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Barghest
16-06-2014, 19:08
I thought it might be nice to have a thread wherein we can discuss the upcoming (rumoured) Bretonnian army book in the General thread, since Darnok has declared the News & Rumour threads to be wishlisting.

Personally, I am hesitant about the rumour since there is literally nothing to back it up. On the other hand we didn't see much about Wood Elves until they were almost on top of us. Avian has suggested in an earlier thread that Bretonnians would be more likely later rather than sooner and I think he's on to something with the drawn out release of Orks as an example (we probably won't even see a damn Ork 'dex until July, at this rate).

Rumours include:

A book (no, really?)
New Questing/Grail Knight c-c-c-combo kit
A trebuchet/relique thingy kit
Knights on foot

Mc1gamer
16-06-2014, 20:02
If you've got links to rumors, please post them. Anything up to date, IE as of this week.Thanks!

Barghest
16-06-2014, 20:35
If you've got links to rumors, please post them. Anything up to date, IE as of this week.Thanks!

I don't; this is just what I've heard from one place or another. Hell, the same rumours are listed in both of the most recent rumour threads on this very site. I'd find a source for them but honestly my belief in them is only middling. It'd be nice if one or two or all of them were true, but I have my doubts.

rwphillipsstl
16-06-2014, 20:56
Wasn't the lead miniature in the Wood Elf teaser video a Bretonnian yeoman figure? Why would they do that of they had no plans to expand/update the Bretonnian range?

Greyshadow
16-06-2014, 20:56
According to a recent post from Avian, there was a rumour from Hastings (or Harry) that Bretonnians were due up next. I recall that the approximate date was suggested as Aug by someone reputable (go look through Avian's and Darnok's posts over the last few months - it's in there somewhere).

I guess what I am saying is that although Faiets comments about Bretonnia in July isn't reliable (as his 'rumours' are frequently dross), there are rumours from reliable sources saying they are soon. I am thrilled by this news, GW have been struggling to maintain such a huge range of armies but if they went ahead and released a new Bretonnian book after such a long time when they could have dropped the army, I think it represents some real loyalty to there customers. Also, my brother collects Bretonnians and I am sure he will love a new book and some new models.

Epicene
16-06-2014, 22:34
If Bretons are to get the level of update needed to missing kits and still have new units added, then they're going to have to dual kit with models already released... so this would be my wishlist

- Questing Knights & Grail Knights
- Mounted Yeomen & [something] (the way kits have been going lately, I'll pin a bet on Damsels riding Unicorns)
- Battle Pilgrims & [something] (*if* the foot-knights rumor is true, it'll be them)
- Grail Relqiue & [something] (I'll pin a bet on a Damsel on a throne)
- Trebuchet
- Clamshell Lord on Horse

6 kits. Big, but not impossible. Dark Elves and Dwarves got a large releases, once you include Clamshells and the Wood Elf release wasn't exactly small either.

Ultimate Life Form
16-06-2014, 23:55
What's a Clamshell Lord? Could this hint at an impending Fishmen release?

Oswen
17-06-2014, 01:52
If Bretons are to get the level of update needed to missing kits and still have new units added, then they're going to have to dual kit with models already released... so this would be my wishlist

- Questing Knights & Grail Knights
- Mounted Yeomen & [something] (the way kits have been going lately, I'll pin a bet on Damsels riding Unicorns)
- Battle Pilgrims & [something] (*if* the foot-knights rumor is true, it'll be them)
- Grail Relqiue & [something] (I'll pin a bet on a Damsel on a throne)
- Trebuchet
- Clamshell Lord on Horse

6 kits. Big, but not impossible. Dark Elves and Dwarves got a large releases, once you include Clamshells and the Wood Elf release wasn't exactly small either.

I think it will be something like that.
Only thing i can't see happening is the Trebuchet not becoming a dualkit aswell since the finecast model is also gone.
Trabuchet/Grail Reliquiarie? Maybe it will turn into some wooden mini-temple thing to fit with the trebuchet structure.

ashc
17-06-2014, 06:02
What's a Clamshell Lord? Could this hint at an impending Fishmen release?

