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Generaloftheabyss
17-03-2014, 14:45
Hey guys , i'm looking to start a small fantasy army. I'd really like my army to be focused around a classic kitted out warlord and ideally want to get him right into the thick of combat! any suggestions on armys/possible builds for whatever race you recommend? whose good in duels/racking up cc kills? i'm looking at around 1500-1850 points , what is most common without hitting 2k points.

Thanks!

GOTA

SSquirrel
17-03-2014, 15:01
Skaven Warlord. Fellblade. Rat ogre bonebreaker.

njaegara
17-03-2014, 15:17
For lizards a kitted out oldblood on cold one is nasty. A few varieties that hit hard and/or hard to kill.

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Ben81
17-03-2014, 17:45
Nurgle daemon prince with 1+ armour save, flight and magic items.

SteveW
17-03-2014, 18:13
Nothing better than a HKB lord for Bretonnia. He can literally kill everything in one shot and you can give him a lot of defense as well.

datalink7
18-03-2014, 04:28
Probably the best single fighter in the game is either going to be a Lizardmen Old Blood, fully kitted out. He beats a Nurgle Daemon Prince in close combat.

Dwarven Lord on Shieldberers might be better, but is harder to get into the combat you want due to slow movement.

Micalovits
18-03-2014, 06:50
Something something bloodthirster...
Though they do lack defence.

moonlapse
18-03-2014, 10:14
Probably the best single fighter in the game is either going to be a Lizardmen Old Blood, fully kitted out. He beats a Nurgle Daemon Prince in close combat.

Dwarven Lord on Shieldberers might be better, but is harder to get into the combat you want due to slow movement.

What makes the Oldblood (I love that name!) better than a Chaos Lord? He basically has chaos Lord stats but less weaponskill, less initiative, and no access to the extremely powerful Chaos Marks.

Borgomos
18-03-2014, 10:22
Indeed, a fully kitted out Chaos Lord will smack the Oldblood. He also has much better mount options.

Timathius
18-03-2014, 10:59
Vampire lord. He is entirely central to your army and can be kitted out to smack pretty much anything in the game. He has the potential to kill 10 rank and file models a turn or you can make him more defensive.

quietus1986
18-03-2014, 15:50
vampire can be kitted out to kill 16 rank and file moddels. bit youl have lower defence.

tmr8188
18-03-2014, 16:45
Beastmen Doombull can wreck entire units on his own. He's fairly cheap kitted out.

inq.serge
18-03-2014, 16:53
My Slaaneshi Sorcerer lord "destroyed" an ogre horde single handedly (Well, His chimera ran them down next turn for him).


A sorcerer lord in WoC Is quite fun; His both a mage, and one hell of a fighter. He's always my MVP.

iamtheeviltwin
18-03-2014, 17:13
Have to throw in another vote for the Vampire Count...his role in the army is about as close to the old "hero-hammer" days so much of your combat strategy will center around a great beat stick.

Sexiest_hero
18-03-2014, 18:26
Another vote for the Ramhorn doombull, He's killed 19 models on his own, smacked down bloodthersters and vampires like nothing. The onething he fears is the HKB brettonian lord and that is my next choice. The Brett lord is pretty much "Boom, headshot"!

datalink7
19-03-2014, 00:53
What makes the Oldblood (I love that name!) better than a Chaos Lord? He basically has chaos Lord stats but less weaponskill, less initiative, and no access to the extremely powerful Chaos Marks.

Mostly because taking an Oldblood in a Lizardmen list actually enhances the list and complements it. Taking a buffed out Chaos Lord is detrimental to a WoC list.

Micalovits
19-03-2014, 06:31
I am gonna put in a vote for daemons, simply due to greater daemons...
Otherwise either vampires or warriors is what you are looking for

Yowzo
19-03-2014, 09:55
Check out orcs and goblins, too.

