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Menthak
21-02-2014, 23:16
Pretty simple really, with the Knights now being released, just curious what you guys think of them.

Personally, I'm not a fan of how they look, as they seem a bit too Brettonian to me (In a weird way), but as I've yet to see one in the flesh, I'm reserving judgement.

Grand Master Azrael
21-02-2014, 23:24
They don't look too bad.

still-young
21-02-2014, 23:41
I think they look incredible, seriously considering pre ordering one along with my infinity army. They are a bit on the expensive side :/ but they're so cool I almost don't care.

Azazel
21-02-2014, 23:42
They look awesome, can't wait to smash one with my Bloodthirster.

Coldblood666
21-02-2014, 23:52
I like them but i can't seem to find out how they work. Can they be added to any space marine army for normal games?

Menthak
22-02-2014, 00:01
I like them but i can't seem to find out how they work. Can they be added to any space marine army for normal games?

I don't think it's been stated yet, but I think that's a safe bet.


They don't look too bad.

Didn't say they did.

Tae
22-02-2014, 00:10
I believe they operate as allies for Space Marines, but this was just based off a quick flick through WD.

Fugazi
22-02-2014, 00:12
They look amazing. And I like the restraint GW showed on the shoulders: you can paint or use transfers; it isn't cluttered with brickabrack.

Really nice model. Poseable options too from what I can tell.

Grand Master Azrael
22-02-2014, 00:14
I don't think it's been stated yet, but I think that's a safe bet.



Didn't say they did.

I didn't say that you did, I was saying that I don't think they look too bad

Gorthaur
22-02-2014, 00:14
Looks great, the price tag might keep me away for a while. Especially after shelling out over 150$ for FW Chaos Dwarfs....had I known this was due to be released a month or two ago maybe I would have done things different.

Beppo1234
22-02-2014, 00:14
probably one of the best updates of an old concept in a long time. So far, love it... and really excited to see what the resident mechs do with them, especially the chaos peops

Karak Norn Clansman
22-02-2014, 00:28
No faults this time around, GW. Only lots of good design, nice details and a very good overall look.


Plus points for it being an Adeptus Mechanicus unit. The rules are pretty uninteresting, but I'd like to read its new background.

dangerboyjim
22-02-2014, 00:58
Quick! You can buy 5 for the price of 5! And get free cards!

I see they are also charging separately for transfer sheets. I wonder if they are putting one in the box... doesn't say that they do... nice move GW!

Gorthaur
22-02-2014, 01:09
Quick! You can buy 5 for the price of 5! And get free cards!

I see they are also charging separately for transfer sheets. I wonder if they are putting one in the box... doesn't say that they do... nice move GW!

if you look though the images you can see it includes a decal sheet, not as much stuff on it though.

dangerboyjim
22-02-2014, 01:15
I'm talking about the Iron Brotherhood, it doesn't say that it includes the transfer sheet, but I guess it's implied that it comes with the knight, and the knight entry has it as included. So nothing to see here...

MajorWesJanson
22-02-2014, 02:00
Preordered one from my FLGS. Probably pick another one up later when I have the money. Also waiting for it to show up on a site I have been buying models from, and for FW to make some conversion kits, like a power lance and a proper fist for the Errant.

Kakapo42
22-02-2014, 02:33
I like it. It nicely pays homage to the old Epic ones, and it looks very much like what it's supposed to be, a miniature titan. My only complaint with it, and even then it's really just nitpicking, is that there's no option for a power lance.

And then there are the conversion ideas. I reckon that battle cannon could make a pretty nice artillery piece for an Imperial Guard army, and I'm already thinking up ways to mount the thermal cannon on a superheavy tank chassis. Then there's the possibility of making a Chaos one or loot'n one...

Theocracity
22-02-2014, 02:35
I think they look pretty snazzy. If I didn't have too many projects on my table I might consider picking one up, but as it is I will keep an eye on them for the future.

MajorWesJanson
22-02-2014, 02:51
My only complaint with it, and even then it's really just nitpicking, is that there's no option for a power lance.


Or Power fist like a proper Errant. Still, FW should have that covered in a few months.

wyvirn
22-02-2014, 04:34
Who can take them?

Camman1984
22-02-2014, 05:07
These look great, the leaked pictures didnt do them justice. I am eagerly looking forward to getting one.

Dkoz
22-02-2014, 05:39
I think it looks cool, but are the rules for it only going to be in the up coming white dwarf?

Spiney Norman
22-02-2014, 07:25
I think it looks cool, but are the rules for it only going to be in the up coming white dwarf?

Yes, those pages have been circling the net for a week or so.

Wolf Lord Balrog
22-02-2014, 07:42
There needs to be another option on the poll: 'Very nice model, but ridiculously expensive.' Its a tad bigger than a Riptide, but costs over 60% more. Even if I could afford it, I wouldn't buy it just on principle.

Ben
22-02-2014, 07:44
There needs to be another option on the poll: 'Very nice model, but ridiculously expensive.' Its a tad bigger than a Riptide, but costs over 60% more. Even if I could afford it, I wouldn't buy it just on principle.

Having seen comparisons it is a good bit taller than a Riptide and a hell of a lot bulkier.

I think I'm very likely to get one, I just hope that you can use them with Legio Cybernetica or Adeptus Mechanicus.

Mauler
22-02-2014, 07:49
Awesome model, great fluff, harks back to a golden age in more ways than one.

Excellent work.

MajorWesJanson
22-02-2014, 07:49
There needs to be another option on the poll: 'Very nice model, but ridiculously expensive.' Its a tad bigger than a Riptide, but costs over 60% more. Even if I could afford it, I wouldn't buy it just on principle.

It's somewhat taller, but far bulkier. The riptide looks big from some angles, but a lot of the parts are rather narrow and don't take up all that much space. Volume wise, you could probably fir the entire Riptide in the Knight torso alone.

bork da basher
22-02-2014, 08:27
i really love the miniature but won't be getting any. im really not convinced they are worth it used by themselves, they just aren't going to live long enough IMO. i realise they are meant to be used in multiples where they get exponentially better but im not about to drop 250 on them. id much rather buy a new army for that. cant fault the models though, they are seriously a thing of beauty and id love to have 3 leading some pre heresy mechanicus but i just can't justify the expense.

NemoSD
22-02-2014, 08:45
If they can be used with IG, I might save up and get a pair. Use them between my Guard and Dark Angels.

KronusDaSneaky
22-02-2014, 08:50
I really like the new Imperial Knight. Not such a big fan of the price but I think its pretty neat model. I have already order mine from a discount retailer hoping to beat the rush on pre-orders.

zam2
22-02-2014, 09:59
The knights are here! I have been waiting decades for this to happen. Plastic Imperial(and eldar before that) Knights! Do you people have any idea how infrequently the old armorcast Knights show up on ebay? let alone what some of these jokers are asking for them? This is a damned good thing in my books.

clanfield
22-02-2014, 10:11
I totally agree with zam lets hope this is the start of the ad mech finaly coming

Born Again
22-02-2014, 11:45
Think the model looks amazing, though a weapon option for the left arm might have been nice. Haven't seen the rules yet though. I think they're a great idea but, as with the Wraithknight and Riptide, I think they belong as part of Apocalypse/ Escalation rather than as allies in 40k, if that is indeed how they work.

Mandragola
22-02-2014, 12:30
I downloaded the white dwarf to get the rules for these. The bit on who can take them is fairly incomplete. It just says you can take up to 3 of them as an allied detachment for each primary detachment. Doesn't say anything about who they will ally with or levels of alliance. They don't seem to be any particular FOC pick so aren't lords of war, scoring, warlords or... anything.

I'm probably going to get one, or two. I suppose there's an outside chance they'll do some of the other types and I'd love to have one of the heavy support guys. I used to have an epic army with knights in it way back before the dawn of time and the fatties with quake cannons were my favourites. I did have paladins and a squadron of errands too, so it's all good.

Splen
22-02-2014, 13:36
I love both the fluff and the way they look. I voted for fluff because stories are important to me.

Gonders
22-02-2014, 15:07
Yep, for the first time in a while, GW nailed it! I'll be buying one and don't even even and Imperial army.

Utred
22-02-2014, 15:50
I wouldn't mind converting one for my renegade guard...

Spiney Norman
22-02-2014, 16:12
I wouldn't mind converting one for my renegade guard...

I'm sure no-one at GW will object to you buying two overpriced kits to make your knight rather than just one...

Utred
22-02-2014, 16:31
I'm sure no-one at GW will object to you buying two overpriced kits to make your knight rather than just one...

I'm sure they wouldn't object... ;-)

I have the little child in my screaming to do it. Repeatedly. Then get out my old adeptus titanicus rules.

The cynic inside me is almost convinced that was GW's ploy the whole time...

malisteen
22-02-2014, 16:32
I like the model, but as a chaos player I'm not sure yet if I'm even able to field one.