Those plastic characters in the plastic packs, odd name for them, imho.

Urgat
17-06-2014, 06:30
Faiets comments about Bretonnia in July isn't reliable
Water is wet!


Those plastic characters in the plastic packs, odd name for them, imho.
I believe it's clampack, no?

Ludaman
17-06-2014, 07:35
Have there been any plastic character clampacks released for either fantasy or 40k that are have been as big as a horse and rider pack would need to be?

Malagor
17-06-2014, 10:21
Have there been any plastic character clampacks released for either fantasy or 40k that are have been as big as a horse and rider pack would need to be?
Not that I'm aware of.
Would guess that such a model would be too big for their normal packages.
But they could give it the high elf package tho with a mage on foot and horse and then a lord on horse and foot.

theshoveller
17-06-2014, 11:53
Maybe we'll see a new peasant character, or a hero level knight who can lead peasant units (replacing the old Virtue of Humility), precisely so that they can release a low-hassle clampack figure.

Wesser
17-06-2014, 11:58
Hmf yea

One of the big problems with Fantasy is the mounted chars we're stuck with. The only mounted Vampire that exist anymore is the 3rd edition Red Duke finecast, leaving most to convert him from the Zombie Dragon Rider.

Empire and High Elves got solutions in that department but most armies are short on mounted characters and BsBs.... though I do note how Araloth and the generic Chaos Lord has been fitted with unadorned, upright spears...


As for Brets I don't believe in Foot Knights. Unlike Phoenixes and Demigryphs that were shoehorned into the fluff, Foot Knights would represent a break to all existing Bretonnian fluff. And what other unit would they dualkit with? Since their role in the army would have to be providing Brets with quality infantry it begs the question on how this will be achieved with human stats? I mean look at how much help Goldswords need... the blessing would only take them so far assuming a KotR profile.

Hippogryph Riders also seems unreasonable given Pegasus Knights.

No I'm wagering that, while we'll see new Grail Knights and Pilgrims with a redefined role for the army, the new units will be weird stuff. What new stuff did Empire get? Wizardwagons and Demigryphs. And arguably Brets are the more magical and mystical of the two, so I'm fully expecting ethereal units along with Damsels riding Unicorns in order to strengthen The Lady as "The Spirit of the Land"

Alltaken
17-06-2014, 13:06
Dont empire and ong have a plastic cavalry kit? I dont know if its a clam pack

From my servoskull

Barghest
17-06-2014, 13:26
While I think it would be kind of nice to have a Damsel on Unicorn unit (even though I'm not typically a big fan of token units like that), I think it would be way cooler if Grail Knights were the ones on unicorns.

theshoveller
17-06-2014, 13:51
Dont empire and ong have a plastic cavalry kit? I dont know if its a clam pack

The Empire General is a 'kit' box, that assembles two things. It's quite a bit more pricey than a single character clampack (and I'm led to believe GW don't want to make any more character kits because they're not hugely profitable).

Petey
17-06-2014, 13:54
I wonder if the fluff in the big red book will make it to the upcoming Bret book. Ghost Knight army ftw.

Voodoo1
17-06-2014, 15:36
I wonder if the fluff in the big red book will make it to the upcoming Bret book. Ghost Knight army ftw.

I hope not! I play against vampires as my main opponent. I don't want a unit of Green knights going up against a unit of Hex Wraiths. Or stupid ghostly bowmen fighting Banshee's or spirit hosts. No, I'd rather that crap was left for the Vampire Counts army. Minus the one special character that we have.

Charistoph
17-06-2014, 15:39
As for Brets I don't believe in Foot Knights. Unlike Phoenixes and Demigryphs that were shoehorned into the fluff, Foot Knights would represent a break to all existing Bretonnian fluff.

Not even close to being accurate. Knights often fight on foot while in siege, as it's hard to get the horses up ladders or through hallways or on battlements. Heck, there's even a picture of a Bretonnian Lord gutting a Chaos Lord while ON FOOT. Not to mention, they don't always have replacement horses available for dismounted knights. And the book shows no dishonour for being dismounted in combat or approaching combat on foot.


