PDA

View Full Version : Possible tyranid



Bloodangeldante
25-02-2014, 22:50
Hey I'm starting to get into tyranids and I wanted some advice about where to start... No I don't have a codex yet :| but I'm going to get one, I don't want to buy stuff so I instantly win, I want a fun gameplay that I may or may not loose


Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk

Geep
25-02-2014, 23:59
That's a pretty broad start.

What appeals to you with 'nids? You can make a swarm army, monstrous creature army, or anything in between. You can focus on combat or shooting, footslogging or odd deployment methods (infiltrate, outflank, deep strike).

All I can say that I'd recommend to anyone is a Hive Tyrant (winged or on foot is up to your preference- both can work), and termagants (armed as you want, but many people would choose fleshborers as they can then be the product of Tervigon spawning). I also think the Tyranid Swarm box is quite a good one if you can stomach forking over that much money at once- although it's not a complete army (Old One Eye is not a good option, so I'm ignoring that possibility).

naloth
26-02-2014, 00:07
Hey I'm starting to get into tyranids and I wanted some advice about where to start... No I don't have a codex yet :| but I'm going to get one, I don't want to buy stuff so I instantly win, I want a fun gameplay that I may or may not loose


There's a Tyranid tactics thread in the Tactics forum that has quite a bit of information.

HereComesTomorrow
26-02-2014, 01:09
I don't want to buy stuff so I instantly win

You won't have that problem with nids...

Langdon
26-02-2014, 01:18
You won't have that problem with nids...

Just users that dont have the skill to try.

rocdocta
26-02-2014, 06:19
The first thing you need when starting a new nid army is to buy a shelf. Place any hopes of a competitive army with good synergy etc on it.

NerZuhl
26-02-2014, 06:44
First things first, why are you here seeking advice before you have educated yourself?

1. Go read the codex
2. Go look at some galleries of the models
3. Make a decision based on your own evaluation

Otherwise this thread is gonna drown in needless troll posts. (Like this one)

Ssilmath
26-02-2014, 06:49
1. Go read the codex
2. Go look at some galleries of the models
3. Make a decision based on your own evaluation


NerZuhl speaks wisdom.

Bloodangeldante
26-02-2014, 21:04
I already know that I want them.. Yes I've seen them and I ready to dish out a bunch of money. I will get the codex soon so just don't tell me when or when not to buy the damn codex.. I'm looking for a game that I could just horde them with troops and have a couple of big guys to pick off anything that worries me


Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk

Bloodangeldante
26-02-2014, 21:05
................

Minibull
26-02-2014, 21:45
Blood, I wouldn't take the tone of several of these replies personally. You happened here not long after the new Nid codex was released and the book was not generally given high marks. Nids have a great look and can be fun to play with several army types. I like the monstrous creatures so I usually go with the big critters. I don't have the patience to paint 100+ gaunts, especially after finishing 48 genestealers not long ago. The best way I would start is with a 500 point force (HQ + 2 troops + what you want to fill it out), then go up in ~250 point additions with figures that you like. Nids won't give you a killer army but they still are fun to play.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

NagashLover
26-02-2014, 22:19
I wanted some advice about where to start...

Sent from my iPod touch using Tapatalk

Well the amazing thing about Nids as an army is you have tons of options on where to go. So you get an idea of what army approach you want to take and you can go with it. For hordes I generally recommend going either all in with horms or terms, you can mix and match but I feel they are better when you dedicate to one or the other. Both are used as cannon fodder more or less, objectives and tying things up so you can then choose the combats you want your threatening units to engage in.

I do recommend getting a HT and a Prime and using them separately. The cost difference between the two can be enough that Primes are still viable options. I would also recommend getting a Tervigon as I have been running it as backfield synapse and spawning. Most importantly when running a theme think about where you want your synapse creatures. For example I generally run my Prime/HT at the front of my swarm with my midfield synapse covered by warrior support and zoanthropes. My backfield has my tervigon with usually some biovores pressuring from the back of the board.

