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Dark_Mage99
28-05-2014, 12:17
What are the current spoken/unspoken rules on using non GW models in stores and at tournaments?

I've heard 50/50 bandied about, but what does that mean? Is it a per model thing, or across the army?

What constitutes 50/50?

How can anyone really tell if they're non GW or not? (I'm planning a heavily converted army).

theunwantedbeing
28-05-2014, 12:22
The general rule is don't.

Urgat
28-05-2014, 12:30
Even with GW models, you may have problems anyway, because most of the current staff won't recognize the older models, and then try and convince them they're actually old GW models (obviously getting the base off to show the slotta isn't exactly an option... especially on preslotta minis)!
Anyway, I don't know about other people, but I've had such horrible experience playing in stores I don't exactly recommend it.

Avian
28-05-2014, 12:40
As a rule of thumb, don't play in GW stores or in any GW-run events (if such a thing still exists). That avoids essentially all your problems.

DruidNei
28-05-2014, 12:52
I've never seen anyone having problems with non-GW models in independent stores in my area. Not that I go there a lot.
Armies almost fully converted or built on alternative miniatures show from time to time in tournament reports from US.

Check out your local gaming places. I don't think there is some worldwide agreement on this.

HelloKitty
28-05-2014, 13:25
It has largely never had a GW creature examine its army enough to actually make sure all models were of the GW creature's. Some of the manager things do know about reaper etc and will not let it use those if they see it using them. One GW creature would not let it bring models that it could not sell into its filthy store, so older gw models were not allowed because the thing could not sell them and thus banned all such plastic and metal from its presence, even if they were older edition model-things that were sold by the gw at one time in the past.

Kung Fu Hamster
28-05-2014, 15:30
The word I got from my local GW is 51% of the army needs to be GW models to use in the store. YMMV, of course, as managers have a good amount of leeway in this regard.


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HelloKitty
28-05-2014, 15:48
Yes hamster-creature. Each manager-thing is different. Its manager largely does not care and lets us use non GW models for characters etc so long as most of its army is GW. It even lets the creatures use Forge World, something the previous manager-creature did not let it use because it did not sell Forge World in the store so would not let it use it.

furrie
28-05-2014, 15:51
it all depends on the store / tournaments.

Luigi
28-05-2014, 21:26
My 2 cents on this:
If you're playing in a GW store then you cannot use non-GW miniatures (hiding a few troops here and there in the back ranks should go unnoticed though :P)
If you're playing in your local gaming store it really should not matter what brand of miniatures you are using.
And, finally, if you're playing at home then you're the one that has a final saying.

Of course if your opponent does complains that your miniatures are not GW material you can always smile at them and not pay with him/her until some sense gets back into him/her.

I never understood people that will refuse a game because "those are not official miniatures". To me that sounds just ridiculous as "I won't play against you because I don't like the colour scheme on your BSB and cavalry".

williamsond
28-05-2014, 22:04
yup a good rule of thumb is no non-gw models in gw shops, however no where else will care, so long as you can tell what its meant to be and is of a similar size.

Epicene
28-05-2014, 22:56
I've had some staff get iffy about me using very old models before as staff members in my local GW have all (by their own admission) only been GW fans a couple years (or in one persons case - months) and they simply don't recognize older models.

Theres also the old line "We don't sell it anymore, so its not 'legal'.

On another note - I love Reaper minis. Got a few in my Empire Army as heroes. I'm eyeing up some for my High Elves, too :)

yabbadabba
28-05-2014, 23:05
What are the current spoken/unspoken rules on using non GW models in stores and at tournaments?
I've heard 50/50 bandied about, but what does that mean? Is it a per model thing, or across the army?
What constitutes 50/50?
How can anyone really tell if they're non GW or not? (I'm planning a heavily converted army). Its pretty much covered here, although possibly not as straight forward as you might have hoped ;)

1. When it comes to whole models, GW does not allow any non-GW models in their gaming environments. Some will ban old models because they do not know better, others will ban old models because they think it is 1994 again.
2. When it comes to non-GW environments, ask what the rules are - its all down to the owner
3. When it comes to conversions, check with the venue. GW have fluctuated between 51% and 100% GW pieces in their environments. Normally for tournaments and events they specify in the packs. I had to caution a staff member once for trying to ban a model which someone had part scratch built, part sculpted. Silly, silly boy. Anyway, other places might have their own rules. Oh, and don't forget WYSIWYG.
4. Finally, its your toy soldiers. If GW say no and others are being difficult, then don't give up. Attitudes on this change as often as a teenager chnages their mind.