And what other unit would they dualkit with? Since their role in the army would have to be providing Brets with quality infantry it begs the question on how this will be achieved with human stats? I mean look at how much help Goldswords need... the blessing would only take them so far assuming a KotR profile.

This is actually a better argument against Foot Knights, as they won't be linked with Peasantry (Peasants can't afford it, and the gentry won't give it to them). So unless there are two or more foot knight units, it does reduce the odds of them being included.

Alternatively, every knight unit in the new book could start dismounted and then purchase their mount on top of that, which would have the Foot Knight unit have the possibilities for Errant, Realm, Questing, and/or Grail built in.

King Arthur
17-06-2014, 15:45
Could there be a morning star unit as they are currently the only army with them just mentioning and isn't it likely there to be a mounted yeoman kit?

Charistoph
17-06-2014, 17:31
It's possible for both. One thing on my lesser Bret wish list is an option for Questing Knights to start with Morning Stars and upgrade option to the Great Weapons.

Yeomen are a hybrid kit right now, and a blister to boot, much like Terradon Riders were. But Warhawk Riders weren't touched, so that's a poor precedent to go by.

As someone mentioned, it's most likely that box kit released for now is likely to be a dual kit for something old and something new. Unless Yeomen are split between archers and spearmen, I don't see it happening this round.

KariP
18-06-2014, 00:09
It is those many little things that make me kinda believe Bretonnia is next. I'm hearing from so many different sources that managers in GW are heavilly hinting that.

Wesser
18-06-2014, 06:41
Not even close to being accurate. Knights often fight on foot while in siege, as it's hard to get the horses up ladders or through hallways or on battlements. Heck, there's even a picture of a Bretonnian Lord gutting a Chaos Lord while ON FOOT. Not to mention, they don't always have replacement horses available for dismounted knights. And the book shows no dishonour for being dismounted in combat or approaching combat on foot.

Sigh..

The Bretonnian fluff for the last two books and the various books and short stories firmly places knights in the saddle. It's almost unthinkable for a Knight not to fight on horseback.

Sieges are a thing yes, but fluffwise Brets will always fight in the open before retreating behind castle walls, and even then the knights will remain in the saddles waiting for a chance to sally out. The actual manning the walls is left to men-At-Arms.

Sure both in battle and sieges a few knights will hold their noses and go stand with the infantry, but that's in order to stiffen the Men-at-arms a bit rather than a tactical formation. But that's really covered by the Virtue of Empathy... though it would be cool with a solution like Giant Slayers to add a few champion knights to a Men-at-arms unit. Would be visually awesome and perhaps provide Brets with a little stronger infantry.


As for knights who get dismounted? Hardly enough to make a unit of and they'd prolly go join the infantry, take loose horse from a dead knight or just charge in....

Ludaman
18-06-2014, 07:01
Sigh..

The Bretonnian fluff for the last two books and the various books and short stories firmly places knights in the saddle. It's almost unthinkable for a Knight not to fight on horseback.

Sieges are a thing yes, but fluffwise Brets will always fight in the open before retreating behind castle walls, and even then the knights will remain in the saddles waiting for a chance to sally out. The actual manning the walls is left to men-At-Arms.

Sure both in battle and sieges a few knights will hold their noses and go stand with the infantry, but that's in order to stiffen the Men-at-arms a bit rather than a tactical formation. But that's really covered by the Virtue of Empathy... though it would be cool with a solution like Giant Slayers to add a few champion knights to a Men-at-arms unit. Would be visually awesome and perhaps provide Brets with a little stronger infantry.


As for knights who get dismounted? Hardly enough to make a unit of and they'd prolly go join the infantry, take loose horse from a dead knight or just charge in....

Eh, the fluff is completely malleable at this point, just look how much the new wood elf book already changed Bretonnia. I wouldn't rule it out completely just yet.

Wesser
18-06-2014, 07:16
Eh, the fluff is completely malleable at this point, just look how much the new wood elf book already changed Bretonnia. I wouldn't rule it out completely just yet.

Did the Wood Elf book change Brets?

We always knew the Lady was sort the spirit of the land in likeness to the spirit of the forest/ariel connection rather than a true Goddess. It was hinted before that she was a Wood Elf scheme, but even spiritually little changes for Brets because the clarifications in the wood elf book.

