed to produce as guff?

Don't get me wrong - if that happens, great. Just colour me cynical, because people have been BEGGING for GW to do that for YEARS and they've gone in completely the opposite direction. If they're finally listening, that's good, and not before time - but still, wouldn't they do it gradually, adding more and more content over time, instead of in one fell swoop?

azhagmorglum
09-01-2014, 15:35
Well WD as it is now is just useless, but if what they are presently doing on the website is what is to be expected instead, it surely won't be better, but at least we won't have to pay for it...

budman
09-01-2014, 15:39
A hobby focused weekly white dwarf...
if true Very cool and I will buy it...

Voss
09-01-2014, 15:41
The reasoning for that is that 40k is a roleplaying game now, not a wargame. It's all about telling a story, and rules don't really matter. You practically need a GM at this point.

A return to RT roots then.

azhagmorglum
09-01-2014, 15:43
It's just another ploy from GW to get some more money from newcomers and long time consumers :

1) announce a change
2) give excuses to raise prices (full colour, hardback, whatever crap you can come up with)
3) people want to see what it is so they buy
4) lasts a couple of months, people start to see it's ************
5) people buy less, but GW got its money

They did it with the last WD overhaul, they will surely do it again this time

Voss
09-01-2014, 15:45
Is it really so hard to listen to what your customers want?
Honestly, yes. Despite any ideas you might glean from vocal minorities on the internet, customers do not all want the same things. They have different attitudes and opinions, and what may* satisfy some will further upset others. Other desires simply aren't practical to fulfill.

*and this isn't even close to certain. Sometimes when you give people what they say they want, they throw it down in disgust.

MasterSplinter
09-01-2014, 16:00
Well WD as it is now is just useless, but if what they are presently doing on the website is what is to be expected instead, it surely won't be better, but at least we won't have to pay for it...

Dont say too loud... -.-

Daigar
09-01-2014, 16:03
Was that the one where the Slayers ended up in a cave or something? If it was then I really liked that one also.

I remember one where Dwarfs were rescuing a relic from Bretonnian territory, and that was a tomb, not a cave, and had some skeletons inside.

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 16:06
OK, but, does anyone - in the world - anyone at all - even one single person, honestly genuinely believe that the White Dwarf they've had for the last few years was what anyone wanted? It certainly wasn't what anyone asked for.

Thorin
09-01-2014, 16:07
There is no release date given for the next WD, which made me wonder as well. Usually they don't miss out an occasion on telling you when to hand them money-for-nothing again. I think it is kinda sad. No more leaked WD images...
But howeve, there'll be something different. I know it, because this is GW. They sell stuff, and to be honest...there was talk of weekly mini-magazine articles sent per Mail that would continue to give you your "weekly load of trash, sorry hobby".

The weekly mags are supposed to be advertising prospects, as I have heard., it should be 32 pages each and serve as a tiny vending catalogue.
The bigger issues are said to focus mostly on real hobby stuff like painting, modelling and converting tutorials and guides.

However, it is still unknown if this might change current release plans, such as having something new out every week (just like having reoccuring sales) or offering small discounts every week.

Prices were stated at 3,20€ for the small, weekly one and about 10 € or more for the bigger monthly one.

Spider-pope
09-01-2014, 16:10
Not saying you aren't right, but I'd love to see Paul back at the Helm of White Dwarf. Yes, the issues weren't as good as those that came before, either due to the LotR business moves or rose tinted glasses, but the man got what the magazine should be about.

I agree, i was a fan of the Fat Bloke era. I'm just disputing the idea that complaints against White Dwarf are a new thing. The exact same charges were levelled against the magazine when Fat Bloke was around, and his predecessors. Give it a decade and i've little doubt there will be posts on Holo-Warseer about how great it was when Jes was in charge, and how White Dwarf 3D is a terrible e-magazine.

ntw3001
09-01-2014, 16:15
I think that, since WD has built up a reputation for worthlessness, GW would consider themselves better served by making large, noticeable changes than by stealthily bringing in content. If they plan to make WD into a product somebody might wish to buy, they'll want potential customers to know that it has changed.

That said, I have no faith that GW will be able to make WD worth buying. They might take out the double page spreads featuring only the word 'BUY', but any useful hobby tips WD might contain are already available independently. I think there's a niche for an independent hobby/gaming magazine, but not for WD.

Sephillion
09-01-2014, 16:18
Yes, but OTOH, they're exactly the same kind of thing that GW have shown absolutely no inclination to do for the last five years or so (how many times have people demanded "bring back EM Masterclass!!!"?) and now they're going to fill up a magazine twice the size of WD and without the 50 pages of new releases and 16 pages of shop listings with it? They've put almost no meaningful content into White Dwarf for several years, and now they're going to give us nothing but meaningful content, and twice as much of it as they managed to produce as guff?

Don't get me wrong - if that happens, great. Just colour me cynical, because people have been BEGGING for GW to do that for YEARS and they've gone in completely the opposite direction. If they're finally listening, that's good, and not before time - but still, wouldn't they do it gradually, adding more and more content over time, instead of in one fell swoop?

Count me in as the doubters, but I would gladly buy it if it’s better than the current one. Maybe the current incarnation was an experiment or a stop gap? Or maybe they changed the team, one that isn’t content in doing a half-assed job? (Not saying it’s the current editors fault, but it’s still possible.) Or at least one with a different vision?

Kurnagar
09-01-2014, 16:21
Hello everyone
I'm nearly never posting anything but for once i'll post what i know

- white dwarf won't disappear or go digital as i read here and there but will become weekly for the "price of a paint pot"
- new white dwarf will only be sold in GW storees and gaming stores, not in bookstores anymore
- each issue will present the new releases of the next week as new releases will not be grouped at the beginning of the month anymore but spread over the entire month
- a new monthly magazine will appear called warhammer vision that will feature only picture of painted miniatures (golden demons entries and so on)
- each issue of the warhammer vision will focus on the army of the previous month (so 1 february you could expect a warhammer vision full of tyranids pictures)

Thanks for reading

mbh1127
09-01-2014, 16:24
The content of WD was never the main problem for me (although it certainly could have been better). It was the outrageous price per issue that ended my subscription. I couldn't justify the fee with the raising price of models on hobby supplies as well.

lybban
09-01-2014, 16:29
What the hell??? What will happen to my subscription then???? My mooooooney!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

Deaf Paradox
09-01-2014, 16:36
Just cancelled my WD sub in DEC to update to the ipad version. Although this months mag was my last, I would have been very pissed off if I had renew my sub on the next mag release with my itunes credits only then to have to chase it back.

Poor show GW, this should have been announced loud and clear.

Splen
09-01-2014, 16:37
I'm on the fence about this one. If the weekly magazine has some decent articles to do with actual gaming, painting and collecting (much like WD used to do more) then I could conceivably be on board. Twenty eight pages seems like quite a small space in which to do this, but as it will be once a week perhaps volume of content will not be a problem. The 'Visions' monthly thing is more doubtful to me though. It seems like it would have to offer something over and above what the website already does in terms of displaying new models, or risk being an expensive irrelevance. I look forward to how GW bridge the gap between 'catalogue' and 'collectors piece' with more curiosity than hope. You have to admit, whatever else you might say about them, they have not been too bad at getting our money off us up till now!

DarkMark
09-01-2014, 16:40
So, more of the same tripe on a different albeit more expensive plate. Fool me once...

lybban
09-01-2014, 16:40
OK, but, does anyone - in the world - anyone at all - even one single person, honestly genuinely believe that the White Dwarf they've had for the last few years was what anyone wanted? It certainly wasn't what anyone asked for.

Word! I am a subscriber and if an issue has 40K releases it takes me 5 minutes to read it back to back. If its fantasy related it lasts for over 20 minutes!!! 20 years ago i read it for a week!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

Splen
09-01-2014, 16:41
Dear mods. I've just noticed that there are lots of these threads at the moment, is it possible to combine them in some way?

Lord Solar Plexus
09-01-2014, 16:50
Hold on, cowboy. They'll refund you automatically when they announce it just like everybody else, so giving them a bad rep by jumping to conclusions is bad style. I'm not surprised they're cutting down on rumour leaks when it only leads to such reactions.

Spiney Norman
09-01-2014, 16:51
I suspect that the weekly magazine will focus purely on the release of that week. Be it fw/bl/40k/fanatsy or hobbit.

It also opens up options of throwing in new units not in a codex on a whim and simply including the rules in that mag or an e.version. £2.40 isn't a lot to drop when you're not getting it every week. While at the same time those that buy wd every month now will likely buy the monthly version for £7.50.

Makes perfect sense in my mind.

It makes you wonder what will be in the weekly magasine on weeks when they don't drop a new release, unless they are going accelerate the release schedule even further than it already is...

Spider-pope
09-01-2014, 16:51
Hello everyone
I'm nearly never posting anything but for once i'll post what i know

- white dwarf won't disappear or go digital as i read here and there but will become weekly for the "price of a paint pot"
- new white dwarf will only be sold in GW storees and gaming stores, not in bookstores anymore
- each issue will present the new releases of the next week as new releases will not be grouped at the beginning of the month anymore but spread over the entire month
- a new monthly magazine will appear called warhammer vision that will feature only picture of painted miniatures (golden demons entries and so on)
- each issue of the warhammer vision will focus on the army of the previous month (so 1 february you could expect a warhammer vision full of tyranids pictures)

Thanks for reading

To be honest that sounds absolutely terrible, and almost doubles the price of White Dwarf, for what appears to be bugger all gain. If this is what it turns out to be, i may not be buying White Dwarf for the first time in 18 years.

Akkaryn
09-01-2014, 16:53
It makes you wonder what will be in the weekly magasine on weeks when they don't drop a new release, unless they are going accelerate the release schedule even further than it already is...

If you think about it. With the merging of forge world and black library they should have something each week that's new. Or they could drop the monthly releases into segments. After all a box every other week is much more psychologically appealing to parents than a massive drop all in one go.

Avian
09-01-2014, 17:18
Maybe it's going to be 240 *digital* pages - the equivalent of around 80 regular ones.

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 17:21
I'm not surprised they're cutting down on rumour leaks when it only leads to such reactions.

Yes; as opposed to, say, telling people what's going on ahead of time, instead of leaving it to the last minute to let them find out, thus creating a market in which rumours can even exist.

Sureshot05
09-01-2014, 17:31
Well, trouble is GW digital sells every month all the articles that used to be in WD and have left it very little to contain.

Rules, Painting guides, backgrounds are all now digital.
So the mag is left with:
Tactica (!), Opinions, Battle Reports, and New Releases.

I don't see GW letting up on the digital front, so what now?
Weekly new releases Digital supplement and cheap store mag?

Conversions and terrain have long been limited in the magazine so maybe they could make a return? Maybe print in it some of the digital rules? I am curious as to how GW see this working, or whether WD weekly becomes the show case, and the monthly becomes Citadel Journal and in a years time, dies a slow death.

Morathi's Darkest Sin
09-01-2014, 17:48
So wait.. they want to make it harder for new folks to find out about GW products. We sell two or three White Dwarf issues a month in a tiny village newsagents/shop and we are in the middle of no where. Seems blinkin mad to me, restricting the advertising mag of the company to their stores/gaming stores which aren't going to gain any more new custom than they already get themselves via passing trade does what exactly?

Lord Solar Plexus
09-01-2014, 17:53
Well, when will they stop it? The announcement is supposed to come in a couple of days. You might be right but from the info here we don't know whether it is last minute.

Deaf Paradox
09-01-2014, 17:55
Hold on, cowboy. They'll refund you automatically when they announce it just like everybody else, so giving them a bad rep by jumping to conclusions is bad style. I'm not surprised they're cutting down on rumour leaks when it only leads to such reactions.

That's fair enough but I was reading on the other thread on this that apparently our subscription just carries on to the new more expensive version automatically. Obviously this is all hearsay at the moment but I still think it is cheeky that they are just going to go ahead of the change before telling what is going to happen.

Especially if it is going to cost more.

Commodus Leitdorf
09-01-2014, 18:14
Sad, but White Dwarf hasn't been worth reading/buying for a long time. I still have older ones lying around that I still go back to for hobby and painting ideas. If only they had kept doing that it might have survived...

then again digital is the future, hopefully they'll be able to capture the old magic with digital releases.

phlewis
09-01-2014, 18:14
I have bought the White Dwarf every month for years even when I wasn't currently playing any of the GW games. If I am now going to be charged more for an e-zine I may just give it a pass.

Avian
09-01-2014, 18:15
GW have figured out that people are willing to download and pay for army lists, painting guides, tactic articles, additional game content and all the other stuff that used to appear in WD.

Why would they start giving it away for free?
Well, it would be "free" in a magazine that you paid for, so it's not as if they'd be giving it away. It's just another way of paying.

Poncho160
09-01-2014, 18:27
Well, it would be "free" in a magazine that you paid for, so it's not as if they'd be giving it away. It's just another way of paying.

Haha, fair one :)

What I meant was, why would they now start putting it back in WD, when they can charge us more by putting it up for sale as a download?

Captain Marius
09-01-2014, 18:33
This would mean January's Parting Shot actually refers to something! "Time for change!" indeed!