Lords are hitty and cheap enough you can afford a lord-level magic user and a fully kitted-out warboss. And you really need that ld boost.

boli
19-03-2014, 12:43
High Elf Prince on a Star Dragon may not be the most powerful combat lord in the game (mainly due to lack of staying power) but with Star Lance and Great Weapon (then option of Armour of Caledor or a 4++ ward) it can give an extremely impressive hammer to your army. He's not going to be able to hold his own against anyone similarly costed (he is 600+ points!!) but used sensibly with combo charges and hidden away from cannons I would classify him as a "classically kitted out Warlord".

zunjinto
19-03-2014, 14:29
I would go for a chaos or vampire lord. Beastmen lords are also not so bad

SteveW
20-03-2014, 19:48
The reason I would prefer an old blood over a chaos lord would be the steg helm and predatory fighter. A t6 old blood the charge can do 13 wounds while the chaos lord can do 7.

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Timathius
20-03-2014, 20:35
The reason I would prefer an old blood over a chaos lord would be the steg helm and predatory fighter. A t6 old blood the charge can do 13 wounds while the chaos lord can do 7.

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I still think the Vamp wins this.

he has an amazing stat line

100 in magic items

100 in vampire powers

He can ride a tgheist which is pretty amazing in and of itself

additionally he is a caster, if all that was not enough, so he can de buff the enemy (shadow, death) or buff himself (Vampires) OR raise minions (Vampires).

He eats people, no literally he can heal himself by eating people on the roll of a 6 at the end of combat

you can make him one of the most if not THE most expensive character in the game maxing around 780 points on a dragon (AN UNDEAD DRAGON THAT HE CAN HEAL CUZ MAGIC)

SteveW
20-03-2014, 20:52
The only problem with the vampire is he crumbles. He can lay a beating on stuff, get his mount killed out from under him and crumble from combat res.

Nubl0
20-03-2014, 21:36
Vamp lord also cant ride the tghiest. I still like the oldblood in most matchups, predatory fighter is awesome on a dude with 5 attacks. He also can equip himself very offensively thanks to his easy access of a 1+ save, not to mention that piranha blade is pretty mean.

SteveW
21-03-2014, 01:34
I assumed he meant zombie dragon.

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Timathius
21-03-2014, 03:54
I was including the strigoi in with vampire lords in general. Crumble is an issue for sure but I suppose it really comes down to taste.

Darnok
21-03-2014, 05:41
In general, you don't want your Vampire general to lead the charge: if he dies, your army will start to crumble. To make him work as a CC monster, you almost have to use him with a Black Knights bus - making it a Deathstar, and being short on points for the rest of the "army".

I think the OP is more looking for something like a Dwarf, WoC or LM combat lord. Either of these can be equipped to be a spectacular fighter, while still commanding an actual army (one that looks like it, and isn't only on paper).

quietus1986
21-03-2014, 06:09
vampire blender lord( lvl 1 wizard) can be combinded with a lvl 3 necro in a 2250 pt list. vampire die's one turn of crumbel en necro take's over. Its a risk but it works well and a unit of grave guard is just as gooe oa a black knights bus in my opinion

SteveW
21-03-2014, 11:55
Wight kings are better than vamps in my opinion. Especially with the battle scroll that lets them march.

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drdenner
21-03-2014, 12:45
Karl Franz

trotsky
25-03-2014, 14:49
Grand master with runefang. Can get a 1+ save free. Runefang can be amazing buy with his good weapon skill. You have 15 points over for the luckstone or something. Stick him in 13 innercircle knights with bsb and its a really fun unit.

Zombie P
25-03-2014, 15:21
You have 15 points over for the luckstone or something

Something being the other tricksters shard...

Thats right, re roll all those ward saves that are all you have :D

ZP

CountUlrich
26-03-2014, 12:40
Grand master with runefang. Can get a 1+ save free. Runefang can be amazing buy with his good weapon skill. You have 15 points over for the luckstone or something. Stick him in 13 innercircle knights with bsb and its a really fun unit.