Crusius
22-02-2014, 16:45
I like it, the looks and the fluff (except that the sword is ridiculous, well that's part of 40k) . After an Apoc battle I was thinking about buying a super heavy, but a Baneblade or Shadowsword variant wouldn't fit with my marines and I still have a fool's hope that Eldar will eventually get a plastic super heavy. Knight would actually fit with my marines and Grey Knights (when I finally get to paint them).

Chem-Dog
22-02-2014, 16:47
I love the model, always loved the fluff.

Will be picking one up soon and more will definitely follow. I can see Knights representing a significant portion of my 40K spend this year and possibly next year as well.



waiting for it to show up on a site I have been buying models from, and for FW to make some conversion kits, like a power lance and a proper fist for the Errant.

This in spades. The Knight is a Heresy friendly kit, so it would be an absolute crying shame if FW didn't jump all over this. I want my 4 meter power sword!

Horus38
22-02-2014, 16:52
These things look *********** ace!

Camman1984
22-02-2014, 18:01
My only complaint is that they didnt give enough options for it. Hoping to see more at some point :) .

I am wondering whether the dreamforge titan powerfist will fit it, and for that matter the multibarrelled battlecannon.

duffybear1988
22-02-2014, 18:03
Nice kit but way too expensive.

TimLeeson
22-02-2014, 18:35
Very good kit, and I'm a huge Epic fan so massive props - but not something I would buy personally. I will be excited to see what other people do with the kit though, especially conversions!

Spider-pope
22-02-2014, 18:49
I think they look fantastic and it's now on my Buy List. Although i will add the caveat that i'd have preferred to see a new edition of Epic or a rejigged Titan Legions than merely adding them to 40k.

Importman
22-02-2014, 19:00
Like the look and concept. But as many other pointed out that are way too expensive.

Might possibly get the bits off eBay in a month or two and do some conversions myself.

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk 2

SirBlackmane
22-02-2014, 19:40
Going to chime in here that I too love the way it looks, but I think that for the price of this kit they could have thrown in more options. The rules were essentially already written under Epic, and it would not have taken much to convert the rest of the options to 40k. I'll most likely pick one up, and at least one of whatever options FW comes up with too, but a part of me regrets that I have to rely on a very overworked and backlogged crew at FW to produce pieces that should have been included in the first place.

Also want to note that the fact that this was priced 50% higher than we expected nipped an arms race at our local FLGS in the bud.

I do like the fluff with them too, along with the concept that one of the knights can "go it alone", giving me an excuse to paint it to match my army. Just not sure if I should match it to my VI Legion or my Wolves.

Mr Scratch & Sniff
22-02-2014, 19:41
I agree that there doesn't seem to be enough weapon options and I don't really like the battle cannon thingy.

Awesome model though. I really like the old school feel and I think I have finally found the right legs to go with my lord of skulls conversion.

nosebiter
22-02-2014, 19:54
I love it. All of it.

Abit pricy, but worth it.

Will be getting one to begin with, more when FW start making extra weapons and conversion kits.

The Emperor
22-02-2014, 20:28
I love this model and, while I think it's overpriced for its size given the price of other similar models (Nevermind all the sprues other kits like the Baneblade come with, which allow for the creation of eight variants while only two variants can be created here), my FLGS has reduced the price to $105, so I went ahead and preordered it. I'll have it in my hands this Friday. :) Whether I get more or not, though, depends entirely on how the one I purchase next week does on the tabletop. If I enjoy it then who knows? Maybe I'll end up getting an army of them. Five of them for $525 certainly isn't too bad.

Andy089
22-02-2014, 20:44
Or Power fist like a proper Errant. Still, FW should have that covered in a few months.

THIS! if it came with a fist I would have bought one right away, as I otherwise love the kit. But the sword just isn't my thing. For this price this kit could have some more weapon options (compared to say, a baneblade)...

insectum7
22-02-2014, 21:06
I'm honestly thinking it's one of my favorite GW models right now. I wasn't going to get one at first, but the more I see it, the more I want to paint one myself.

I have no idea if I'd use it in an army though. I'd consider it a collectors piece.

Telemachus
22-02-2014, 21:25
I think it's great. Possibly a bit overpriced, but certainly one of the best plastic models I've seen for a long time.

Looking at pictures of the two variants, it might; and I say might because I won't know for definite until I get my hands on one; be possible to build both weapons and swap them about.

As for who they're able to ally with? This is just an opinion so shoot away, but given they're called Imperial Knights I reckon that they'll only be available as allies to Imperial armies.

lordbeefy
22-02-2014, 22:03
love it...nice and true to the epic feel and i cant wait to see what forge world releases for these babies...lances and fists oh please oh please!

Furiosa
22-02-2014, 22:03
I play Eldar and Space marines and never ventured to any other hobby although it's been there, unless someone can show old picture proving GW did it first, the whole design reminded me of a bigger copy of Warmachine.

sorry if people done see the hunch back and the head very central/middle of the total height of the model but I never followed GW's space marines history, seen picks of phantom warlock titals ghost knights and true harelquins but never something that would suggest GW did this style before warmachine so its lost any credence with me while I ponder this, am I alone?

an example of my thoughts?
http://pikigeek.com/files/2011/09/Vanquisher_09.png

Telemachus
22-02-2014, 22:08
I play Eldar and Space marines and never ventured to any other hobby although it's been there, unless someone can show old picture proving GW did it first, the whole design reminded me of a bigger copy of Warmachine.

sorry if people done see the hunch back and the head very central/middle of the total height of the model but I never followed GW's space marines history, seen picks of phantom warlock titals ghost knights and true harelquins but never something that would suggest GW did this style before warmachine so its lost any credence with me while I ponder this, am I alone?

an example of my thoughts?
http://pikigeek.com/files/2011/09/Vanquisher_09.png Read White Dwarf; it'll fill some of the gaps on the Imperial Knights' history. Either that or head over to the Rumour Forum and have a look at the really old pictures of Knights that have been posted there.

Disposable Hero
22-02-2014, 22:30
Sorry, not my cup of tea. Think they look weird.

Another step away from normal guardsmen or other core troops.

Disposable Hero
22-02-2014, 22:30
Sorry, not my cup of tea. Think they look weird.

Another step away from normal guardsmen or other core troops.

Bugger, double post.

Kakapo42
22-02-2014, 22:37
I play Eldar and Space marines and never ventured to any other hobby although it's been there, unless someone can show old picture proving GW did it first, the whole design reminded me of a bigger copy of Warmachine.

sorry if people done see the hunch back and the head very central/middle of the total height of the model but I never followed GW's space marines history, seen picks of phantom warlock titals ghost knights and true harelquins but never something that would suggest GW did this style before warmachine so its lost any credence with me while I ponder this, am I alone?

an example of my thoughts?
http://pikigeek.com/files/2011/09/Vanquisher_09.png

I direct your attention to this (http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/b/bd/Knight_Paladins.jpg) and this (http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/6/67/Knight.jpg). GW was definitely doing that style long before Warmachine came around.

insectum7
22-02-2014, 22:45
and this (http://zenseeker.net/BoardGames/StarQuest/EpicImperialReaverTitan.jpg) and this (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-mAHUBgl-Xps/UgM-qTHh9fI/AAAAAAAAZEM/x1zmopKZ_-Y/s1600/WarpRunner_Warlord1.jpg)

That warmachine model looks like a poop in comparison.

Menthak
23-02-2014, 01:44
and this (http://zenseeker.net/BoardGames/StarQuest/EpicImperialReaverTitan.jpg) and this (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-mAHUBgl-Xps/UgM-qTHh9fI/AAAAAAAAZEM/x1zmopKZ_-Y/s1600/WarpRunner_Warlord1.jpg)

That warmachine model looks like a poop in comparison.

They all do.

Abaraxas
23-02-2014, 01:51
Thumbs up from me.

I'm so used to disliking the new releases this one came as a pleasant surprise!

I'd never buy one, but it's lovely.

Horus38
23-02-2014, 03:36
They all do.

Haha, that just made my day! And yea Furiosa, that's a big no on GW copying PP.

Clang
23-02-2014, 05:30
One of these would look great locked in close combat with an ork stompa, if anyone's looking for ideas for a Golden Demon diorama. (Quite an expensive diorama, alas.)

Hmm, or a looted and seriously converted one would be a great counts-as stompa...

insectum7
23-02-2014, 05:34
They all do.

True that.

ehlijen
23-02-2014, 06:13
I don't particularly like it. Then again, I've never liked any of the rounded GW titans and walkers, I always preferred the blocky ones.

Gorthaur
23-02-2014, 06:42
THIS! if it came with a fist I would have bought one right away, as I otherwise love the kit. But the sword just isn't my thing. For this price this kit could have some more weapon options (compared to say, a baneblade)...