Jim30
09-01-2014, 18:37
If aim is weekly edition for price of pot of paint, does anyone else see paint soaring in price soon :-)

canberraguy
09-01-2014, 18:49
Of this happens I will not know what to do! Have every issue since 106, but the last few years the issues have been pretty average.
Do I keep buying or not. If the new monthly mag is mainly painting and tactics articles that sounds pretty good.

InstantKarma
09-01-2014, 18:56
I think the most disappointing part of WD these days is how the battle reports slowly devolved into a story, rather than a report. Models are referred to as their names ("The Maw of Death" rather than "the Trygon") which made them incredibly difficult to follow, along with the lack of diagrams showing unit movements and firing etc.

Shame.

This^^^. I was shocked when I picked up a WD last year for the first time in years and found no diagrams in the Bat Rep. Greatly missed those, and the more detailed descriptions of, you know, THE BATTLE!

Lorcryst
09-01-2014, 18:57
I've had an active subscription to the White Dwarf for more than 10 years ... and I'm not totally raging about the quality of it. Sure, back when GW didn't produce plastic terrain the articles about making your own out of cardboard were nice, but I've found the Paint Splatter series much more instructive than the previous "you mix a bit of this paint with a drop of that paint and hope to get the nice colour you want" ... all in all, even if my interest in 40K has waned and my total lack of interest for LoTR/The Hobbit mean that I skip those pages, I still find it a good read. Special kudos to the article of Jervis Johnson this month wit lots of random tables for "family heirlooms" magic items, just for that one I'm satisfied with this month's offering.

Better than most monthly magazines with "shock and awe" pictures of "celebs" and the latest stupidity of Justin Bieber that can usually be found on the newstands here in Belgium, anyway.

Digital might be the future, but personnaly I've used my tablet extensively for four months, and then gone back to paper ... papers versions don't need batteries than die on you, you don't have to fiddle with screen resolutions that makes things hard to read, and a one-year subscription to a paper magazine costs a fraction of the price of a tablet.

Speaking of subscriptions, the one-year subscription package to the White Dwarf is still available on the four versions of the GW website I usually check, too, with not a single peep about "check this website later for HUGE news !".

Finally, the source of this rumour (Faiet I think ?) has a very checkered track record, so I'll still go to my local GW this saturday (need more paints anyway) and ask about this supposed change, but until I have hard facts I call hogwash, shenanigans, hate-filled wishlisting and false alarm.

Rated_lexxx
09-01-2014, 19:07
This^^^. I was shocked when I picked up a WD last year for the first time in years and found no diagrams in the Bat Rep. Greatly missed those, and the more detailed descriptions of, you know, THE BATTLE!

I picked up this month's WD to read the battle report, maybe get some of the new rules for nids. I do this normally when a new army comes out

It was more difficult then it had to be to figure out what is going and as others have said there are no overhead diagrams to see what is going on.

Deadnight
09-01-2014, 19:55
OK, but, does anyone - in the world - anyone at all - even one single person, honestly genuinely believe that the White Dwarf they've had for the last few years was what anyone wanted? It certainly wasn't what anyone asked for.

And yet People still buy it though... That simple fact says more to the bean counters than any amount of forum rage from angry nerds, methinks.

Killgore
09-01-2014, 20:04
Many people only buy WD for a specific army or article. Well now you pay for less toilet paper and get greater choice in which issues you want to buy/ download.

I can only see this as being a good thing, unless you have to own every issue, then it will hit you in the pocket.

But with the 'rumoured' promise of more hobby content and rules, if delivered correctly, I can see this being a success.

Baked
09-01-2014, 20:22
I've had an active subscription to the White Dwarf for more than 10 years ... and I'm not totally raging about the quality of it. Sure, back when GW didn't produce plastic terrain the articles about making your own out of cardboard were nice, but I've found the Paint Splatter series much more instructive than the previous "you mix a bit of this paint with a drop of that paint and hope to get the nice colour you want" ... all in all, even if my interest in 40K has waned and my total lack of interest for LoTR/The Hobbit mean that I skip those pages, I still find it a good read. Special kudos to the article of Jervis Johnson this month wit lots of random tables for "family heirlooms" magic items, just for that one I'm satisfied with this month's offering.

Better than most monthly magazines with "shock and awe" pictures of "celebs" and the latest stupidity of Justin Bieber that can usually be found on the newstands here in Belgium, anyway.

Digital might be the future, but personnaly I've used my tablet extensively for four months, and then gone back to paper ... papers versions don't need batteries than die on you, you don't have to fiddle with screen resolutions that makes things hard to read, and a one-year subscription to a paper magazine costs a fraction of the price of a tablet.

Speaking of subscriptions, the one-year subscription package to the White Dwarf is still available on the four versions of the GW website I usually check, too, with not a single peep about "check this website later for HUGE news !".

Finally, the source of this rumour (Faiet I think ?) has a very checkered track record, so I'll still go to my local GW this saturday (need more paints anyway) and ask about this supposed change, but until I have hard facts I call hogwash, shenanigans, hate-filled wishlisting and false alarm.

I agree with you faeit has proven lately to be full of it. Tryanids where suppose to be in December and many others. I think waiting will be the key cause I wouldn't be surprised if this turns out to be another ******** runour.

Autumn Leaves
09-01-2014, 20:24
Profitability.
It's all about profitability.
GW is a PLC.
They are looking at ways to squeeze more money out of the various aspects of the GW pantheon.
Sadly this new action of taking an old format and rebranding it should all but kill the poor old WD stone dead. However as WD is not improving it's profitability the PLC are looking at how they can 'rejuvenate it' (read as 'make more money'.)
The brb costs money to manufacture so the digital option with live updates is much more cost effective for the PLC . ergo the digital brb is the way toward greater profitability.
WFB is at an all time low ebb for sales, expect that to be repackaged in the next 18 months.
Right now the WD is being repackaged to increase profitability, do any of you remember what happened when the popular individual specialist games magazines were amalgamated into the solitary Fanatic magazine?
Hmmmm…. e-zine for white dwarf coming up?
40K is keeping GW afloat.
God help them if 40K sales droop.

Brother Dimetrius
09-01-2014, 20:25
How fortuitous, I didn't renew my iPad subscription this month.

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 20:28
And yet People still buy it though... That simple fact says more to the bean counters than any amount of forum rage from angry nerds, methinks.

Yes, at least some do (to my shame, I'm one of them, even though I think it's a load of toss... turns out twenty years of habit and nostalgia are slightly stronger than throwing away £3 per month on a Direct Debit I get no value from); but we don't know if it's more or less than before, or more or less than the bean-counters expect, or more or less than it could sell if they put some effort into it.

Completely statistically invalid observation: the "this month's White Dwarf Review" threads in this forum used to get 200+ posts each for years on end; then they gradually dwindled to barely 10% of that, then the mods stopped creating them at all because no-one was posting. It's just possible that this reflects far fewer people buying it to be able to review it, isn't it? Don't get me wrong, I'm not proposing it as proof or anything, but it would seem a reasonable conjecture.

Autumn Leaves
09-01-2014, 20:30
It's a sign of the times, a digital brb, war hammer fantasy sales at an all time low, WD not pulling it's weight on the economic bottom line.
The fact is GW as a PLC must turn the various component parts of it's inventory to profitability if they are lagging.
Repackage the failing parts to return them to a greater profitability.
The brb has always cost money to manufacture so flog it as a digital entity and save a fortune on the production costs.
Let the army books follow suit. Bigger return for a smaller outlay.
Turn the White dwarf into a weekly e-zine…
Repackage WFB as a skirmish game.
Right now the only element of GW's inventory that is safe from 'repackaging' is 40K.
Because it's making a satisfactory profit.
The PLC MUST make a profit and some people here are not seeing the very real problems the PLC is having in continuing to create a profit for it's shareholders.
They will stop at nothing to make that profit, or… to ready the the old girl for the scrapyard to be broken up and sold off to the highest bidder.

InstantKarma
09-01-2014, 20:32
I'm starting to disregard Faeit as a good source when the source is either named 'anonymous' or 'stickmonkey'.

I'll believe that GW's flagship mag is getting the axe when GW says so.

dangerboyjim
09-01-2014, 20:34
The people at GW's idea of what their customers want is so wildly different from mine, I expect to be disappointed.

I can't see them going from one magazine with nothing but filler in it, to two magazines with content, original artwork, rules, bat reps and all the other interesting stuff they used to have.

BramGaunt
09-01-2014, 20:35
This weekly White Dward must be one of the smartest buisness moves I've seen from GW in a while.

It offers not much to a veteran player, agreed. But put yourself back at the beginnings of your hobby career.

You are a teenager livng several train stations away from the next hobbyshop, and your parents are to occupied to drive you there on a regular basis. You know squat about painting, assembling and playing the new miantures you hae set your eye upon. But now the stafer says "you know what, I'll show you how to apply paint on a miniature, and to go along with your new box of, lets say, Dwarven Ironbreakers, you take this pamphlet. It has any information you need on how to paint them, including other variations, and a tactics artcle on how to use them best." You just paid 35 - 40 € on your new miniatures, and you already have 50 € worth of paint and brushes. What's another 3,20? Yes, thank you very much, mr. staffer. What's that in the back?" "Oh, that the new cannon we are releasing next week, see you then I suppose?"

Now imagine it's the parents. "For only 3,20 you get this, it includes any information your son/daughter will need to assemble his miniatures, and how to paint them, so he won't need your help." 3,20€ for 3 hours of quiet from your teenager? Yes, please.

Ohman
09-01-2014, 20:37
So what does Warseer think brought this on? If true that is... Is it the decision to start with weekly releases that made this necessary? Or has the White Dwarf reader base dropped to such lows that GW felt it was unsalvageable?

Sir_Glonojad
09-01-2014, 20:40
[QUOTE=Autumn Leaves;7030743], war hammer fantasy sales at an all time low,/QUOTE]

Ah, yes, those famous "eight percent" which You never cared to actually support with a reference (unless I am mistaken and You finally did).

DarianZG
09-01-2014, 20:46
Please bring back EM Masterclass.


This. The Masterclass articles were the only reason I bought the magazine. When they went to the new format, I really didn't like their 'studio painter' format stuff. While the step by step articles on painting were decent enough, I always wanted to see more high level tutorials that would push my skills as a painter to try new things.

Avian
09-01-2014, 20:47
I heard that White Dwarf sales only make up 8 % of GW's profits (the guy didn't give a source for this figure, but he repeated it several times, so it must be true). Presumably that's the reason.

DeathGlam
09-01-2014, 20:55
Im hopeful that it is true about the flashy buy the new stuff articles being removed from the monthly issue, as im still a subscriber, sure it is not great but i enjoy flicking at it once a month, which is enough for me as i don't think of it as something expensive.

Edit: I am a big fan of them making the Battle Reports more stories then gamey though, id much rather read the fluff of the battle then, what exact dice roll they each get every turn.

TheFang
09-01-2014, 21:03
I heard that White Dwarf sales only make up 8 % of GW's profits (the guy didn't give a source for this figure, but he repeated it several times, so it must be true). Presumably that's the reason.

If WD sales were 8% of profits they wouldn't change it at all.

Ohman
09-01-2014, 21:09
:D

Anyway, I'm actually more intrigued about what other changes this year might bring. I mean if they can get rid of White Dwarf than anything is possible...

Cuchulain84
09-01-2014, 21:24
It says a lot that no-one seems to be particularily sad about this. White Dwarf used to be so good in the 90's and even the early 00's and it gave so many people so much joy. It feels so dead already now that putting it to bed just feels like the right thing to do.

TheFang
09-01-2014, 21:30
I've read it since issue one. My sub is only still running because of inertia and I can't be bothered cancelling the direct debit. I used to return to issues several times over the month it came out and go back every few months for reference. Now I flick through it once and it slots into the pile.

fenrisbrit
09-01-2014, 21:31
I am a big fan of them making the Battle Reports more stories then gamey though, id much rather read the fluff of the battle then, what exact dice roll they each get every turn.

When the battle reports were at their best they were an analysis of how things worked. In fact my all time favourite article was a very detailed analysis on how to conduct an assault (which in 3rd Edn was complex). Not just a list of dice rolls and not empty fluff but a really well thought out piece of education on how to improve your game. Fluff is great but there also has to be some substance.

mattjgilbert
09-01-2014, 21:37
If WD sales were 8% of profits they wouldn't change it at all.

I agree - 8% from a magazine like that is huge.

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 21:51
Edit: I am a big fan of them making the Battle Reports more stories then gamey though, id much rather read the fluff of the battle then, what exact dice roll they each get every turn.

A good battle report isn't just a list of dice rolls. Neither is it "Bob My Awesome General beat up Fred His Amazing General and it was so wicked!!!!"

A good battle report discusses army selection, tactics, and the reasoning behind decisions - shown on a map so you can understand why they did what they did, and maybe become a better player.

One of the best battle reports they ever printed was (IIRC) Jervis Johnson's Space Marines and Imperial Guard against Andy Chambers' Orks, in a game of Epic. I have never played a game of Epic in my life, and I certainly neither know nor care what dice rolls they needed, but the entire thing was a discussion of the tactics they were using and what they were trying to achieve, so the fact I didn't know the rules didn't stop me from appreciating what they were trying to do as table-top generals. Can anyone tell me what tactics they used in the latest batrep? Lined up a load of Tyranid MCs and Tau suits and rolled a bunch of dice, as far as I can tell. It failed as an interesting story, and failed even harder as an insight into the generalship of the players.

