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Darnok
23-01-2014, 15:33
Via FB:


As you may have seen on other sites Febraury is all about the Dwarfs. So for you fans of the short and bearded get pumped. March will see the release of Imperial Knights. This year is shaping up to be a good one.
-Rik

With their track record I'm inclined to believe it. That might also mean that IG is due in March.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 15:41
Yeeesssssss!!!!

budman
23-01-2014, 15:46
Well Damn best get on with that lotto win

totgeboren
23-01-2014, 15:48
Cool. I wonder if they will give them the 'Stompa transition'? That is, Stompas in epic were about on par with a Leman Russ, and Knights were also kinda like a Leman Russ, only with a shield to the front.
Stompas in w40k on the other hand are huge warmachines, much bigger than the Stompas from Epic. So Knights could be given the same treatment.
On the other hand, Imperial Knights are a great candidate for occupying the same slot as Riptides and Wraithknights, so they could as well just be big 'normal' w40k units, which might lead to more sales.

Chem-Dog
23-01-2014, 15:48
Hooo sweet momma I hope this is legit.

Lion275
23-01-2014, 15:54
IG will be in April. March will focus soley on the Imperial Knights.

budman
23-01-2014, 15:56
IG will be in April. March will focus soley on the Imperial Knights.

well as doubleing down on madness goes

Lion275
23-01-2014, 15:57
Followed by Wood Elves in May...

Fen
23-01-2014, 15:59
I'll just sit here and wait for the rage-wave if they release a new version of the tracked warden knight

A.k.a a lord of skulls with (maybe) less skulls :D

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 16:01
Hopefully they're a Heavy Support or Elites choice, and not a Lord of War. I want a Riptide/Wraithknight equivalent. Imperials already have the Warhound and Reaver Titans for Lord of War walker choices. I wonder how they're going to release the rules, too. Will they be released in a book or a Dataslate?

StraightSilver
23-01-2014, 16:09
I hope this is true, I really do, but I'm not sure.

However Knights fall outside the usual chain of command so would fit into pretty much any Imperial army, not just IG.

In terms of rules a lot of rumours point to them actually being in White Dwarf, the magazine being used as a way of releasing models outside of the Codex which is how things used to be done.

I really think this is the right way to go. :)

Lion275
23-01-2014, 16:14
As far as it being true this is straight from the source that gave us the Space Marine and Dark Elf rumors. Check that thread for my accurate description for the models that were released. At this time we don't have pics but that might change as time progresses.

DoctorTom
23-01-2014, 16:15
Hopefully they're a Heavy Support or Elites choice, and not a Lord of War. I want a Riptide/Wraithknight equivalent. Imperials already have the Warhound and Reaver Titans for Lord of War walker choices. I wonder how they're going to release the rules, too. Will they be released in a book or a Dataslate?

Probably a dataslate that they can make a bunch of money from. I doubt they'd do something nice like actually include the rules with the model.

Ramius4
23-01-2014, 16:16
As far as it being true this is straight from the source that gave us the Space Marine and Dark Elf rumors. Check that thread for my accurate description for the models that were released. At this time we don't have pics but that might change as time progresses.

Just an FYI, Lion had 100% accuracy for those releases.

stevegill
23-01-2014, 16:21
As far as it being true this is straight from the source that gave us the Space Marine and Dark Elf rumors. Check that thread for my accurate description for the models that were released. At this time we don't have pics but that might change as time progresses.

And just as I finish my DreadKnight conversion - it must be true :eek:

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 16:22
As far as it being true this is straight from the source that gave us the Space Marine and Dark Elf rumors. Check that thread for my accurate description for the models that were released. At this time we don't have pics but that might change as time progresses.

Do you happen to know any particulars about the rules for the Imperial Knights? Will they be Monstrous Creatures or Walkers? And will they occupy an Elite or Heavy Support slot, or will they instead be a Super Heavy?

Lion275
23-01-2014, 16:32
It sounds like it will be a Dataslate or a mini codex.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 16:35
According to 40k Radio, it might be a White Dwarf article in the issue of the week of its release.

Lion275
23-01-2014, 16:38
According to 40k Radio, it might be a White Dwarf article in the issue of the week of its release.
BTW I am one of the hosts from 40k Radio. (Rik). I bet you see it in the WD then have it come out in Dataslate/mini dex.

gitburna
23-01-2014, 16:41
I would have thought this would be the same sort of size as the eldar/tau/grey knight/tyranid big beasts. And probably as a dataslate or "new white dwarf" release, but perhaps with rules also in the Imperial Guard codex. I can't imagine it as a superheavy walker but you never know.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 16:50
White Dwarf, Dataslate, no matter. I'd gladly buy one or both. So long as it lets me add a Knight Titan to my Space Marine list, then I'll be happy either way.

Formerly Wu
23-01-2014, 16:54
An independent release sounds ideal from my perspective. I was concerned they'd be shoehorned into the Imperial Guard codex, where thematically they don't fit at all.

Lion275
23-01-2014, 16:58
From what we were told it will not be in the IG codex and will be able to ally with various armies.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 17:03
I wonder how that'll work? My guess is it'll work like an Inquisitorial Detachment which doesn't take up the Allied Detachment and doesn't have to meet all the requirements for an Allied Detachment, otherwise they'd have to come up with an HQ and Troops choice which would have to be taken in order to select the Imperial Knight.

Avian
23-01-2014, 17:06
I bet it's going to be an additional Lord of War. That would fit the rumours and be a really easy way to integrate them.

Master Sheol
23-01-2014, 17:14
I am pretty curious to Know if this Will be a dataslate formation, a new FOC addition or a LoW/Apocalypse superheavy...
I am against the use of Escalation and i rarely play Apocalypse so i hope that the Imprrial Knight Will be a normal 40k entry like the wraithknight...

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 17:15
True, that's one option. I'm holding out hope for a Monstrous Creature akin to a Wraithknight, though, which instead occupies an Elite or Heavy Support choice. After all, the Knight Titan is weaker than the Warhound Titan, which is itself only 720 points. It'd be nice to have a 300 point unit or so which you can take multiples of in a standard army. Well, we'll know for sure either way two months from now.

Gropius
23-01-2014, 17:16
The first White Dwarf in February supposedly has the full rules for the dwarf character from the cover. If that is true, rules for new models in white dwarf could certainly be an ongoing thing.

Morathi's Darkest Sin
23-01-2014, 17:16
Been wanting something Guard side to challenge my Ork armies two stompas in CC, this might be it. :)

Chem-Dog
23-01-2014, 17:18
Will they be Monstrous Creatures or Walkers?

A Knight is a vehicle with a pilot, thus far the walker/vehicles have erred towards the "bloody huge armour" end of the spectrum, so i wouldn't be surprised to see them retain Vehicle status. Give 'em a healthy AV and something like shrouding to represent it's power field (which can be overloaded by a dispersed attack , like anything that ignores cover) and possibly even give it the IWND rule and you're laughing. Remember this isn't a melee unit, it's a MBT-on legs.

Of course it could be a MC, but that'd be boring.

*runs off to re-read Mechanicum again.

Also this month's planned 40K spend is postponed, if this is happening, I want three.

Fen
23-01-2014, 17:19
True, that's one option. I'm holding out hope for a Monstrous Creature akin to a Wraithknight, though, which instead occupies an Elite or Heavy Support choice. After all, the Knight Titan is weaker than the Warhound Titan, which is itself only 720 points. It'd be nice to have a 300 point unit or so which you can take multiples of in a standard army. Well, we'll know for sure either way two months from now.
Well,the wraithknight itself is a renewed version of the old eldar knights so it would make sense

Hendarion
23-01-2014, 17:21
Since when is Shrouded the imperial way of giving something a shield? Void Shields make much more sense or a simple invul.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 17:22
A Knight is a vehicle with a pilot, thus far the walker/vehicles have erred towards the "bloody huge armour" end of the spectrum, so i wouldn't be surprised to see them retain Vehicle status.

The Riptide is a vehicle with a pilot, but it was made a Monstrous Creature, so who knows.


Well,the wraithknight itself is a renewed version of the old eldar knights so it would make sense.

Exactly. There's also the Grey Knight Dreadknight, which is a vehicle piloted by a single crewman but it's also treated as a Monstrous Creature. We'll see, though.

Kung Fu Hamster
23-01-2014, 17:22
I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet, but IG is getting a new name with their new codex a la SoB. According to 40K Radio's source, they'll be renamed to the Astra Militarium.

Let the whining commence! :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Samsonov
23-01-2014, 17:31
Sweet. Now just rerelease epic and all those old knight models and everyone will be happy.

Lion275
23-01-2014, 17:31
I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet, but IG is getting a new name with their new codex a la SoB. According to 40K Radio's source, they'll be renamed to the Astra Militarium.

Let the whining commence! :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yup a brand new name.

Inquisitor Kallus
23-01-2014, 17:32
Knights could do melee as well as shoot. The Lancers and Paladins were probably the best at it followed by the Errant, which had a big fisr and melta weapon. Castellans and the other one were used in a fire support/heavy role and didn't have CC weapons

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 17:32
Wait, are you serious about that? I thought he was trolling.

Lion275
23-01-2014, 17:35
Nope. Completely serious. The book is called Astra Militarium.

Theocracity
23-01-2014, 17:37
I bet it's going to be an additional Lord of War. That would fit the rumours and be a really easy way to integrate them.

I'm sort of expecting this as well. But for some reason my personal rumor-dar is throwing off warnings lately, so I'm just gonna sit back and see what happens.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 17:38
Well, that doesn't make any sense. Imperial Guard was a perfectly good name. It certainly isn't the mouthful that is "Astra Militarium." One would think that they would've named the recently released Codex: Space Marines as Codex: Adeptus Astartes, if they were going to do that with every Imperial army. Weird.

Theocracity
23-01-2014, 17:40
Well, that doesn't make any sense. Imperial Guard was a perfectly good name. It certainly isn't the mouthful that is "Astra Militarium." One would think that they would've named the recently released Codex: Space Marines as Codex: Adeptus Astartes, if they were going to do that with every Imperial army. Weird.

Its possible that GW feels more comfortable enforcing a trademark of Space Marines than they do on Imperial Guard.

Fen
23-01-2014, 17:42
Its possible that GW feels more comfortable enforcing a trademark of Space Marines than they do on Imperial Guard.
The fact that "imperial guard" is the name of a few real world historical units doesn't help i guess

Lion275
23-01-2014, 17:43
I am just going by what our source has told us. Could be a legal issue, could be they are incorporating more things into the Codex. Time will tell.

Samsonov
23-01-2014, 17:43
Nope. Completely serious. The book is called Astra Militarium.Adeptus Militarium would sounds good to me (Imperial Guard suggest some level of being elite) but what does Astra mean in 40K terms?

Dryaktylus
23-01-2014, 17:44
Nope. Completely serious. The book is called Astra Militarium.

Well, as the codex contains elements from the Navy, the Adeptus Mechanicus and the Adeptus Astra Telepathica this makes some sense I guess. A bit weird though.