The issue I have with this is the more weapon choices included they would drive the average cost of the kit up even further. And you end up paying extra for bits you wont be using. This kit is good enough I think, it has all the basics. I would rather some resin conversion pieces from Forge World for those who want them. Like a fist, lance, fancy head/ shoulderpads and whatever else. I do think this kit is really expensive for its size and whats included though.

Spiney Norman
23-02-2014, 08:46
and this (http://zenseeker.net/BoardGames/StarQuest/EpicImperialReaverTitan.jpg) and this (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-mAHUBgl-Xps/UgM-qTHh9fI/AAAAAAAAZEM/x1zmopKZ_-Y/s1600/WarpRunner_Warlord1.jpg)

That warmachine model looks like a poop in comparison.

Its odd really, I've never been able to quantify what exactly it is about PP models that just looks so awful and jarring, but they just seem to.


The issue I have with this is the more weapon choices included they would drive the average cost of the kit up even further. And you end up paying extra for bits you wont be using. This kit is good enough I think, it has all the basics. I would rather some resin conversion pieces from Forge World for those who want them. Like a fist, lance, fancy head/ shoulderpads and whatever else. I do think this kit is really expensive for its size and whats included though.

This is the crux for me, too many people are talking like GW would have thrown another sprue in the box with a dozen different weapon configs and kept the price the same, that's just not how they do things. Looking at the sprues they are pretty full as they are, adding a power fist for the errant and maybe a third main gun option (or a gun option to replace the CC arm) might have made a better kit, but is imagine it would also have added 10-15 on to the price, at the very least.

Menthak
23-02-2014, 09:46
Its odd really, I've never been able to quantify what exactly it is about PP models that just looks so awful and jarring, but they just seem to.

Just generally crappy uninspired models to me.


This is the crux for me, too many people are talking like GW would have thrown another sprue in the box with a dozen different weapon configs and kept the price the same, that's just not how they do things. Looking at the sprues they are pretty full as they are, adding a power fist for the errant and maybe a third main gun option (or a gun option to replace the CC arm) might have made a better kit, but is imagine it would also have added 10-15 on to the price, at the very least.

I still think there should be an options sprue, optional though, because you're right in that if they add it to the standard kit then most people will not want to fork out 100-ish for bitz they don't want and can't convert easily.

The Emperor
23-02-2014, 09:52
It's a matter of how big the sprues are, though. For instance, while the Knight has three sprues, the Baneblade has eight sprues for the same price. If the sprues are about the same size then there's no reason to believe that GW couldn't have included additional 1-3 sprues with more options for the same price.

Menthak
23-02-2014, 10:09
It's a matter of how big the sprues are, though. For instance, while the Knight has three sprues, the Baneblade has eight sprues for the same price. If the sprues are about the same size then there's no reason to believe that GW couldn't have included additional 1-3 sprues with more options for the same price.

Emperor, please stop trying to use logic to figure out why games-workshop acts as it does.

The Emperor
23-02-2014, 10:30
Emperor, please stop trying to use logic to figure out why games-workshop acts as it does.

You're right, I'm not sure what I was thinking. :p

Merellin
23-02-2014, 12:27
These Knights makes me want to expand my Space Wolf army, just so I have a reason to buy a Knight and add to it..

zam2
23-02-2014, 13:08
I play Eldar and Space marines and never ventured to any other hobby although it's been there, unless someone can show old picture proving GW did it first, the whole design reminded me of a bigger copy of Warmachine.

sorry if people done see the hunch back and the head very central/middle of the total height of the model but I never followed GW's space marines history, seen picks of phantom warlock titals ghost knights and true harelquins but never something that would suggest GW did this style before warmachine so its lost any credence with me while I ponder this, am I alone?

an example of my thoughts?
http://pikigeek.com/files/2011/09/Vanquisher_09.png
Given that the knights and their look predate warmachine by a good decade and change, I'd say no, I don't see anything reminding me of warmachine in the Imperial Knight.

RedNinja
24-02-2014, 00:57
I play orks ...but damned those knights are glorious.
But yeah I want a oversized lance for my knight.

Spiney Norman
24-02-2014, 01:18
It's a matter of how big the sprues are, though. For instance, while the Knight has three sprues, the Baneblade has eight sprues for the same price. If the sprues are about the same size then there's no reason to believe that GW couldn't have included additional 1-3 sprues with more options for the same price.

Ummm, let me think about that for a second... Yeah I guess that when you're a corporate company focused on making as much money as possible and not focused on doing freebie favours for your customers then you probably would charge extra if you were going to put extra sprues in the box...

Losing Command
24-02-2014, 01:34
GW prices seem based more on effort made to produce than quantity of sprues/plastic needed. Personally I think the baneblade looks boring as hell and is totally not worth my precious money. The Knight is a different story however ;)

Inquisitor Earl
24-02-2014, 02:03
As a commission painter, finishing my own 40k army has been rather difficult. Being able to get at least half the points i need through 3 awesome knights which i will spend a lot of time detailing and weathering is just awesome. Leaves me time to do a few mechanicus conversions for the rest of the army and not have to worry about piles of boring models to paint. For some, spending all the cash to buy 3 would be insane, for me it's quite logical. Just depends on your point of view.

IcedCrow
24-02-2014, 02:36
Im painting one for an armies on parade entry and getting a second one to pair with it. I love the model

tezdal
24-02-2014, 04:50
I'd buy it.... If it came in EPIC scale

Darnok
24-02-2014, 06:07
I love the model, no doubt about that.

But I have serious doubts about their "playability". While one Knight on the other side might be okay for an "all-comers" list, facing six of them is just impossible to manage for some armies out there. Tyranids and Orks simply lack the tools to deal with that, and most SM lists not tailored towards it will just die as well.

It is turning 40K even more into R/P/S on the army list level, with excluding quite a few books from the game alltogether. I consider that to be a bad thing.

Ssilmath
24-02-2014, 06:16
I don't foresee 5 Knight lists to be altogether too common an army list. It is likely that tournaments will ban that particular combination, and I doubt the person who shows up every game with 5 Knights is going to have many opponents or will find himself tailored against.

bork da basher
24-02-2014, 07:32
if i show up to the club with an all comers list i expect to play 40k not 40k vs mini titan legions. im not interested in playing against an army of 5 knights which im not prepared to deal with. it's why escalation hasn't taken off here because unless you plan your game to involve super heavies then it's not massively fun to face them if you don't expect them. 5 knights vs most all comers armies will be seriously one sided as the majority of the army won't be geared towards playing this way.

im all for options and new ways to play but only when it's a fair fight, if i can prepare for it hell yeah i'll fight you, and bring down your 5 knights! if you expect me to play you with a list i was expecting to kill MEQ with then im not really interested in setting up a forgone conclusion game. i think people who are planning on buying whole armies of these might have a hard time finding people who want to play them and i can't see many tournaments at least not wanting to limit their use.

rules wise im not convinced they are even close to being worth it unless you take 2-3. a single one of them is going down latest turn 2. it's hardly ever going to be in a position to have line of sight blocked to it, it's dodgy shielding rule is easy to circumnavigate (literally) and it almost always wants to cross the board and get to you in close combat. its going to be exposed from word go and because it's threat up close won't be allowed to live to get there. any all comers list can take down a single one of these without too much hassle, i know for a fact my eldar army would bring one down in a turn of firing, i doubt it would take my whole army to do it either. 2 or 3 of them on the other hand and id have serious problems.

id love to buy the model because its without question an amazing kit, but i don't collect imperials and have no plans to. if chaos space marines could take them id get one solely for the modelling project to nurgle it up, but alas.

Born Again
24-02-2014, 08:26
Its odd really, I've never been able to quantify what exactly it is about PP models that just looks so awful and jarring, but they just seem to.


To me, at least as far as the Warjacks go, it's that they always seem so top heavy and unbalanced that they could be defeated with a slight prod from your index finger. They also have an over-the-top cartoony quality, the Knight looks much more believable as a real-world construct.

On topic though, again I haven't seen the rules but are they just in WD or are they charging money for a digital codex? If they're just in WD is there any chance that the idea of a Knight army is just a ploy to get people to buy multiples, and when this rumoured 7th edition rolls around incorporating Escalation, we'll see them become stand alone Lord of War choices (as they should be)?

nosebiter
24-02-2014, 08:37
They all do.


Mmmmm.

No. Just No.

And all GE minis are amazing. "Coughslaughterbrutenagashhelldrakeminotaursabombco ugh"

;-)

FlashGordon
24-02-2014, 10:22
I was in doubt when i saw the drawings but the model is awesome.

breadbin
24-02-2014, 11:15
facing six of them is just impossible to manage for some armies out there. Tyranids and Orks simply lack the tools to deal with that, and most SM lists not tailored towards it will just die as well.

I think GW might have played a rather clever hand here. From what I understand, all armies are currently able to take Knights as allies. Anyone having trouble dealing with knights is therefore able to field one of their own as a counter measure.