MiyamatoMusashi
09-01-2014, 22:02
I heard that White Dwarf sales only make up 8 % of GW's profits (the guy didn't give a source for this figure, but he repeated it several times, so it must be true). Presumably that's the reason.

8% of a £20M profit is £1.6M. Assuming for simplicity that everyone who reads it is a subscriber paying £36/year by direct debit, that's roughly 44000 readers, which is believable as a rough ballpark figure; though a fair bit down on the ABC from 15 years or so ago which was about 80000 IIRC, and represents a far smaller share of the player base as GW has grown a lot since then. (And the more people paying full price instead of a direct debit subscription, the fewer readers that implies). So I could understand them being unhappy with those sort of numbers.

Of course, to be clear, that's mixing revenue from White Dwarf sales against GW's profits - it's not really clear if that was the intention of that statement. But as stated, those numbers seem feasible.

Darnok
09-01-2014, 22:17
If WD sales were 8% of profits they wouldn't change it at all.


I agree - 8% from a magazine like that is huge.


8% of a £20M profit is £1.6M. Assuming for simplicity that everyone who reads it is a subscriber paying £36/year by direct debit, that's roughly 44000 readers, which is believable as a rough ballpark figure; though a fair bit down on the ABC from 15 years or so ago which was about 80000 IIRC, and represents a far smaller share of the player base as GW has grown a lot since then. (And the more people paying full price instead of a direct debit subscription, the fewer readers that implies). So I could understand them being unhappy with those sort of numbers.

Of course, to be clear, that's mixing revenue from White Dwarf sales against GW's profits - it's not really clear if that was the intention of that statement. But as stated, those numbers seem feasible.

Please adjust your sarcasm detectors - they failed you. Avian was making a joke.

Avian
09-01-2014, 22:27
I was referencing Autumn Leaves, who is clearly of the opinion that sales of everything non-40K is insufficient. 8 % is his often repeated figure for the sales of FB as a share of GW's total profits. Lots of people have asked where he got that number but so far he's declined to tell us.

lybban
09-01-2014, 22:41
I heard that White Dwarf sales only make up 8 % of GW's profits (the guy didn't give a source for this figure, but he repeated it several times, so it must be true). Presumably that's the reason.

I think 8% is gonna be the magic number of 2014! I am 8% certain of this.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

MT Bucket
09-01-2014, 23:35
If true then they're a few weeks late - turkeys are traditionally killed in time for Christmas.

Before it became the all new WD it was barely worth getting: after the re-brand it wasn't worth it at all. Someone should have drowned that puppy a long time ago.

Bring back "On The Boil" and "Marginalia" :) ! Back in the day (the early 100's) it had a circulation of over 200,000 copies, before they started their quest for global domination! It was absolutely chock full of rules, scenarios and painting articles, with a little bit of fluff and some pages of quirky releases (e.g Imperial Army Trooper models all named after actors from the Batman TV series). A very sad decline to today's overpriced 'brochure'.

We'll have to wait and see what comes next, if anything.

MT Bucket
09-01-2014, 23:36
Double post

canberraguy
09-01-2014, 23:38
A shame as it will mean my collection comes to an end (started with WD 125). Don't see why they can just do the new monthly mag as they plan it and still call it white dwarf, but anyway. The last few years have been poor for WD so if the new monthly format is as they say it will be that's a big win.

I think making WD a massive ad put a lot of people off. Readers felt marketed to and people don't like that. If the mag was simply a GW hobby magazine the interest and enthusiasm would generate sales without putting people off.

Senbei
10-01-2014, 00:10
I think making WD a massive ad put a lot of people off. Readers felt marketed to and people don't like that. If the mag was simply a GW hobby magazine the interest and enthusiasm would generate sales without putting people off.

I always felt that bad issues were ones that had nothing for YOU. Variant army lists, in depth tactical discussion or new units to field or have fielded against you. If you want to know what's new you can just look at the GW web page, theres no real reason to buy the mag.

Good issues tend to have rules in them, and this is something that GW has shied away from for a while: for a while in the 80s and 90s there were rules for new units* in almost every White Dwarf, even if they maybe didn't work without the army book, dark millennium and 40k rule + wargear books.

*though the game they were for could be almost anything. I remember Epic, WFRP, Dark Future, Judge Dredd, WFB, 40k, Confrontation, Dragon Masters, Space Hulk, Adv Hero Quest, etc, etc (This is just the earlier stuff too...). There were even two issues published that were full of Space Crusade and Heroquest rules.

stortotta
10-01-2014, 00:23
@ Avian - you made me laugh at a 92% level, until sarcasmintolerant people dropped than figure to round about 8%...

Horus38
10-01-2014, 00:46
Didn't see any confirmation in the thread yet, but at my local shop tonight the manager said this is happening, so it is confirmed if that hadn't been said yet.

lbecks
10-01-2014, 01:14
A shame as it will mean my collection comes to an end (started with WD 125). Don't see why they can just do the new monthly mag as they plan it and still call it white dwarf, but anyway. The last few years have been poor for WD so if the new monthly format is as they say it will be that's a big win.

I think making WD a massive ad put a lot of people off. Readers felt marketed to and people don't like that. If the mag was simply a GW hobby magazine the interest and enthusiasm would generate sales without putting people off.

There's no reason to make WD a massive ad in the internet age. Making it a catalog made sense before the internet. But now it's just redundant and annoying.

RevEv
10-01-2014, 01:49
Sorry to be a naysayer - but this rumour comes from one source and not a good one at that.

WD subscriptions are still available online, WD subscribers still expect their magazine. IF this were to occur GW will have a lot of angry customers knocking at their doors expecting refunds on goods promised but not delivered.

lorelorn
10-01-2014, 01:58
This looks like more of re-branding than a cancellation. GW is still going to have a monthly gaming magazine. It's now going to be called Warhammer: Visions, keeping it in line with the names of GW's two supported games. White Dwarf is a name that means nothing to the GW of today, the name has no connection to their products.

As for the content, the main change being flagged is the removal of new releases from the front of the monthly magazine, and put into a shorter weekly product.

Coldhatred
10-01-2014, 03:04
OK, but, does anyone - in the world - anyone at all - even one single person, honestly genuinely believe that the White Dwarf they've had for the last few years was what anyone wanted? It certainly wasn't what anyone asked for.

Actually there are several people at my local store that really enjoy White Dwarf as it is right now. That being said, they haven't experienced White Dwarf prior to the last revamp.

Shibboleth
10-01-2014, 05:21
I tried to ask a question to the GW Digital Editions Facebook page about which versions will be digital... it said my message was published, but it didn't show up on their page yet.
Do they get to mod posts before they're published?

Basically this means I'm out now - not a rage quit, just forced out.
I was a regular WD buyer, borderline okay paying $12 AU for WD every month, but $20 is just beyond worth it
especially if there will also be $6 per week editions on top of that for what also used to be part of the price
- which I can only buy from a store that's an hour's bus trip away
- which I can't get to on Saturday release day or Sunday (weekends) and is closed Monday/Tuesday's because it's a one man store and the guy has to have a break himself...

So Wednesday's I could get a copy, if I can make the trip, and after the content's been all over the internet for that whole time...

WD has gone from $12 a month to $34 a month, and is now harder to get.
I don't see this paying off.
It's only putting customers like me out of the gang.

Novafix
10-01-2014, 07:30
I remember one where Dwarfs were rescuing a relic from Bretonnian territory, and that was a tomb, not a cave, and had some skeletons inside.

That sounds about right. Really liked that battle report.

MiyamatoMusashi
10-01-2014, 07:42
@ Avian - you made me laugh at a 92% level, until sarcasmintolerant people dropped than figure to round about 8%...

By "sarcasm intolerant people", I assume you mean "people who don't follow the arguments and personal vendettas of unrelated posters carried over from other threads and referred to without context or explanation".

As far as I realised, an awareness of some random poster's obsession with a sourceless 8% figure wasn't a requirement of membership of the forum? Maybe I missed that one in the entrance exam.

Avian
10-01-2014, 07:46
All right, I apologise for the distraction. If you weren't following the FB Rumours forum, you wouldn't have understood the reference.

Evil Hypnotist
10-01-2014, 07:52
Sorry to be a naysayer - but this rumour comes from one source and not a good one at that.

WD subscriptions are still available online, WD subscribers still expect their magazine. IF this were to occur GW will have a lot of angry customers knocking at their doors expecting refunds on goods promised but not delivered.

Agreed, I am gobsmacked that, as a subscriber, I have not been made aware of forthcoming changes. GW obviously have a habit of keeping their cards close to their chest but if they intend to change my subscription and ESPECIALLY if they intend to charge me more for it I expect to be notified in plenty of time.

Autumn Leaves
10-01-2014, 08:09
None of us are aware of the forthcoming changes, that doesn't mean they are not going to happen.
GW PLC has never been of a mind to forewarn customers and long time supporters like us.
The closing of war hammer historical came with no warning.
The specialist games closing down came with no warning.
What makes any of us here think we are going to get any kind of warning from a company that is notoriously tight lipped about its activities until they launch them?
Hmmmm?
I agree with the folks who think it's upsetting to lose the White Dwarf, a cornerstone of the GW hobby for decades. Once upon a time it was a fantastic magazine, for a long time, but obviously it has profitability angles that the PLC wants to exploit.
Hence the changes.
This year is going to be a roller coaster ride, fasten your seat belts.
Regarding WD, it's a sad day and no mistake.
It's a very long standing flagship that deserves some real fanfare at it's departure.

Keravin
10-01-2014, 08:51
I don't think it is just limited to one source now. We've had other sources confirming in this thread and I've seen a lot of GW staffers confirming there is a change coming.

budman
10-01-2014, 08:51
8% of a £20M profit is £1.6M. Assuming for simplicity that everyone who reads it is a subscriber paying £36/year by direct debit, that's roughly 44000 readers, which is believable as a rough ballpark figure; though a fair bit down on the ABC from 15 years or so ago which was about 80000 IIRC, and represents a far smaller share of the player base as GW has grown a lot since then. (And the more people paying full price instead of a direct debit subscription, the fewer readers that implies). So I could understand them being unhappy with those sort of numbers.

Of course, to be clear, that's mixing revenue from White Dwarf sales against GW's profits - it's not really clear if that was the intention of that statement. But as stated, those numbers seem feasible.

The 36 qiud times 44,000 reader is turnover not profit
profit is turnover minus costs...

MiyamatoMusashi
10-01-2014, 09:00
Agreed, I am gobsmacked that, as a subscriber, I have not been made aware of forthcoming changes. GW obviously have a habit of keeping their cards close to their chest but if they intend to change my subscription and ESPECIALLY if they intend to charge me more for it I expect to be notified in plenty of time.

I feel it's worth injecting a hint of sanity into the conversation here.

If the rumours are accurate (as seems increasingly likely), you will be made aware of the forthcoming changes... on Saturday. It's not completely clear how long after that the new format starts, but your first awareness of the change won't be "welcome to our new magazine and by the way we've already charged you more for it!" It may only be a couple of weeks or a months' notice, but how long would you like to be told in advance? Is two months enough? Three? A year? Why?

In addition, there are rules (and indeed laws) about how companies have to handle this sort of thing. Nobody is going to find they've paid for a 12 month subscription, got one issue, then GW took their money and ran. Just as when Fanatic magazine ended, there will be refunds for those who have paid up front; if indeed ongoing subscriptions are moved from one to the other, there will be the option to cancel and increased charges will have to be authorised. GW may be many things, but they are not scammers.

While I am as cynical as the next man about the likely quality of the new magazine(s) - I quite clearly remember being told how great the "new" White Dwarf was going to be in October 2012, only to watch them go on a continuous run of the worst 16 issues in the magazine's long and celebrated history - and while I'm usually the last to defend GW when it comes to their price policy: it's worth remembering that nobody's going to get ripped off here.


The 36 qiud times 44,000 reader is turnover not profit
profit is turnover minus costs...

Yes. I know. I acknowledged that point in the final paragraph of the very post you quoted. Thanks though.

Herzlos
10-01-2014, 09:03
So wait.. they want to make it harder for new folks to find out about GW products. We sell two or three White Dwarf issues a month in a tiny village newsagents/shop and we are in the middle of no where. Seems blinkin mad to me, restricting the advertising mag of the company to their stores/gaming stores which aren't going to gain any more new custom than they already get themselves via passing trade does what exactly?

Yeah this part strikes me as pretty dumb. My local newsagents have always stocked a few WD's every month, and we're an hour by train away from the nearest GW. These weekly issues may provide an incentive to go into a GW or order from them, but in having to go to a gaming store in order to get the catalog is going to be a pain. Though it's maybe got something to do with the rumour of WH Smiths no longer stocking WD and they've decided to give up on the wider retail chain; essentially the only place left where non-gamers can stumble across their stuff, well played.


This^^^. I was shocked when I picked up a WD last year for the first time in years and found no diagrams in the Bat Rep. Greatly missed those, and the more detailed descriptions of, you know, THE BATTLE!

It's very hard to provide an in-depth battle report whilst trying to avoid discussing the rules directly, something they want you to pay to find out.

VaeVictisGames
10-01-2014, 09:16
This looks like more of re-branding than a cancellation. GW is still going to have a monthly gaming magazine. It's now going to be called Warhammer: Visions, keeping it in line with the names of GW's two supported games. White Dwarf is a name that means nothing to the GW of today, the name has no connection to their products.