That's the best empire can put out, sure ... but he does t compare at all to the real combat lords ... tgm, ws 6, str 4 (counting your runefang), tough 4, 4 attacks on 6 init or vamp lord ws 7, str 5 (and almost always with ogre blade buffing up to str 7), tough 5, 5 attacks (potentially buffed to 10 by red fury) on 7 init (probably with asf due to quickblood). Now yes, the vl is twice the cost, but that's because he is so superior.

I play empire too, and my general is often a grand master. But if you throw your gm against the real warlords of the game, he is going to be a red spot under their boots. And wounding with that gm 4 str is not a high percentage thing most of the time.

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Zombie P
26-03-2014, 12:58
To further your point ulrich, the trick I propose with the gm can be done better by an old blood. The blade of realities ignores saves, and he is s5 so he really hurts. Buff him with wyssans and you are good to go. Especially with his predatory fighter. The only advantage the gm has is initiative, and the old blood can ride that storm while laying on a lilo.

Vampire lord or old blood for a functioning classic badass. Otherwise there are plenty of contenders.

ZP

Yowzo
26-03-2014, 13:05
And wounding with that gm 4 str is not a high percentage thing most of the time.

A runefang is an autowound weapon, S4 doesn't matter at all.

rolly_321
26-03-2014, 14:16
Empire wizard lord with speculum & cloak of ulfric on a griffon.

You vamp/bloodthirdster/oldblood/chaoslord is going to get spanked if he gets them in a challenge, otherwise its an increadibly daft idea.. but hey you can still throw a few spell around while you chase that pansy chaos lord!

ALTERNATIVELY

Skaven warlord with fellblade, lots cheaper than most combat lords for some insane damage output, while also potentially killing himself, which is classic skaven..

CountUlrich
26-03-2014, 14:51
A runefang is an autowound weapon, S4 doesn't matter at all.

Ok, sorry ... he's still dead before he swings against the blenderlord though ...

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trotsky
26-03-2014, 20:11
Ok, sorry ... he's still dead before he swings against the blenderlord though ...

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was this a thread about who wins in duels? :s

PirateRobotNinjaofDeath
28-03-2014, 20:24
Armies with amazing combat lords:

Vampire Counts - the "blender lord" is an absolute killing machine. 5 ASF S7 attacks, and he gets an extra attack for each unsaved wound. He's typically seen either in a black knight bus for mobility, or on foot with skeletons or grave guard. He's in the running for the killiest lord in the game. He can also be your primary wizard.

Warriors of Chaos - can also make some devastatingly killy characters. The demon prince can be made borderline invincible, and is a giant thunder-stomping monster to boot. Oh and he flies, and can be a level 4 death wizard. Talk about nasty. However it's considered a somewhat "cheesy" build and everyone and their mother brings the tools to take him down. Chaos Lords are also awesomely killy, and you'll get some brownie points for taking him over a demon prince. The only problem is that you'll need to run him in Knights to protect him, and unlike Vampires running the lord means you'll have troubles fitting a level 4 wizard into the army as well.

Beastmen - the hitback doombull is a *********** monster. He's got a huge number of S6 attacks which increases every round of combat he wins. Oh, and for every wound he saves with his 1+ rerollable armour save he gets an additional attack! He's one of the few lords that can basically be thrown into any unit solo and, so long as he doesn't get broken on static combat res, expect to come out ontop.

Bretonnia - the Heroic Killing Blow lord has probably a dozen unique snowflake builds, but in general they include a 1+ or 2+ rerollable armour save and some way to maximize the number of HKB attempts he can make. Generally that's something like the ASF sword to maximize hits, or the wyrmlance for rerolls to wound. In an army where everything is overcosted, this guy is absolutely undercosted for his offensive capabilities and a complete beast in combat.

Armies with strong combat lords:

Lizardmen - Saurus Old Bloods are very strong and super killy, though slightly weaker than those in the above categories. He also eats into points available for the Slann, who is the lynchpin of most competitive lizardmen builds. That said, saurus scar vets are also very killy and come out of heroes. Most lizardmen players I see run 1-3 "scar vet cowboys" solo on cold ones, and they're a force to be reckoned with

Dark Elves - DE masters and dreadlords can both be really killy, coming stock with ASF and high weapon skill and plenty of awesome equipment options. You often see them flying around on pegs, knocking out key threats like laser-guided missiles.