TheFang
23-01-2014, 17:44
I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet, but IG is getting a new name with their new codex a la SoB. According to 40K Radio's source, they'll be renamed to the Astra Militarium.

You can't copyright Imperial Guard.......


Knights would be great. Ideal for the Horus Heresy Mechanicum and could ally with any 40k Imperial Force.

Fen
23-01-2014, 17:47
Adeptus Militarium would sounds good to me (Imperial Guard suggest some level of being elite) but what does Astra mean in 40K terms?
Well,as far as fake latin goes,it sounds like it's intended to be soldiers/army of the stars (both are actual latin words but while astra is star,militarium is a bit of a problem :P)

Lars Porsenna
23-01-2014, 17:49
This indeed is awesome news, and I know what I will be spending my hobby budget on come March. Wondering, however, if there will be Chaos versions at some point?

Damon.

Chem-Dog
23-01-2014, 17:55
Since when is Shrouded the imperial way of giving something a shield? Void Shields make much more sense or a simple invul.

Personal feeling. It's something that can be defeated by the likes of flamers very easily because the Knight can't detect incoming shots and deflect them with it's sheild. The alternative would be to give it an Inv, but to stay true to the background on the unit, it'd be one that can be lost (either a "first fail it's gone" deal or counting as a weapon and thus capable of getting taken out by a Weapon Destroyed result)


Knights could do melee as well as shoot. The Lancers and Paladins were probably the best at it followed by the Errant, which had a big fisr and melta weapon. Castellans and the other one were used in a fire support/heavy role and didn't have CC weapons

Could do combat sure, against units of a similar displacement (and then really only as a last resort), watching a Knight engage in melee against regular sized infantry would be like watching a Terminator playing Whack-a=mole with a Thunderhammer. :D


Its possible that GW feels more comfortable enforcing a trademark of Space Marines than they do on Imperial Guard.

There is that, I was thinking that it's more to do with the fact other aspects of the Imperium's military might be present ing greater numbers in the book, the current book has a Squad upgrade and a vehicles that are explicitly stated as being Navy, throw in a few more naval units, perhaps some more Ad-Mech and so on and it stops technically being Codex:Imperial Guard.

I'll still call it the IG anyway.

Theocracity
23-01-2014, 17:55
My main concern about the veracity of the name change rumor is that it would involve an awful lot of reboxed models.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 18:06
Personal feeling. It's something that can be defeated by the likes of flamers very easily because the Knight can't detect incoming shots and deflect them with it's sheild. The alternative would be to give it an Inv, but to stay true to the background on the unit, it'd be one that can be lost (either a "first fail it's gone" deal or counting as a weapon and thus capable of getting taken out by a Weapon Destroyed result)

Eh, they've already got rules for Void Shields in the game. Why reinvent the wheel?


Could do combat sure, against units of a similar displacement (and then really only as a last resort), watching a Knight engage in melee against regular sized infantry would be like watching a Terminator playing Whack-a=mole with a Thunderhammer. :D

Which is why its being a regular Vehicle would be a problem. Who wants to see a Baby Titan blown up by one lucky hit by a Sergeant with a Power Fist? It'd have to either be a Monstrous Creature or a Super Heavy.

Kung Fu Hamster
23-01-2014, 18:09
All the splinter weapons in my Dark Eldar army would love for them to be MCs. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Chem-Dog
23-01-2014, 18:13
Eh, they've already got rules for Void Shields in the game. Why reinvent the wheel?

Good point, I hadn't thought of that.




Which is why its being a regular Vehicle would be a problem. Who wants to see a Baby Titan blown up by one lucky hit by a Sergeant with a Power Fist?

Me, if the alternative is seing them get poisoned to death by a DE Raider drive-by ;) I think Supherheavy is looking more likely.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 18:14
That's a price worth paying to put them on the same plane as Dreadknights, Wraithknights, and Riptides. The presence of Dark Eldar hasn't made those three any less awesome. :p

I'm starting to think that they're more likely to be a Super Heavy, though. While I'd love to have a 300 point equivalent to a Wraithknight and potentially take two or three of them in an army, and I thought their dearth of weapon options made it likely they wouldn't be a Super Heavy (they have access to what, two weapons?), one of those weapons is a Titan weapon, some of which are Str D, and I can't imagine them putting a Str D weapon on something which isn't a Super Heavy for Fortification. They could give it different weapon options, I suppose, or maybe weaker versions of those Titan weapons which aren't Str D, but that's less likely.

Whatever the case, I wants one, already! It's going to be a looonnnggg wait these next two months!

Darnok
23-01-2014, 18:16
Anything about the Knights' rules at this point is speculation. Please take that to a thread of its own in 40K General.


Darnok [=I=]

Everto
23-01-2014, 18:25
Lion, any rumors on a chaos version at all??

Lion275
23-01-2014, 18:27
None so far.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 18:29
A Chaos version would be neat. Hopefully one will be in the pipeline eventually.

How about the size of it? How does it compare to the Wraithknight/Riptide/Deadknight? Any word on which of those it's closer in size to?

Inquisitor Kallus
23-01-2014, 18:35
Eh, they've already got rules for Void Shields in the game. Why reinvent the wheel?



.

Because Knghts never had Void shields..............


They used to have directional shields in Titan Legions but then it got changed for later incarnations.

Some kind of Wave Serpent like protection but maybe an invulnerable save? Its nice to have a unique thing for them I feel as they're not the same as Titans and tend to have different roles and face different threats

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 18:38
Because Knghts never had Void shields..............

I was replying to that posters comments about how to deal with Void Shields in game, not commenting on whether Knights should have Void Shields or not.

Dryaktylus
23-01-2014, 18:38
So, as the Knights are Mechanicus stuff: any news if there's a new Enginseer? I mean they're also part of the IG... er.... AM... AsMil, and the model still isn't Finecast.

stevegill
23-01-2014, 18:47
So, as the Knights are Mechanicus stuff: any news if there's a new Enginseer? I mean they're also part of the IG... er.... AM... AsMil, and the model still isn't Finecast.

Good point - time to order a couple more of them before they disappear forever

quantumcollider
23-01-2014, 19:04
Imperial Knights? And a new IG armybook?

This may be the perfect time for me to start a Skitarii force. :)

Gungo
23-01-2014, 19:05
Because Knghts never had Void shields..............


They used to have directional shields in Titan Legions but then it got changed for later incarnations.

Some kind of Wave Serpent like protection but maybe an invulnerable save? Its nice to have a unique thing for them I feel as they're not the same as Titans and tend to have different roles and face different threats

While kind of a cop out the wave serpent shield that causes only glances would certainly make knights sturdier then normal walkers depending on the number of hull points and AV. A displacer field can also work by reducing the strength of incoming hits. But instead of doing this i have a feeling it will be a monsterous creature and make no sense.

Dark Primus
23-01-2014, 19:13
This indeed is awesome news, and I know what I will be spending my hobby budget on come March. Wondering, however, if there will be Chaos versions at some point?

Damon.

Well Slaanesh is suppose to have Knight version. Ugly however.
http://i615.photobucket.com/albums/tt237/Alpha-Theta/SlaaneshSubjugator.jpg

Avian
23-01-2014, 19:17
Well, that doesn't make any sense. Imperial Guard was a perfectly good name. It certainly isn't the mouthful that is "Astra Militarium." One would think that they would've named the recently released Codex: Space Marines as Codex: Adeptus Astartes, if they were going to do that with every Imperial army. Weird.
Well, they have to start somewhere if they want to bring in a new trend, and they started with Sisters. It wouldn't surprise me if the whole "Spots the Space Marine" farce was the reason behind this.

I wonder what they'll call the Chaos Space Marines. They can't exactly call them "Chaos Adeptus Astartes".

Excessus
23-01-2014, 19:28
Well, they have to start somewhere if they want to bring in a new trend, and they started with Sisters. It wouldn't surprise me if the whole "Spots the Space Marine" farce was the reason behind this.

I Wonder what they'll call the Chaos Space Marines. They can't exactly call them "Chaos Adeptus Astartes".
Or just "Worse Space Marines"...

quantumcollider
23-01-2014, 19:39
Imperial Knights? And a new IG armybook?

This may be the perfect time for me to start a Skitarii force. :)

Sorry to quote myself, but I just remembered that FFG's next Only War expansion will contain rules for Skitarii regiments. When GW published Codex: Grey Knights, FFG came with the Daemonhunters expansion, where you could see from their contents that both companies coordinated their fluff. So maybe they will do so again.

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 19:40
Or just "Worse Space Marines"...

Codex: Heldrake & Friends.

Inquisitor Kallus
23-01-2014, 19:40
While kind of a cop out the wave serpent shield that causes only glances would certainly make knights sturdier then normal walkers depending on the number of hull points and AV. A displacer field can also work by reducing the strength of incoming hits. But instead of doing this i have a feeling it will be a monsterous creature and make no sense.

Sorry, I meant the part that it only protects from certain angles. The rest of the Serpent shield rules dont fit it at all

Barghest
23-01-2014, 20:02
I both do and don't like the new name. I don't want this to become Codex: "Everybody who isn't a Space Marine".

But then knowing GW, I truly doubt they'd rename one of the OG codices. I'm hoping not, anyway.

Imperial Knights, gimme a break. Enough of this Gundam **** already.

Inquisitor Kallus
23-01-2014, 20:08
Imperial Knights, gimme a break. Enough of this Gundam **** already.

They exist in 40k background already, they were very cool in Epic

Lars Porsenna
23-01-2014, 20:11
They exist in 40k background already, they were very cool in Epic

Indeed, Imperial Knights have been around for a lo-ong time, and I think it is about time they get some presence again. I was hoping knights would release with some sort of Mechanicum supplement, but that might be a bit much to hope for...

Damon.

Barghest
23-01-2014, 20:23
I know they've been around, but after the Riptide and Wraithknight I'm kind of soured on the idea. I hope it's separate from the IG codex; it doesn't make sense for only the Guard to get access to them.

Ramius4
23-01-2014, 20:27
I know they've been around, but after the Riptide and Wraithknight I'm kind of soured on the idea. I hope it's separate from the IG codex; it doesn't make sense for only the Guard to get access to them.

Well, seeing as there are really only 3 Imperial armies represented in a codex (Marines, SoB, Imperial Guard)... And the Imperial Guard being by far the most likely to fight alongside them...

The Emperor
23-01-2014, 20:29
Well, seeing as there are really only 3 Imperial armies represented in a codex (Marines, SoB, Imperial Guard)... And the Imperial Guard being by far the most likely to fight alongside them...

Look upthread. The rumors are that they're coming out March and Imperial Guard are April, so their rules are coming from some other source.

my_name_is_tudor
23-01-2014, 20:39
I wonder what they'll call the Chaos Space Marines. They can't exactly call them "Chaos Adeptus Astartes".

Codex: Traitor Legions?

Arguably with the inclusion of cultists it could be Codex: Warriors of Chaos.