Except GW have three supported games systems, and i can't help but wonder what Warners, MGM and the Tolkien Estate will think of GW excluding the SBG from this rumoured new monthly magazine.

I also can't help but be disappointed, if this rumour turns out to be true, that no fuss was made over what could have turned out to be the last issue of White Dwarf proper. No matter what you think of the magazine, it's been part of the hobby for a long time. You would think some mention would be made of it's era coming to a close.

RevEv
10-01-2014, 09:34
Having searched extensively for sources of this rumour is still goes back to just one source and lots of conjecture. I will wait out until tomorrow before getting really worried.

In defence of WD the magazine publishing industry is going through a huge change at the moment with paper magazines taking a tumble in sales as the digital market changes the way we purchase our media. Having subscribed to several that have failed to certain extents to provide a satisfactory reading experience. WD is by far the best by a very long way.

MiyamatoMusashi
10-01-2014, 09:40
I also can't help but be disappointed, if this rumour turns out to be true, that no fuss was made over what could have turned out to be the last issue of White Dwarf proper. No matter what you think of the magazine, it's been part of the hobby for a long time. You would think some mention would be made of it's era coming to a close.

Yeah, I have some great memories of White Dwarf. None of them - at all - come from the last 16 issues, or even the few years before that. So, yeah, White Dwarf is currently still here in name, but it's been dead in spirit for a long, long time. That's why no-one's lamenting its passing.

It's a bit like when dear old Great Aunt Doris finally shuffled off this mortal coil at the grand old age of 103. We loved her, but for the last three decades of her life she smelled of wee, and could barely remember her own name, never mind all the grandkids... she had a good innings, but her passing is probably for the best.

[edit] Oh, wait. You mean like January's White Dwarf should have been a final celebration issue? Yeah, fair enough, see what you're getting at. OTOH the issue 400 "celebration" was such a pathetic joke that again, it's probably for the best for them not to bother.

Binky
10-01-2014, 09:47
In regards to existing subscriptions I'd assume they'd just switch to the new monthly mag with no extra charge until they expired. My WD direct debut subscription has remained the same price (£9 for 3 issues) since I started it despite the magazine going up from £4.50 to £5.50 in that time.

quizmaster
10-01-2014, 09:49
White Dwarf in the last version is a failure. It's only a catalogue of new products, big pictures and the on going self praising of GW (we of we-say-so). I stopped buying it after mor than 20years!, because everything which is in the WD will be also on the GW site, so what is the use of spending 8euro's a month on an advertisement magazine. And sorry RevEV, there is no defence for making WD a useless bunch of glossy paper. And be real a weekly magazine that would be utterly stupid.. Greetings to you all Quizmaster

Lorcryst
10-01-2014, 10:23
I see that some people are still pushing their agendas of "the game is dead", "WD is an ad", and "the sky is falling" ...

A quick browse through my archives of White Dwarf (back to around issue 100 or so) reveals that back in the 80's, there were full page colour spreads of the latest models released that month, plus a couple of "Eavy Metal" pages showing the previous month's releases painted, plus full-page ads for new shops, and even some pages advertising the "metal rock bands" of the era ... and back then the magazine was maybe a fourth of the number of pages of the current ones.

All in all, I'd say that the ratio of ads vs articles is still roughly the same ... shocking isn't it ?

Also, I've never found Jervis or Mr Vetock articles on the website, and I searched ... same thing with the (admitedly rare) new scenarios for Warhammer/40K and a couple of more obscure articles about the painting/gaming efforts of the WD staff.

All this talk about "digital is the way forward, paper is dead, WD is trash, WFB is dying, 8% OMGWTFBLARGH" makes me wonder if I live in the same world ...

Jim30
10-01-2014, 10:57
I think we all look back to when we first purchased WD as a halycon days. I was looking through the tiny stash I have left the other day and was struck by how the much vaunted 'golden age' of 180 onwards and 'fat dwarf' was in fact a collection of articles that today we can get instantly via a world of blogs, FB, Warseer and other such sites. Its not that WD used to be particularly innovative (in fact it was just as much a catalogue 20 years ago as it is now), but that back then we had nowhere else to easily go for information that is now permanently at our fingertips.

Duke_of_Krondor
10-01-2014, 11:03
I'm no rumourmonger but I'm fairly certain (because pricing and distribution methods have been released to those who will need to know). Visions will be bigger but more expensive but weekly is only going to be available in store. White Dwarf recently took on an extra staff member who, effectively, is project managing their schedule - a clear indication of a pace change.

BUB
10-01-2014, 11:06
I think we all look back to when we first purchased WD as a halycon days. I was looking through the tiny stash I have left the other day and was struck by how the much vaunted 'golden age' of 180 onwards and 'fat dwarf' was in fact a collection of articles that today we can get instantly via a world of blogs, FB, Warseer and other such sites. Its not that WD used to be particularly innovative (in fact it was just as much a catalogue 20 years ago as it is now), but that back then we had nowhere else to easily go for information that is now permanently at our fingertips.

THIS a million times!

Before the internet, well before the internet became amazing I used to buy loads of mags every month.

Power Slam for my wrestling fix
Games TM and Edge for my gaming fix
Empire and Total Film for my film fix
White Dwarf, obviously.

That's about £25-£30 a month just on mags now I buy the occasional White Dwarf an that's it. Fact is magazines much like newspapers are just becoming less relevant as time goes on. It's good to see GW realise this and hopefully come out with something cool.

StraightSilver
10-01-2014, 11:08
Well I have a few thoughts on this but please bear in mind that this is conjecture, I have no facts to back it up.

Jes Bickham was brought in as editor of White Dwarf from SFX magazine. Guy Hayley was also from SFX, and both as I understand it were brought in to modernise the format and in turn increase sales.

Certainly the format has changed radically, and in my opinion the content is heading in the right direction, just isn't there yet. I tend to find the second half of the magazine a better read, the FW, BL and designer notes sections are quite interesting.

I have also noticed that they are trying to emulate Sci-Fi book reviews now, although this isn't objective as they are in-house reviews but tbh there have been a couple where they have critisised authors, and they are almost (almost) becoming actual reviews.

I think again this is the influence of Jes' SFX background.

In terms of the name change and increase in cost?

I think this is actually a drive to get it back into Newsagents. The reason it was pulled from places like WHSmiths is because they actually charge the publisher for shelf space, the more you pay the more premium position it gets on the shelf.

GW didn't want to pay this, and so pulled it from Smiths, sales dropped and other newsagents stopped stocking it as it wasn't selling, so it became a vicious circle.

Non-GW stores have lost confidence in the White Dwarf brand, and GW have realised that it not being easily available has dropped sales but also means they are not attracting new customers.

To get it into mainstream stores means another price rise to cover the extra cost of distribution and other costs, so they simply increase the page content. However colour page spreads cost more so they need to fill these pages with text, which means more articles, which can only be a good thing.

But I also now suspect that this new launch will mean that White Dwarf is no longer produced in-house in the same way. A lot of the new staff have come from external publishing backgrounds, rather than being ex-staffers or internal applicants and I wonder if that's why the name is changing.

I hope this can only be a good thing, a re-branding and re-launch of a failing magazine to get it back into shops and be the organ for GW. I don't mind paying more if I can buy it from my local newsagents and the content is improved.

However if it's just filler and i can only buy it from GW then I won't bother.

I am also very sceptical about a weekly magazine being published, I can't see GW investing in the costs involved unless it is digital only, but guess we'll find out saturday.

TheFang
10-01-2014, 11:57
Smiths have stocked WD again for a few years now.

Warhammer:Visions would seem to exclude LotR. Odd in view of the Hobbit licence.

There seems to be enough corroboration from shops and those who've viewed the order forms to say this is happening.

zoggin-eck
10-01-2014, 12:06
Rather than list what I think are the "golden ages" of WD (there's a thread for WD general), let me say I'm actually pretty interested to see what comes of this.

I have a big collection of WD issues, and wouldn't part with them, but I think anything new has to be a good thing. The "new format" White Dwarf has been a disappointment to me. As jaded as I thought I was, I'm surprised to think that I'd probably make the effort to pop into a store once a week if the content is enough. If GW can pull it off and make a weekly magazine interesting enough I'll be thrilled. If they can look back and take the best bits from White Dwarf's history and put it into one magazine It'd be sweet. Even just one decent scenario, background piece or report each week. If they end up with one weekly and one monthly glossy catalogue, I'll be pretty sad.

If it's worth the "price of a pot of paint" this magazine may well go back to the "I'm having lunch/coffee out today, how about I pick up WD instead of the paper" type product that it hasn't been to me for years.

One thing though, for people who like to collect things (and yeah, this is kind of the hobby for people like that) is the fact that an issue every week over the course of a year will result in a huge number of issues to hang on to! I guess it'll be like people keeping tons of comics. Could get out of hand pretty quick :)

My main fear is how much effort anyone would be willing to put into a weekly publication. It could easily be the same kind of non-effort put into the website's "Daily" edition.

StraightSilver
10-01-2014, 12:08
That's weird, no Smiths in SE London stock it and when I asked the magazine buyer recently he said that none of their stores stocked it any more. Fair enough, might just be because SE London is rubbish... :)

Poncho160
10-01-2014, 12:23
It may sound weird, but I suspect that many people would prefer to buy a £3 magazine once a week, rather than a £5.50 magazine once a month.

£5.50 is rather a lot for a magazine, so people may perceive that a £3 mag is better value than a £5.50 one, even though it's on sale once a week rather than once a month.

Lorcryst
10-01-2014, 12:23
I'm thinking more about it, and I've stumbled on a personnal problem : I'm subscribed to the english version of White Dwarf (and buy my rulebooks in english too) even while I'm in the french-speaking part of Belgium because : a)it allows me to practice my English languague skills, b) it's easier to know the terms in english to be able to discuss them on the Internet, and c) I still remember the "horrors of translation" from ages back (like the infamous Ogryns and Ratlings stat lines switcheroo of the 2nd Ed IG Codex in french ... Ogryns with BS4 and S2 were bad enough, but Snipers with BS2 were a sad joke).

If that new "weekly" mini White Dwarf is only availble in GW Stores, that means I won't be able to have it in English ... cue sad panda face.

I'm not too fussed about newsagents carrying the White Dwarf or his new siblings, because in Belgium it was never the case anyway ... back in the mists of time before the internationnal versions of the magazine, the ONLY way to get it was by subscription, and before Internet websites, it was also the ONLY way to be able to order bitz and models : be subscribed to WD and use the order form at the back of it.

I hope that if this is true, the subscription fee will cover both the weekly and monthly new magazines, even if it is more expensive ... as I said a bit higher in this thread, I still like the content of the magazine, and the price is relatively less steep than daily papers, weekly TV programs or a tablet for digital versions (that are the same price as paper versions anyway).

Jim30
10-01-2014, 13:02
Straight silver - I live in SE London and found either Lewisham Smiths used to do it, or I used Victoria railway station. The smiths in Oxford St does it, along with most other gaming magazines.

Brother Vaneb
10-01-2014, 13:03
WD in second edition and 3rd edition I maintained it into 4th and lost interest the battle reports and stories were what made it for me. Detailed battle reports.

Herzlos
10-01-2014, 13:07
That's weird, no Smiths in SE London stock it and when I asked the magazine buyer recently he said that none of their stores stocked it any more. Fair enough, might just be because SE London is rubbish... :)

The Smiths in Scotland all seem to stock them, as recently as the last fortnight (when I was in one last), but in some the prime spot has been given over to Wargames Illustrated.

RevEv
10-01-2014, 13:31
White Dwarf in the last version is a failure. It's only a catalogue of new products, big pictures and the on going self praising of GW (we of we-say-so). I stopped buying it after mor than 20years!, because everything which is in the WD will be also on the GW site, so what is the use of spending 8euro's a month on an advertisement magazine. And sorry RevEV, there is no defence for making WD a useless bunch of glossy paper. And be real a weekly magazine that would be utterly stupid.. Greetings to you all Quizmaster

I don't believe I was defending the paper version! If you read carefully you'll see I'm praising the digital version that is an excellent example of how to use digital technology to its best advantage, second only to The Times.

There is a distinct possibility that, if this rumour is true (and I still have my doubts), I will make the leap to subscribe digitally if the new mags are worth it. Saying that it is very useful to have a hard copy as I am not always in reach of a secure, reliable internet connection.

We all take WD for different reasons. I personally get bored by the battle reports but love looking at the miniatures and reading of new techniques to paint my miniatures. It is also intriguing to read of what other hobbies to are doing, Blanchitsu has been superb for that recently. WD is also a darn sight better now than the June 2006 edition which I managed to read in its entirety between ordering a pizza at a restaurant and it arriving and never picked up again... now that was a catalogue and a low point!

Oh, and as for cost Poncho160, check the prices of similar mags in store. They may appear cheaper but there will be less relevant content and more adverts!

TheFang
10-01-2014, 15:06
That's weird, no Smiths in SE London stock it and when I asked the magazine buyer recently he said that none of their stores stocked it any more. Fair enough, might just be because SE London is rubbish... :)

Every Smiths I've been in in North west England/North Wales has had it in. Might be hard to find because of the horrible shop layout but they've been there.

Herzlos
10-01-2014, 15:28
Oh, and as for cost Poncho160, check the prices of similar mags in store. They may appear cheaper but there will be less relevant content and more adverts!