This has caused a bit of a problem for me, as I am now thinking of all the great modeling / "counts as" opportunities this presents, and it's making me think about starting a new army just so I can field a custom knight :D

Orks: Looted knight, or "counts as" Forgeworld Mega Dread.
Tau: A remote Knight-World has joined the Tau Empire. Great opportunity for small, subtle Tau details and colour scheme.
Chaos: Lord Of Skulls for Khorne parts, Tomb Kings Warsphinx for Tzeentch.
Necrons: A big Necron, basically...
Eldar: Freeblades
Dark Eldar: There have been discussions in the past about whether DE would build and use Titans, and the general consensus is that Titans are simply too big a war machine for the DE. Knights could be used to represent the biggest "Titan" the DE build.
Tyranids: Ok, this one's a bit of a silly one, given that the concept of Genestealer Cults seem to be going the way of the Squats, but a Knight could be used to represent a Knight World having fallen to a GC... or if you want to be really silly, a walking GC limousine :D (I say "really silly" because there is no room in them to carry troops :shifty: )

ChrisMurray
24-02-2014, 16:34
I love the model and the background. I don't think the price is bad personally, but everyone has the right to consider it good or bad value for money. One thing I like is that if anyone has been considering getting a titan such as the warhound, they can have a practice at seeing if they like building/painting such a large titan style model for only 85 rather than 331 for a warhound.

My only real problem is trying to decide what colour to paint it.

ChrisMurray
24-02-2014, 16:34
I love the model and the background. I don't think the price is bad personally, but everyone has the right to consider it good or bad value for money. One thing I like is that if anyone has been considering getting a titan such as the warhound, they can have a practice at seeing if they like building/painting such a large titan style model for only 85 rather than 331 for a warhound.

My only real problem is trying to decide what colour to paint it.

bork da basher
24-02-2014, 17:18
I think GW might have played a rather clever hand here. From what I understand, all armies are currently able to take Knights as allies. Anyone having trouble dealing with knights is therefore able to field one of their own as a counter measure.

please tell me this isn't the case. EVERYONE can have knight allies??? seriously? surely not. i need clarification!!

i can understand imperial factions and even chaos but how the hell do the rest fall into it. just saying theres merc knightly orders isn't good enough to explain why orks, necrons, nids etc can use them. what ork would PAY a HUMAN for his warmachine services, he'd kill him, take it and tac on something more useful than a heavy stubber thats for sure. if this is the case and i suddenly see tyranid players dropping 3 knights on the table the part of my brain that enjoys this hobby still might just burst at the horrible fluff this is. on the other hand 3 knights in every nid army might mean they win 1 game in 10 now ;)

Hendarion
24-02-2014, 17:24
The look is great. Being able to add 3 Super Heavies as allies to an army is just stupid though. I'll be refusing to play such armies unless it is Apocalypse of course.

Chem-Dog
24-02-2014, 17:42
The look is great. Being able to add 3 Super Heavies as allies to an army is just stupid though. I'll be refusing to play such armies unless it is Apocalypse of course.

Yeah, I know what you mean. I had fervently hoped they'd be less than superheavy so that they'd be usable without Apocalypse/Escalation silliness. I'll be buying plenty of Knights but doubt I'll use them in non Apoc games unless a mate wants an unusual challenge (or they feel like bringing their own big stuff).

IcedCrow
24-02-2014, 17:42
They are fieldable in non apoc games per their rules. You can use them in normal games.

TheBearminator
24-02-2014, 19:29
Not really a fan of the model. Especially the small head. And to small in comparison to the Wraithknight in my opinion. But I don't care much about the fluff. I just want an impressive model that isn't outshined by some Eldar ditto.

Edit: may I add that I don't think the imp Knights arms look like they could swing a sword or do particularly well in cc in any way.

Chem-Dog
24-02-2014, 20:14
They are fieldable in non apoc games per their rules. You can use them in normal games.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should or that I will ;)



Edit: may I add that I don't think the imp Knights arms look like they could swing a sword or do particularly well in cc in any way.

I dunno about you, but I would definitely want to avoid fighting one of these (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/14/Trencher_2006-06-25.km.jpg) let alone one carried by a big angry robot.

Khornies & milk
24-02-2014, 21:19
Not really a fan of the model. Especially the small head. And to small in comparison to the Wraithknight in my opinion. But I don't care much about the fluff. I just want an impressive model that isn't outshined by some Eldar ditto.

Ever smaller now that GW have come clean/fixed a typo/changed the height of the Knight, only 150mm now...6" not 8". I play against a lot of Eldar players and I was happy to see that a Knight would at least be comparable in size to a Wraithknight - not now though.

Some of my fellow gamers are now baulking at the price, while some are just "meh" and are still going to buy....from Combat Company though at a discount, and in bulk so p&p can be spread out somewhat.

nosebiter
24-02-2014, 21:21
Eldar walkers of all sorts have allways been taller and leaner then Imperial ones, why should the knights be any different.

And the ImpKnight is much more massive.

nosebiter
24-02-2014, 21:26
Ever smaller now that GW have come clean/fixed a typo/changed the height of the Knight, only 150mm now...6" not 8". I play against a lot of Eldar players and I was happy to see that a Knight would at least be comparable in size to a Wraithknight - not now though.

Some of my fellow gamers are now baulking at the price, while some are just "meh" and are still going to buy....from Combat Company though at a discount, and in bulk so p&p can be spread out somewhat.

Sad for your friends. They are missing out on a great model, due to a few inches.

clovis
24-02-2014, 22:11
love the model,I have white dwarf 126 when thy first appeared;I plan to get 3 of them; My only problem is that I don't see how ork would get some( why would a Knight pilote trust ork to join them!) dark elder even worse(it doesn't suit they style of warfare/raid/fast attack),necron(they already have big monolytes);tyrannids(do I need to explain!);Chaos no problem since many houses joined during the horus heresy.

ColShaw
24-02-2014, 22:13
I voted "on the fence". I think it's a very pretty model, but way out of my single-model price range. I don't like the mainstreaming of superheavy/titan-type models, because I think it's detrimental to the balance of the game. So... like the model, dislike the rules would be my vote, if it were possible.

Menthak
24-02-2014, 23:02
It is turning 40K even more into R/P/S on the army list level, with excluding quite a few books from the game alltogether. I consider that to be a bad thing.

Sorry Darnok, but what is an R/P/S?


Mmmmm.

No. Just No.

And all GE minis are amazing. "Coughslaughterbrutenagashhelldrakeminotaursabombco ugh"

;-)


What the hell is a GE Mini? But if you're on about the 'Warjacks' then they do look bad, why you ask? Because they look very...mecha-kingdom hearts-y.

http://privateerpress.com/files/products/32053_BlessingofVengeance_WEB.jpg

Ozendorph
24-02-2014, 23:09
Not sure what a GE mini is, but R/P/S = rock, paper, scissors

edit: after re-reading his post I think GE was supposed to be GW

Darnok
24-02-2014, 23:10
Not sure what a GE mini is

Propably a typo. E is right next to W, so I guess "GW" was meant.

agurus1
25-02-2014, 00:38
My big frustration is... WTF?!!! NO SEARCHLIGHT ON THE KNIGHT?!101!1!1? SEVERELY UNDERPOWERED! ;)

TheBearminator
25-02-2014, 00:51
Just because you can doesn't mean you should or that I will ;)



I dunno about you, but I would definitely want to avoid fighting one of these (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/14/Trencher_2006-06-25.km.jpg) let alone one carried by a big angry robot.

Lol. Big time. :)

Friedrich von Offenbach
25-02-2014, 05:09
I voted for "love it, especially the way it looks", because the model looks good, although seems a bit expensive for its size (but ill wait to i see it in my hand till i fully commit to that comment). However i think the background is somewhat weak. Even before the last few weeks where knights were a epic model I always thought that there was never enough justification for why these random nobles (who would actually be more like peasants as far as the larger imperium would be concerned) from certain planets get given these big suits of armour and no one else does. Surely there are more experienced fighters such as Space marines or Imperial guard/inquisitorial Storm troopers who could pilot them. It is not so much the fact that these nobles of knight woulds get the suits but rather that they seem to get them exclusively.

Also what ever happened to the mechanicus jealously guarding technology :shifty:

agurus1
25-02-2014, 07:38
I voted for "love it, especially the way it looks", because the model looks good, although seems a bit expensive for its size (but ill wait to i see it in my hand till i fully commit to that comment). However i think the background is somewhat weak. Even before the last few weeks where knights were a epic model I always thought that there was never enough justification for why these random nobles (who would actually be more like peasants as far as the larger imperium would be concerned) from certain planets get given these big suits of armour and no one else does. Surely there are more experienced fighters such as Space marines or Imperial guard/inquisitorial Storm troopers who could pilot them. It is not so much the fact that these nobles of knight woulds get the suits but rather that they seem to get them exclusively.