Imperator64
31-05-2014, 00:42
I'd be interested to know what country each poster in this thread comes from. I've never played in a gw store but gathered from friends that non-gw was a no go. (i'm from uk). Do the rules get less harsh the further away from nottingham that one gets?

CountUlrich
31-05-2014, 00:59
Im from Austin, Texas. In America the independent tournament scene is massively larger and more varied than any GW scene, and most people don't play in GW stores either, so if you would rather throw down mantic zombies or AoW dwarves no one cares.

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MOMUS
31-05-2014, 01:32
Im from Austin, Texas. In America the independent tournament scene is massively larger and more varied than any GW scene...


Theres a GW scene? :confused:

In a GW = all GW models
Tournament = Whatever the TO allows....even a bucket of bugs! :shifty:

Lorcryst
31-05-2014, 12:08
The last (and only) time I tried to play in my local GW, the players were obnoxious, and I had GW/Citadel models in my Night Goblin army older than the manager (who didn't know the rules of 8th Ed Fantasy even tough he was supposed to run demo games).

I didn't even think of bringing my Daemons of Nurgle, because two of my Heralds are either AoW or HellDorado models, while 4 of my 6 Beasts of Nurgle are Reaper's Great Worms ... but when I did a painting session there with my first and second generation Plaguebearers (the ones with orcish faces and runed plagueswords), the manager asked me if those were GW models when I glued them to the bases ... had to show the tab with "Citadel 1988" on one side and "plaguebearer" on the other side before he "allowed" me to paint them in the store ...

Same thing with some of my paints, I still have a couple of hex pots and the old inks, he wouldn't believe GW had produced them, or that I was able to keep them fresh with carefull storage and a bit of water now and then.

It all depends on your local GW and it's manager and "fauna", but I'd say to avoid such venues and search for either a club with friendly people or a local independent store ... I've found that indies are much more lenient, since they don't sell GW models exclusively ... and they also have a better grasp of the rules, strangely enough !

Bloodknight
31-05-2014, 13:33
but when I did a painting session there with my first and second generation Plaguebearers (the ones with orcish faces and runed plagueswords), the manager asked me if those were GW models when I glued them to the bases

I've had that with Plaguebearers from the 90s before, actually only a year or two after the current ones had been released. The redshirts did not know that the models I had there were the predecessors of the current ones, and neither did the blackshirt. Same for some 5th edition Empire models and some of the Dogs of War range when they actually still were selling those.
I wonder how GW always manages to find those noobs, who're supposedly fans of the stuff they make, but don't actually know anything about it. I'd expect them to at least recognize some of the back catalogue, particularly if those models have been out of date for a year or two only.


or that I was able to keep them fresh with carefull storage and a bit of water now and then
He probably couldn't believe that they once sold paints that did not dry out in a year in an unopened pot. Although that has become a bit better since they ditched those godawful screw top pots.

Verm1s
31-05-2014, 14:11
I wonder how GW always manages to find those noobs, who're supposedly fans of the stuff they make, but don't actually know anything about it.

I remember the time when the current Necron 'dex was out a couple of weeks, and I was lamenting to a blueshirt about the loss of pariahs in it. They didn't have a clue what I was talking about.

HelloKitty
31-05-2014, 15:17
it has found most gw store managers are not allowed to be gamers or fans. In fact it applied before and was told by several of the creatures that gw will not hire players or anyone familiar with the game, it is against its policy to do so.

SpanielBear
31-05-2014, 15:17
Sad to hear the negative experiences people are having. Worth giving feedback about really, either to the store manager or take it higher. stuff like that costs sales.

