PDA

View Full Version : European differences



Imperator64
24-01-2014, 18:49
No I'm not taking about personal hygene or attitudes towards social welfare but differences in warhammer. Do european versions have their measurements converted into metric or do they use Henry VIII's thumb as a standard aswell?

Feorag
24-01-2014, 18:57
In the UK it's imperial!

Imperator64
24-01-2014, 18:59
The uk isn't really European. God created the Channel to ensure that.

forseer of fates
24-01-2014, 19:04
Dam right, Rule Britannia!

Eyrenthaal
24-01-2014, 19:10
"Fog in Channel; Continent Cut Off" ;)

In Sweden we play it as is. Only time I'd even consider using imperial... But then again, in this case I wouldn't dream of using anything else..

Scammel
24-01-2014, 19:10
Imperial all the way, old bean.

InstantKarma
24-01-2014, 19:15
No I'm not taking about personal hygene or attitudes towards social welfare but differences in warhammer. Do european versions have their measurements converted into metric or do they use Henry VIII's thumb as a standard aswell?

Well see now you've robbed us Americans of half the additional jokes we could make on this thread.

Mithras69
24-01-2014, 19:16
In the Netherlands we use the Imperial system too... for measurement of movement that is. For base sizes we use the metric system though. How does that work in Britain? Do you have base sizes that use Henry VIII's thumb or are they converted to a proper measurement system? ;)

Malagor
24-01-2014, 19:34
Sweden here as well and yeah we use inches when we play. Would GW however offer measurements in metric we would use that in a hearthbeat.

Imperator64
24-01-2014, 19:38
Yeah strangely we use mm for bases. We British are a strange confused people. We're very skilled in the use of multiple measuring systems when just one should do. With regards to weather we use Celsius when it's cold (because its a smaller number) & fahrenheit when its hot(for the opposite reason.)

Imperator64
24-01-2014, 19:41
And give Dwarved M7.5?

baransiege
24-01-2014, 20:25
Warhammer and 40k are both pretty old games, don't forget when BFG and Epic were re-launched in the mid 90s they both used metric. I can't wait until they do away with imperial on road signs, it hasn't been taught in the education system for decades.

Griefbringer
24-01-2014, 20:29
Didn't Epic use metric measurements all the way from beginning?

Warmaster was also fully in metric if I remember correctly.

Ramius4
24-01-2014, 20:36
Well see now you've robbed us Americans of half the additional jokes we could make on this thread.

We're Americans. Aren't we supposed to tell the jokes anyways and deal with the facts and consequences later? :p

baransiege
24-01-2014, 20:40
Didn't Epic use metric measurements all the way from beginning?


Ahh quite possibly, I only played from Epic 40,000 onwards.

Urgat
24-01-2014, 21:21
Inches for measurements and mm for base sizes. But we used metric for measurement during 7th ed, and it was, well, annoying. So now, it's inches. But there's a catch! GW France has made up a new measurement system only for Warhammer. See, we don't call inches inches, we call them "steps" (well, "pas" in French). Hah!

Imperator64
24-01-2014, 21:47
Brilliant! L'Academie francaise even focuses its attention on wargames.

Shakkara
26-01-2014, 20:40
I use a metric ruler and an inch is just 2.5 cm.

GrudgeBringer
26-01-2014, 23:25
I use a metric ruler and an inch is just 2.5 cm.

not exactly, an inch is 2.54cm so if you aim your cannon 10 inches from the back of a chariot base 100mm by 50mm and roll a total of 6 on the artillery dice with bounce you dont actually hit, assuming you are firing dead on anyway.

Karak Norn Clansman
26-01-2014, 23:30
Inches only in Sweden.

Hengist
27-01-2014, 00:00
Didn't Epic use metric measurements all the way from beginning?

Warmaster was also fully in metric if I remember correctly.Ahh quite possibly, I only played from Epic 40,000 onwards.

Epic indeed used centimetres right from the beginning.

As I recall, Rick Priestley has remarked that the decision to use inches in Warhammer (and centimetres in Warmaster) was led by scalability with six-sided dice as much as by familiarity with Imperial measurements, a 1 - 6 cm scatter being unlikely to make much difference at 25mm scale, for instance.

Voss
27-01-2014, 00:14
We're Americans. Aren't we supposed to tell the jokes anyways and deal with the facts and consequences later? :p

When have Americans ever let silly things like 'facts' get in the way? And most people I meet on the street (or in political office) wouldn't know a consequence if it hit them.