Apart from the Fay being abducted and rogue Vampire knight running about it's not a lot of change.

Ofc GW can do what they want with the fluff. Heck they can make Brets ride around in chariots if they want to....

Artinam
18-06-2014, 07:59
Didn't the fluff books of Bretonnia show Knights fighting on foot during a siege, and even the weaponmaster in the book mentions the importance on knowing how to fight on foot. Loosing your horse, or fighting on terrain that doesn't allow effective cavalry tactics (swamps, mountainous areas). He was counter argumenting a Knight Errant who claims learning to fight on foot is a waste of time.

Fluff, real world history and just common sense supports fighting on foot for knights.

Roi Baudoin
18-06-2014, 08:32
The fluff also clearly mentions that knights of Montfort mainly fight on foot because of the physical geography of their dukedom.

Greyshadow
18-06-2014, 08:53
Sigh.. The Bretonnian fluff for the last two books and the various books and short stories firmly places knights in the saddle.

I see where you are coming from Wesser, I also value the importance of a consistent background. Whilst the prouder knights clearly eschew fighting on foot, the Bretonnians have fine military minds and I could totally see them fielding units of dismounted knights if the tactical situation warranted it (for assaulting fortresses, fighting in jungles, protecting shrines, fighting underground, fighting in difficult terrain, etc). I know you alluded to it but it is also worth mentioning that foot knights use to be something you could buy and use (in 2nd edition, and yes, the background has moved on somewhat since then I agree).

I think it would be fantastic if foot knights made it into a new Army Book, especially as a special or rare choice.

theshoveller
18-06-2014, 10:19
Didn't the fluff books of Bretonnia show Knights fighting on foot during a siege, and even the weaponmaster in the book mentions the importance on knowing how to fight on foot. Loosing your horse, or fighting on terrain that doesn't allow effective cavalry tactics (swamps, mountainous areas). He was counter argumenting a Knight Errant who claims learning to fight on foot is a waste of time.

Fluff, real world history and just common sense supports fighting on foot for knights.
Interesting case in point, though:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Saule

Wesser
18-06-2014, 11:03
Didn't the fluff books of Bretonnia show Knights fighting on foot during a siege, and even the weaponmaster in the book mentions the importance on knowing how to fight on foot. Loosing your horse, or fighting on terrain that doesn't allow effective cavalry tactics (swamps, mountainous areas). He was counter argumenting a Knight Errant who claims learning to fight on foot is a waste of time.

Fluff, real world history and just common sense supports fighting on foot for knights.

Clearly that knight had the Virtue of Empathy... and of course knights can be forced to fight on foot in very specific circumstances.

However. For a unit to exist in the army book it would have be a formation of knights dedicated to fighting on foot... what knight would join such a unit? I suppose they could do some "fluff" about Dishonored knights who've lost the right to ride the noble bretonnian warhorses (due to cowardice, crimes, neglecting duties) and have to fight on foot until they can atone... but then would we want to include such a unit?

I just don't see it happening fluff or modelwise

tneva82
18-06-2014, 11:09
Umm...Dedicated? You know it's not dedication if army decides pre-battle that some knights will fight on foot.

It's not like it's on-off and if you choose to fight on horse you are glued to the horse.

Or you think knights are so stupid they can't learn how to fight on horse or on foot as situation dictate? Yeah let's train combat all your life and learn only one way to fight. Sheesh what an idiots those bretonnians are.

Ultimate Life Form
18-06-2014, 11:11
I have read all the Bretonnia background lately and I seem to recall that when a knight loses his honor he is demoted and has to do all this knighty stuff all over again until he has redeemed himself. Really who would want to do something like that, but whenever you field a unit of Knights Errant, chances are, they're a bunch of dishonorabe curs and you don't even know it. :shifty:



It's not like it's on-off and if you choose to fight on horse you are glued to the horse.


Actually they are, unless they are magnetized.

tneva82
18-06-2014, 11:14
Actually they are, unless they are magnetized.