This is why you will see many people crying, they don't quite think about how the unit/monster combinations really work with one another and instead tend towards trying to plug in the "best" overall options in the book together in hopes that they can mitigate the part of 40K that relies on player skill and execution.

I will second Geep and say the Tyranid box is quite a good starting point as it gives you plenty of options to go from there. Terms and horms are great for a swarm of troops, gargoyles do well when you focus on a fast moving swarm (i.e. flyers, deepstrikers, infiltrators) and a fex is always useful if anything as another potential threat.

So first decide if you want a horde of swarming melee creatures or a swarm of shooty Nids. We have plenty of options and loadouts for both.

Ignore the sob brigade as they provide nothing constructive or of logical value to the discussion at hand.

naloth
26-02-2014, 23:43
<snip>Ignore the sob brigade as they provide nothing constructive or of logical value to the discussion at hand.

I've read product advertisement that was written less favorably and heard political ads more respectful of differing views.

If you don't want to plumb through the tactics thread here's my take on things. I'm certainly not a fan of the new codex but with work you can make it work, even well. For composition that largely depends on your meta:
- If you can buy fortifications, it will help. This are basically the only "allies" you can buy.
- If you want to use Lictors or 'Stealers look into the dataslates. They give you upgraded options.
- If you face a fair amount of fliers you'll want a flyrant, crones, or perhaps both.
- Hive Commander is incredibly useful for outflanking a troop choice since you won't have transports to ferry troops. You'll want at least one HT anyway.
- A HT would be superior in every way except he can't hide in a large cheap unit using LOS to protect him. If you're short on synapse and need to keep it alive a Prime hides better.
- A tervigon is useful as psyker, synapse, and an objective holder (depending on the mission).
- I would suggest Termagaunts (rather than Hormagaunts) as troops since you'll need a unit of 30 to unlock a Tervigon and you'll be spawning later. I also find more use for 12" S4 shooting then the hormagaunts CC advantages in this edition. Perhaps 7e will help CC more.
- Devilgaunts are a good bargain. Try to take up to 40% of any purchased Gaunt units as having Devourers (you can mix weapons now).
- Generally people bring around 1 heavy weapon per 150 points and those generally will be shooting at your MCs. Field enough or enough cover to protect them.
- Zoey's have a nice 3++ and powers but you'll want to minimize LOS otherwise they are bolter bait.
- Mawlocs are good disruptions but be careful about sending it into too many troops alone.
- Exocrines are good but somewhat short range.

As for the starter set, I don't see that big of a discount. I'd pick individually what appealed to me in the quantity I wanted to start with.

Langdon
27-02-2014, 00:49
I've read product advertisement that was written less favorably and heard political ads more respectful of differing views.

If you don't want to plumb through the tactics thread here's my take on things. I'm certainly not a fan of the new codex but with work you can make it work, even well. For composition that largely depends on your meta:
- If you can buy fortifications, it will help. This are basically the only "allies" you can buy.
- If you want to use Lictors or 'Stealers look into the dataslates. They give you upgraded options.
- If you face a fair amount of fliers you'll want a flyrant, crones, or perhaps both.
- Hive Commander is incredibly useful for outflanking a troop choice since you won't have transports to ferry troops. You'll want at least one HT anyway.
- A HT would be superior in every way except he can't hide in a large cheap unit using LOS to protect him. If you're short on synapse and need to keep it alive a Prime hides better.
- A tervigon is useful as psyker, synapse, and an objective holder (depending on the mission).
- I would suggest Termagaunts (rather than Hormagaunts) as troops since you'll need a unit of 30 to unlock a Tervigon and you'll be spawning later. I also find more use for 12" S4 shooting then the hormagaunts CC advantages in this edition. Perhaps 7e will help CC more.
- Devilgaunts are a good bargain. Try to take up to 40% of any purchased Gaunt units as having Devourers (you can mix weapons now).
- Generally people bring around 1 heavy weapon per 150 points and those generally will be shooting at your MCs. Field enough or enough cover to protect them.
- Zoey's have a nice 3++ and powers but you'll want to minimize LOS otherwise they are bolter bait.
- Mawlocs are good disruptions but be careful about sending it into too many troops alone.
- Exocrines are good but somewhat short range.