Also what ever happened to the mechanicus jealously guarding technology :shifty:

well as far as the new fluff is concerned (can't speak for the old stuff) they are the only ones that get it because they are the only ones who had it since mankind first expanded across the stars. the machines weren't originally war machines but rather used to clear forest areas and move or bear heavy loads. Only when in dire straits the colonist realized "hey! we can strap guns and armour plates to this thing." and from there the knights as we know them were born. the fluff states that the MIU's and Machine Spirits of the Knights were always bellicose in nature and just like Titan's required certain types of people to be able to operate them. The Mechanicum when they rediscovered knights, forged exclusive pacts with them in exchange for relics of technology housed in the Knights citadels.

So basically, the knights on have the Knight Titans because the MIU's require very specific types of people to be linked to them to operate properly, just like the bigger Titan's. You don't want a random Guardsman getting into the saddle because in all likelyhood the war spirit would either drive them mad or fry their brains. Space Marines can't pilot them because they have already received their specialized training and in all likelyhood the Codex Astartes doesn't allow for them to have Titan's in their armories, and the probably couldn't fit in the cockpits anyway lol. And to top it all off the Knightly Houses made pacts with the Imperium and the Adeptus Mechanicus, they are no other knights because of the Imperiums belief in "separation of powers" as far as the military goes, and why bother wasting time trying to train up guard to do the job when there are already whole worlds with clans who have been doing the job for generations?

Wolf Lord Balrog
25-02-2014, 08:08
It's somewhat taller, but far bulkier. The riptide looks big from some angles, but a lot of the parts are rather narrow and don't take up all that much space. Volume wise, you could probably fir the entire Riptide in the Knight torso alone.

Now GW have confirmed that it is only the same size as the Riptide, it definitely isn't worth it, not even remotely. And from the look of the sprues the additional bulk is mostly empty space inside the Knight's torso. So that's 60% more money for only a little bit more plastic. I now officially think GW is trolling their own customers to see how ridiculous a price they can charge for something before most people just throw up their hands and quit the hobby.

Karak Norn Clansman
25-02-2014, 08:26
I like the model, but as a chaos player I'm not sure yet if I'm even able to field one.

You could maybe use it as a Maulerfiend or whatever the shooty version is called?

A shame about the price. One would have expected the Knight to be on the level of Riptide and Wraithknight.

nosebiter
25-02-2014, 08:35
Now GW have confirmed that it is only the same size as the Riptide, it definitely isn't worth it, not even remotely. And from the look of the sprues the additional bulk is mostly empty space inside the Knight's torso. So that's 60% more money for only a little bit more plastic. I now officially think GW is trolling their own customers to see how ridiculous a price they can charge for something before most people just throw up their hands and quit the hobby.

Meh. I dont care. I like it alot. An inch or two in height doesnt bother me.

But thank you for basically calling us that want one "less than normal intelligent".

Darnok
25-02-2014, 08:36
Please take comments on the Knights price to the GW Pricing Discussion (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?209297-Games-Workshop-Pricing-Feedback-Thread).


Darnok [=I=]

Kiarr
25-02-2014, 09:00
Love both the fluff and the way it looks personally :) not that overpowered from what I have seen from the rules I personally dont think a good little fit into WH 40k

Zingraff
25-02-2014, 09:57
I really like how this is turning out. With the background story they've released we suddenly have a new human faction in 40k, and it's even pre-Imperium. Which is immensely cool.

Did anyone else notice this in the description in the GW online store?

"At 6 inches tall the Imperial Knight is a towering war engine."

That can't be right, surely they must have meant 16 inches.

jtrowell
25-02-2014, 12:25
No, it looks like the Knight is the very same size than a riptide ... for almost twice its already expensive price ... :shifty:

Ozendorph
25-02-2014, 16:19
It might be the same height as the riptide, but looks like a substantially larger and more detailed kit.

At any rate I think they look fantastic and I'll buy one just to build and paint. GW isn't doing much right these days (imo), but credit where credit is due

Nagash333
25-02-2014, 17:39
Fantastic model, great concept. Hope to see more classics reapear

RanaldLoec
25-02-2014, 19:31
NWell I saw the imperial knights was inspired to start a mechanicum army and then went and bought Forgeworlds biggest imperial titan.

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/02/26/jumupu3e.jpg



I will be adding 3 knights a warhound and a good few FW mechanicum infantry models.

So yeah the Knights are going to end up costing me thousands.

I guess that means I like them ........ Allot

MongooseFire
26-02-2014, 15:10
I think they look great. A bit on the pricey side but would definitely get one if I didn't have loads of models to paint up already.

kaimarion
26-02-2014, 21:31
If Knights are being introduced to standard 40k does this not set a precedent for strength D weapons to become available to other armies in standard 40k?

Awesome model and the timing of the release is very nice with Titanfall coming out on the same month, that should help get even more 40k gamers frothing at the mouth for large mechs.

agurus1
27-02-2014, 00:19
I have to say I played a game today with a "Knight" (read: counts as Knight using Khorne Lord of Skulls), and I enjoyed the way it played. I fought an escalation game vs Orks (they had a Skullhammer). The Knight performed pretty solidly, I used an Errant for this game. Stomp helped clear out a big mob of boyz that threatened to tie it up, and its SD CCW ripped the Ork superheavy apart in a single phase. The Ion-Shield worked very well at keeping it alive, it absorbed around 4 turns of shooting before being glanced to death by Lootas. Over all a good experience and I look forward to getting my hands on the actual model.

Things to look out for: Hidden powerfists/claws in big squads.

KhornateLord
27-02-2014, 03:21
I think they look pretty awesome.
If they can strike before death stars, they might see use countering 2++/2++ death stars with their D-weapon attacks.
If they get a ranged D-weapon option from FW, even if it's a weapon with a small blast, being able to take a bite out of a deathstar is going to have value to players who can't or won't field death-stars and might help bring that to an end in the same way that Tau ended flyer domination.

As a chaos player, I'm a bit disappointed I can't buy one and make it evil, and field it with rules from the book. I might get one anyway, but I might wait and see if FW release chaos rules and bits for them.

LegioDestructor
27-02-2014, 06:24
Even though they won't be as tall as they should be, I think they're amazing models. Their look is IMO a perfect blend of the current 40k imagery and their OOP models and the artwork from Epic. Can't say anything about the "new" fluff except that I only hope they kept and built on what existed already, because it was awesome. I'm also glad their armament is a perfect port from their former incarnation.

I liked the model so much it convinced me to start playing 40k again and I pre-ordered the box. Hopefully they'll release models, or at least rules, for the Lancer, Baron, Castellan, and Crusader.

RE: Chaos, I'm sure they can use Knights too - don't the Freeblades fight for whoever will pay them? Only Slaanesh had specialist Knights and they were very much Daemon Engines. My Paladin will be painted in Iron Warriors colours regardless.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 06:33
Freeblades still fight for Humanity, actually, and apparently Imperial Knights can't ally with Chaos Space Marines. As for Freeblades, I'm thinking that the idea behind them, Imperial-Aligned Knight Households, and Mechanicum-Aligned Knight Households, is simply a matter of paint schemes. If they're all different colors and symbols, then they're Freeblades. If they're matching colors, then they're Imperial, and if they're matching colors with Mechanicus symbols, then they're Mechanicus.

Scribe of Khorne
27-02-2014, 06:42
Love the model, sick of the Imperial wankfest though, CSM should be able to use it, just like they do Imperial Guard.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 06:45
No, that's what Chaos Knights are for. They exist in the background. That's what Chaos should get.

agurus1
27-02-2014, 07:02
Love the model, sick of the Imperial wankfest though, CSM should be able to use it, just like they do Imperial Guard.

Apparently you won't be waiting for too long, the rumor mill is already working overtime about how Forge World is making alternate weapons, heads, and yes even Chaos Themed armor plates.

Scribe of Khorne
27-02-2014, 07:07
No, that's what Chaos Knights are for. They exist in the background. That's what Chaos should get.

Lots of things exist in the background, ask me what I think of the CSM book when I look over at Space Marines with Traits?

As for FW saving the game from the main designers (again) thats all well and good if it happens, but in the meantime its too little, too late, kind of like the brutal helbrute (Dreadnought, its a Dreadnought GW, has been for years) who will still suck in game, or the Black Legion 'book'.

If GW wants to forget about balance thats fine, but at least let everyone use the toys if thats the case. As for me, its a non-impact anyway as I play my marines as Blood Angels, so your going to have a nice Night Lord themed Knight rolling around, but it still sticks in my craw that you have imperial after imperial after imperial, with everyone else shafted, its simply not good for the game as a whole.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 07:30
Lots of things exist in the background

Yes, and then they become models. Only a few months ago people thought the Knight was just 20-year-old background fluff that had no bearing on the game, and suddenly it's getting a codex. You really think that the Chaos Knight isn't the next logical step?


ask me what I think of the CSM book when I look over at Space Marines with Traits?