Haha cracked me up :D Good one.

theshoveller
18-06-2014, 11:17
Actually they are, unless they are magnetized.
Yeah, but I've tried magnetising my cavalry and when I deploy them dismounted, they all look like they're walking like John Wayne...

rwphillipsstl
18-06-2014, 12:55
In historical gaming armies, the rulesets provide for the knights to be able to dismount if there is any evidence that they did so in real life. Rules for Bretonnians could easily provide for the Knight units to start mounted and dismount during the game.

That enables the player to emulate the tactical decision to dismount versus bow and pike rather than charge in on horseback. Bretonnian fluff is based quite a bit (among other things) on the French high medieval period, and French knights quickly learned to dismount and fight during the Hundred Years' War. They also quite often fought dismounted anyway in the myriad number of sieges and such that constituted so much of the warfare in the 14/15th centuries. There used to be quite a few foot knight figures for Bretonnians that went OOP for whatever reason. Bringing back a plastic box for foot knights, IMHO, is sorely needed.

rwphillipsstl
18-06-2014, 13:02
Actually, GW should do the same thing with the Empire knights box. I love the old Reiksguard foot knight figures.

Because we know GW will squeeze the price point, what they could do for both is change the Knights boxes to be 5 figures, with BOTH 5 sets of rider legs and 5 sets of foot/standing legs, but otherwise keep the same heads/arms/torsos options they currently use. The box then becomes a "dual kit" just the way they seem to want to go now. Heck, they could even redo Glade Guard for Wood Elves and Silver Helms for High Elves the same way, with a little imagination.

dalezzz
18-06-2014, 13:08
Surely though the reason people want foot knights over mounted is because they will be 15 points cheaper ? Not because of the terrain or battlefield tactics :)

Petey
18-06-2014, 13:25
A few points against the whole "da bretons don't not ride" argument.

Be questing knight.
Fight monstra
Monstra eated ma horse
what do?
Fight on foot

Questing knights and grail knights should have the option to fight on foot or mounted. They live off the grid, have dangerous lifestyles and don't breed horse. The fluff specifically says that they often lose mounts and keep on fighting for days if necessary.

Secondly, the fluff can and will change. I remember when the dark elf fluff was that the witch elves had killed and replaced Malekith (I even still have the white dwarf that that story is in). I remember when the imperial guard had beast men in it. I remember when gnomes lived with dwarves in WHFB and vampires were creatures of chaos. The fluff will change. We should look forward to it, as usually it means more options and new units. I hope we do get questing knights on foot, and KotR on foot even

Charistoph
18-06-2014, 16:41
However. For a unit to exist in the army book it would have be a formation of knights dedicated to fighting on foot... what knight would join such a unit? I suppose they could do some "fluff" about Dishonored knights who've lost the right to ride the noble bretonnian warhorses (due to cowardice, crimes, neglecting duties) and have to fight on foot until they can atone... but then would we want to include such a unit?

I just don't see it happening fluff or modelwise

Someone mentioned the mountainous duchy of Montfort, and that isn't enough? The sea barons who operate a surprisingly effective navy would fight more often on foot than charger.

So, the only real argument against foot knights is that it's unlikely to be fitting 2 units, so less likely to be made during this production paradigm.

Everything else comes across too much as "I don't wanna!". Which is fine since you don't have to field them any more than Empire needs to field GreatSwords, but don't try to sell me road apples as granny smiths to do it.

Ramius4
18-06-2014, 17:12
Oh great... Yet another "is Bretonnia going to be released" thread, which, in less than one page became a: "Bretonnia wishlist/mounted vs. unmounted knights" thread.

We haven't had one of these in what? Slightly over a week?

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?393264-Bretonnians-going-away-Nonsense-or-Vigilance

Lord Dan
18-06-2014, 17:17
Yet another "is Bretonnia going to be released" thread, which, in less than one page became a: "Bretonnia wishlist/mounted vs. unmounted knights" thread.

Mission accomplished.

Ludaman
18-06-2014, 17:41
That other thread had gotten to be old news; don't you guys want to discuss the same thing in a new thread. This thread is where the cool kids are hanging out now...

Ramius4
18-06-2014, 19:10
That other thread had gotten to be old news; don't you guys want to discuss the same thing in a new thread. This thread is where the cool kids are hanging out now...

