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View Full Version : Dan's Weekly Poll #5: One Book to Rule Them All



Lord Dan
24-03-2014, 23:55
One of the more interesting, as-of-yet unfounded rumors about our next edition of Warhammer is regarding all of the individual army books being combined into the BRB itself. Whether or not this makes sense, either from a practical business or financial standpoint, I'm curious as to how you all feel about it from a consumer and gaming perspective. Please take a moment to answer the poll, above.

Urgat
24-03-2014, 23:56
You forgot the poll, above :p

Lord Dan
25-03-2014, 00:01
Haha, for some reason it posts the thread while I'm creating the poll.

Moss
25-03-2014, 01:30
I like the idea of all books being updated at the same time, so that you don't have the current problem of books being two editions behind others.

Kakapo42
25-03-2014, 02:08
I'm very opposed. Call me a special-snowflake-handkerchief-obsessing lunatic if you must, but I really like having each faction with it's own army book. Regardless of what problems it poses, I feel like it helps make each faction really unique, and I like that. Everyone should feel like their army is special if you ask me.

Kahadras
25-03-2014, 02:30
I think it would be a good idea. Combining armies into the BRB allows GW to fix issues with individual rulebooks while bringing everything into line with the new edition. They could then use feedback on the BRB army lists to hammer out issues with individual armies if they then wanted to re-release them as stand alone army books.

The bearded one
25-03-2014, 02:41
If people complain about bookprices now, then imagine the price this 750-1000 page colossus will be.

If anything I'm opposed because combining them all in in one book will make that unreasonably large (a hassle during gaming. The large BRB is quite a handful already), and thus an unreasonably pricey basic requirement to play the game (again, the large BRB is an expensive enough entrycost as it is). Putting them all in one book will either make that book huge, or will see all the armies and their rules compressed.

bigbiggles
25-03-2014, 07:35
I have all the armies and I'm still opposed. Partly because I fear fluff or units will be dropped, and partly because a large book is a hastle to use and handle

MOMUS
25-03-2014, 08:07
I think this rumour and idea would only be imposed if a major rule overhaul was implemented and there was a need for a quick 'get me by' set of lists a la 40k 3rd edition.

I would like separate army books.

Darnok
25-03-2014, 09:36
I can see a temporary thing like the "Ravening Hordes" booklet from WHF 6th or the extremely streamlined army lists in the BRB from 40K 3rd - but the "temporary" can not be stressed enough.

I can not see such a thing working for a longer time, and thus voted "very opposed". Individual army books are essential to flesh out each faction. And to be honest: with the way GW adds supplements for individual companies of subfactions of a codex in 40K, I don't see them doing the exact contrary in WHF.

Samsonov
25-03-2014, 09:56
They can do this for Warmaster, Warmaster Ancients had loads of army lists, similarly Hail Caeser and Black Powder (yes, all these also got expansions but the first rulebook contained more armies than warhammer does). Ultimately, if warhammer cannot do this then I suggest it is not streamlined enough.

Scythe
25-03-2014, 10:01
I like having separate army books, so you could say I'm opposed. That said, I am rather unlikely to buy any new books from a new edition, once it arrives, and I sincerely hope they 'finish' 8th edition with the four missing army books before starting over (and without the weekly codex spam nonsense we have with 40k now).

Malagor
25-03-2014, 10:27
Very opposed.
I like having a book for my army, a book that fleshes out my army with rules and fluff.
Having 1 book to provide the same content for all factions would probably make it bigger then the BRB and more expensive and wouldn't work out in the end.

Baragash
25-03-2014, 11:05
I'm perfectly happy buying fluff and army lists separately, so I'd have no issue with this in principle. (I voted neutral though as I don't mind them being separate in principle).

StygianBeach
25-03-2014, 11:12
If people complain about bookprices now, then imagine the price this 750-1000 page colossus will be.

If anything I'm opposed because combining them all in in one book will make that unreasonably large (a hassle during gaming. The large BRB is quite a handful already), and thus an unreasonably pricey basic requirement to play the game (again, the large BRB is an expensive enough entrycost as it is). Putting them all in one book will either make that book huge, or will see all the armies and their rules compressed.

I am also very opposed. Having a large book sounds nice and tidy, but functionally it is a nightmare.

Looking up stuff is much more difficult, and also carrying around all the armies while only needing two is a hassle I would rather avoid.