Of all other wargaming magazines such as "Wargames Illustrated", "Wargames, Soldiers & Strategy", "Miniature Wargaming", White Dwarf is by far the worst; it's the most expensive (the rest are under £4.50), has the least content, and has the most obvious sales pitch.

I suspect it still doesn't fare too well when you compare it to hobby magazines like "Military Modelling", or console gaming magazines.

Jobu
10-01-2014, 15:48
I am sorry sir, you must be mistaken. As an avid SBG fan I can tell you that there are only two supported games systems.
I often wonder what MGM or WB think of the effort that GW puts into The Hobbit. With LoTR there was a dedicated magazine as well as a lot of support and in turn, sales of product.
While it is purely anecdotal, IMHO the Hobbit is selling very poorly. So much so that some of the distributors have stooped stocking it and I can not get it from my FLGS.
This weekly format iseems to be some kind of panacea for a limited time, to support the hobbit and help push WFB sales back up. Then once the WB/MGM contract is done there will be no more white dwarf.
Or maybe I am just a bitter old man.

RevEv
10-01-2014, 15:50
Ahh, but how many of the articles have a direct correlation to the games you actually play?

I've looked at all of these magazines and still consider WD better value for money and more worthy to be kept beyond bin day (recycling bin of course)!

Morquentas
10-01-2014, 16:03
I think we all look back to when we first purchased WD as a halycon days. I was looking through the tiny stash I have left the other day and was struck by how the much vaunted 'golden age' of 180 onwards and 'fat dwarf' was in fact a collection of articles that today we can get instantly via a world of blogs, FB, Warseer and other such sites. Its not that WD used to be particularly innovative (in fact it was just as much a catalogue 20 years ago as it is now), but that back then we had nowhere else to easily go for information that is now permanently at our fingertips.

Absolutely. And they were, based on what else was available, Necromunda battle reports being a particular highlight. Seeing White Dwarf go is a wrench but I refuse to bow to nostalgia when the product is simply rubbish and available largely for free. And the fact is that if, back then we could have watched a battle report live, read a hobby blog about a slow-grow tournament and countless other bits of written content we wouldn't have bothered spending money on the magazine.

GW could do all of this, and do it really well, partly by guaranteeing a certain level of quality and polish, but also because the one thing you still can't seem to find that's fan-written (at least as far as I can tell) are decent playtested rules and scenarios.

Verm1s
10-01-2014, 17:19
Ahh, but how many of the articles have a direct correlation to the games you actually play?

I've looked at all of these magazines and still consider WD better value for money and more worthy to be kept beyond bin day (recycling bin of course)!

Do you really get historical gamers?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JzhmuEIbu8Q/UAyFfSjU2eI/AAAAAAAAEGg/p2qaYLMxGAU/s1600/Leadhead+Storage.jpg

http://www.fanaticus.org/DBA/fun/Leadhead/larryc33.gif

http://www.erichotz.com/images/larry07.gif

I get WSS and love it far more than I do White Dwarf (which is, admittedly, not a stretch for WSS), though I might not play most of the periods and games in each issue.
The difference between GW fanboys and other gamers is that other gamers will at least deign to cast a sideways glance at other rules and settings. (Not so much of this 'get LotR out of my magazine!' cobblers that I've seen for the past ten years or so) And because most of 'em aren't GW, it's a wee bit more economical to diversify. ;)

Sophet Drahas
10-01-2014, 18:28
If the new monthly mag can come close to what Rackham was providing in the initial releases of it Cry Havoc! quarterly magazine then I'll wait with baited breath. The modeling and painting articles in those were fantastic and I still have my copies as they're great reference material when building tiles or terrain.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

Autumn Leaves
10-01-2014, 18:44
I get WSS and love it far more than I do White Dwarf (which is, admittedly, not a stretch for WSS), though I might not play most of the periods and games in each issue.
The difference between GW fanboys and other gamers is that other gamers will at least deign to cast a sideways glance at other rules and settings. (Not so much of this 'get LotR out of my magazine!' cobblers that I've seen for the past ten years or so) And because most of 'em aren't GW, it's a wee bit more economical to diversify. ;)

Thats a very fair call.
I haven't purchased WD since … I don't know when. I've read a store copy every now and then but nothing has interested me enough for a loooong time to buy a copy.
I get two bi-monthly mags from a Dutch crowd called Karawansaray publishing, they were at Salute last year, the mags are excellent quality and crammed full of interesting historical battles and supporting articles.
Ancient Warfare and Medieval Warfare. Really good quality productions.Very little sales and advertising.

http://www.karwansaraypublishers.com/cms/karwansaray/ancient-warfare.html

http://www.karwansaraypublishers.com/cms/karwansaray/medieval-warfare.html

If White Dwarf had quality content I'd still be a subscriber.

Ohman
10-01-2014, 19:09
Kroothawk over at Dakka is reporting the following:


Some more info retailers got:
1.) Weekly keeps the White Dwarf name. It features the new products of the Saturday NEXT week. The editorial part (what we called content in the 90s) goes into this White Dwarf. GW (store and website) and retailers only, no subscribtion.
2.) Warhammer Visions is indeed mainly photos with short descriptions in 3 (!) languages and no editorial content like columns. Size is smaller, but more pages. Unknown if Hobbit content is included.

Daniel36
10-01-2014, 19:16
I agree, i was a fan of the Fat Bloke era. I'm just disputing the idea that complaints against White Dwarf are a new thing. The exact same charges were levelled against the magazine when Fat Bloke was around, and his predecessors. Give it a decade and i've little doubt there will be posts on Holo-Warseer about how great it was when Jes was in charge, and how White Dwarf 3D is a terrible e-magazine.
You are begging to be sigged!!

But I don't want to fill up my sig...

Still, that post was hillarious.

However, I highly doubt people will look back at the current White Dwarf era in due time and wax nostalgic.

An'farli
10-01-2014, 19:28
I am assuming that when the announcement is made that people who currently have a subscription will get an email of some sort to inform us of what is happening with these subscriptions.

Ludaman
10-01-2014, 19:46
This is just a thought, but if they do make the new white dwarf announcement in February, it may be in place of the February release spot and the reason why dwarves are rumored in March by some (40k radio)

Poncho160
10-01-2014, 19:50
Is the rumour that news will be announced this weekend?

Would GW do this on a army release weekend?

Inquisitor Kallus
10-01-2014, 20:06
Is the rumour that news will be announced this weekend?

Would GW do this on a army release weekend?

There's a first time for everything....

soviet
11-01-2014, 00:49
The only parts of the current White Dwarf that I enjoy are Blanchitsu, the pictures of non studio models, the hall of fame nominations, and the designers notes. Would all of these go into the monthly Visions magazine? Mainly I'm wondering about the design notes but I suspect they will scrap them rather than put them in their weekly catalogue for the kiddies who live in the stores.

Shibboleth
11-01-2014, 05:16
Yep, designer's notes were the best part of the current form. Hearing Jes Goodwyn's thoughts on why he made things a certain way was helpful when converting the models too.

Azazyll
11-01-2014, 08:18
Hopefully they don't mess up as terribly as WotC did with the digitization of Dragon and Dungeon magazines with 4th ed. That was a fiasco for the company.

And the best era of WD for me was Codex Astartes. Once I realized those were over, I canceled my subscription.

VaeVictisGames
11-01-2014, 08:25
Is the rumour that news will be announced this weekend?

Would GW do this on a army release weekend?

Well the daily update on the website is up, about Tyrannic War Veterans and tickets on sale. Nothing about magazine changes. So if it is being announced, it's probably not going to be today.

RevEv
11-01-2014, 09:17
Another fail from Faelt!

EDIT - apologies to Faelt for doubting him. Had confirmed today by my local GW manager what others are reporting later on in this thread.

Rather interestingly the monthly magazine is to be freed from the shackles of just reporting on latest releases and trying to fit the latest releases in to hobby articles. Instead, in my sources words, 'It will be more like a modelling magazine'.

Full staff briefing on Wednesday apparently.

Karak Norn Clansman
11-01-2014, 09:28
It's likely poor performance due to GW website and lack of content which has lead to this. Mostly lack of content.

Had the quality of White Dwarf continued to be at the level it was during Fat Bloke's editorship I'd have been subscribed for several years now. Instead I almost never buy a White Dwarf, and I'm not unique in this regard. I guess you don't want the money, dear Games Workshop, nor the indirect and unexpected spendings which are caused by WD's best articles.

One expects some content in a magazine to make it more than worth its value for the customer.


Yeah. I will believe the greater "hobby" focus when i see it. The company pitch from GW is: Collect our models.

I expect nothing positive, but yet more blingy overpriced contentless garbage.

I'd hold my bet on this as well. They'll have to surprise us positively to regain trust in their magazine.

stahly
11-01-2014, 11:09
Seems like GW Helsinki spread the news too early:


Stop press, we have a new format of White Dwarf incoming!

Starting February 1st. White Dwarf will appear weekly. Within it's 32 pages you'll find everything you need to know about all the week’s other new releases and latest hobby news.

You’ll also find new features, new modelling and painting techniques, new rules, new columnists and much more. All of this will be available, for the price of a paint pot!

Alongside the the new White Dwarf, we'll have a brand new magazine; Warhammer: Visions. Warhammer: Visions contains all your favourite sections from the old monthly White Dwarf – from Army of the Month and Blanchitsu, to Kit Bash and Paint Splatter. This 232 page tome will be available on the first Saturday of every month, for only 9€!

For those of you with subcriptions to the old White Dwarf, fear not, you will still be able to use them monthly. We'll have more information on the subscriptions for you on Thursday, so check back with us to find out how the new system will work.

Source (https://www.facebook.com/GWHelsinki?fref=ts)

ntw3001
11-01-2014, 11:22
Hopefully they don't mess up as terribly as WotC did with the digitization of Dragon and Dungeon magazines with 4th ed. That was a fiasco for the company.

Wizards have, on the other hand, had a lot of success with their online content for Magic: the Gathering. While Magic and GW's games are scarcely analogous, I do rather wish GW would take a few pointers. Maybe being bought by Hasbro led to an improvement in marketing. Or maybe the people creating Magic just take more care and have more in-depth decisions to discuss (probably both). Either way, it's a separate topic.

Daniel36
11-01-2014, 11:59
A weekly magazine... for the price of a paint pot... Well, if you put it that way... It is more expensive than what White Dwarf costs now.

New rules though...

I'll believe it when I see it. They seriously royally **** me off right now... They could've included new rules and whatnot in the White Dwarf as it stands now.
I wonder how many of those 32 pages are devoted to the invalubale store finder. Weird though, the current iteration only lasted for a couple of months, really...

The bearded one
11-01-2014, 12:46
From what I've heard from my manager is that the weekly WD will mostly be devoted to the releases of that week, and the monthly one will be the "hobby content" one, and quite a bit thicker than the current WD without even doing all the release info. The weekly ones apparently will also 'sneak peak' what is coming next week.

The benefit of essentially having WD split into 5 bits rather than 1, is that you can pick the bits you want. Don't give a damn about what the new releases are, then you can skip the weekly ones. Cynical about hobby content? Skip it.

A point of note is that releases seem to be going to a weekly format, rather than the monthly one we have now. And by being weekly, they are supposedly switching up a lot and throwing in various things in a month, so we'd get new waves of different armies/systems in a single month, released on a week-by-week basis, rather than.. say.. having a wave of releases all from 1 new army at the start of each month, and then having to wait 4 weeks before there is a new release.

Fable
11-01-2014, 12:48
Rules, eh?

zoggin-eck
11-01-2014, 13:32
Oh please just put something good into it (OK, into both) and I'll buy it. If not, then I'll have two magazines not to buy :)

Spider-pope
11-01-2014, 14:07
Seems like GW Helsinki spread the news too early:



Source (https://www.facebook.com/GWHelsinki?fref=ts)

So that's 4 x £2.50 for the Weekly, roughly £7 for the monthly. At three times the current cost of White Dwarf, if they want these new magazines to sell they really are going to have to up the quality of the content. I didn't mind paying £5.50 for what i got out of White Dwarf the last couple of years, but there's no way i'm paying £17 a month.

Poncho160
11-01-2014, 14:40
32 pages for £2.50, 4 times a month? wonder if people will perceive this as better value than a one off payment of £5.50?

Do we know if this is for sale in the likes of Smiths ect or just in GW? Will it be digital?

Jobu
11-01-2014, 15:32
So where will each magazine be available? There is no GW here, only FLGS.

VaeVictisGames
11-01-2014, 15:53
So where will each magazine be available? There is no GW here, only FLGS.

A couple of people have said it'll be in GW stores and retailers, so your FLGS should be able to stock at least one of them. But it does look like the days of being to pick up a GW magazine in WH Smiths or Asda (Walmart) are over.

Coldhatred
11-01-2014, 17:02
32 pages for £2.50, 4 times a month? wonder if people will perceive this as better value than a one off payment of £5.50?

Do we know if this is for sale in the likes of Smiths ect or just in GW? Will it be digital?

32 pages? I was hoping for a bit more than that. But if it's chock full of good articles it will be fine with me.

The bearded one
11-01-2014, 17:23
32 pages? I was hoping for a bit more than that. But if it's chock full of good articles it will be fine with me.

It most likely won't be full of articles.