If by "old news" you mean "the same news in a new package", then I'd agree :p

rwphillipsstl
18-06-2014, 22:07
Oh great... Yet another "is Bretonnia going to be released" thread, which, in less than one page became a: "Bretonnia wishlist/mounted vs. unmounted knights" thread.

We haven't had one of these in what? Slightly over a week?

http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?393264-Bretonnians-going-away-Nonsense-or-Vigilance

So what? Does it cause you pain to see someone else discuss something they like about Warhammer? This thread is not in News and Rumors, so it should not be confusing to anyone.

Ultimate Life Form
18-06-2014, 23:10
So what? Does it cause you pain to see someone else discuss something they like about Warhammer? This thread is not in News and Rumors, so it should not be confusing to anyone.

Hmmm... yes, in all honesty, it can be a pain sometimes when the forums are constantly filled with the same old complaints all the time. That is exactly the reason why the official Pricing Feedback sticky was first concieved and pricing discussion elsewhere forbidden - because every single thread woud inevitaby devolve into money moaning and GW bashing (not that I blame anyone, it was the era of the "Goldswords" who seem to look more like Leadswords these days). The Bretonnian wishlisting and mounted vs unmounted debate is so ancient it probably predates the T. Rex, and it never lead anywhere because there is no more to it than people going to arms over a simple question of different tastes (not that this would be anything new in history) and at the end of the day GW does what they want anyway, so it's basically like fighting each other over how the weather will be tomorrow. Also I think it's fairly inconsequential because, as has been pointed out, no one will be forced to field foot knights. Therefore there is actually no detriment in adding them for additional choice. I'd say make a Bretonnia wishlisting sticky and be done with it, but since an update seems to be imminent I predict there will be entirely different gripes in a few months time (finally).

Ramius4
18-06-2014, 23:58
So what? Does it cause you pain to see someone else discuss something they like about Warhammer? This thread is not in News and Rumors, so it should not be confusing to anyone.

A quick search by the OP would have showed him that such a thread already existed. In other words, there was no need for him to open yet another thread discussing the same thing...

We really don't need multiple threads all discussing the same topic (much like the 3 threads currently on the first page here that all boil down to "how can we change steadfast?")

Lord Dan
19-06-2014, 00:06
So what? Does it cause you pain to see someone else discuss something they like about Warhammer? This thread is not in News and Rumors, so it should not be confusing to anyone.

I was halfway through a witty retort, but I got distracted trying to pronounce your handle. Rwiffillipstill? Wifflestille?

Ramius4
19-06-2014, 00:07
I was halfway through a witty retort, but I got distracted trying to pronounce your handle. Rwiffillipstill? Wifflestille?

I'm pretty sure it's Rumplestiltskin with a lisp :shifty:

http://amkss32.weebly.com/uploads/2/6/8/4/26849333/9975694_orig.jpg

Lord Dan
19-06-2014, 00:10
I'm pretty sure it's Rumplestiltskin with a lisp :shifty:

While sneezing.

Ramius4
19-06-2014, 00:11
While sneezing.

In Russian

Wesser
19-06-2014, 05:55
Really Ramius

Is there any topic that HASN'T been discussed literally tonnes of time? And even if someone was to refind threads with the same general topics, well then it would just be threadomancy...

Everything has been done. Ranting on forums have been done before. We should go hang ourselves...

Greyshadow
19-06-2014, 06:28
That other thread had gotten to be old news; don't you guys want to discuss the same thing in a new thread. This thread is where the cool kids are hanging out now...

Yes, I think I might be one of the cool kids :) ! Well, to weigh in: this thread is in the general discussion section and is titled Bretonnia so I think we are all good here.

I noticed some posts seemed a bit adversarial to Wesser's view on foot knights. The guy has simply put forward his personal opinion. I do hope though Wesser that if we do get foot knights you don't view it as a negative. There are all kinds of players out there and I kind of like that someone somewhere will be raiding a fortress complex, exploring the ruins of Mordheim or winning golden daemons with dismounted knights. Yes, they may be situational but they would be there in the Old World. Also, if the book has good internal balance, you could leave them out of your more conventional army.