My own store is really good, thankfully. There's a blanket ban on non-GW products, but they are cool with scratch built models (in fact they are likely to gush like fan boys over a cool conversion!), so long as some GW bits were used. They are also hobby veterans, and are pretty relaxed about old models.

But yeah, general rule of thumb, no non-GW models at GW events or stores.

HelloKitty
31-05-2014, 15:19
It will also point out that its GW store is very good, but that is because the player things that are there tend to not be filthy creatures and none of the creatures argue rules or are obnoxious.

Bloodknight
31-05-2014, 17:40
. In fact it applied before and was told by several of the creatures that gw will not hire players or anyone familiar with the game, it is against its policy to do so.

It got lied to.
No, seriously, unless they did a 180 on that policy, people used to be required to have armies for at least two core systems.

Lorcryst
01-06-2014, 00:34
It got lied to.
No, seriously, unless they did a 180 on that policy, people used to be required to have armies for at least two core systems.

I also applied to work at my local GW when they were recruiting for the manager position, got several emails and a "speed-interview" by phone ... apparently, a wide knowledge of all their universes, including some very obscure references, 25 years collecting and painting models, a diploma in marketing and enthusiasm are worth next to nothing compared to a couple of years of experience in a sales department and an art degree.

Ok, I'm bitter.

But to give him his dues, the manager of my local GW, while young and more of a seller than a hobbyist (I know for a fact that all the armies displayed in the store are "player's armies", and that he doesn't have one), IS a terrific painter, I go there mostly to ask questions about colour schemes and colour theory ... well, he did paint a rusted iron sword with verdigris on it, proving that his grasp of chemistry is rather lacking ...

My best suggestion is this : try to find a club near(ish) of where you live, with individuals having the same outlook of the game as you, and never worry again about "full GW models" (there are companies out there that produce absolutely beautifull things, not always cheaper than GW, mind) and when you want to collect, paint, and finally push your lovingly painted and converted models around, having "friends" (quotation marks because when you start in a club, you don't know the people there) to do so with is the best thing in the world !

GrandmasterWang
01-06-2014, 05:32
Sad to hear the negative experiences people are having. Worth giving feedback about really, either to the store manager or take it higher. stuff like that costs sales.

My own store is really good, thankfully. There's a blanket ban on non-GW products, but they are cool with scratch built models (in fact they are likely to gush like fan boys over a cool conversion!), so long as some GW bits were used. They are also hobby veterans, and are pretty relaxed about old models.

But yeah, general rule of thumb, no non-GW models at GW events or stores.

My local GW store is just like yours.

Pretty chilled with conversions but rival models are a no-no which is understandable

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KalEf
01-06-2014, 05:44
I also applied to work at my local GW when they were recruiting for the manager position, got several emails and a "speed-interview" by phone ... apparently, a wide knowledge of all their universes, including some very obscure references, 25 years collecting and painting models, a diploma in marketing and enthusiasm are worth next to nothing compared to a couple of years of experience in a sales department and an art degree.

Ok, I'm bitter.

But to give him his dues, the manager of my local GW, while young and more of a seller than a hobbyist (I know for a fact that all the armies displayed in the store are "player's armies", and that he doesn't have one), IS a terrific painter, I go there mostly to ask questions about colour schemes and colour theory ... well, he did paint a rusted iron sword with verdigris on it, proving that his grasp of chemistry is rather lacking ...

My best suggestion is this : try to find a club near(ish) of where you live, with individuals having the same outlook of the game as you, and never worry again about "full GW models" (there are companies out there that produce absolutely beautifull things, not always cheaper than GW, mind) and when you want to collect, paint, and finally push your lovingly painted and converted models around, having "friends" (quotation marks because when you start in a club, you don't know the people there) to do so with is the best thing in the world !

I loved everything about this post

SteveW
01-06-2014, 06:10
It got lied to.
No, seriously, unless they did a 180 on that policy, people used to be required to have armies for at least two core systems.

That was on the application when I worked for them in 04. It didn't seem to mean anything though because I was the only guy there that could run a demo game of anything other than 40k.