WordBearer
23-01-2014, 20:55
Cool. I wonder if they will give them the 'Stompa transition'? That is, Stompas in epic were about on par with a Leman Russ, and Knights were also kinda like a Leman Russ, only with a shield to the front.
Stompas in w40k on the other hand are huge warmachines, much bigger than the Stompas from Epic. So Knights could be given the same treatment.
On the other hand, Imperial Knights are a great candidate for occupying the same slot as Riptides and Wraithknights, so they could as well just be big 'normal' w40k units, which might lead to more sales.Epic abstracts a lot more than 40k, just like 40k abstracts a lot more than, say, Inquisitor.

warlordbob
23-01-2014, 21:00
Or, if using the rumoured pig latin naming conventions, Codex: Traitoris Extremis could make sense

Spiney Norman
23-01-2014, 21:03
Via FB:



With their track record I'm inclined to believe it. That might also mean that IG is due in March.

When I first read their post I was like "wooooo, finally new plastic core knights for WH empire army", then I saw the comments underneath and I realised it was just a riptide for Imperial armies.

Oh well, still good news, just not quite as good as I originally thought. I guess knight means its going to be comparable in size to the dreadknight yes? Sounds like yet another non-sister bolt-on for my SoB army that will make them slightly less crap.

Lion275
23-01-2014, 21:24
When I first read their post I was like "wooooo, finally new plastic core knights for WH empire army", then I saw the comments underneath and I realised it was just a riptide for Imperial armies.

Oh well, still good news, just not quite as good as I originally thought. I guess knight means its going to be comparable in size to the dreadknight yes? Sounds like yet another non-sister bolt-on for my SoB army that will make them slightly less crap.

Man some new Empire Knights would have excited me too!

burni
23-01-2014, 22:03
I really hope the Knights ARE separate from the IG codex. I don't care for the 'big robots' aspect of 40K personally (okay, maybe the stompa...), but I'm happy for those that do. I'd just rather they don't take over my beloved 'chunky tanks' and 'squishy troops' army.

As for the IG name change... Hmmm. I'm not a fan. It doesn't sound quite right. I like all the 'administorium' names you get in the Uplifting Primer, but this just doesn't seem to fit with them, to my mind.

Interesting weeks and months ahead...

Timathius
23-01-2014, 22:41
My bank account is going to hate me soooo much in March and April....

Lion, did your source give you any idea of scale or look for the titan? or any info on the guard release at all?

Lion275
23-01-2014, 22:44
So far he has not given us the scale for it yet. Hopefully he will soon. And I want to re-iterate Knight ARE NOT part of Astra Militarium (IG). No info on that codex.

cuda1179
23-01-2014, 22:46
I'm just happy that I all ready have an Epicast Knight and a resin 15mm scale Leviathan Crusader from DreamForge.

zeuso
23-01-2014, 22:48
Man some new Empire Knights would have excited me too!

Excited me three! Still it means I'll be saving some money these next few months hopefully, my wallet took a battering with the nids and dark elves releases :cries:

Formerly Wu
23-01-2014, 22:52
Is Astra Militarium a pre-existing term in the lore, or a neologism?

Lion275
23-01-2014, 23:01
I believe it might be a new thing. I have not heard it but I have only been in the hobby since 2001 so it could well pre-date me.

Fear Ghoul
23-01-2014, 23:01
Is Astra Militarium a pre-existing term in the lore, or a neologism?

The Ordo Militarum was defined in the Inquisition codex as the ordo which watches over the Imperial Guard. So it's a relatively recent term.

Fable
23-01-2014, 23:06
The rebranding of IG is surprising, but for trade mark it makes sense. I was half expecting Eldar to be rebranded Craftworld Eldar since the word is a direct Tolkien rip, the same way Tau Empire got rebranded back in 05 (I think).

As for Space Marines being rebranded, I'd say they probably protect that IP like it's the Federal Reserve.

Barghest
23-01-2014, 23:07
Lion, I'd love to hear some more IG rumours whenever you get them. When do you normally hear things, out of curiosity?

Lion275
23-01-2014, 23:11
Usually we get stuff a month out. Things were a bit difficult after we pretty much outed all the Sentinels of Terra stuff. As of right now we just have the release schedule. As soon as we get more info we will make it available.

Barghest
23-01-2014, 23:15
Usually we get stuff a month out. Things were a bit difficult after we pretty much outed all the Sentinels of Terra stuff. As of right now we just have the release schedule. As soon as we get more info we will make it available.

Then we love you.

Lion275
23-01-2014, 23:23
Then we love you.

Well thank you! Everyone here was super cool when I was giving out info on the Dark Elves. Hopefully we will get more info as time gets closer.

Bloodknight
23-01-2014, 23:36
Nope. Completely serious. The book is called Astra Militarium.

Codex: Crappy Name. Why can't it at least be un-mangled Latin (Milites Astrarum, for example) or something a little more pronouncible? It sounds awkward, not cool.

jason_sation
23-01-2014, 23:37
I've always wondered how much info from GW was tossed to the developers of that never released 40k MMO. I thought it had both Ad Mech and a Titan in the trailer?

Senbei
23-01-2014, 23:38
This would be GOOD. But it's GW, so I'll be skeptical till I see it in print. Then I'll believe that they're gonna fsk up the model till I see one in the plastic. SKULLZ SKULLZ EVERYWHERE! ADD MORE SKULLZ(tm) etc.


Cool. I wonder if they will give them the 'Stompa transition'? That is, Stompas in epic were about on par with a Leman Russ, and Knights were also kinda like a Leman Russ, only with a shield to the front.

Stompas were a 2+ save, Super heavy assault walker, with a -3 save mod cannon (so.. low-end titan level weaponry).

Knights had 3+ or 2+ saves, depending on the type, and a shield. And a battlecannon, massive chain-blade or claw and a load of bolters. They also had shock lances.

Leman Russ was... 4+ save with a battlecannon and bolter? I think... maybe. It's been a while.



I'm starting to think that they're more likely to be a Super Heavy, though.


Now, as an ancient grognard, I can tell you that in 2nd ed Epic, Knights came in many sizes. Imperial Knights could be 2+ save Superheavies with Knight shields (effectively making them tougher than Baneblades against most enemies) whilst some traitor (Slaanesh had a load of Knights and 2 different scout Titans) knights were 4+ save (Leman Russ/Predator level) and about the same height as an Eldar dreadnought (though scale was a little ropey in epic).

Ramius4
23-01-2014, 23:55
Well thank you! Everyone here was super cool when I was giving out info on the Dark Elves. Hopefully we will get more info as time gets closer.

And if you happen to have anything on the upcoming Dwarf release, feel free to hop over to the fantasy rumors ;)

Lion275
23-01-2014, 23:57
And if you happen to have anything on the upcoming Dwarf release, feel free to hop over to the fantasy rumors ;)

Absolutely my man. I am a big WHFB and I would love to get some info on them.

Ramius4
24-01-2014, 00:14
Absolutely my man. I am a big WHFB and I would love to get some info on them.

Thanks Lion275. I can't speak for everyone, but I have really appreciated all of the rumors you guys have provided for both game systems.

Fangschrecken
24-01-2014, 01:50
I guess this means I can eternally postpone my plan to make knight titans out of nemesis dreadknights, but I pray the Emperor doesn't let them become monstrous creatures.

All you'd need is AV13 front and side, with an invul save and ~6 hull points.

Making it a monstrous creature is just another damned money grab because they know they can sell big monsters but not vehicles because of the damned 6th edition rules. (I'd wager landraiders used to be a big seller pre-6th.)

WordBearer
24-01-2014, 02:08
Vehicles with invulnerable saves seems so weird and backwards to me, but I can't deny that it helps with things like daemon engines.

The Emperor
24-01-2014, 02:33
I hope they do make them Monstrous Creatures for just that reason. It sucks that you can have a single guy with a Meltagun run up and one-shot you on the roll of a 4+, but a Wraithknight or Riptide can be wounded up to five or six times by those same Meltaguns and keep going. Monstrous Creatures are flat out more survivable, so unless the rules for Vehicles are drastically changed, making it a Walker would guarantee that it's far less effective in comparison to its counterparts. But that's a discussion going on in the 40k General Discussion forum, so best to take such talk over HERE (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?387711-What-if-Riptides-Dreadknights-and-more-were-walkers).

Kegslayer
24-01-2014, 03:02
@ lion is there any proof on any of the chaos space marine rumours?

Lion275
24-01-2014, 03:43
He does not have any information about a February Chaos Space Marines release...but that doesn't mean it wont happen.

Fable
24-01-2014, 04:07
Possible 7th (errata) edition, new white dwarf format with rules, renamed Imperial Guard, Imperial Knights... If your source's proven track record continues 2014 could go down as one of the oddest and most tumultuous years for 40k in memory.

Davidian
24-01-2014, 06:40
IG will be in April. March will focus soley on the Imperial Knights.

Sounds like a supplement... mini codex ala inquisition? Then it covers more codecies (all imperial ones), cheaper and sold independently makes good business sense.

This will silence all the folks who were disappointed that C:SM didn't get the riptide/wrathknight treatment if true.

Not sure a Knight has any place in my Imperial collection.... may be swayed if the model is freaking epic.

Rowenstin
24-01-2014, 06:46
Awesome, another toddler sized "miniature" to stomp the battlefield. If only there was a game, on another scale, where such warmachines could be comfortably used. That would be epic.

ismeno
24-01-2014, 06:59
Awesome, another toddler sized "miniature" to stomp the battlefield. If only there was a game, on another scale, where such warmachines could be comfortably used. That would be epic.

:D this! ^^


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Samsonov
24-01-2014, 07:51
Awesome, another toddler sized "miniature" to stomp the battlefield. If only there was a game, on another scale, where such warmachines could be comfortably used. That would be epic.I believe "quoted for truth" is the correct phrase to employ here.

Shibboleth
24-01-2014, 08:44
Awesome, another toddler sized "miniature" to stomp the battlefield. If only there was a game, on another scale, where such warmachines could be comfortably used. That would be epic.
My dream is for a 'Flames of Warhammer', in 1/72nd scale.
Mainly cos a plastic Warlord Titan in 1/72 would be the best thing ever, but I'll settle for a Knight in 40K.

predator99
24-01-2014, 08:48
someone mind explaining to me what the Imperial knights are? Unless it is a new name for the Grey Knights?

Bloodknight
24-01-2014, 08:49
Sort of a small one-pilot titan. Used to be equivalent to a Stompa, but it looks like they're shrinking.

Apologist
24-01-2014, 09:02
As Bloodknight says, Knights are (or were in Epic) tank-sized walkers. They were roughly equivalent to a Leman Russ in combat effectiveness (slightly more expensive and slightly more killy/resilient, but nowhere near as powerful or tough as a superheavy like a Baneblade).

MajorWesJanson
24-01-2014, 09:31
Sort of a small one-pilot titan. Used to be equivalent to a Stompa, but it looks like they're shrinking.