Karak Norn Clansman
25-03-2014, 11:31
My main problem with this has to do with background. With WD having long since ceased to be a wealth of hobby material, GW's army books and codices are the remaining redoubts of developing (or even preserving) background, not counting Black Library and Forgeworld. One big army book would necessarily cut down on the background parts for all armies. This would have to be compensated with thinner, background-focused army books if I was to be happy with it, and it's far from certain if this would be a viable solution.

Well, Ipad-ing all the background would work, but it would be a slap in the face for all of us without Ipads...

shelfunit.
25-03-2014, 12:16
If people complain about bookprices now, then imagine the price this 750-1000 page colossus will be.

10-15 pages per list plus a couple of pages for magic items/special rules/magic, done. 250 pages tops. Fluff can be in seperate books. Might cost about £50, but that's still significantly better than £30 a pop per army.

Karak Norn Clansman
25-03-2014, 12:30
10-15 pages per list plus a couple of pages for magic items/special rules/magic, done. 250 pages tops. Fluff can be in seperate books. Might cost about £50, but that's still significantly better than £30 a pop per army.

It sounds like a bad business idea, then. :p

Vipoid
25-03-2014, 12:34
On the one hand, having all armies presumably updated at the same time - along with the current edition - could be interesting. Might also be nice to have the rules for other armies handy, so that you can give them a try without forking out for an expensive army book. But then, you've effectively already paid for every such army book - regardless of whether or not you want to play them.

In any case, I also have a few problems:

1) Considering that such a book will likely have an excessive price tag, it's likely that our group would just buy one and share it. This *might* involve paying less each than we would have done for individual army books (though this is GW, so I won't hold my breath), but this will also involve us borrowing said book whenever we want to build an army.

2) I really don't like the idea of ploughing through a monolithic book whenever I want to find the stuff relating to my army.

3) Related to the above points, it will make it more of a pain with regard to checking rules for individual armies - since we can't have our separate books open at the right pages.

4) To me, this seems like it would be used as an excuse to cut down options even further. e.g. "Well, since all the books are now one book, they don't need individual magic items, do they?"


10-15 pages per list plus a couple of pages for magic items/special rules/magic, done. 250 pages tops. Fluff can be in seperate books. Might cost about £50, but that's still significantly better than £30 a pop per army.

Considering GW's track record, £50 seems optimistic to the point of being delusional. The current BRB is £45. I very much doubt a combined book would would be sold for less than £100, and wouldn't be surprised to see GW trying to sell it for twice that amount.

Evil Hypnotist
25-03-2014, 12:52
Opposed, but not very opposed. I think in some cases the levels of special rules required to remember for a race is a bit much, and would be reduced severely if a Super Army Rulebook was released. However, my favourite bit of an armybook; the fluff, would be severely reduced as well.

Imperator64
25-03-2014, 13:28
I'm all for it. I'd like to know about my enemy without having to pay£30 for each factions book.

shelfunit.
25-03-2014, 13:50
Considering GW's track record, £50 seems optimistic to the point of being delusional. The current BRB is £45. I very much doubt a combined book would would be sold for less than £100, and wouldn't be surprised to see GW trying to sell it for twice that amount.

Then they can kiss any new players completely goodbye. If the aim is to expand their market increasing prices is (and the last several years worth of financials show) the fastest way to shed customers by the bucket full.

Timathius
25-03-2014, 13:51
opposed and most of the reasons above are the main reasons but I have one more. I already have to hulk around a ton of stuff, I don't want to swap my nice small army book for the tome that this would create.

Vipoid
25-03-2014, 14:06
Then they can kiss any new players completely goodbye. If the aim is to expand their market increasing prices is (and the last several years worth of financials show) the fastest way to shed customers by the bucket full.

Oh, I quite agree - but that certainly hasn't stopped them before.

IcedCrow
25-03-2014, 14:22
There's no way that they will give up the amount of money they make off of people that feel that they have to own every book or be at a disadvantage by combining them all into one book and then charging at a much less rate than what the books all collectively go for now.

Thinking that a book like that would go for $100 is completely insane... 10 army books go for $1000, there's no way you're going to get them to distill that into one volume for $100. There is more of a chance that the history channel is right about aliens and that aliens have created a moon base than there will be for this scenario to play out.