But personally, I have always found that a society isn't sufficiently complex unless it has multiple exclusive systems of measurement, and one or two extra measurement terms that derive from obscure principle involving animals, shoes, or both. Bonus points if clothing measurements are different depending on the intended gender.

Bloodknight
27-01-2014, 00:17
Spain used to use cm (they even had a different artillery die), but IIRC now all countries use inches.

Lord Solar Plexus
27-01-2014, 02:19
That was Spain's revenge for the Armada I think.

Germany uses inches (metric for bases) like just about everyone else.

WhispersofBlood
27-01-2014, 03:22
That was Spain's revenge for the Armada I think.

Germany uses inches (metric for bases) like just about everyone else.

As does Canada

Shadeseraph
27-01-2014, 04:07
Spain used to use cm (they even had a different artillery die), but IIRC now all countries use inches.

Correction: In Spain we use "UM"s ("unidades de medida"/"Measurement Units"), not inches. They are completely different things. An inch is roughly 2,5 cms, a UM is roughly 25 mms, how can't you see the difference?

And yes, before 8th edition, we used cms. That gave us some interesting conversions. The values on an artillery dice were 5/10/15/20/25, which meant that many things that used an artillery dice had to "invent" tables to create the inches artillery dice. Or they forgot about the difference, and then a razordon was able to shoot up to 25 spines. I remember that long ago, the hellblaster had the same problem, too, which was hilarious.

Ombragier
27-01-2014, 07:03
Spain used to use cm (they even had a different artillery die)
I thought the Italians use(d) cm and therefor had the other artillery die (at least I was told that).

Bloodknight
27-01-2014, 08:26
Hmm, maybe Southern Europe had cm, Northern Europe had inches?

Lord Solar Plexus
27-01-2014, 09:10
Could be. Where's the daring adventurer who has traveled those exotic lands when you need one!

quietus1986
27-01-2014, 11:51
inches in belgium we use english ( uk books )

pjklan
27-01-2014, 11:58
I thought the Italians use(d) cm and therefor had the other artillery die (at least I was told that).

no, in italy we have always used inches.

Lorcryst
27-01-2014, 12:23
inches in belgium we use english ( uk books )

In the french-speaking part of Belgium we have books in french, and up to 8th Ed we had the "standard step" of 2.5 cms in the french rulebooks and army books ... the dimensions of the recommended table were 180 cms x 120 cms, tape measures were in cms too ... but the red plastic rulers that came in the boxed sets were in inches !

That was very confusing when you had to go to a tournament in the dutch-speaking part of the country, were the tables were a little bit bigger and you "fell short" on most measurements ... a 6 feet x 4 feet table, 72 inches x 48 inches, is in fact 182.88 cms x 121.92 cms, or in other words, 2 cms wider and 3 cms longer than the official measurements in the 6th/7th Ed rulebook.

Thank all that is holy that 8th ed went back to inches ... lots of headaches avoided.

That said, I've always prefered my GW books in english, some translation are horrible, when not downright wrong (the 2nd Ed 40K Imperial Guard Codex had the profiles for Ogryns and Ratlings switched ... geez Louise, a Sniper with BS2 S4 ... and a brawler with WS2 S2)

Griefbringer
27-01-2014, 18:46
As I recall, Rick Priestley has remarked that the decision to use inches in Warhammer (and centimetres in Warmaster) was led by scalability with six-sided dice as much as by familiarity with Imperial measurements, a 1 - 6 cm scatter being unlikely to make much difference at 25mm scale, for instance.

Back in the 3rd edition, WHFB used polyhedral dice in addition to regular D6. Thus, when firing a mortar you might end up rolling D20 to see if you hit or scattered, followed by 2D6 to determine amount of scatter - and if you managed to hit and wound somebody, you could then end up rolling D4 to determine the number of wounds caused.

IIRC with 4th edition WHFB standardised on using D6, though at that time also artillery and scatter dice were introduced to the game. (Scatter dice and artillery dice were first featured in Space Marine 2nd edition a year earlier.)

For some reason 40K 2nd edition persisted on using polyhedral dice for a number of rolls (mainly for determining amount of wounds or armour penetration), while introducing scatter dice, artillery dice and new sustained fire dice.

Lord Anathir
27-01-2014, 19:18
its inches everywhere IIRC

Meraklis
28-01-2014, 14:55
Greece also uses inches. No attempts were made to use cm

Nkari
29-01-2014, 23:47
Sweden here to, I use the measurements in the rules.. if its in inches.. I play with inches.. if it is like flames of war.. wich have both inches and centimeters, I go with centimeters..