I would, but I'm too busy bathing in your tears.


kind of like the brutal helbrute (Dreadnought, its a Dreadnought GW, has been for years) who will still suck in game

That applies to all Walkers, not just the Helbrute. It's the Walker rules, not the Helbrute model in particular. Or are we forgetting that the Helbrute is pretty much the same as the Space Marine Dreadnought, and is even better in some ways?


If GW wants to forget about balance thats fine, but at least let everyone use the toys if thats the case.

Are you serious? If you want to play a game where every army is exactly the same then play Horus Heresy. The whole point of a game with factions, though, is that each faction is different. If they all have access to the same stuff then it defeats the whole purpose of having those factions to begin with.


but it still sticks in my craw that you have imperial after imperial after imperial, with everyone else shafted, its simply not good for the game as a whole.

So this one model constitutes "imperial after imperial after imperial"? Wow, exaggerate much? Before that it was Tyranids, not Imperial. And after that it'll be Chaos, not Imperial. So what are you even going on about?

Spiney Norman
27-02-2014, 12:31
Lots of things exist in the background, ask me what I think of the CSM book when I look over at Space Marines with Traits?

As for FW saving the game from the main designers (again) thats all well and good if it happens, but in the meantime its too little, too late, kind of like the brutal helbrute (Dreadnought, its a Dreadnought GW, has been for years) who will still suck in game, or the Black Legion 'book'.

If GW wants to forget about balance thats fine, but at least let everyone use the toys if thats the case. As for me, its a non-impact anyway as I play my marines as Blood Angels, so your going to have a nice Night Lord themed Knight rolling around, but it still sticks in my craw that you have imperial after imperial after imperial, with everyone else shafted, its simply not good for the game as a whole.

Its better just to ignore the willful ignorance, I agree that inserting a crappy looking chaos dreadnought kit between Imperial codexes is not really adequet, but in fairness if you've not adapted to the imperio-centric nature of the 40k game then you've probably not been playing it very long. It does my head in too, even though one of my three armies is imperial.

Out of the 17 codex armies that currently grace the game (including Imperial Knights in that), 9 of them are Imperial (that's more than half), also every fortification and building terrain kit (except for one sprue which allows you to 'spiky up' a bastion) that has been produced to date has been designed for the imperium, and forgeworld is even more imperial-biased. In 40k the imperium gets all the nice stuff, that's what sells so that is what they make. As a chaos player there's not much you can do about that, except maybe accept that like 7 of the other armies in the game, you're not the special snowflake.

And I say this as a dark Eldar/necron player.


Yes, and then they become models. Only a few months ago people thought the Knight was just 20-year-old background fluff that had no bearing on the game, and suddenly it's getting a codex. You really think that the Chaos Knight isn't the next logical step?

If you think a chaos knight is the logical next step you are more deluded than I could have conceived. It is perhaps a logical future step, but if you think we will be seeing one in the next few weeks or months I think you are sadly mistaken. The imperial knight is a sound move because it is usable by the 9 imperial armies, and allegedly half of the Xeno armies as well. I personally think its a little hard on the traitors when letting them take it could have opened the door to some really creative conversions. And there's no real in-universe reason why a knight house couldn't recently have fallen to chaos if they wanted to use one straight from the box. I don't really see why a knight house would be any more or less corruptable than any other imperial official and planetary governors and IG commanders seem to turn traitor all the time.

LegioDestructor
27-02-2014, 15:22
No, that's what Chaos Knights are for. They exist in the background. That's what Chaos should get.
Very true, but House Devine seems to be the only named Knight House that fell to Chaos and they are always explicitly mentioned as following Slaanesh and armed with very Slaaneshi-specific weaponry. What about a Khornate or Undivided force? Half the Mechanicus fell to Chaos during the Heresy - and took half the Knight Houses with them.

As far as the "Imperials get XYZ" arguments, let's not go there... Xenos players should cling to the sliver of hope that GW remembers that the Eldar once had Knight models too.

Mauler
27-02-2014, 15:51
Beh, while I know that 40k requires a rigid framework of rules to function, the main aim of the game is to engage your friends and enjoy it. It's clear from the design team's articles in WD that house-rules are commonplace and encouraged so if you want to field an Imperial Knight with your Chaos forces then check-in with your gaming group, knock up a story and get to it. I really can't see many decent people objecting if they want to play games and face new challenges.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 15:56
Very true, but House Devine seems to be the only named Knight House that fell to Chaos and they are always explicitly mentioned as following Slaanesh and armed with very Slaaneshi-specific weaponry. What about a Khornate or Undivided force? Half the Mechanicus fell to Chaos during the Heresy - and took half the Knight Houses with them.

...and those Knights would likewise probably be as mutated and warped as House Devine Knights are, just in a different way. After 10,000 years, though, they certainly wouldn't look and be armed the same way as Imperial Knights, much less governed by the same rules (For instance, the Banelord had a kind of rage mechanic which the Warlord Titan didn't have, among its many other differences).


As far as the "Imperials get XYZ" arguments, let's not go there... Xenos players should cling to the sliver of hope that GW remembers that the Eldar once had Knight models too.

Of course they remember. That's where the Wraithknight came from. Never heard of it, I take it?

188174


Beh, while I know that 40k requires a rigid framework of rules to function, the main aim of the game is to engage your friends and enjoy it. It's clear from the design team's articles in WD that house-rules are commonplace and encouraged so if you want to field an Imperial Knight with your Chaos forces then check-in with your gaming group, knock up a story and get to it. I really can't see many decent people objecting if they want to play games and face new challenges.

As has been pointed out ad nauseam, what you do is your own business. That doesn't mean that it should get the GW stamp of approval, otherwise we'd have ridiculousness in the fluff like Hello Kitty Necrons. If you want to break the rules then that's entirely up to you, but the background and lore has to maintain a level of consistency and coherency, as does the game, otherwise by that argument anyone can take anything.

Spiney Norman
27-02-2014, 16:05
...and those Knights would likewise probably be as mutated and warped as House Devine Knights are, just in a different way. After 10,000 years, though, they certainly wouldn't look and be armed the same way as Imperial Knights, much less governed by the same rules (For instance, the Banelord had a kind of rage mechanic which the Warlord Titan didn't have, among its many other differences).

Can you explain why all chaos knights should be warped abominations, but none of the chaos titans should? I'm just unclear why the difference between knights and titans (essentially just the size of the machine) means that all knights should be pulsating masses of flesh and ichor while titans should just be the same as The imperial ones, painted in dark colours with spikes stuck to the top.

When last I checked the FW chaos warhound Titan didn't have any exposed flesh or tentacles breaking out all over the place. I'm ok with the concept of a mutated knight existing, I just resent the idea that it has to be mandatory. This principle operates at every level of the chaos force, not all chaos marines are possessed marines after all, most of them are just bad people in power armour with bolt guns.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 16:22
Can you explain why all chaos knights should be warped abominations, but none of the chaos titans should?

They're not? So what's going on here?

188176

Is it normal for Imperial Titans to grow teeth or for daemonic faces to appear on their kneepads?


I'm just unclear why the difference between knights and titans (essentially just the size of the machine) means that all knights should be pulsating masses of flesh and ichor while titans should just be the same as The imperial ones, painted in dark colours with spikes stuck to the top.

I'm amazed at your ability to see the Banelord posted over and over again and yet ignore it as if it never existed. Well, here it is again.

188177

Daemon head not found on Imperial Titans? Check. Tail not found on Imperial Titans? Check.


When last I checked the FW chaos warhound Titan didn't have any exposed flesh or tentacles breaking out all over the place.

Nope, it just has a writhing face on its right leg.

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There's nothing unusual about that in comparison to Imperial Warhounds at all. They all have that.

And note also that, while Forge World has produced those two models, neither of them has seen print in any GW publication. Not Apocalypse, and not Escalation, so GW may have some ideas about how "official" they consider those two depictions.


This principle operates at every level of the chaos force, not all chaos marines are possessed marines after all, most of them are just bad people in power armour with bolt guns.

So you consider this to be standard issue MK V Power Armor? Yeah, I'm sure those horns were there before they turned to Chaos...

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Chem-Dog
27-02-2014, 17:13
It's worth pointing out that the FW titans (which are only "slightly" chaos) are the baseline, most basic Chaos version and that whilst many will be this level, many more will be properly corrupted. if we go back to the olden days, there were a number of chaos only modifications (Daemonic heads, weaponry tails and whatnot).

The difference is dedication versus infestation. A vehicle dedicated to the dark gods will be ornamented thus, daubed with blasphemous runes and probably the skulls of a bunch of loyalists, it might even carry constructed images of daemonic visages. An infestation will be a vehicle whose fabric or crew have become the playthings of the dark gods. The crew or machine itself will be literally possessed by a Daemonic entity or at least be warped by Chaos Energy in a way that blurs the lines between biological and mechanical.