Actually, Knights are the same size they used to be- the Wraithknight is a blend as the old Fire Gale/Towering Destroyer. It's just that the old Leman Russ sized Stompa was conflated with the larger Supa-stompa, and ended up as a full on Scout Titan.

Shibboleth
24-01-2014, 09:39
So, what do we call a single 'guardsman' now?

The Emperor
24-01-2014, 09:42
A space soldier?

Binky
24-01-2014, 09:45
Knights certainly sound interesting, I guess we're likely to get more than one type if it's the main release for the month, so hoping they do the three different classes, Warden, Paladin and Lancer, with multiple builds for each! But maybe that's too optimistic.

Telemachus
24-01-2014, 09:45
If they look anything like this; I'll be one happy bunny wabbit.

185877

This and another image can be found on the original site here (http://www.ifelix.co.uk/wh40kgallery/adeptusmechanicus/7000.html).

quantumcollider
24-01-2014, 10:07
If they look anything like this; I'll be one happy bunny wabbit.

185877

This and another image can be found on the original site here (http://www.ifelix.co.uk/wh40kgallery/adeptusmechanicus/7000.html).

Interesting. Is this a scratch built model or a forge world prototype?

Telemachus
24-01-2014, 10:17
Interesting. Is this a scratch built model or a forge world prototype? Scratch build entry for Golden Demon I think.

Rowenstin
24-01-2014, 10:25
So, what do we call a single 'guardsman' now?

It's an Adeptus Squishus.

The Emperor
24-01-2014, 10:29
Knights certainly sound interesting, I guess we're likely to get more than one type if it's the main release for the month, so hoping they do the three different classes, Warden, Paladin and Lancer, with multiple builds for each! But maybe that's too optimistic.

That'd be awesome. It'd be especially neat if there were both a Heavy Support option and a Super Heavy option, with the Heavy Support version equipped with Battle Cannons and the like, while the Super Heavy can wield the D Weapons and so on.

TheFang
24-01-2014, 10:34
He does not have any information about a February Chaos Space Marines release...but that doesn't mean it wont happen.
Given the source of the CSM rumours the lack of information isn't surprising.


Interesting. Is this a scratch built model or a forge world prototype?

Scratch built GD entry. A search for 40k knight titans will bring up loads more fan based models.

MajorWesJanson
24-01-2014, 10:40
That'd be awesome. It'd be especially neat if there were both a Heavy Support option and a Super Heavy option, with the Heavy Support version equipped with Battle Cannons and the like, while the Super Heavy can wield the D Weapons and so on.

Knights should not have D-Weapons.

Shibboleth
24-01-2014, 10:42
Knights certainly sound interesting, I guess we're likely to get more than one type if it's the main release for the month, so hoping they do the three different classes, Warden, Paladin and Lancer, with multiple builds for each! But maybe that's too optimistic.They may do a couple of variants, but I think it will be left to Forgeworld to step in on the others, like with the Riptide...

TheFang
24-01-2014, 10:43
Knights should not have D-Weapons.

Nothing outside Adeptus Mechanicus Ordinatus or Warlord titans should have D weapons.


They may do a couple of variants, but I think it will be left to Forgeworld to step in on the others, like with the Riptide...

Yes. With 30k variants please.

The Emperor
24-01-2014, 10:52
Knights should not have D-Weapons.

According to Lexicanum, they could be equipped with a Volcano Cannon, which is a D Weapon, which is why I brought it up.


Nothing outside Adeptus Mechanicus Ordinatus or Warlord titans should have D weapons.

Both Warhound Titans and Reaver Titans already have access to D Weapons.

MajorWesJanson
24-01-2014, 10:54
They may do a couple of variants, but I think it will be left to Forgeworld to step in on the others, like with the Riptide...

Errant and Paladin are basically interchangeable, just weapon changes. Baron is taller and fancier. Lancer has longer legs. All of them share basically the same torso and head however, at least the newer models for them do. (currently soaking some of each to strip paint off) The potato shaped Warden basically split into the Crusader and Castellian (names stolen from old Imperial Robots) which were wider than the paladin et al. and traded the CCW for a second ranged weapon. One had a pair of dual autocannons, the other had a battle cannon and a gattling gun.
Give the kit 3 CCWs (Power Lance, Power Fist, Eviscerator) and 3 ranged weapons (Melta cannon, battle cannon with short and long barrel, maybe add punisher cannon) and you could basically make four variants out of one kit- Paladin and Errant are weapon loadouts, Lancer could add Fast/Fleet, and Baron is fancier and could just be a WS/BS increase rules-wise, maybe a tad more armor.

Radu Lykan
24-01-2014, 11:00
i dont remember any of the knights having anything like d weapons, paladins and lancers were battle cannons with chain blade or lance, a knight errant had either a melta cannon or possibly inferno gun (i forget) and giant powerfist, castellan had a mini quake cannon and multi barrelled auto cannon and the crusader had the same mini quake cannon with 2 lascannons.
depending on super heavy v monstrous creature v regular walker rules i imagine the quake cannons blast might get reduced in size, the autocannon could become a hades autocannon and the lascannons might become neutron laser projector type things, basically beefed up a bit but not to strength d, at least i hope not

for those with no idea what an imperial knight is this should help
http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Knight

The Emperor
24-01-2014, 11:01
I guess the people who wrote the Lexicanum article were wrong.

Radu Lykan
24-01-2014, 11:27
yep :) if you pop over to the dakka version of this thread they have a pic of the model parts from the old castellan, def a quake cannon. which is still one of the warlord titans main guns so might need toning back but at least its not a strength d weapon

Born Again
24-01-2014, 11:28
Great, because we really need some more oversized units in 40k, especially for Imperials.

I'm sure the model would be amazing, but I think (much like the Riptide & Wraithknight), the resources on this kit could have been better spent elsewhere.

The Emperor
24-01-2014, 11:50
Great, because we really need some more oversized units in 40k, especially for Imperials.

I've been itching for one for a while, so IMO, we do need one. :p And don't forget that it'll be available for every Imperial force. One large model for seven Codex books is a huge return on the comparatively small investment made to create the model (As opposed to the Wraithknight, which is just for Eldar, and the Riptide, which is just for Tau).

Kingly
24-01-2014, 12:53
Well well that is VERY exciting!

ferrus
24-01-2014, 13:06
I always love it when they revisit something cool that got lost in the past of 40k, 2nd edition epic if I'm not incorrect. We've been fed scraps about them since (13th Black Crusade gave them a mention), but it's nice for them to be back. This almost makes me as happy as Forge World would if they'd make an Electro-Priest model for their new Ad Mech range.

Azazyll
24-01-2014, 13:17
Very exciting to see knights come out, and hopefully get decent fluff. One of the things allies is actually good for is representing the combined might of the imperium. Hopefully the major xenos races will get similar treatment eventually (ie exodites, harlequins that don't suck, etc)

Morathi's Darkest Sin
24-01-2014, 13:26
I've been itching for one for a while, so IMO, we do need one. :p And don't forget that it'll be available for every Imperial force. One large model for seven Codex books is a huge return on the comparatively small investment made to create the model (As opposed to the Wraithknight, which is just for Eldar, and the Riptide, which is just for Tau).

Potentially two more if they do a Chaos conversion kit. :)

Spiney Norman
24-01-2014, 14:01
Potentially two more if they do a Chaos conversion kit. :)

Or even a completely separate chaos knight kit, does everyone really think they're going to go an entire month just re leasing a single plastic kit and the rules for it?

Darnok
24-01-2014, 14:21
Or even a completely separate chaos knight kit, does everyone really think they're going to go an entire month just re leasing a single plastic kit and the rules for it?

The imperial version can be fielded - if the rumours are to be believed - by 7 of the 15 armies from 40K. A Chaos Knight would be usable by one - unless it would include a lot of daemonic bits, then it'd be two. I don't think there will be a chaotic version as a seperate kit.

Royals
24-01-2014, 14:24
Chaos version = add spikes

Ramius4
24-01-2014, 14:38
Chaos version = add spikes

Don't forget lotz and lotz of skullz!

baphomael
24-01-2014, 14:41
I, for one, welcome our new robot overlords. As soon as large kits started getting produced the Knight Titan seemed the perfect unit to give a new breath of life.

InstantKarma
24-01-2014, 14:44
True, that's one option. I'm holding out hope for a Monstrous Creature akin to a Wraithknight, though, which instead occupies an Elite or Heavy Support choice. After all, the Knight Titan is weaker than the Warhound Titan, which is itself only 720 points. It'd be nice to have a 300 point unit or so which you can take multiples of in a standard army. Well, we'll know for sure either way two months from now.

Moar raelgunns pleaz!

Seriously, as a Tau player I'd actually want this just so Ipmerials can, in the words of Arnold, 'STOP WHINING!'

Avian
24-01-2014, 16:29
With the Stompa, we had Forge World coming out with a number of conversion bitz. I would be surprised if they didn't do the same with the Knight, including parts for a Chaos version.

Shibboleth
24-01-2014, 17:04
Chaos version = add spikes
Yep, we haven't got a Chaos Baneblade yet, so probly no effort will be made on a Chaos Knight either...

I do like the idea of Knights in March, "Come Knights, we march!"
or something... eh...

Inquisitor Kallus
24-01-2014, 17:12
Yep, we haven't got a Chaos Baneblade yet, so probly no effort will be made on a Chaos Knight either...

I do like the idea of Knights in March, "Come Knights, we march!"
or something... eh...

Slaanesh had Knights, but they were quite different to the Imperial versions

Charistoph
24-01-2014, 17:27
I just hope I can get a Thunderbolt or Orion, and delay releasing the Mad Cat.

Oops, wrong game. ;)

I do actually hope I can get one that fits in my Templar Tactics army.

But if I could get a Chaplain Knight with Power Maul and big bolter... :D

Barghest
24-01-2014, 18:26
I just hope I can get a Thunderbolt or Orion, and delay releasing the Mad Cat.

Oops, wrong game. ;)

No, sounds like the right game, the way things have been going...

As for Chaos Knights, I contacted a source and was assured that there WILL be a conversion set, and I was able to snag a screen cap for everyone:

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440335a&prodId=prod1290062

Senbei
24-01-2014, 19:29
Slaanesh had Knights, but they were quite different to the Imperial versions

Yeah, Daemon Knights. They were machine-beast type things. Also looked a bit like they were wearing stockings.

Shibboleth
24-01-2014, 20:38
Slaanesh had Knights, but they were quite different to the Imperial versions Yes, and Slaanesh probly has Baneblades too...

Dkoz
25-01-2014, 00:30
Who are Imperial Knights? Are they like Grey Knights with more Guard options?

The Emperor
25-01-2014, 00:31
Who are Imperial Knights? Are they like Grey Knights with more Guard options?

http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Knight

They're similar to Titans, but they're one-man walkers associated with the Adeptus Mechanicus (albeit not part of it), which hail from "Knight Worlds."

The Emperor
25-01-2014, 00:42
Well, I'm basing my Dataslate belief from this comment.