High Elves - you can build a pretty killy HE lord, though not quite as killy as his DE compatriot.

Ogres - Put 100 points of magic items on an elite ogre statline and you're pretty much guaranteed to get something scary

Orcs - Same thing as with ogres. Black orc characters are mean as ****.



Most other armies can also build a pretty decent combat lord, though I don't think any of them can quite stand up to the ones listed above.

datalink7
29-03-2014, 08:04
Good run down, but I really believe that the Saurus Old Blood belongs in the "amazing" combat lord category. He beats a Vamp blender lord, a WoC lord, a WoC DP, Bret Lord barring killing blow getting past 4++, and most other things. Haven't run him against the Doombull but I wouldn't be surprised if he wins there as well.

Plus, you can take him and a Slann (admittedly, not with much equipment), so it's one of the only armies (along with Vamps, WoC, Brets and probably Dark Elves) where a combat Lord doesn't eat into your competitiveness.

Nubl0
29-03-2014, 09:57
I feel that is is the case, and also he is rather cheap for what he brings to the table. It's not hard to field a slann alongside an oldblood. That said, I had totally forgotten about the doombull, he's probably up there with the blendervamp as far as unit smashing goes, might even be better infact.

Borgomos
29-03-2014, 10:13
Saurus Oldblood does not win against a Tzeentch Disclord.

Saying he beats Bret Lord barring killing blow is a faulty argument, the Bret Lords entire shtick is to get that Heroing Killing blow in the first place.

Doombull and Vampire Lord are not duelists but unit-killers.

That being said, i rate Oldblood very highly as well. His main problem is that he is slow and his mount\mounted escort options are generally quite bad. Solo Cowboy seems to be the best way to field him. I like that he can do stuff without having a lot of points invested in him.

Alltaken
29-03-2014, 13:41
Empire wizard lord with speculum & cloak of ulfric on a griffon.
If you see a flying empire wizard and you challenge it your starting your Fantasy carreer really!

Oldbloods most likely, buy on a horse a batallion, sally or 2, a skink priest and you got your army there probably. Cowboys work wonders with LM. What I dont know is how he gets to pull 13 wounds

Dwarf lords are awesome, but taking them to the combat you want is hard.

I dont know why the blender lord isnt getting more mentions, he's deffinetly cheese


From my servoskull

SimaoSegunda
29-03-2014, 18:25
Not strictly relevant to the OP, but if you want a character to win a duel, then a Treeman Ancient with a Murder of Spites and and Annoyance of Netlings is absolutely killer.

Panda in Panic
30-03-2014, 00:07
Probably the most effective combat lords considering the whole army are characters who are fighters and wizards at the same time. That means well kitted vampire lords and daemon princes.

But I would say that chaos lord well equipped can be the badest ass in town. He can have 1+ re-rollable armor save, 3++ re-rolls 1s ward save and soul feeder for defense and still have 25 points for magic items and other stuff, for example gw and the other tricksters shard. Try to kill that then... And chaos lord has several good options for mount, horse if you want to go with knights and jugged or daemonic mount if you want to ride alone or with skullcrushers and there's chaos dragon as well.

But there is one combo for chaos lord that is probably the most effective for entire unit slaying: khorne lord, potion of foolhardiness, helm of many eyes for asf, and hellfire sword which gives flame attacks, ignores armor saves, D3 wounds, and for every foe slain by throwing a 6 the slain enemy explodes and inflicts D6 S4 hits to the enemy unit. Then you can have soul feeder and S4 breath weapon. That means 7 asf attacks S5 that ignore armour saves and inflict D3 wounds with the explosion possibility plus the breath weapon. Imagine that bastard charging a troll horde. It's possible that he inflicts 75 wounds killing a total of 25 trolls, if the dice are favorable... Then there is also a change that he fails the stupidity check and the trolls vomit him to death.