The weekly format will primarily be about that week's releases. Pictures of the new miniatures and stuff, and possibly sneak peaks of what will come the week after. This will be a weekly advertisement booklet, basically, but rather than having always had the first 50-100 pages of every mont's WD devoted to new releases, you can now opt not to have to buy that by skipping these weekly WDs. What GW Helsinki's facebook post on it about 'new rules, new techniques' etc. means is probably things like new rulebook releases, new types of technical paints, etc. 32 pages isn't much room for much more than that week's releases after all.

The monthly WD will have most of the articles and hobby content.



And it seems noone yet picked up what I wrote earlier; our manager told us about the new WD format already as well, and he noted that releases will now be spaced out on a week-by-week basis, rather than 1 wave of releases every month. It also meant months wont always be entirely dedicated to a single army's releases, such as "january: Tyranids!" But that there will be releases from different armies/systems in different weeks.

Autumn Leaves
11-01-2014, 18:23
What exactly does GW release on a weekly schedule?
I can't think of much fodder for the weekly mag regarding new releases.
Surely it will be articles over new release material.
Plenty of catalogue material to fill up the pages.

Poncho160
11-01-2014, 18:45
In guessing the 32 page WD could be along the format of, "This week we are releasing the new Plastic empire knight set and the new plastic eldar aspect warrior kit".

The magazine would then contain the following:

Pages showing this week main releases along with any other minor releases (such as BL, scenery, dataslate releases)
Specific articles on this month main releases (tactics, how to paint ect)
A sneek peak of next week release.

With only 32 pages there won't be much more than that.

VaeVictisGames
11-01-2014, 18:50
What exactly does GW release on a weekly schedule?
I can't think of much fodder for the weekly mag regarding new releases.
Surely it will be articles over new release material.
Plenty of catalogue material to fill up the pages.

I heard they release 8% of their products on a weekly schedule.

The release schedule looks like it's changing from a single monthly release, to multiple releases a month. If thats the case, there is plenty to stick in a 32 page pamphlet.

Darnok
11-01-2014, 18:57
In guessing the 32 page WD could be along the format of, "This week we are releasing the new Plastic empire knight set and the new plastic eldar aspect warrior kit".

The magazine would then contain the following:

Pages showing this week main releases along with any other minor releases (such as BL, scenery, dataslate releases)
Specific articles on this month main releases (tactics, how to paint ect)
A sneek peak of next week release.

With only 32 pages there won't be much more than that.

Maybe add the odd scenario every now and then, fitting for that weeks release(s), and I could see this new format becoming a success. One of the major complaints about WD through all its years was "the article about X was nice, but I couldn't care less about Y and Z". With the lower price and a focus on one or maybe two releases, this should not happen any more - if you are interested in a release, you can get more information about it, just without other things that might not bother you. And I can see people paying for this.

But only time will tell...

Avian
11-01-2014, 19:45
They could throw in dataslates that improve that week's releases.

Win - win (or a loss for game balance...)

Brother Haephestus
11-01-2014, 19:56
Call me a booger-butt but I just don't see how splitting what has become largely a sales rag into pieces is really going to increase sales/quality. The work needed to fix the problems is not format-dependant. Also, taking a magazine and splitting it in half is creating a competing product. What happens when 'Visions' no longer has the sales numbers to support itself?

I also think increased tempo is going to create a sort of 'exhasted' response in the long run. Getting to the FLGS once a month to get magazine is fine. Getting there every week is going to transition to becoming a chore, and that's not good.

Truth be told, we're just going to have to wait and see how things pan out. It will be interesting, to say the least. I personally am hoping we will see more of those delicious plastics, like Nurgle Chaos Lord, Cairn Wraith, Saurus Oldblood, etc. A monthly release is DEMANDED! Nao!!!

Orrinocco
11-01-2014, 22:02
Agreed, I am gobsmacked that, as a subscriber, I have not been made aware of forthcoming changes. GW obviously have a habit of keeping their cards close to their chest but if they intend to change my subscription and ESPECIALLY if they intend to charge me more for it I expect to be notified in plenty of time.

THis is just what I was going to say. I thought as a pre-paid customer, I was legally entitled to be informed of any changes to my contract.
Do we have any real lawyers (not just people who say they are) who know some detail on this?

zoggin-eck
11-01-2014, 22:10
What I'm annoyed at is the assumption that everyone is willing or able to buy something from them every single week. If there really is something useful in the weekly version, you'll only have seven days to go out and buy it? Perhaps stores will hold on to back issues like they used to? When I was much younger, taking the train to the nearest store was a treat/effort/expense and something I could only manage every month or so. Older, I can't see myself pulling in to a GW store on the way home from work every week (which would be uncomfortable enough since it'd be all I ever buy from there). Especially for a couple of dollars magazine. Clearly they'd love every customer to come in and buy something every single week, but this seems a little hopeful. I don't even need to go grocery shopping every week :)

I guess we'll know in less than a month anyway. I still think that a hobby magazine can be relevant these days (plus it's nice occasionally to have a break from reading terms like "army build", "army tiers"or variations of "alot/allot", usually in caps). so I wish them well and hope it's better than what they've sold the last couple of years. At the least I will check them out next month.

Chivs
11-01-2014, 22:11
I'm not a fan of rules* appearing in White Dwarf in it''s previous state, and am now even more concerned if they'll make a reappearance in a new weekly format.

I'll clarify: by rules I mean anything compulsory, which includes unit stats (Like the Dakka Jet and Storm Talon) or Codices (like Sisters of Battle). It makes purchasing White Dwarf compulsory to use those units/armies, and there's already enough compulsory purchases needed to play the game. And should a player not get that issue, or possibly start the game after publication, then they miss out. When these were then released in pdf format it was fine, but that stopped. Games Workshop have now started releasing dataslates which has mitigated this somewhat, or in overpriced compendiums like Death from the Skies, but it's still costly when a codex should be enough.

If these are now coming out weekly, then the cost is potentially continuing to rise, but there is further chance of missing an issue. You only have 1 week to discover what is in the issue, and make your way to a store to purchase it. Even more chance of missing out on something needed.

Optional rules are fair, or extra scenarios and missions, and I'd welcome their return, but I'll retain my discomfort with compulsory rules appearing in what should be an optional, and now possibly harder to obtain, magazine.

This opinion usually leads to a load of "GW just can't win posts".

AlexHolker
11-01-2014, 23:03
The benefit of essentially having WD split into 5 bits rather than 1, is that you can pick the bits you want. Don't give a damn about what the new releases are, then you can skip the weekly ones. Cynical about hobby content? Skip it.
Except that it would be cheaper to buy the old White Dwarf and throw away the bits you don't want than to buy the bits of the new White Dwarf you want.

Darnok
11-01-2014, 23:06
Except that it would be cheaper to buy the old White Dwarf and throw away the bits you don't want than to buy the bits of the new White Dwarf you want.

Only if you want them all.

Kijamon
11-01-2014, 23:51
Hopefully they put the rules for new minis in the box of the kit and not in the magazine.

It certainly seems like we might get occasional new codex releases this way. Or they'll go back to revisit other stuff.

Torga_DW
12-01-2014, 00:07
assuming the rumour is true (grain of salt, drop of lemon, take the shot), i surmise the following:


1 - rather than setup digital to complement hardcopy, they've instead set it up to compete with it. Digital was the perfect opportunity to release annual 'chapter approved' and what-nots without the publishing costs. Last time i checked, printers use pdf format anyways. Now that one has emerged the winner (okay kids fight for my love, the winner gets a christmas present) they can justify scrapping/revising the other. But then this is the problem with promoting their products as a game with rules and then making those rules the very last priority on their worklist. Changing this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPPj6viIBmU into this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJsikWXgbO8 will only take you so far.

2 - this suggests some form of internal 'something' is going on. Note the restructuring of the 'vets' on the team. Perhaps 'totally changing' white dwarf a year or two ago (which they really didn't) was needed to justify this change? Also remember 2017 is getting closer and closer.

3 - Profits and/or income are not what gw would prefer them to be, either gw as a whole or white dwarf itself - if it ain't broke, don't fix it. If white dwarf was the formula for success, they wouldn't be changing it (twice in 2 years?).

4 - the dedicated 'hobby content' plan is amusing, as it goes back to the whole writers are usually the cheapest part of production. Requires price increase on the magazine for this, right?


Small prediction - the new magazines will see a shake-up in a year or two after launch (cancellation or major revision of one or both). All assuming the change is true, of course.

Kijamon
12-01-2014, 00:16
There is no "assume the rumour is true" the GW staffers are all talking about it and posting about it on FB.

Danny76
12-01-2014, 00:17
THis is just what I was going to say. I thought as a pre-paid customer, I was legally entitled to be informed of any changes to my contract.
Do we have any real lawyers (not just people who say they are) who know some detail on this?

Basically what they can do is announce the change before the next issue, giving enough time for those who wish to cancel, then any who don't they will assume they want to continue on (this you see with these monthly free trial places. Don't act and it becomes the regular price etc).
Obviously what they can, but don't have to do, is give you an issue of the new one at old prices if it is going up in cost, to see what you think.

But if you've paid for the next 3 issues and cancel during the change over after one or two issues only, you'd have to be refunded the final as it's a whole new magazine in effect - as opposed to a new format of the same magazine.
Hope this helps

Spiney Norman
12-01-2014, 00:22
So that's 4 x £2.50 for the Weekly, roughly £7 for the monthly. At three times the current cost of White Dwarf, if they want these new magazines to sell they really are going to have to up the quality of the content. I didn't mind paying £5.50 for what i got out of White Dwarf the last couple of years, but there's no way i'm paying £17 a month.

Indeed, I've somehow got away with only paying £3 an issue for WD because I took out a rolling subscription of £9 a quarter something like two years ago. I've been expecting them to notify me that they were increasing it ever since the price of the mag jumped to £5.50 but they never did, £7 is indeed going to be pretty hard to swallow so we'll see what happens to the subscriptions that are already going.


It most likely won't be full of articles.

The weekly format will primarily be about that week's releases. Pictures of the new miniatures and stuff, and possibly sneak peaks of what will come the week after. This will be a weekly advertisement booklet, basically, but rather than having always had the first 50-100 pages of every mont's WD devoted to new releases, you can now opt not to have to buy that by skipping these weekly WDs. What GW Helsinki's facebook post on it about 'new rules, new techniques' etc. means is probably things like new rulebook releases, new types of technical paints, etc. 32 pages isn't much room for much more than that week's releases after all.

The monthly WD will have most of the articles and hobby content.



And it seems noone yet picked up what I wrote earlier; our manager told us about the new WD format already as well, and he noted that releases will now be spaced out on a week-by-week basis, rather than 1 wave of releases every month. It also meant months wont always be entirely dedicated to a single army's releases, such as "january: Tyranids!" But that there will be releases from different armies/systems in different weeks.

Sorry but, "the week's releases"?

Are we going to be getting releases every week now not just every month? It seems mad that they are going to try and coordinate a global release of models and magazine every single week. I guess I will just get the weekly thingy from my local Indy stockist if and when they are releasing something I want...

The bearded one
12-01-2014, 00:25
Sorry but, "the week's releases"?

That's what the manager said, yes.

Torga_DW
12-01-2014, 00:29
There is no "assume the rumour is true" the GW staffers are all talking about it and posting about it on FB.

It most likely is true. But then the staffers denied space hulk 3rd edition was about to come out right up until it came out. They even went as far as having shirts made. Grain of salt, drop of lemon, take the shot.

The bearded one
12-01-2014, 00:32
It most likely is true. But then the staffers denied space hulk 3rd edition was about to come out right up until it came out. They even went as far as having shirts made. Grain of salt, drop of lemon, take the shot.

Denying something new is about to come it and then having it come out after all is different from announcing something "exciting" is about to happen, and then it doesn't happen. In our GW the staff paused the gaming for a couple minutes to hold an "official announcement", detailing all the different changes to WD, and those details are just like those posted on for example Helsinki's facebook.

Torga_DW
12-01-2014, 00:35
Denying something new is about to come it and then having it come out after all is different from announcing something "exciting" is about to happen, and then it doesn't happen. In our GW the staff paused the gaming for a couple minutes to hold an "official announcement", detailing all the different changes to WD, and those details are just like those posted on for example Helsinki's facebook.

Depends on your definition of 'exciting'.

The bearded one
12-01-2014, 00:36
That's why I put it in apostrophes.

Verm1s
12-01-2014, 01:35
But then the staffers denied space hulk 3rd edition was about to come out right up until it came out. They even went as far as having shirts made.

They... had shirts made to... deny the release...?

Shibboleth
12-01-2014, 02:37
2 - this suggests some form of internal 'something' is going on. Note the restructuring of the 'vets' on the team. Perhaps 'totally changing' white dwarf a year or two ago (which they really didn't) was needed to justify this change? Also remember 2017 is getting closer and closer.
2017? 2017! Thanks for reminding me!
Can you believe I nearly forgot about 2017? OMG!

Brother Haephestus
12-01-2014, 02:39
2 - this suggests some form of internal 'something' is going on. Note the restructuring of the 'vets' on the team. Perhaps 'totally changing' white dwarf a year or two ago (which they really didn't) was needed to justify this change? Also remember 2017 is getting closer.

2017? Whay am I missing here?