BTW I am one of the hosts from 40k Radio. (Rik). I bet you see it in the WD then have it come out in Dataslate/mini dex.

We don't really know for certain what format it'll come out it. Dataslate's just seem more logical, though. They won't end up out of print like a White Dwarf and it saves them the expense of a physical book which would likely be pretty small if it's just the stats for Imperial Knights. I could imagine them introducing the stats in White Dwarf first, to help sales of the magazine, but long-term a Dataslate might be the way they go.

As for 7th Edition, I got my impression of their changes from 40k Radio's post on their Facebook page.


40K Radio From what we understand the new Rulebook with incorporate data slates, escalation, stronghold assault, and some tweaks.

So that's why I figured we're not talking big changes, but just collecting all the recently released rules into one book, and not expecting a major overhaul to the rules, which is why a big change to the Vehicle rules seems unlikely to me.

Spiney Norman
25-01-2014, 00:49
So that's why I figured we're not talking big changes, but just collecting all the recently released rules into one book, and not expecting a major overhaul to the rules, which is why a big change to the Vehicle rules seems unlikely to me.

That's why I think they really need to preserve knights using the vehicle rules. With relatively minor tweaks the vehicle rules could be made to work in a satisfactory manner, all they need to do is remove explodes from the damage chart and make it so vehicles cannot be one-shotted (basically they can only be destroyed by removing all HP, whereupon the vehicle could have a chance of exploding or being wrecked).

I do not think there is any chance of them moving all vehicles to a toughness/armour save system because that would be a massive change, we're talking all-current-codexes-become-invalid massive (except for perhaps Tyranids).

Its really not satisfactory to let the "unit type-x using rules for unit type-y" situation continue on through an edition change, its just a totally ham-fisted way of dealing with the problem, rather like saying "well we wanted Eldar banshees to be able to run fast and get a cover save from dodging so we thought we'd give them the unit type Jetbike".

If you want to make rules for a vehicle that can't be one-shotted, give it a vehicle profile with a special rule that stops it being one-shotted, don't just give up and give it a completely irrelevent and contradictory unit type.

The Emperor
25-01-2014, 00:58
It'd be a big change, but at the rate they've been releasing codex books lately, maybe not as hard as it'd be otherwise? They could also provide an errata or update in a new rulebook which provides new stats, just like the 6th edition rulebook gave Hull Point values for a large number of vehicles (I'm just talking in general here, and not about 7th Edition in specific).

As for the Knights, it'd depend on if they actually do update the Vehicle rules to make meaningful changes. According to 40k Radio, we're just looking at tweaks (Which is why I don't expect my above hopes of discarding armor values entirely in favor of Toughness values and Wounds to come true), so any kind of revamp seems like it'd be pretty unlikely, in which case a year from now Walkers may have the same exact issues they currently have, but who knows? It's apparently at the printers and should be out in eight months or so, so we'll know for sure then. In the meantime, I just hope that the intervening seven months are spent with an Imperial Knight which has a set of rules which are fun and worth the $100~ it'll likely cost.

Spiney Norman
25-01-2014, 01:06
It'd be a big change, but at the rate they've been releasing codex books lately, maybe not as hard as it'd be otherwise? They could also provide an errata or update in a new rulebook which provides new stats, just like the 6th edition rulebook gave Hull Point values for a large number of vehicles (I'm just talking in general here, and not about 7th Edition in specific).
Err, they'd be writing a completely new style of profile for around a quarter of the units in the game, that goes a little bit beyond the scope of 'FAQ', not to mention inventing a whole slew of new special rules to make vehicles behave in a vaguely realistic way.


As for the Knights, it'd depend on if they actually do update the Vehicle rules to make meaningful changes. According to 40k Radio, we're just looking at tweaks (Which is why I don't expect my above hopes of discarding armor values entirely in favor of Toughness values and Wounds to come true), so any kind of revamp seems like it'd be pretty unlikely, in which case a year from now Walkers may have the same exact issues they currently have, but who knows? It's apparently at the printers and should be out in eight months or so, so we'll know for sure then. In the meantime, I just hope that the intervening seven months are spent with an Imperial Knight which has a set of rules which are fun and worth the $100~ it'll likely cost.

This is one of the reasons why I desperately hope they go down the stompa-route and make the Imperial Knights a slightly lighter class of super-heavies (in the same range as the Necron obelisk, A12 and around 6HP), it allows them to conveniently dodge the problem with creating more non-MC-MCs.

I think it actually makes good sense to have them as Lord of War units if they want to bring escalation into the core rules as part of their "7th Ed" revision (or whatever it is going to be) because it would allow SM players to play with LoW without dropping 400 on a Thunderhawk or more on a Titan.

The Emperor
25-01-2014, 01:14
Err, they'd be writing a completely new style of profile for at least a quarter of the units in the game, that goes a little bit beyond the scope of 'FAQ'.

What'd be needed beyond a Toughness value, Wound value, and Armor Save, for the most part? Check out Page 134-137 in the rulebook where you can find stats for everything in game, and Vehicles have Hull Points added to their profiles and possibly some Type changes. Just do the same, only instead of adding Hull Points, restat them. For example:

DREADNOUGHT WS: 4, BS: 4, S: 10, T: 8, W: 3, I: 4, A: 2, Ld: 10, Sv: 3+

Simple.

But anyway, all of this is getting wildly off-topic. We can take this to the general discussion thread on the very subject (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?387711-What-if-Riptides-Dreadknights-and-more-were-walkers/page5).

Mike3791
25-01-2014, 02:25
The rebranding of IG is surprising, but for trade mark it makes sense. I was half expecting Eldar to be rebranded Craftworld Eldar since the word is a direct Tolkien rip, the same way Tau Empire got rebranded back in 05 (I think).

Imperial Guard is also the name of the Emperor's red bodyguards from Star Wars. Craftworld Eldar seemed likely after the Dark Eldar update.


As for Space Marines being rebranded, I'd say they probably protect that IP like it's the Federal Reserve.

Swish! :p

Darnok
25-01-2014, 06:03
A good number of off topic posts has been removed. If you wish to discuss the pros and cons of possible rules - which is speculation - please do so in 40K General.


Darnok [=I=]

TheBearminator
25-01-2014, 10:46
I don't think anyone has mentioned this yet, but IG is getting a new name with their new codex a la SoB. According to 40K Radio's source, they'll be renamed to the Astra Militarium.

Let the whining commence! :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sounds OK to me. I always thought Imperial Guard sounded somewhat... Uninspiring.

MajorWesJanson
25-01-2014, 11:10
Sounds OK to me. I always thought Imperial Guard sounded somewhat... Uninspiring.

I would have preferred the Departmento Munitorium

Poncho160
25-01-2014, 12:26
What is the point of changing the Guards name? Absolutely zero people will call them by the new name and it will just confuse newbies starting the game.

No one is going to walk into a shop and ask for Adeptus Militaris or what ever. They will ask to see the Imperial Guard Codex or models.

It is also a bit confusing to pronounce.

Erazmus_M_Wattle
25-01-2014, 13:00
I can only assume they didn't call it departmento munitorum because the army can contain other elements of the Imperium's military might other than the departmento munitorum.

I'm not especially bothered that it's bad cod Latin either. If you were lucky enough to have the opportunity to learn Latin in school then go you. Well done. However even Latin used by he church isn't the Latin the Roman Empire used so it doesn't really make any difference. The use of cod Latin is there to give us the feeling of an ancient language that the vast majority of the imperial subjects don't actually understand. I'm not sure many are aware of the fact but High Gothic is actually meant to be English. In 40,000 years the language has changed and it's become vastly different to the one we know today. How do you get that across to gamers by using our English? You can't so GW uses cod Latin.

Anyway. I quite like the idea of the name "Astra Militarium" it sounds cool. It's a massive departure from calling it Imperial Guard. They've been called that since second edition. First edition they were called Imperial Army. So it's going to take a lot of getting used to. My guard playing gaming buddy is going to totally hate it. Lol.

Anyway. On the topic of the Imperial Knight model; I really hope this rumour pans out as being true. I loved the idea of the imperial knight households. I've still got some knocking around somewhere from Titan Legions. Epic scale obviously. I've been keen to have some for a long time. Was I going to scratch build one? Was I going to but one of the fan made kits out there? Was I going to convert using a dread knight? I hadn't made my mind up yet and I'd love to see how GW would update the look. FW made an absolutely sterling job of updating the war hound and reader titans. They still conserve the look of the old epic models but have a more believable technological realism about them. If that's possible.

My hope would be that they expand on the Knight background a bit, give us a better idea of heraldry. They shouldn't just be painted in the colour schemes of the Titan ordos. They had their own heraldry like he knights of the Middle Ages. And one day I'd like them to give us details about the Chaos households. I just hope they don't make them all daemon engines. That's a bit do a cop out and is boring.

And I'd like to point out that the hellstrider of Slaanesh and it's partner were not knights. They were a class of scout tian in the same scale as the Warhound. They'd need a kit the size of the Stompa and to be honest I can't imagine GW doing them although there's no reason why Forgeworld shouldn't.

I'm also hoping if this is true that the knight kit has the possibility of doing the knight as any of the knight variants. There's no reason there couldn't be parts to extend the legs to make a Lancer or extra armour parts for the heavier variants. Although it's possible Forgeworld could provide conversion kits for them. I'm a bit saddened by the fact that Forgeworld do far less of the conversion kits than they used to in favour of completely new kits. Conversion kits are what the did to start with and I liked that much better.

If the new guard codex really is going to be more of a combined military might of the Imperium of Man then a Riptide/wraithknight kit one the main army list rather than a super heavy in lords of war suits me just fine. Besides a lord of war limits you to one. Why not have it as a heavy support unit and we can have, in the style of US government military spending, three Knights for three times the price. He he.




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TheFang
25-01-2014, 13:09
What is the point of changing the Guards name? Absolutely zero people will call them by the new name and it will just confuse newbies starting the game.


You can't trademark "Imperial Guard" and get real protection because so many real world forces had them. I can come up with my Napoleon in space army and call the elite the Imperial Guard. I could then produce add on parts for my SpaceNap Imperial Guard which happen to fit GW's Guard kits and there's little GW could do to stop it.

You can trademark "Astra Militarium". It's a way to try and reduce the penetration of third party bits manufacturers.

Ghal Maraz
25-01-2014, 13:19
I think Low Gothic is meant to be English, while High Gothic is pseudo-Latin, actually.

The Imperial Guard was named Imperial Army just for the first quarter or so (probably less that that) of Rogue Trader, then it was swapped for Imperial Guard.

Knights coming back for the Imperium would be good. One can only hope that sometime in the future even the Xenos races could get back some of their lost background...


But I'm still more intrigued by what 7th edition will mean. As, in the words of my FLGS owner, "yeah, it's a long well known fact it is coming". Which is something I haven't dismissed so easily, because he doesn't ever share anything. I guess GW is really trying to do something entirely unexpected. Me, I'm just waiting to see if something good's gonna come out of all this mess.