Kingly
29-01-2014, 23:58
Back in the 3rd edition, WHFB used polyhedral dice in addition to regular D6. Thus, when firing a mortar you might end up rolling D20 to see if you hit or scattered, followed by 2D6 to determine amount of scatter - and if you managed to hit and wound somebody, you could then end up rolling D4 to determine the number of wounds caused.

IIRC with 4th edition WHFB standardised on using D6, though at that time also artillery and scatter dice were introduced to the game. (Scatter dice and artillery dice were first featured in Space Marine 2nd edition a year earlier.)

For some reason 40K 2nd edition persisted on using polyhedral dice for a number of rolls (mainly for determining amount of wounds or armour penetration), while introducing scatter dice, artillery dice and new sustained fire dice.

...Aie?! I played 3rd and never used a D20!

ivan55599
30-01-2014, 07:00
Inches, mm bases in Finland. Never saw otherwise.

Griefbringer
30-01-2014, 18:38
...Aie?! I played 3rd and never used a D20!

Perhaps you never fired a mortar, stone thrower, bazuka or fire thrower? I am not sure if there was anything else using D20 in the game, but for those you would need a D20 to determine if you hit or scattered. Essentially, rolling 1-12 would indicate scatter (and the direction using a clockface), while 13-20 would hit, though depending on weapon rolling 18, 19 or 20 might result in a slight or more serious misfire.

Also there are some tables using D100 in the book, such as the one for chaos attributes. However, when the designers later wrote the Realms of Chaos: Slaves to Darkness they decided that D100 just wasn't chaotic enough, and wrote even bigger table using D1000 instead.

Also the full range of polyhedral dice (D4, D8, D10, D12 and D20) are mentioned on page 36 of the book. That said, I am not entirely sure where D8 and D12 were used in the game.

That said, late Rogue Trader had multi-melta causing 2D12 damage (changed from the original where it caused 4D6 - designers thought that was too predictable in practice).

PirateRobotNinjaofDeath
31-01-2014, 11:39
Here in Canada, the only time we use metric in Warhammer is when we travel down across the border for tournaments ;)

Some of our group even imported those funky metric artillery dice just to take the joke one step further. Or "convert the stat lines into metric as well."


Though funny question for those of you who did use metric at some point: was there a specified maximum for your movement characteristic? Because it seems like otherwise you could get away with doubling your movement above 10"?

Lorcryst
31-01-2014, 12:49
The stat profiles were the same in the metric version, at least here in Belgium, but you had to multiply the Movement value by 2.5 to know how many centimeters you could move.

anthioram
31-01-2014, 19:13
In Spain movement was indeed in cm, and I fail to remember if there was a maximum movement value.
The conversion was a bit odd. Apparently half units are hard, so the movement value was randomly rounded up or down, with dwarves moving 8cm (instead of 7.62~7.5) and elves moving 12cm (instead of 12.7~12.5) and so on...

Fleeing or pursuing infantry moved 5d6 cm and cavalry 8d6cm. The average distance is the same, but the dispersion was much lower so pursuing was more predictable.
That was also why fanatics were a bit worse. Rolling 8+ on 2d6 is much more manageable than rolling 20+ on 5d6.


The stat profiles were the same in the metric version, at least here in Belgium, but you had to multiply the Movement value by 2.5 to know how many centimeters you could move.

Are you sure? I used to live in Brussels, and I think I remember the books being in centimeters as well. Maybe the french books were in cm and the dutch ones in inches....

Lorcryst
01-02-2014, 08:33
Are you sure? I used to live in Brussels, and I think I remember the books being in centimeters as well. Maybe the french books were in cm and the dutch ones in inches....

Not totally sure, no, because I've used English books since the beginning, and I only knew of the french version using centimeters from a couple of friends ... and it was years ago, they stopped that "standard step" nonsense in 7th ed, where we were back to proper inches ...

As far as I remember, back then there wasn't a Dutch version of the army books/rules, the Dutch-speaking part of the country had the english versions, while Brussels, being bi-lingual by law, had both versions. I remember going to Antwerp to buy my books in the only GW store of the country back then ...

Kingly
01-02-2014, 08:56
Well i'll be, we definitly played with Mortars and Stone Throwers, but i cannot for the life of me remember D20's :/

Also i had deamons so that D1000 m'larky sounds totally different. Is this maybe a translation difference?

Griefbringer
01-02-2014, 09:30
Is this maybe a translation difference?

Was 3rd edition ever published in other languages? My copy is certainly original English version, with little Union Jack and "Printed in England" text in the rear cover.