Torga_DW
12-01-2014, 02:54
@ verm1s:
Trying to find info/pics on the shirts still, warseer a bit slow at the moment and google a lot to sift through. Was the games day right before space hulk was released iirc if anyone else wants to search, i was only hoping to be on here for a minute will look later.

@shibboleth:
you're welcome :)

@ haephestus:
its a bit off topic, but basically the 10 year plan to make/replace all senior appointments with internally trained staff. When combined with kirby's 'retirement' it may be related to whats going on with white dwarf.

Still, grain of salt.

Danny76
12-01-2014, 02:54
Is it a white dwarf or warhammer/40k anniversary 2017?
Well White Dwarf wouldn't matter if it's that, as we won't even see that for nearly all of 2014, let alone onwards

zoggin-eck
12-01-2014, 03:18
(White Dwarf would turn 40 in 2017 for those who can't count :angel:)

RevEv
12-01-2014, 13:42
There was no denial involved when I had the rumour confirmed by my local store manager - he volunteered the information to me and then we had a short talk about what it would mean from the information he has, so far, been given. We would have talked longer but the store was busy... (yes, a GW store that is busy).

If the monthly magazine is as reported I am looking forward to the change!

ihavetoomuchminis
12-01-2014, 14:23
Weekly releases? so instead of releasing 4 boxes once a month, they will release 1 box once a week, and do a 2,5 pounds mag full of pictures we can see in the interwebz. Right.

Minimuggs
12-01-2014, 15:23
Would be a shame if it goes but it hasn't been that great for a while now...

@allmyownbattles
12-01-2014, 15:46
The weekly one will be the front section of the current White Dwarf: the adverts. And the monthly one will be glossy pictures of what came out over the past few months. When they say 'hobby', they mean, "Look what we painted. You can too." If WD has had no proper hobby content because they make no money from it, it won't suddenly start turning a profit under a different name.

I feel they may simply be cutting the existing mag in half to reduce leaks by increasing the rate of releases and up profit by increasing the volume of releases/publications.

williamsond
12-01-2014, 16:59
I'm not full of confidence but as some one said a while back "WD cant get any worse" I really hope that warhammer visions turns out to be a good mag, but I'm not holding my breath.

Cochrane
12-01-2014, 19:28
Sorry for the long off topic post, but a few people mentioned this.

It was the Battle of Grimdal's Barrow I think. It was my first ever white dwarf and I have most of them since that time. The dwarves were trying to get some long lost runic items from the barrow and some bretonnians (and a wood elf) found them at the barrow following a treacherous kislev scout betraying them. They were attacked and some of the dwarves performed a holding action whilst some slayers and a hero entered the barrow, killed a troll (yeah I know troll slayers killing trolls who knew!!!) and skeletons. By the time they get out the rest of the dwarves were dead. The knights charged, which could have been prevented if the hero hadn't left the anti-charge magic item in the barrow so he could pick up the magic warhammer, and most of the slayers were killed, but not before the dwarf hero hammered a previously left dragon tooth in the bretonnian heros skull, grieviously wounding him. The dwarfs retreated (to gain breath, not falling back) into the barrow. The Bret lord challenged his loyal knights to enter the barrow and he offered the hand of his daughter, a sorceress in the battle, to the knight who brought him the magic warhammer. She didn't like that and cast a spell sealing the barrow and the last heard of the dwarfs was the banging of stone from within the barrow.

It was narrative battle reporting at it's finest and I highly recommend picking that wd up just for the report. That's probably why I got hooked in the hobby and the latest battle reps do not compare. If the new magazine moves in that direction it gets a thumbs up from me. It probably won't tho.

shelfunit.
13-01-2014, 03:51
32 page booklets for £2.50 a week I can see easily - people already pay £5.50 for 150 pages of adverts a month, why not £10 for 128 pages of them. The 232 page monthly thing though, what is that all about? Is this a new ad free version of WD, or will it basically contain the same as the ad booklets + the normal "content"?

The bearded one
13-01-2014, 04:05
One of the weekly booklets will come out almost at the same time as 'Warhammer Visions' each month, so I doubt that. It'll have articles like blanchitsu, army of the month etc. most likely.

shelfunit.
13-01-2014, 05:27
One of the weekly booklets will come out almost at the same time as 'Warhammer Visions' each month, so I doubt that. It'll have articles like blanchitsu, army of the month etc. most likely.

So what will they use to fill the other 220ish pages? Half of it (at least) is going to be pure adverts, and the only things they will have to advertise are the things that will be out that month.

Melkanador
13-01-2014, 05:41
Maybe the weekly ones advertise for this/next week´s release and the monthly ones advertise everything else? ;)

Daniel36
13-01-2014, 08:40
A more detailed store finder, probably.

Herzlos
13-01-2014, 08:54
It's likely to be huge collections of photos we've seen before. Think Golden Demon and Army Showcases, taken to extreme.

The bearded one
13-01-2014, 09:46
The snarky cynicism is very innovative, I would not have expected that in GW general ;)


So what will they use to fill the other 220ish pages? Half of it (at least) is going to be pure adverts, and the only things they will have to advertise are the things that will be out that month.

I meant things like blanchitsu, army of the month and golden demon showcases would go into 'Visions' (that's what the monthly one is called). Maybe they'll make up more of those kinds of articles, or put in more battle reports, or make an effort to create more new content and articles, rather than only transplanting the already existing ones. What the manager did say was that Visions would have a lot of photographs :o

But we don't know about what they'll do with adverts. Considering the weekly WDs are practically specifically intended to showcase/advertise the new releases from each week, Visions shouldn't be 50% ads :shifty: especially because that'd mean they managed to bump up adverts to 230 pages each month in total between the weekly WDs and Visions.

Keravin
13-01-2014, 10:11
If they actually expanded Blanchitsu to include the construction pictures of various models, got some decent modellers in to do kit bash so that it was more than I took this bit from one space marine kit and used it with another, went out and found more armies that are worthy of talking about than some repeats of the WD staffers armies etc.

There are ways to expand visions, but I do think the price point means it has to be great or it's really not worth it. Having a better understanding of what some people in the studio are making would help as I know there are some fantastic stuff being made that would be great to showcase.

If it is going to be more photographs then getting a photographer who is not obsessed with red backgrounds would also be good.

shelfunit.
13-01-2014, 10:43
The snarky cynicism is very innovative, I would not have expected that in GW general ;)

I'd call it realistic expectation based on all previous experience.


I meant things like blanchitsu, army of the month and golden demon showcases would go into 'Visions' (that's what the monthly one is called). Maybe they'll make up more of those kinds of articles, or put in more battle reports, or make an effort to create more new content and articles, rather than only transplanting the already existing ones. What the manager did say was that Visions would have a lot of photographs :o

But we don't know about what they'll do with adverts. Considering the weekly WDs are practically specifically intended to showcase/advertise the new releases from each week, Visions shouldn't be 50% ads :shifty: especially because that'd mean they managed to bump up adverts to 230 pages each month in total between the weekly WDs and Visions.

Well, yes, that's the hope, but we're talking about a monthly magazine with 232 pages - there hasn't been 232 pages of non-advert content in WD in the last year or more of issues combined. I would love to have a 232 page magazine to read, I would happily pay £7 to read it, but I have (almost) zero confidence that GW can do that.

AlexHolker
13-01-2014, 11:35
Only if you want them all.
No. They're charging 25% more for part of the magazine than they were charging for the whole thing.

Daniel36
13-01-2014, 11:46
If they actually expanded Blanchitsu to include the construction pictures of various models
I will 1-up you.

If they actually expanded Blanchitsu to include construction pictures of various models, have them play a narrative skirmish game with them, post about this ongoing campaign with pictures, add in a large section of rules to play this same type of skirmish game (you know, Inquisimunda-ish)... THEN the magazine would be worth it.

Anyone remember the Iron Lords campaign they played for Necromunda? I literally read that section 30 times over, over a period of years. I can still take it out and drool over those articles. When will they learn and do stuff like that?

About a year ago I took out all my old White Dwarfs, ripped out the worthwhile articles and put them in a binder, threw away everything else. I can't remember how many I had, but let's just pick a low count and say there were about 30 White Dwarfs I had left. The amount of articles was pretty much the page count of 1 White Dwarf. Now obviously I didn't include things others may have included (for example very little 40K stuff), but still...

You may find my previous comment snarky and cynical, and obviously it was meant to be that, but I am seriously ticked off with GW and the WD team for not putting in more effort to come up with cool stuff like that. For example, I have one article that's not even that old, that includes new stuff for Storm of Magic, mostly items for Empire Priests and Witch Hunters, with the promise there would be more of these.

THERE SHOULD BE MORE OF THOSE!!! That's the kind of stuff we want, and how hard it is to come up with that stuff. Furthermore, I mailed the WD team TWICE and they never even responded with a quick thanks for the mail or anything.

Liber
13-01-2014, 11:51
The snarky cynicism is very innovative, I would not have expected that in GW general ;)


I sarcastically agree with this sarcastic remark :D


I'm cautiously optimistic about the WD changes.


I will check in with the first couple issues, and it will be the first time GW has seen any money from me in a very long while.


Hoping for the best.

Keravin
13-01-2014, 11:57
I will 1-up you.

If they actually expanded Blanchitsu to include construction pictures of various models, have them play a narrative skirmish game with them, post about this ongoing campaign with pictures, add in a large section of rules to play this same type of skirmish game (you know, Inquisimunda-ish)... THEN the magazine would be worth it.

Well given the models in Blanchitsu are largely made for Inq28 and for other skirmish games (though they do use Lost and the Damned) it's not that difficult. Then again those of us who are doing it are putting up battle reports and the construction pictures online.

They'd have to admit we're playing Inquisitor which might be interesting given the Blanchitsu articles have been specifically written around that fact.

canberraguy
13-01-2014, 12:01
I sarcastically agree with this sarcastic remark :D


I'm cautiously optimistic about the WD changes.


I will check in with the first couple issues, and it will be the first time GW has seen any money from me in a very long while.


Hoping for the best.

Me too, in principle Warhammer Visions is a great idea. Hope it turns out to be in practice.

NealSmith
13-01-2014, 13:19
(confirming what I saw much earlier in this thread about weekly releases, etc.)

OK here is what my FLGS owner told me that he got straight from the GW sales rep:

- Weekly release schedules with each month having a "theme". So like January Tyranids and February something else, but each week is a new release of product.
- The weekly magazine ($4 USD) is tied to that week's release. It may have rules for a particular model being released that might not be in a codex/supplement yet. They then get integrated into the next iteration of the book they are supposed to be in. Not a lot of other details, so I'm still on the fence about the weekly.
- The monthly will be the "model-porn" version with pretty pictures, painting, etc. I didn't ask the price...

- As with the current WD, people will probably pick and choose based on their interests.

- He did mention something about an actual re-write of the rules coming up and that Fantasy 9th was indeed pushed back. We had a tornado warning come up, so I didn't get to ask him much about that. (Seriously! It did happen! )
He mentioned something about changing snap-shots/defensive fire during assaults to help "assaulty armies"... I need to get more details...

- Fantasy 9th will integrate the "big battles" stuff and the "skirmish" games more fully apparently. Make it easier to play low point games it seems. I haven't played much Fantasy lately, but it's taking off at our FLGS because of issues with 40K.

- One (tongue in cheek) comment he made was "instead of spending $500 on one Saturday a month, you can spend $150 every Saturday." :)

tu33y
13-01-2014, 13:22
this week, John Blanche does ANOTHER conversion with the plague lord.... and another! and another! someone tell that boy they have more than two minis... (the other being the banshee)

zoggin-eck
13-01-2014, 13:48
I'm still cautiously optimistic, but I hope they respond to feedback with this change. Remember how many people said to give the "new" White Dwarf a couple of months to improve, because of the printing in advance?


this week, John Blanche does ANOTHER conversion with the plague lord.... and another! and another! someone tell that boy they have more than two minis... (the other being the banshee)

I dare say he's painted and converted more miniatures than most people over the last four decades, but I'll agree that the Nurgle lord and Banshee (also Chaos sorcerer with head-swap!) are getting beyond the joke. I'd love them to show one of his much older models alongside a recent one each month.



- He did mention something about an actual re-write of the rules coming up and that Fantasy 9th was indeed pushed back. We had a tornado warning come up, so I didn't get to ask him much about that. (Seriously! It did happen! )


You sound like a brave news reporter! "But the people at home (Warseer) need to know!" (I hope everyone was safe, by the way)

Zenithfleet
13-01-2014, 14:25
Bit confused here - are they keeping the name 'White Dwarf' for the weekly brochure things?

It's a minor point, but I hope so, since it's such a perfect name for a mag that covers both a fantasy and a sci-fi game.

Also, a few pages back (well, right back at the start really), a few people mentioned even Paul Sawyer's run getting criticism too. I also noticed that in that excellent Retro Review of WD 187 over on Dakka, the OP mentioned that ish 216 was where the battle reports all went wrong.

I've been collecting a lot of back issues lately, and I have to admit that there was a definite dip in WD quality roughly corresponding to the point when Fat Bloke took the reins (around 213-217, just after the blue/red sidebars disappeared from the covers). The much maligned 216 was actually Sawyer's very first issue IIRC. The batreps didn't even bother to describe the actual battles, let alone do proper maps. Plus typos all over the place, weirdly 'busy' layouts, garish backdrops that made it hard to read the text, and other oddities.