As for the starter set, I don't see that big of a discount. I'd pick individually what appealed to me in the quantity I wanted to start with.

I actually agree with you here..

rocdocta
27-02-2014, 01:17
Well as I was trolling before, I should add some genuine constructive advice for a fellow nid player.

As always the best thing to do when starting a new army is: proxying. Forget all the advice about this or that build. You will be playing it and paying for the models eventually. I have bought whole armies only to find that they didn't suit my style. Vanilla marines am looking at you! I have played 40k since 1994 and nids were my first army. I have IG, Marines, Nids, Necrons, tau and a small 1500pt DE force. But enough about me...

The new book has been received both poorly and happily by various players dependent on their outlook and playstyle. I for one would burn the book and its creators in Mount Doom along with the One Ring. But this is not about that.

things to remember with new nids:

1. Without synapse Nids will lose your (the Player) control. This may mean that they may not move or will shoot at the wrong target or move off the objective. Not auto lose by any means but for some it is a kick in the goolies in an already bland and weak codex for very marginal benefit.

- So what this means is protect your synapse and/or have multiple redundancy for it.

2. As Stalin never said "Quantity has a Quality all of its own." I have found that in most nid editions that its better to have more lower quality bodies than upgrade as much as possible. this is due to a 4 point gaunt falling as easily as an 8 point one. With the removal of fearless wounds in combat, having a super unit tie up a CC monster until the end of time is a classic move. But don't get caught in the excitement that these tie up bodies will actually kill anything of value. They wont.

- So what this means is upgrade key units or members of units but don't give all the upgrades to all the units. Give some MCs regen. Give a termagant unit 50% devs and 50% flesh borers. This way the FBs cop the damage before the devs do.

3. Shooting is King with CC the Jester in this edition. You can try and make the classic nid CC army. Just be prepared for a lot of Starship Trooper scenes where they mow down most of the CC bugs and then a transport comes to safely remove their unit when you are in assault range. You may like that. For example for a hormagant to wound an enemy it must weather multiple shooting phases and even if they get there, the enemy gets one last round of shooting and ooe be unto thee if they have 2 flamers as your cas are removed from the front and you may not make it into combat by falling short. This is one of the reasons that stealers are almost extinct.

- What this means is that nids are now shooting rather than assaulting. Forget the fluff etc. a horm cannot scratch a vehicle. a devgaunt can reliably pull hull points off AV10 when taken even in moderate numbers...and from 18inches away without charging...from inside cover...on top of the objective. I suggest firepower and not claw power as much as it saddens me. It is why I suggest proxy prior to purchase as buying painting and playing a CC list may be depressing.

4. Fortifications can help. We struggle with flyers. a bastion can stop your synapse and venomthropes being sniped out. stick a prime with a VT and put them in a bastion and now they are hidden BUT can also have a much larger footprint. Could put a quad gun or comms depending on your army. However this will make you more static and not project your presence down range.

- What this means is that forts can help if you sit back and try hard to come up with something. It just may not help you win the end game or may not match with your idea of nids operating walkie talkies 'ok outflank...NOW!!!"

5. Venomethropes and +2 to cover saves are not that good. Even with a 2+ cover save people will just either throw bolter shots at it or less commonly will use no cover save weapons to drop it. Read what a hive guard does to VTs. hit on 4s wound on 2s with ID with no saves. 3 HG will almost always kill 3 VTs in 1 round. Think of it as handy but not that good. Once the VTs are dead, the high quality shooting will target synapse to wreck your plans.

- What this means is VTs must be kept hidden and/or in multiples. Don't expect them to survive.

Hope this helps. I am trying to make nids work but find myself grinding my teeth with all the taxes and penalties. With all sincerity good luck.