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static grass
25-01-2014, 13:47
You can't trademark "Imperial Guard" and get real protection because so many real world forces had them. I can come up with my Napoleon in space army and call the elite the Imperial Guard. I could then produce add on parts for my SpaceNap Imperial Guard which happen to fit GW's Guard kits and there's little GW could do to stop it.

You can trademark "Astra Militarium". It's a way to try and reduce the penetration of third party bits manufacturers.


You can but they haven't atleast not according the Intellectual Property Office in the UK.

Shibboleth
25-01-2014, 14:12
Third partiers can still make bits for 'Imperial Guard' and everyone will know what it's for, and now GW can't touch 'em...

Silvertongue
25-01-2014, 14:35
I would have preferred the Departmento Munitorium

All these names sound quite ridiculous, at least for a spaniard. Our language is quite close to latin in many word roots, and it makes these names sound like what they are: a mish-mash that makes no sense and doesn't even sound cool.

Having said that, I couldn't care less.

TheBearminator
25-01-2014, 16:50
In any case, both Imperial Guard and Astra Militarium sounds way better than Space Marines. That sounds like something you'd expect to find on a five year old's wishlist. How about we change it to World Police? That would be a lot more intriguing. :-)

Edit: By the way. I've seen a picture of an Imperial Knight from Epic. It was awful, but I mean no Epic models are very beautiful. Besides, it must be age old by now. I'm not impressed by the forgeworld titans. The hounds are OK at best. What do you think we can expect this time? Does anyone have a good link or picture of an Imperial Knight from artwork or so?

Fear Ghoul
25-01-2014, 16:54
I don't see the problem with the name change. Imperial Guard will probably still be the informal name, just as Space Marines is the informal name of the Adeptus Astartes.

Iball17
25-01-2014, 17:06
I really have my doubts on them changing the name just like "space marine" could not be copyrighted yet they still use it they will just copyright the armies like cadian. It will be interesting to see if the baneblade will be in the codex.

Fen
25-01-2014, 17:12
I really have my doubts on them changing the name just like "space marine" could not be copyrighted yet they still use it they will just copyright the armies like cadian. It will be interesting to see if the baneblade will be in the codex.

Space marine is actually a GW trademark as far as GW is concerned(how far they can defend it is another story,but look at the legal section on their site) while IG isnt

And the guard regiments' names are already trademarked

Iball17
25-01-2014, 17:44
Space marine is actually a GW trademark as far as GW is concerned(how far they can defend it is another story,but look at the legal section on their site) while IG isnt

And the guard regiments' names are already trademarked

If they have little or no legal backing they dont have real ownership of it. They just have not been challenged by someone with same amount of money to pour into the legal system.

static grass
25-01-2014, 18:00
Space marine is actually a GW trademark as far as GW is concerned(how far they can defend it is another story,but look at the legal section on their site) while IG isnt

And the guard regiments' names are already trademarked

Really they are? Can you show me where?

Darnok
25-01-2014, 20:06
You can but they haven't atleast not according the Intellectual Property Office in the UK.

You mean I could do that right now and GW was screwed? I think it is safe to assume that this rumour about the name change is BS then. Any printed product for a release in March/April is done by now. It would be pants-on-head stupid to not have the copyrights sorted by now.

Lion275
25-01-2014, 20:53
Ok some more news. There was a slight misunderstanding of the new IG name....Astra Militarum. No extra "I" in there. And from our source there will be a mix of Cadian and Catachan releases for Astra Militarum. So the rumors of Catachans going away would appear to be incorrect.

Inquisitor Kallus
25-01-2014, 21:11
Ok some more news. There was a slight misunderstanding of the new IG name....Astra Militarum. No extra "I" in there. And from our source there will be a mix of Cadian and Catachan releases for Astra Militarum. So the rumors of Catachans going away would appear to be incorrect.

Sweet. No news about new 'Guard' regiments?

Thanks Lion

Lion275
25-01-2014, 21:24
I would not anticipate new regiements, or at least new models for them. While it would be really cool to see Steel Legion make a come back in plastic I just don't see GW having three separate lines all under the Astra Militarum. You would be looking at 3 new kits (Command Box, Squad Box, and Heavy Weapon box) just to bring that army into line with Catachans and Cadians. And that would take away from what ever they already had planned for them. I see GW trying to get rid of metal kits (Ratlings and Karskin/Storm Troopers), and adding a few new plastic kits. Even though I don't play them I would love to see a new Catachan box as those models pre-date me being in the hobby.

The Emperor
25-01-2014, 21:26
The original pewter Catachan miniatures were fantastic. I used to have a squad of them just because they looked so great. The current plastic infantry versions are pretty terrible, so it'd be nice to see updated plastic versions which look as great as the original classic versions.

As for Ratlings, have you heard any rumors of them being produced in plastic? If GW decides to get rid of the metals entirely, then hopefully that won't mean that they'll do away with the unit in the meantime.

Lion275
25-01-2014, 21:33
I have not heard any rumors specifically but GW is a creature of habit. They want to get everything into plastic. The only thing I could see holding Ratlings back would be they are not as widely used as other units in the codex. Or they may have a gigantic back stock of metal Ratlings they want to get through first. Only time will tell.

The Emperor
25-01-2014, 21:33
Well, here's hoping. I love those little Hobbit snipers.

Avian
25-01-2014, 22:15
You mean I could do that right now and GW was screwed? I think it is safe to assume that this rumour about the name change is BS then. Any printed product for a release in March/April is done by now. It would be pants-on-head stupid to not have the copyrights sorted by now.
Wasn't one conclusion from the whole Chapterhouse farce that you don't need to register trademarks you have in use? IIRC it was only because they didn't have a model to go with the Tervigon name that CHS could start to make a model under that name. And presumably there is some sort of time limit to how close someone can publish something else with the same name and get away with it. AND I don't think you can register a trademark unless you're going to actually release something under that name within some reasonable period of time.

Copyrights can't be registered AFAIK.

Darnok
25-01-2014, 22:23
Wasn't one conclusion from the whole Chapterhouse farce that you don't need to register trademarks you have in use? IIRC it was only because they didn't have a model to go with the Tervigon name that CHS could start to make a model under that name. And presumably there is some sort of time limit to how close someone can publish something else with the same name and get away with it. AND I don't think you can register a trademark unless you're going to actually release something under that name within some reasonable period of time.

Copyrights can't be registered AFAIK.

That would explain a lot. Thanks.

Fable
25-01-2014, 22:42
Wasn't one conclusion from the whole Chapterhouse farce that you don't need to register trademarks you have in use? IIRC it was only because they didn't have a model to go with the Tervigon name that CHS could start to make a model under that name. And presumably there is some sort of time limit to how close someone can publish something else with the same name and get away with it. AND I don't think you can register a trademark unless you're going to actually release something under that name within some reasonable period of time.

Copyrights can't be registered AFAIK.

I have had the copyright process take over a year in the US, and with GW's roughly 6 month complete to print window it might not process in that time, but still be protected by application date or publishing date, whichever is earlier.

Last I knew, in the US titles are not protected by copyright, so protecting them often falls to trademarking word combinations.

static grass
25-01-2014, 22:57
That would explain a lot. Thanks.

Remember even if you can explain it in 100 words the whole IP infringement scene is big money so it is not so simple :) The Chapterhouse thing isn't finished yet but one of the most concrete conclusions thus far was that GW was able to copyright their shoulder pad design for Space Marines. As always(?) other people can use your names but they cant use your logos (trademarks) or generally make products that might confuse the consumer. So you can still reference Space Marines for your conversion parts. See Chapterhouse Studios website. GW have very few registered Trademarks mainly GW, Space Marine, etc.

Born Again
25-01-2014, 23:50
I'm not buying the name change. Aside from the fact they've been called Imperial Guard for 95% of the game's life (as opposed to Sisters, who have been through Sisters of Battle, Witch Hunters, and Adeptus Sororitas in just 3 books), the term 'Astra Militarum' has, to my knowledge, never been used in 40k ever. 'Adeptus Sororitas' was the long-standing 'official' name for them in the background. Also, claims of name changes seems to be the in thing the past few years - Dark Eldar were supposed to get one, and Space Marines were supposed to become Astartes too IIRC.

High Marshal Siegfried
26-01-2014, 12:55
On the topic of the Imperial knights, March would also be the release date of Titanfall (Video game with big stompy mechs, been getting lots of praise / publicity / hype). Coincidence, or clever marketing? ;)

Bigglesworth
26-01-2014, 13:21
On the topic of the Imperial knights, March would also be the release date of Titanfall (Video game with big stompy mechs, been getting lots of praise / publicity / hype). Coincidence, or clever marketing? ;)


I imagine the release was decided before titanfalls announcement (or at least release date announcement)... And consider the months titanfall was not released, I.e when the riptide and eldar thingy were released...

Big stompy robots are popular any time of the year.

Any smart person would not have a big release in the same month as a big Game, as thats 40 they won't be spending on a new miniature, many feature films have learned this the hard way.

So coincidence is my bet.

TheBearminator
26-01-2014, 15:08
Astartes would've been a welcome name change to Marines. And Dark Eldar is a crappy name as well. All these prefixes get tiresome very fast. Dark Eldar, Dark Elves, Dark Angels, Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Dwarves. Can't they come up with something new?

Edit: Once again. Are there any artwork that might give a hint on how an Imperial Knight might look? Other than the hideous epic model?

Azazyll
26-01-2014, 17:13
Astartes would've been a welcome name change to Marines. And Dark Eldar is a crappy name as well. All these prefixes get tiresome very fast. Dark Eldar, Dark Elves, Dark Angels, Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Dwarves. Can't they come up with something new?

Edit: Once again. Are there any artwork that might give a hint on how an Imperial Knight might look? Other than the hideous epic model?

Yes. Type Imperial Knight Epic into google and you will find several images. They look basically the same as the epic models. Which are pretty good for epic, actually.

Spiney Norman
26-01-2014, 19:30
Astartes would've been a welcome name change to Marines. And Dark Eldar is a crappy name as well. All these prefixes get tiresome very fast. Dark Eldar, Dark Elves, Dark Angels, Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Dwarves. Can't they come up with something new?

Edit: Once again. Are there any artwork that might give a hint on how an Imperial Knight might look? Other than the hideous epic model?

Unfortunately they look quite a lot like a scaled up warmachine warjacks

TheBearminator
26-01-2014, 19:32
You know, suddenly I'm not all that excited anymore. I hope they did a total remake in this case. :(

Avian
26-01-2014, 19:59
Unfortunately they look quite a lot like a scaled up warmachine warjacks

People who play Cygnar should already have theirs ready. :D

http://privateerpress.com/warmachine/gallery/cygnar/colossals/stormwall

Darnok
26-01-2014, 20:05
People who play Cygnar should already have theirs ready. :D

http://privateerpress.com/warmachine/gallery/cygnar/colossals/stormwall

The Khador one is pretty 40K-ish too.

Hendarion
26-01-2014, 20:41
Too much offtopic...