Both are valid and neither is wrong.

Spiney Norman
27-02-2014, 17:31
They're not? So what's going on here?

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Is it normal for Imperial Titans to grow teeth or for daemonic faces to appear on their kneepads?



I'm amazed at your ability to see the Banelord posted over and over again and yet ignore it as if it never existed. Well, here it is again.

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Yeah, it just reminds me how utterly shocking the older models used to be and how much better of a Job forgeworld has done with the same concept, what was your point, that new models should look as bad an ancient ones for nostalgic reasons?


Daemon head not found on Imperial Titans? Check. Tail not found on Imperial Titans? Check.
I was talking about model at hat are currently in production not ancient concepts that were dumped in the quagmire of history because they looked so awful.


Nope, it just has a writhing face on its right leg.

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There's nothing unusual about that in comparison to Imperial Warhounds at all. They all have that.

You mean chaos puts chaosy images on its armour plates and imperial aligned titans put imperial images on their armour plates... really? A molded picture of a face on an armour plate says "extreme corruption" to you? And modifying a metal face plate to be a bit more toothy is similarly more decorative than anything else, its a far cry from tentacles and exposed flesh.

You could always paint a chaosy-style face on the shoulder pad of you right if you wanted to, but right now there is no point because there is no way to represent a knight allied to a chaos army in the rules unless you do an army of just knights and say they're chaos aligned.


And note also that, while Forge World has produced those two models, neither of them has seen print in any GW publication. Not Apocalypse, and not Escalation, so GW may have some ideas about how "official" they consider those two depictions.
Ahhh, so the old "forgeworld is unofficial unless it is printed in a GW book" argument, I thought we had buried that one a long time ago. The book you are looking for is Imperial armour Apocalypse.



So you consider this to be standard issue MK V Power Armor? Yeah, I'm sure those horns were there before they turned to Chaos...

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I think the only difference here is in the degree of difference we require in the aesthetics of our units, you find a couple of horns added to a helmet to be acceptable to denote a chaos marine from a loyalist marine (or in some cases, just a top-knot), but adding a few spikes to a knight is somehow not enough?

Felwether
27-02-2014, 17:56
And note also that, while Forge World has produced those two models, neither of them has seen print in any GW publication. Not Apocalypse, and not Escalation, so GW may have some ideas about how "official" they consider those two depictions.


The Warhound featured in Apocalypse 1st Edition.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 17:59
The Warhound featured in Apocalypse 1st Edition.

Well, I'm looking at the current iteration of Apocalypse as well as Escalation.

Felwether
27-02-2014, 18:04
Well, I'm looking at the current iteration of Apocalypse as well as Escalation.

It has featured in a GW publication though, and a relatively recent one to boot.

Also, seeming as you're talking about the actual models rather than the rules here, they've actually featured in quite a few publications including the 6th edition rulebook. I'd call that fairly official.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 18:06
It has featured in a GW publication though, and a relatively recent one to boot.

Also, seeming as you're talking about the actual models rather than the rules here, they've actually featured in quite a few publications including the 6th edition rulebook. I'd call that fairly official.

Ah, okay. Well, correction noted. The point still stands, though, that even those models have still been altered by Chaos and aren't still in the same form as their Imperial counterparts.

OuroborosTriumphant
27-02-2014, 18:14
For whatever it's worth, if anyone is still in any doubt about whether they want to get a Knight based on its size, I can report that the Knight is just a shade under 7 inches tall, from base to tip of chimney.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 18:18
For whatever it's worth, if anyone is still in any doubt about whether they want to get a Knight based on its size, I can report that the Knight is just a shade under 7 inches tall, from base to tip of chimney.

NO ONE will be satisfied until someone produces a pic of one next to a tape measure. Can you produce said pic? ;)

OuroborosTriumphant
27-02-2014, 18:51
NO ONE will be satisfied until someone produces a pic of one next to a tape measure. Can you produce said pic? ;)

I'm going to be totally honest. Yes, I could, but it'd involve finding the right cable to get images off my laughably ancient non-smart phone and onto my laptop. I honestly can't be bothered given that the world and his brother will be able to do it come Saturday.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 18:53
D'oh! Oh well. I'm pleased with your news, though. After all, 7 inches is better than 6 inches.

...and wow, these discussions on its height the past few days have sounded REALLY nasty!

Spiney Norman
27-02-2014, 18:57
For whatever it's worth, if anyone is still in any doubt about whether they want to get a Knight based on its size, I can report that the Knight is just a shade under 7 inches tall, from base to tip of chimney.

Much appreciated, I just hope this doesn't reignite the great Imperial Knight-size riots that swept through the forum earlier this week ;)

agurus1
27-02-2014, 19:17
is that 7" including the base?

AngryAngel
27-02-2014, 19:28
So it being 6 was too much, but 7 is a good call ? I never thought I'd read such heated discussion based on inches of a models height in warhammer.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 19:29
So it being 6 was too much, but 7 is a good call ? I never thought I'd read such heated discussion based on inches of a models height in warhammer.

Eh, I was fine with it when I thought it was 6" and 8". Naturally I prefer a bigger robot for the price, but it looks pretty big as-is and will look nice stomping across the battlefield.

AngryAngel
27-02-2014, 19:35
I'd be fine with a 6 inch, and an eased down price. Had it been 6 and around 100 I think they'd have done an excellent job per stats and quality of model with what you get.

OuroborosTriumphant
27-02-2014, 19:42
is that 7" including the base?

It is a little under 7", including the base.

The Emperor
27-02-2014, 19:49
I'd be fine with a 6 inch, and an eased down price. Had it been 6 and around 100 I think they'd have done an excellent job per stats and quality of model with what you get.

If I paid $140 for it then there's no way I'd ever buy it. Simply not worth the value at its price point. Fortunately for me, though, I can get it from my FLGS at 25% off. It's far more appealing at $105.

AngryAngel
27-02-2014, 20:08
My own flgs does a few annual sales where warhammer is 25 percent off, needless to say it is when I will be getting my super heavies.

Wolf Lord Balrog
27-02-2014, 22:41
As I've mentioned many time before where it concerns GW products, a lot of things would be smoothed over if the prices were less ridiculous. People wouldn't care much at all what size the Knight was exactly if they weren't being charged $140 for it. The extremely high price does two bad things: First, it makes people want to investigate it much more closely before they shell out their hard-earned cash than they would if, say, it only cost $60-$80. Second, its only natural to compare what you are getting for your money to other products in the range: when you see the Riptide for $85 and the only-a-tiny-bit-bigger Knight for $140 (and you were price-sensitive in the first place), you feel gouged and therefor not at all inclined to view the thing charitably.

Darnok
28-02-2014, 08:19
Meh...

We have already as much as a confirmation from FW that they work on chaotic conversion bits for the Knight kit. If their Chaos Reaver and Warhound are anything to go by, I'd bet on different heads and multiple sets of corrupted armour plates. Most likely some chaosified weapons too. I wouldn't count on a genuine Chaos Knight anytime soon - they have an imperial base kit to work with, which GW wants to sell. By Chaos conversion kits, the Knight can be sold to more people - win/win for both of them.

Shibboleth
28-02-2014, 10:00
I agree it will most likely be head/armour-plate swaps etc. but I wonder if FW can resist the temptation to do posable legs though too...

The Emperor
28-02-2014, 10:17
It'd be a shame if GW doesn't make a full-fledged Chaos Knight. They certainly won't be short on profits when it comes to the Imperial Knight. After all, I think it's safe to assume that the Riptide and Wraithknight kits were pretty good sellers, and they're each for just one army. Not only is the Imperial Knight available to multiple armies (Adepta Sororitas, Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Eldar, Grey Knights, Imperial Guard, Inquisition, Space Marines, and Space Wolves, if you're going no worse than Allies of Convenience), but it's available to the most popular armies GW sells. Space Marines constitute, I think, 30% of GW's profits. That's a huge percentage of their customers, many of whom would likely want to add the Imperial Knight to their Space Marine armies. Nevermind those players who play other Imperial armies or Eldar players who want to ally one in. And to top it off, you'd have those people who'd buy up four or five of them and play an army of them. Odds are GW's looking at some pretty successful sales with the Imperial Knight, and don't have any real need to find more ways to generate revenue with that kit.

But that's just me. I enjoy seeing big models like that taking to the field, and the more the better, in my view. I'd like to see every army that has a good reason to field such a model to have one, particularly since I also enjoy seeing the character of each army reflected in that model. A Chaos Knight that looked like a melding between, say, the Maulerfiend and the Imperial Knight would be fun. Or hell, maybe one whose armor was twisted to look more Khornate, including the classic Khorne helmet? Ah well.