Fear Ghoul
25-03-2014, 15:37
I quite like the idea of having updated army lists as part of the BRB, much like 3rd edition 40k but without all the associated blandness. Subsequently GW would not need to release army books for every army, and instead use campaign packs, expansions, and White Dwarf to release their new models. But of course this isn't going to happen, because it would be too inexpensive to GW customers and be too sensible for GW management.

tezdal
25-03-2014, 15:48
Depends on the rules, and the price. Since I havnt bought any of the overpriced 50 dollar armybooks indifferent to them being invalidated.

quietus1986
25-03-2014, 17:00
All depends how they do is. so I am not for or against it. ( Id love the idee to have al the army's updated at the same time do )

Snake1311
26-03-2014, 11:29
I'm supportive of this in principle. It means they would look at all the armies simultaneously, and at least theoretically achieve better balance and such.

It also doesn't necessarily mean the death of separate army books; they could all still be released as separate publications, but at the same time as each other and as the big book. So you'd maybe get the rulebook for £45, army books for £30, and a big hefty volume with everything rulewise (probably with much less fluff and pics so it can physically fit) for £150? I mean, I'd buy it for that, even with less fluff and pictures...

Spiney Norman
26-03-2014, 15:48
There are obviously pros and cons to this, but in this case I feel the negatives outweigh the positives.

Firstly the physical size of such a time would be impractical, those of us who own the large format brb (or worse the Ltd Ed) can testify what a pain it is to lug it around to games, two such volumes would make it even worse.

Secondly you would have to lose something in the detail or quantity of fluff and artwork if you were going to make a single book containing the material for all 15 armies. Army books usually weigh in around 80-100 pages at the moment, a book that just bundled them altogether would be a staggering 1200-1500 pages which is totally impractical unless they took a lot of stuff out.

Thirdly the cost, I resent having to pay the current going rate for one army book, let alone a single volume with 15 armies in, I deeply resent being made to pay for content I will not use (and my 5 armies would only account for 1/3 of the content of a combined volume).

The principle benefit of a combined volume is the rather shaky assumption that if they designed all army lists at the same time they would somehow manage to balance them properly, but I have some serious doubts about that, when they can produce army books that put units like the stegadon and troglodon alongside each other, or the chimera and slaughterbrute then they can easily screw up the balance between several lists designed concurrently.

People are assuming that GW manage to achieve game imbalance by accident, but to be honest I struggle to believe that anyone who actually plays the game can consistently get it so wrong, I'm fairly certain they have got a policy of imbalance in order to drive sales.

Zombie P
26-03-2014, 17:50
I like things the way they are, at least more than this possible universe, so opposed. The practicalities and imaginable flaws are terrifying!

ZP

The bearded one
26-03-2014, 17:57
There are obviously pros and cons to this, but in this case I feel the negatives outweigh the positives.

Firstly the physical size of such a time would be impractical, those of us who own the large format brb (or worse the Ltd Ed) can testify what a pain it is to lug it around to games, two such volumes would make it even worse.

Secondly you would have to lose something in the detail or quantity of fluff and artwork if you were going to make a single book containing the material for all 15 armies. Army books usually weigh in around 80-100 pages at the moment, a book that just bundled them altogether would be a staggering 1200-1500 pages which is totally impractical unless they took a lot of stuff out.

Thirdly the cost, I resent having to pay the current going rate for one army book, let alone a single volume with 15 armies in, I deeply resent being made to pay for content I will not use (and my 5 armies would only account for 1/3 of the content of a combined volume).

The principle benefit of a combined volume is the rather shaky assumption that if they designed all army lists at the same time they would somehow manage to balance them properly, but I have some serious doubts about that, when they can produce army books that put units like the stegadon and troglodon alongside each other, or the chimera and slaughterbrute then they can easily screw up the balance between several lists designed concurrently.

People are assuming that GW manage to achieve game imbalance by accident, but to be honest I struggle to believe that anyone who actually plays the game can consistently get it so wrong, I'm fairly certain they have got a policy of imbalance in order to drive sales.

This hits all the important points for me. An internet cookie for the vertebrae man*


* Also a cookie for who gets it.

SpanielBear
26-03-2014, 20:18
This hits all the important points for me. An internet cookie for the vertebrae man*


* Also a cookie for who gets it.

Vertebrae. Because he's spine-y..

I just really want a cookie...