Mr_Rose
26-01-2014, 21:08
I want Knights back in the game so this is good.
I loathe many of GW's recent design decisions so this is potentially bad.

My secret hope is that they let FW do the actual sculpting then made an injection mould from that.

Morathi's Darkest Sin
26-01-2014, 21:33
As long as it isn't a Dreadnought in a harness, I think we'll be alright. ;)

The Emperor
26-01-2014, 23:22
You know, suddenly I'm not all that excited anymore. I hope they did a total remake in this case. :(

Maybe they will? Who knows. Remember, this is a design that they haven't touched in, what, 20 years? They've never had a need before to update the appearance of the Imperial Knight Titan, but now that they're bringing it back, they're probably revamping its look from the ground up while trying to keep it somewhat recognizable.

MajorWesJanson
27-01-2014, 01:13
Maybe they will? Who knows. Remember, this is a design that they haven't touched in, what, 20 years? They've never had a need before to update the appearance of the Imperial Knight Titan, but now that they're bringing it back, they're probably revamping its look from the ground up while trying to keep it somewhat recognizable.

And while it is not Forgeworld doing the Knight, look at how the old epic Warhound and Reaver titans were updated to modern detail and functional appearances. And the Wraithknight was an update on the old Towering Destroyer/Fire Gale Eldar Knights.

The Emperor
27-01-2014, 01:41
Yep. They went from this...

186009

...to this.

186010

We'll likely see the same with the Imperial Knight.

Azazyll
27-01-2014, 03:18
Yes indeed. Try not to trash a hypothetical, rumored model made in 28mm scale with modern plastic injection techniques and CAD technology because it may or may not be based on a twenty year old hand sculpted pewter model designed for a 6mm game. That would be silly even for Whineseer.

Although I do miss the old over the top Eldar back finials.

totgeboren
27-01-2014, 07:40
As long as it isn't a Dreadnought in a harness, I think we'll be alright. ;)

GW redesigns make me scared, though the DreadDreadKnightKnight to the right (http://www.abload.de/img/knightmare_finalvuwx.jpg) is the prefect size (or maybe a tiny bit too big).

MiyamatoMusashi
27-01-2014, 10:33
Nice pic. Yeah, somewhere between the DreadKnight and the DreadDreadKnightKnight seems about right to me.

Shibboleth
27-01-2014, 10:51
I hope they do an updated version of the old plastic Knight rather than the metals. They were perfect.

xerxeshavelock
27-01-2014, 15:05
I hope they do an updated version of the old plastic Knight rather than the metals. They were perfect.

I'm hoping for the exact opposite. Not saying the old (as in original) metals couldn't do with an update, but they're far more original and more dynamic than the stompy plastics that came after. What I'm really hoping for is they release a kit that has 3 very distinct versions rather than one with all the weapon options.

Binky
27-01-2014, 15:33
Yep, I like the older metal ones as well, hoping for multiple kits to make the different types, basically a heavy support, scout and a mid-level one.

TheBearminator
27-01-2014, 18:53
Yeah, about the forgeworld titans and hounds and such. How old are those models?

miciobello
27-01-2014, 20:47
Yeeesssssss!!!!

You just nailed it with this comment. . . .

Inquisitor Kallus
27-01-2014, 21:00
I'm hoping for the exact opposite. Not saying the old (as in original) metals couldn't do with an update, but they're far more original and more dynamic than the stompy plastics that came after. What I'm really hoping for is they release a kit that has 3 very distinct versions rather than one with all the weapon options.

likewise. It's possible that a number ofdifferent heads and armour plates could be included, as well as weapons, to make different classes of knights. We could even say a knight command unit that gives a bonus to other knights, maybe with baners/pennants and the like.

TheBearminator
28-01-2014, 01:12
Something sentinel like? I'm not a fan of forgeworlds titans and super heavies. But the sentinels are among the most beautiful vehicles in the game imo. So I hope they come up with something that resembles to a sentinel. And that can kill three Wraithknights per turn.

But seriously, it'll be interesting to see what they put in the box, as there are so many different Imperial armies out there. To please all players I think the first thing is to include a great number of both shooty and cc options.

lordbeefy
28-01-2014, 18:16
Absolutely delighted to hear this. Will absolutely be getting at least one.

Not sure bout them name though, they will always be my Guard!

The Emperor
29-01-2014, 05:55
Absolutely delighted to hear this. Will absolutely be getting at least one.

Not sure bout them name though, they will always be my Guard!

Hopefully the name will just be a catch-all for all the various organizations mixed in and inside the book they'll still be referred to as the Imperial Guard.

ObiWayneKenobi
29-01-2014, 19:50
Late to the party, but has it been stated if the Imperial Knights are going to be a bolt-on to an existing army, or are they going to be their own force/codex? From what little I've seen of their fluff (before my time) they are supposed to be fairly powerful so an entire army of them seems like it'd be into the realm of silliness or the 20-man GK Draigowing style of army where you field barely anything.

However it'd be awesome if they were made into a complete codex. The temptation to do a Game of Thrones-style Knight House would be too hard to ignore :D

TheBearminator
29-01-2014, 22:20
No one seems to know, but hardly material for a new codex. But it appears that you'll be able to field them with pretty much any kind of Imperial army. Don't know in what form it's rules are gonna be published, if it'll be one kind or several types of units and so on or how many you'll be able to use in a game.

The Emperor
29-01-2014, 22:25
Yep. We're likely looking at one to a handful of unit entries (if there're any variations) which'll likely be published in White Dwarf and/or a Dataslate and which will be available to all Imperial armies (Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Grey Knights, Space Marines, Space Wolves, Imperial Guard, Adepta Sororitas, and Inquisition). That seems to be as far as a logical extrapolation of what we know can take you.

Charistoph
30-01-2014, 06:01
I guess it depends on how the company sees how well the Dataslates and Formations have been selling.

If they are perceived to have been selling well, then they will be a Dataslate and organized akin to the Inquisition.

I do wonder if they will be able to be a Primary Detachment like the Inquisition, though.

The Emperor
30-01-2014, 09:30
That'd be interesting. Maybe something like so?

HQ: Baron

TROOPS: Knight Paladin

ELITE: Knight Errant

FAST ATTACK: Knight Lancer

HEAVY SUPPORT: Knight Crusader, Knight Castellan

Nah, there's no way they'd release an army like that! I have to say, though, it'd be pretty funny to have an 1850 army which consists of about seven models. :p

OuroborosTriumphant
30-01-2014, 09:37
With Codex: Inquisition, they proved perfectly willing to rewrite the force organization chart for Inquisitorial detachments. They may do so again.

Worth noting though, Codex: Inquisition was a purely digital release without new model support, as have been dataslates and formations to date. If this is supporting a new plastic kit (and in GW's mind, rules are support for models, not vice versa), they may do things differently.

stevegill
30-01-2014, 09:44
With Codex: Inquisition, they proved perfectly willing to rewrite the force organization chart for Inquisitorial detachments. They may do so again.

Worth noting though, Codex: Inquisition was a purely digital release without new model support, as have been dataslates and formations to date. If this is supporting a new plastic kit (and in GW's mind, rules are support for models, not vice versa), they may do things differently.

Whichever way they go about it GW will be breaking new ground if they release a new kit that's not just a simple codex add-in.

If they aren't going to be standard FOC adds I would really think the rules should come with the kit.

The Emperor
30-01-2014, 10:06
Personally, I suspect that it won't even be as complex as Codex: Inquisition, and that it'll be a single unit with multiple weapon options (which can represent those variant Knight units and maybe some new weapon options which didn't exist in Epic) which can be slotted into any Imperial army depending on what sort of unit it is. If it's a Monstrous Creature along the lines of a Riptide or Wraithknight or a Walker, then it'll be an Elite or Heavy Support option which will be available to all Imperial armies just like any other Elite or Heavy Support option from their own Codex. If it's a Super Heavy, then it'll be a Lord of War option equally available to all of them. Either way, I doubt the rules for taking it will be very complicated.

MajorWesJanson
30-01-2014, 10:11
Nah, there's no way they'd release an army like that! I have to say, though, it'd be pretty funny to have an 1850 army which consists of about seven models. :p

You mean Armored Company?


Personally, I suspect that it won't even be as complex as Codex: Inquisition, and that it'll be a single unit with multiple weapon options (which can represent those variant Knight units and maybe some new weapon options which didn't exist in Epic) which can be slotted into any Imperial army depending on what sort of unit it is. If it's a Monstrous Creature along the lines of a Riptide or Wraithknight or a Walker, then it'll be an Elite or Heavy Support option which will be available to all Imperial armies just like any other Elite or Heavy Support option from their own Codex. If it's a Super Heavy, then it'll be a Lord of War option equally available to all of them. Either way, I doubt the rules for taking it will be very complicated.

Agreed. I'm starting to think it will lean in the direction of resembling the Defiler, both in cost and rules. With some options to trade the gun for other weapons, likely various Leman Russ turret options. As for organization, maybe as a formation of 1-3 Knights and an obligatory Tech Priest.

Binky
30-01-2014, 10:34
I would think it could easily be done as a full codex with just three kits, mid-level knight with two basic builds and an HQ option, then fast attack and heavy versions with two builds each, couple of weapon options in each (maybe interchangeable between kits) and you've got a full knight force available. That's probably over optimistic though, I suspect a single kit with a dataslate is more likely.

The Emperor
30-01-2014, 10:37
You mean Armored Company?

Yeah, I remembered after I made that post that there was already an option for a hideously expensive but equally small army. :p


Agreed. I'm starting to think it will lean in the direction of resembling the Defiler, both in cost and rules.

Boy, I hope not. The Defiler's little better than a standard Dreadnought. For something that big, I'd expect tougher.


I would think it could easily be done as a full codex with just three kits, mid-level knight with two basic builds and an HQ option, then fast attack and heavy versions with two builds each, couple of weapon options in each (maybe interchangeable between kits) and you've got a full knight force available. That's probably over optimistic though, I suspect a single kit with a dataslate is more likely.

Well, it'd certainly be interesting. ;) I've been thinking of getting an Armored Company, too, but odds are that like the Armored Company, a Knight Household operating on its own might end up getting overwhelmed by a prepared opponent.

laudarkul
30-01-2014, 11:16
Any info's if the Mechanicum from FW will be able to join the Knight for an 40K army list?

The Emperor
30-01-2014, 11:18
All we know of the Knight at the moment is that it's coming out in March and will be available to every Imperial army. Beyond that, nobody can say anything. There definitely hasn't been even the barest wisp of a rumor about the rules, so who knows how they'll be able to interact with any lists from Forge World.

OuroborosTriumphant
30-01-2014, 11:25
Massacre, the second HH book, gives permission/guidelines for taking any Imperial superheavy without a 30k-equivalent as a Lord of War (which, bear in mind, is slightly different in 30k). So if Knights are Superheavy Wakers, they'll be available to the Mechanicum via that route.

laudarkul
30-01-2014, 11:46
I have Massacre, but it's about 30k...I'm curious also about 40k :D ...