And yet a couple of issues later things were back to normal. Ish 218 (my first ever subbed issue) had three properly mapped and described batreps: WFB, Gorkamorka and 40K's Sanctuary 101. Plus Tale of Four Gamers, of course... And I'd say Sawyer's overall run was extremely strong.

It's as if during that brief changeover period around ish 216, the team were either rushed for time, or were experimenting with a simplified 'it's for kidz!!' approach that they quickly thought better of. I can't help wondering if they brought a few of those ideas back from the dead in recent years... :shifty:

ObiWayneKenobi
13-01-2014, 15:11
Some of the best memories I have about White Dwarf is from the issues that had Tale of Four Gamers (the original) and Nigel Stillman's three part article on building a Bretonnian army. I salvaged some old issues and they always had articles about a certain unit that was out, or fluff or tactics or just how somebody painted some new unit for their own (not Studio) army. Chambers of the Horned Rat with Andy C. talking about his Piscina campaign. I forget the name but a couple of articles from this guy in the UK about him and his mates having a WHFB league (he was a larger and older gentleman as I recall, I think the armies were Lizardmen, Undead and a few others), articles from one of the staff with a journal of sorts about a WHFB campaign (the one with the map on the island) he was taking part in.

That's the kind of articles that WD needs again, not just pretty pictures and maybe a painting article showing how to paint things the default way. I want to see how regular people (even if they are employees) paint and model and theme their armies.

Zogash
13-01-2014, 17:48
He mentioned something about changing snap-shots/defensive fire during assaults to help "assaulty armies"... I need to get more details...


Holy ***** YES!!! I hate having to play my Orks with a focus on massed Shootas if I want to be semi-competitive. If this is true, maybe I can dust off my good ol' Sluggaboyz and not lose every single game because they get shot to ineffective pieces every time. Assaulty armies, especially footslogging and/or low-model count (e.g. trukkboyz) varieties, are in dire need of a buff to deal with the overabundance of shooty cheese around these days (I'm looking at you, Tau/Eldar combi-lists!) and the singularly disadvantageous combination of assaulting into difficult terrain, random charge distance, overwatch, and removing casualties from the front.

If GW actually takes the weekly as an opportunity to implement such changes, I'll swallow all my pricing/exploitation criticism of what WD has become and actually buy it for the first time in years!


Some of the best memories I have about White Dwarf is from the issues that had Tale of Four Gamers (the original) and Nigel Stillman's three part article on building a Bretonnian army. I salvaged some old issues and they always had articles about a certain unit that was out, or fluff or tactics or just how somebody painted some new unit for their own (not Studio) army. Chambers of the Horned Rat with Andy C. talking about his Piscina campaign. I forget the name but a couple of articles from this guy in the UK about him and his mates having a WHFB league (he was a larger and older gentleman as I recall, I think the armies were Lizardmen, Undead and a few others), articles from one of the staff with a journal of sorts about a WHFB campaign (the one with the map on the island) he was taking part in.

That's the kind of articles that WD needs again, not just pretty pictures and maybe a painting article showing how to paint things the default way. I want to see how regular people (even if they are employees) paint and model and theme their armies.

Yes, Tale of Four Gamers was an awesome concept! It really helped to keep motivation up in my own projects and was always a fun read. That, the Index Astartes articles, the Heroes&Villians showcases (with rules!), and awesome Battle Reports (there was this one 5-man free-for-all one with a Warboss that refused to move more than 1" per turn that cracked me up :D) are what I miss most in the current WD. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that Visions will live up to that, though I tend do be pessimistic...

Autumn Leaves
13-01-2014, 19:22
In the 1990's and earlier WD was an awesome magazine, full of wonder and treats and for quite a while, the colour red.

misterboff
13-01-2014, 22:29
THis is just what I was going to say. I thought as a pre-paid customer, I was legally entitled to be informed of any changes to my contract.
Do we have any real lawyers (not just people who say they are) who know some detail on this?

In the UK, the Direct Debit guarantee states:
# If there are any changes to the amount, date or frequency of your Direct Debit the organisation will notify you (normally 10 working days) in advance of your account being debited or as otherwise agreed.

Mine's due to go out at the end of this month and I've received nothing regarding any changes as of yet...

Mattcrowther00
13-01-2014, 22:57
In the UK, the Direct Debit guarantee states:
# If there are any changes to the amount, date or frequency of your Direct Debit the organisation will notify you (normally 10 working days) in advance of your account being debited or as otherwise agreed.

Mine's due to go out at the end of this month and I've received nothing regarding any changes as of yet...

Though by that 10 day notice they still have a good week to let us know

Archibald_TK
14-01-2014, 02:00
It's probably not that much of an interesting news but I may as well say it anyway.

Since the "Visions of Warhammer" or "Warhammer's Visions" or whatever is mainly pics and very light in written content, it will be a multi-languages book (which languages, that I do not know) so there will be only one version of that magazine that will be the same everywhere in the world.

Sophet Drahas
14-01-2014, 07:17
Holy ***** YES!!! I hate having to play my Orks with a focus on massed Shootas if I want to be semi-competitive. If this is true, maybe I can dust off my good ol' Sluggaboyz and not lose every single game because they get shot to ineffective pieces every time. Assaulty armies, especially footslogging and/or low-model count (e.g. trukkboyz) varieties, are in dire need of a buff to deal with the overabundance of shooty cheese around these days (I'm looking at you, Tau/Eldar combi-lists!) and the singularly disadvantageous combination of assaulting into difficult terrain, random charge distance, overwatch, and removing casualties from the front.

I've actually wondered about this with the Tyranids codex. I'm wondering if that may have been the first one written/released with 6.5/7th Edition in mind. It could explain why things are so bad with it for assaulting units. From what I understand, Orks are in a similar boat with us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

N1AK
14-01-2014, 10:20
Completely the wrong forum for this, but... the reason people don't buy it isn't that it's leaked online, but that because it has NOTHING in it but new releases which are up on the GW website the same day the magazine comes out, it's devoid of purpose.

This. The very few WD I have bought in the last few years I have bought for specific content; detailed painting guides come to mind for example. White Dwarf could be £1 but if it remained a glorified new releases catalogue then I wouldn't be interested. I've just accepted I'm not the target market but I really wonder who is? Surely today's teens are even less likely to want a paper sales catalogue when it's all available on-line anyway.



About a year ago I took out all my old White Dwarfs, ripped out the worthwhile articles and put them in a binder, threw away everything else. I can't remember how many I had, but let's just pick a low count and say there were about 30 White Dwarfs I had left. The amount of articles was pretty much the page count of 1 White Dwarf. Now obviously I didn't include things others may have included (for example very little 40K stuff), but still...


I've still got a couple of old 40K 'compendiums' from around the Rogue Trader / 2nd Edition days. Afaik these were created by compiling the worthwhile game content from WD, and possibly other sources. They're probably the size of a WD copy and are packed with rules on new units, new ways to play, scenarios, background and information. It really emphasises how back in the 80s and at least most of the 90s White Dwarf was a really valuable resource for gamers and hobbyists.



Optional rules are fair, or extra scenarios and missions, and I'd welcome their return, but I'll retain my discomfort with compulsory rules appearing in what should be an optional, and now possibly harder to obtain, magazine.


My only real issue with rules for units in White Dwarf in the past was that you had to buy an expensive magazine during a narrow window to get them. Personally I think the game would have benefited from having, for example, a new unit or tweak adding to the Wood Elf army since the last release, but the cost shouldn't be extortionate and it should be available in some format while it remains useful.

To me it seems self-defeating to not release new units, which the game would benefit from, for years because it's somehow 'wrong' to charge for it between army book releases. I play WoC and I didn't buy the WD with the Skullcrusher rules, nor did I use Skullcrushers, the rules for them weren't 'compulsory' unless you wanted to use them, in which case the rules for a scenario you want to play are also 'compulsory'.

Wesser
14-01-2014, 11:17
Good riddance

I browsed through the new issue in 10 minutes gaining what can only be described as scraps.

Proper tactical battle reports instead of the current haphazard junk that tells us nothing about how the opposing forces Work
Alternative army lists
Q&A
Tacticas
Insights into the thoughts behind new army books, codexes and other addons
Special Scenarios
Terrain Templates and step-by-step Construction walkthroughs
Optional special rules like those Empire Knightly Orders or the various types of goblins
Short stories or novellas

All of these could help make a good hobby magazine and WD have absolutely zero of them.

Seriously go read the newest issue and then the day after write a list of what was in it...."Uhm Pictures of new releases... Ehm a badly written battle report... parting shot maybe?".....


They really just can let it die if it continues as now

ObiWayneKenobi
14-01-2014, 12:55
The sad part is WD used to have all that stuff years ago. I'm certain the reason it doesn't anymore is because they figured out that they can charge more for those things on their own versus giving them away in a (at the time) cheap magazine.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk (http://tapatalk.com/m?id=1)

Shibboleth
14-01-2014, 15:01
I actually bought the latest WD because I was interested to see how the new Tyranids go against the current Tau in the Battle Report, with Tau's reputation as a top army at the moment in this shooty edition, vs the Assault based Tyranids, hoping to see if nids had made assault worthwhile...
I was very disappointed, the battle report was not even proper FoC on either side.
It was just everybody using their biggest modelss in a monster mash up. 6 Riptides vs multi HQ unit / MC nids.
I'm sure they had fun playing (and they let us know that in the aftermath page) but it was absolutley uselss in informing players how the new army works, and absolutely useless for any real comparison of Tau vs Nids.
An utter joke, it was practically an insult, and now that WD is dead I realise the players probly knew that and just decided to muck around for the final battle report.
Not a fitting demise I think, and just disrespectful.

ObiWayneKenobi
14-01-2014, 16:43
I actually bought the latest WD because I was interested to see how the new Tyranids go against the current Tau in the Battle Report, with Tau's reputation as a top army at the moment in this shooty edition, vs the Assault based Tyranids, hoping to see if nids had made assault worthwhile...
I was very disappointed, the battle report was not even proper FoC on either side.
It was just everybody using their biggest modelss in a monster mash up. 6 Riptides vs multi HQ unit / MC nids.
I'm sure they had fun playing (and they let us know that in the aftermath page) but it was absolutley uselss in informing players how the new army works, and absolutely useless for any real comparison of Tau vs Nids.
An utter joke, it was practically an insult, and now that WD is dead I realise the players probly knew that and just decided to muck around for the final battle report.
Not a fitting demise I think, and just disrespectful.

Definitely agree. The "fun" style of battle reports are all well and good, but when they are peddling the line that the game is balanced competitively and is a "play against anyone" type of game (and in the same breath peddle the "forging the narrative" excuse), I would have liked to see a real battle report featuring at the very least "standard" armies and at the best the typical gamer's army so you can actually see how it plays out versus "We decided to say screw the FOC and wanted to use all the monsters" since nobody actually plays non-narrative games like that in the real world.

It always amazed me how most of the players armies (to say nothing of the studio army itself) weren't representative of real-world armies at all. Not that I expected everyone to field the net list du jour, but you would think that for their own armies they would be more competitive style of army and be more like what average players field in pick-up games versus the Studio army which at least in the past used to be field what looks good, regardless of how it plays, in an effort to show off the models.

anselminus
15-01-2014, 08:36
Today GW confirmation on their website

White Dwarf magazine goes weekly!

Saturday 1 February sees the birth of the new, weekly, White Dwarf magazine.

Saturday 1 February sees the birth of the new, monthly, Warhammer: Visions magazine.

Yes, that’s right. We’ll be launching two new magazines on the same day, Saturday 1 February.

White Dwarf, now weekly.

From Saturday 1 February, White Dwarf will be available each and every Saturday exclusively in your local Games Workshop store, Independent Stockist and at games-workshop.com

White Dwarf will contain everything that’s new and exciting in the hobby that week, from news and information on all the week’s other new releases, to new columnists, interviews, painting, modelling, game rules and much more. And the price? The same as a pot of your favourite Citadel paint.

Warhammer: Visions, now monthly.

Warhammer: Visions will be available on the first Saturday every month in your local Games Workshop store, Independent Stockist, games-workshop.com and local newsstands in the UK, Europe and Australia.

Warhammer: Visions is a completely new monthly magazine, also from the White Dwarf team. It’s unlike anything we’ve ever done before and this super high-quality visual feast weighs in at a whopping 236 pages, each and every month.

Just 17 days to go and counting.

After months of planning and hard work, we’re really excited to be able to share this news with you. We were overwhelmed by all the support and feedback you gave us last time we relaunched White Dwarf back in September 2012 (and by your emails and photos that you send us every day – please keep them coming), and we’re even more excited by what we’ve got coming up for you in 2014.

If you can’t wait for Saturday 1 February and want to know more, then your local Games Workshop store manager has more info…

MT Bucket
15-01-2014, 09:55
So, now its official: White Dwarf is dead.

I particularly liked this line:

"We were overwhelmed by all the support and feedback you gave us last time we relaunched White Dwarf back in September 2012 (and by your emails and photos that you send us every day – please keep them coming), and we’re even more excited by what we’ve got coming up for you in 2014."

Or: "We were such a failure that within 18 months we realised we had to break out of a death spiral. Send us your pictures because we'll need something to fill a weekly magazine and a monthly one. Remember: anything you send us becomes ours because we own all the IP rights and you only have our implied consent to do anything to the models anyway!"

Having failed once, will they learn from their mistakes? I really, really hope so.