As I've mentioned many time before where it concerns GW products, a lot of things would be smoothed over if the prices were less ridiculous. People wouldn't care much at all what size the Knight was exactly if they weren't being charged $140 for it. The extremely high price does two bad things: First, it makes people want to investigate it much more closely before they shell out their hard-earned cash than they would if, say, it only cost $60-$80. Second, its only natural to compare what you are getting for your money to other products in the range: when you see the Riptide for $85 and the only-a-tiny-bit-bigger Knight for $140 (and you were price-sensitive in the first place), you feel gouged and therefor not at all inclined to view the thing charitably.

Yeah, the price really surprised me, particularly in comparison to similar kits. I don't know the size of the sprues yet, but it's amazing that the Knight has three sprues while the Baneblade, for the same price, has eight, all of which is enough to create eight Baneblade variants, whereas the Knight just has the one right arm weapon swap. Four or five sprues at that price would've been nice. With another sprue or two they could've probably included the power fist/power lance/lascannon/gatling gun/quake cannon arms necessary to make the other Knight versions. Now in that case I definitely would've bought four or five of them, if I knew I could create all the Knight variants and not just the Errant and Paladin.


My own flgs does a few annual sales where warhammer is 25 percent off, needless to say it is when I will be getting my super heavies.

Yep, the recent 30% off holiday sale my FLGS had was what spurred me to not only buy the Adeptus Astartes Storm Wing, but the Eldar Ghost Warriors box and Tau Empire Firebase Support Cadre box. Those discounts were just too good to ignore.

nosebiter
28-02-2014, 10:28
I am still depressed i didnt snag a ghost warriors box from an online seller...

The Emperor
28-02-2014, 10:29
I am still depressed i didnt snag a ghost warriors box from an online seller...

It's not too late to get one at 20% off.

http://chaosorc.com/warhammer-40k-eldar-ghost-warriors-army-set-p-20515.html

nosebiter
28-02-2014, 10:29
Meh...

We have already as much as a confirmation from FW that they work on chaotic conversion bits for the Knight kit. If their Chaos Reaver and Warhound are anything to go by, I'd bet on different heads and multiple sets of corrupted armour plates. Most likely some chaosified weapons too. I wouldn't count on a genuine Chaos Knight anytime soon - they have an imperial base kit to work with, which GW wants to sell. By Chaos conversion kits, the Knight can be sold to more people - win/win for both of them.


Going by the stuff they do lately, it will most likely be a complete kit, not just a conversion kit.

nosebiter
28-02-2014, 10:30
It's not too late to get one at 20% off.

http://chaosorc.com/warhammer-40k-eldar-ghost-warriors-army-set-p-20515.html

Sadly that is the the usa. Before i add on customs and taxes, it will be moree xpensive then buying it here in denmark

The Emperor
28-02-2014, 10:30
How old are their Titans, anyway, both Imperial and Chaos? I have no idea what year they were produced.


Sadly that is the the usa. Before i add on customs and taxes, it will be moree xpensive then buying it here in denmark

Damn. Sorry. :\

Mandragola
28-02-2014, 19:44
There's now a video tutorial of how to build a knight on the GW site. You can watch it here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njhLv_nyP_s). Not sure if you'll need the info, though it doesn't hurt, but it's interesting to see the thing with its armour off. Looks even cooler in a way.

Converting the legs is going to be a massive pain though! The arms are very multi-pose but the legs aren't at all. If getting more than one that might be a bit of an issue, and with an army I think it would start to look silly.

The codex is also up for pre-order. It doesn't contain any rules for other knights - just the two we know about already. I'm surprised it's appeared for pre-order on Friday though. Does that usually happen? Wonder if it will be out tomorrow... but not getting my hopes up.

Importman
28-02-2014, 20:22
The more I look at this the more I want it. But still, I don't think I will unless I can get them cheaper than the rrp. And honestly where is the fist?

Sent from my GT-N7105 using Tapatalk 2

The Emperor
01-03-2014, 01:23
There's now a video tutorial of how to build a knight on the GW site. You can watch it here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njhLv_nyP_s). Not sure if you'll need the info, though it doesn't hurt, but it's interesting to see the thing with its armour off. Looks even cooler in a way.

Converting the legs is going to be a massive pain though! The arms are very multi-pose but the legs aren't at all. If getting more than one that might be a bit of an issue, and with an army I think it would start to look silly.

The codex is also up for pre-order. It doesn't contain any rules for other knights - just the two we know about already. I'm surprised it's appeared for pre-order on Friday though. Does that usually happen? Wonder if it will be out tomorrow... but not getting my hopes up.

Man, I wish I'd seen that beforehand! I made a screwup assembling the head which, thankfully, I was able to correct. Still, it would've been nice if I could've retained the articulation on my Knight's head.

The Emperor
01-03-2014, 01:29
Anyway, here's the final result.

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Losing Command
01-03-2014, 01:43
The size and shape of the baze suprised me a little. It's actually a little smaller than the Lotr Mumakil base (much like the knight is a little smaller than a mumakil ;)) but it is a lot more rigid than the flyer base. Which is good, never liked how a stormraven wobbles when somebody bumps into the table.

The legs are indeed a bit troublesome to convert. The position of the thigh parts is pretty much set with all the pistons and cables, but nothing a little greenstuff can't fix. Personally going to try and bend the knee of the right leg a little to see if that looks a little more like a walking walker.

agurus1
01-03-2014, 01:59
Anyway, here's the final result.

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seems pretty big to me

The Emperor
01-03-2014, 02:18
6.5 inches tall.

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agurus1
01-03-2014, 03:05
can't wait to get my hands on mine!!!

MajorWesJanson
01-03-2014, 20:34
Going by the stuff they do lately, it will most likely be a complete kit, not just a conversion kit.

FW? They like using plastic bases for kits, as it saves on weight and money- the SM Fellblade uses some parts from the baneblade kit, though it is hard to tell when completed. (And I wish they had done the Fellblade tracks like the sicaran. I love how the Sicaran sides are single pieces with integral tracks)

A Chaos knight could probably use a lot of parts from the plastic knight and still end up vastly different. Keep the legs, hips, and main torso. Replace the arms, torso top, feet, armor plates and head, and you can end up with a vastly different look while still being about 50% plastic.

The Emperor
01-03-2014, 20:48
A Chaos knight could probably use a lot of parts from the plastic knight and still end up vastly different. Keep the legs, hips, and main torso. Replace the arms, torso top, feet, armor plates and head, and you can end up with a vastly different look while still being about 50% plastic.

Agreed. You could probably get a very different look by replacing the exterior features. The plates which cover the legs, the feet, the shoulder pads, the head and faceplates, top hull, and of course the weapons. Hell, I've been thinking about how much the old Epic Banelord looks like a Knight, and it occurs to me from looking at the Knight kit that maybe you could remove that box on the Knight's posterior and replace it with a tail. I would kill to see a Chaos Knight with a tail! But yeah, they could keep half the kit, the interior frame, and just replace the outer bits which could potentially change its appearance completely.

nosebiter
01-03-2014, 20:57
Just finished building mine. And joy of joys, what a marvelous kit to build. A stunning model. Well worth the expense.

Cant wait to get my hands on the companion book, had a flick through a copy in my local GW, and a great book.

agurus1
02-03-2014, 04:01
Started building mine, assembled everything but the arms and head and keeping the armpit plates separate for now. It's impressivly high even at only about 7". It's around 2 stories high compared to Imperial ruins GW sells.

Paint it Red
02-03-2014, 04:06
Here is the fluff of knights. There were a group of planets called knight worlds. These worlds are very similar to feudaul worlds apart from the adeptus mecahnicus visited them during the age of strife. Before then these worlds had no outside contact. The adeptus mechanicus gave them technology including the technology to create big walkers called knights. These planets in 41st millenium are called forgeworlds and create big walkers called 'titans'. Knights are no longer created because the have been superseded by titans, especially the warhound. The planets only created knights because the leader of these knights worlds thought still from the 15th century. They still valued cavalry and high mobility. However, in the armies of mankind (spaces marines and imperial guard) the knights are seen as subpar.

From a fluff point of view the model is only useful to a titan legion army. From the rules I don't think they are that hot either. I think the model looks good but not good enough to buy as an ornament.

agurus1
02-03-2014, 04:23
I don't know man I can see the uses, ranged Strikedown attacks for one will help my Legion vs other CC centered armies that might be I4 (not uncommon). Halving the imitative of Grey Knights that might be coming at my lines is a big thing.

Losing Command
02-03-2014, 05:21
To bad strikedown only affects single models, not whole units, with how shooting attacks are allocated. Still usefull for tanking characters and single model units coming at you that aren't monsterous creatures :)

librerian_samae
02-03-2014, 10:03
here is mine finished assembly wise bar the face helm, some termi scale marines and my slaaneshi hellstrider knight converted from a forge fiend for size comparison.
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Oh the gun arms are incredibly easy to swap between, no magnets needed, possibly a tiny bit of blue tack for gaming use purposes, but other than that the parts hold on quite well.
Also sorry for the picture quality I am having to use my phone camera.