TheBearminator
30-01-2014, 12:05
Is it really a sound strategy from GW to sell giant plastic kits that can't be used for regular games? At least IG already has one, the Baneblade. I don't know about the other Imperial factions. But I actually thought a lot of players was like me, grownups with limited spare time but with steady income. I would love to have a Stompa for my Orks, or a Baneblade for my IG. I could certainly afford them (and since I started airbrushing I could probably even find the hours to paint them!) but I would get to use them like once a year, cause I simply don't have time for that type of massive games. I wonder if GW ever think of it that way OR if they only think that the impressive Stompa will encourage Ork players to buy another 200 Orks and the escalation rules.

The Emperor
30-01-2014, 12:18
Well, that's the point of the Escalation supplement, so that you can use big units like the Stompa, Baneblade, and Lord of Skulls in regular games and not be limited to Apocalypse games.

Darnok
30-01-2014, 12:38
Well, that's the point of the Escalation supplement, so that you can use big units like the Stompa, Baneblade, and Lord of Skulls in regular games and not be limited to Apocalypse games.

But not whole armies of them...

Dark Primus
30-01-2014, 12:46
Vehicles with invulnerable saves seems so weird and backwards to me, but I can't deny that it helps with things like daemon engines.

Fluffwise the invulnerable save can be anything, like for example a forcefield to help shield the vehicle.

MajorWesJanson
30-01-2014, 12:56
Yes, being a non-superheavy would make it easier to field. Especially if they allow multiples in one army. More sales of that nice $115 kit if you can run 3 in a list, rather than a single lord of war.

The Emperor
30-01-2014, 13:01
But not whole armies of them...

I got the impression from the poster I replied to that he was talking about people only being able to use one in large point games, not multiples. But yeah, GW's more likely to see sales from a unit if it falls into a slot other than the Lord of War slot. Just compare the Stompa to the Wraithknight. The former is $115.50 while the latter's $115, but most Ork players will probably only buy one of the former, whereas Eldar players might potentially buy up to three of the latter. That's $345 for GW instead of just $115.50. GW might've been better served making something like the Stompa a 300 point Heavy Support choice for Orks rather than a 700+ point Lord of War.

TheBearminator
30-01-2014, 13:21
I got the impression from the poster I replied to that he was talking about people only being able to use one in large point games, not multiples. But yeah, GW's more likely to see sales from a unit if it falls into a slot other than the Lord of War slot. Just compare the Stompa to the Wraithknight. The former is $115.50 while the latter's $115, but most Ork players will probably only buy one of the former, whereas Eldar players might potentially buy up to three of the latter. That's $345 for GW instead of just $115.50. GW might've been better served making something like the Stompa a 300 point Heavy Support choice for Orks rather than a 700+ point Lord of War.

Appearantly I'd misunderstood the Escalation idea. I've been in the startup phase of two armies since it was released so I haven't had any interest in 90 models.

But this is pretty much what I meant. Better to keep it on Wraithknight level and sell multiple than aim at larger games or just sell a maximum of one to every Imperial player.

Darnok
30-01-2014, 13:28
I got the impression from the poster I replied to that he was talking about people only being able to use one in large point games, not multiples. But yeah, GW's more likely to see sales from a unit if it falls into a slot other than the Lord of War slot. Just compare the Stompa to the Wraithknight. The former is $115.50 while the latter's $115, but most Ork players will probably only buy one of the former, whereas Eldar players might potentially buy up to three of the latter. That's $345 for GW instead of just $115.50. GW might've been better served making something like the Stompa a 300 point Heavy Support choice for Orks rather than a 700+ point Lord of War.

I don't know about you, but I have a Stompa - and it is massive. I get a headache when thinking about transporting it, so more than one would be a full-on nightmare. I know the Wraithknight is not as massive, but propably not easy to transport either. From that point of view I'm actually not that happy about more and more huge models. Transporting all those monstrosities can become a difficult issue.

The Emperor
30-01-2014, 13:32
Well, as an Imperial player, I wouldn't mind the option of being able to take up to three if it's good. :p I've always been a fan of giant robots (Transformers, Robotech, Voltron, Gundam Wing, Pacific Rim, etc.), so I'd love it if I could take a Knight as an Elite or Heavy Support choice rather than being restricted to a single Lord of War (Besides, the Imperium's already got Lord of War Walkers, the Warhound and Reaver Titans, and the Warhound's comparatively cheap at 720 points).


I don't know about you, but I have a Stompa - and it is massive. I get a headache when thinking about transporting it, so more than one would be a full-on nightmare. I know the Wraithknight is not as massive, but propably not easy to transport either. From that point of view I'm actually not that happy about more and more huge models. Transporting all those monstrosities can become a difficult issue.

Good point. I'd forgotten about just how big the Stompa actually is. I was just thinking back to how the Stompa was supposed to be the equivalent of the Eldar and Imperial Knights. Maybe GW could do a version which isn't quite so big?

Spiney Norman
30-01-2014, 13:37
With Codex: Inquisition, they proved perfectly willing to rewrite the force organization chart for Inquisitorial detachments. They may do so again.

Worth noting though, Codex: Inquisition was a purely digital release without new model support, as have been dataslates and formations to date. If this is supporting a new plastic kit (and in GW's mind, rules are support for models, not vice versa), they may do things differently.

I don't think GW will release a new model whose rules are only available via data slate, if they are feeling inordinately generous they might put the rules in the box like they did with the firestorm redoubt, or more likely they will print them in White Dwarf (or include a pamphlet with it like they have done with waves of new models that release before their army book/codex). however they choose to do it, I imagine there will be a digital version of it before too long as well. I don't really see it being data slate only because they limits the market for a model they obviously want to sell lots of.

MajorWesJanson
30-01-2014, 13:50
I don't know about you, but I have a Stompa - and it is massive. I get a headache when thinking about transporting it, so more than one would be a full-on nightmare. I know the Wraithknight is not as massive, but propably not easy to transport either. From that point of view I'm actually not that happy about more and more huge models. Transporting all those monstrosities can become a difficult issue.

Well, the Riptide and Wraithknight rather handily separate at the waist, with or without magnets, so they can basically be split in half for transport.

Poseidal
30-01-2014, 14:12
Well, the Riptide and Wraithknight rather handily separate at the waist, with or without magnets, so they can basically be split in half for transport.

I broke the little join on mine, so I glued it in (though doing that allows you to pose it at more angles).

The join actually looks similar; if the Imperial Knights is the same, could you swap out parts like in Armored Core?

TheBearminator
30-01-2014, 16:50
Yeah, there's a generous range of giant robots to take inspiration from. I personally like the Evangelion robots. Don't expect the Imperial Knight to be much like them though. ;)

Vida
30-01-2014, 18:09
Don't forget they can always easily say 1-3 Knights count as your Lord of War choice. Just because they haven't done it yet doesn't mean they wont.

Krieg Marshall
31-01-2014, 11:38
It's certainly a stupid question, but imperial knights won't unbalance the IG? I mean, the IG is the most traditionnal army in the WH40k universe and there is a clear separation between the navy, the admech, the adeptus astates and other organisations. I know that the admech may join forces with IG for certain operations. It's a personnal point of view, but the IG rely on infantry, tanks and artillery, why adding such a unit, wich seems to be basicly a tank with legs?

I'm may be considered as a black sheep, but my question seems legit. If you want to thrash me and my opinion do it by PM, this thread is not the right place for arguments. I will happily explain my point of view to anyone who feels hurt.

The Emperor
31-01-2014, 11:49
The rules for Imperial Knights aren't being published in the 6th edition Codex: Imperial Guard/Codex: Astra Militarum, which comes out in April, but in a separate venue (White Dwarf article, Dataslate, or something else) which comes out in March, and they'll be available to all Imperial armies, not just the Imperial Guard.

Although even if they were in the next Codex: Imperial Guard, I don't see why there would be an issue. After all, we already have several units from several different Imperial organizations outside of the Imperial Guard which can be found in the current Codex: Imperial Guard. Techpriest Enginseers are Adeptus Mechanicus agents, Valkyrie's and Vendetta's are a part of the Imperial Navy, Primaris Psykers are part of the Adeptus Astra Telapathica, Priests are part of the Adeptus Ministorum, and so on. Codex: Imperial Guard has always covered those units which not only constitute the Imperial Guard, but those from other organizations which frequently fight alongside the Imperial Guard (Which might partially be why the name of the book is changing to Astra Militarum, to account for those organizations which fall outside of the Imperial Guard structure which are in the book).

TheFang
31-01-2014, 11:57
Plus unlike Defilers, Riptides, Heldrakes, Forgefiends and most of the other stuff which has appeared to fill the "large model" FOC slot there's actually pre-existing background for the Knights. Not something which has just appeared from nowhere but a blank from the past being filled.

The Emperor
31-01-2014, 12:03
Plus unlike Defilers, Riptides, Heldrakes, Forgefiends and most of the other stuff which has appeared to fill the "large model" FOC slot there's actually pre-existing background for the Knights. Not something which has just appeared from nowhere but a blank from the past being filled.

Yep, that's part of what has me excited. I thought they were awesome when I first saw them in advertisements and battle reports when Epic: Titan Legions came out. Sadly I never got around to buying that box, as none of my friends were interested in playing Epic, but I've always wanted some Knights. It'll be great to finally have the opportunity to add one or two to my collection. :D

Krieg Marshall
31-01-2014, 12:08
It makes more sense now, thank you for your answer. But, if I haven't misunderstood what you wrote imperial knights could eventually be chosen by any army of the imperium? knights could be considered as any "attached" unit from a different organisation just as a valkyries does? Otherwise, my question was mainly about teh fact that a knight is only a tank with legs and I personnaly don't understand the tactical role of such a unit. Maybe It's only a way to match with other armies, like Eldars or Taus which have already heavy walkers.

I'm actually studying military strategy so I personnaly found redundant to use knights with tanks and artillery... Sorry to be a pain

MiyamatoMusashi
31-01-2014, 12:34
Military strategy and 40K have absolutely nothing to do with one another.

The Emperor
31-01-2014, 12:37
They can be taken by Adepta Sororitas, Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Grey Knights, Imperial Guard, Inquisition, Space Marines, and Space Wolves. How that'll work, though, no one knows. They might be a Lord of War choice available to each of those armies. They might be an Elite or Heavy Support choice which counts as part of the Detachment they're purchased for. They might be treated as an Allied Detachment with unusual rules like Codex: Inquisition. Or there might be some other rules which govern how they can be chosen. Nobody knows anything, beyond the fact that they're an option for every Imperial army.

As for the advantages, you get the same advantage from them that you'd get from a Dreadknight, Dreadnought, Helbrute, Riptide, Wraithknight, Killa Kan, etc. It's more mobile than a tank and it'll have close combat capability, which you can't get with a tank. And frankly, because giant robots look awesome, which is a good enough reason for me. :p


Military strategy and 40K have absolutely nothing to do with one another.

There's also that.

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