Urgat
19-06-2014, 06:46
Is there any topic that HASN'T been discussed literally tonnes of time?

PLenty, for instance, is washed Skaven hair rough or smooth? How far can a troll jump? What do people think of the average size of hills in the game?
:p

Wesser
19-06-2014, 06:58
Yes, I think I might be one of the cool kids :) ! Well, to weigh in: this thread is in the general discussion section and is titled Bretonnia so I think we are all good here.

I noticed some posts seemed a bit adversarial to Wesser's view on foot knights. The guy has simply put forward his personal opinion. I do hope though Wesser that if we do get foot knights you don't view it as a negative. There are all kinds of players out there and I kind of like that someone somewhere will be raiding a fortress complex, exploring the ruins of Mordheim or winning golden daemons with dismounted knights. Yes, they may be situational but they would be there in the Old World. Also, if the book has good internal balance, you could leave them out of your more conventional army.

I'm not an opponent of Foot Knights. I'm merely pretty confident that GW will do something altogether different with Brets, but who knows?

Since all we can do is speculating I was merely pointing inconsistencies with existing fluff and how GW rarely do a non-dualkit

Wesser
19-06-2014, 06:59
How far can a troll jump?


A troll can jump as far as a troll could jump if trolls jumped about...

Eh.. am I trolling now...

Mc1gamer
19-06-2014, 07:10
How bout this....any new links of new news regarding rumors that might support the notion of a new army book? Not old ones from weeks or months past, but new as in recent days. I return for new news in hope of seeing actual...well, news. Yes, alot of that turns out to be false, but its aparent we are all hoping for a new book soon. :)

Greyshadow
19-06-2014, 08:02
At the moment we have no recent news - there really is none. When there is I have no doubt it will pop up in N&R very quickly.

Epicene
19-06-2014, 08:30
Actually - King Louen Leoncouer has been repainted\rephotographed. As has the Pegasus Knight and Knights of Realm. The Pegasus and Knights can be seen on GWs site for the battalion boxset whilst Louen is easy to find. Why repaint models you plan on cancelling soon?

Also - The Breton book is no longer available in both French AND German now. Kits are frequently going out of stock, which would suggest they're not manufacturing some kits as much anymore (only keeping the stock levels up). Again - why keep manufacturing models\lines you are going to cancel? Models being cancelled or replaced in the past are often out of stock for weeks before hand.

Stuff *is* happening on GWs website - models are kept at low stock levels (but not cancelled) and all traces of old metal kits have been stripped from the range. If Bretons were going to silently "slip away" - they've had numerous chances for it to happen by now as every model in the range has gone out-of-stock at some point in the past few months.

Voss
19-06-2014, 08:48
But that has been happening for over a year now, so it doesn't really count as a sign of Brets happening at any point I the near future. The first 'omg! The trebuchet isn't in the store anymore' n&r thread is so old it has fallen off the default date filter.

And it took more than five years of 'stuff happening on the website' before the dark eldar were redone. Things moved, fell off and came back for years, and each time it was held up as a sign. And it never was

Greyshadow
19-06-2014, 09:41
Wow, you are right I think Epicene, that Pegasus Knight on the battalion box photo is new. Are you sure about Leoncouer? He looks the same to me.

What I ment is that there was no new news since the N&R thread got shut down, not that their was nothing to indicate that Bretonnia was the next army for Warhammer. The Army Book is still on sale on the website here in Australia. Normally, I understand the Army book goes off sale about a month before a new version is released. That would put Bretonnians at late July/early August at the earliest. We will probably get more substantial news closer to these dates I think.

Epicene
19-06-2014, 10:39
195066

I am absolutely certain that is a new image (see the old one above for comparison). It all changed when the new website was uploaded.

theshoveller
19-06-2014, 13:16
PLenty, for instance, is washed Skaven hair rough or smooth? How far can a troll jump? What do people think of the average size of hills in the game?
:p
But is the average hill rough, or smooth? Can a Skaven jump over it?

Barghest
19-06-2014, 13:45
A quick search by the OP would have showed him that such a thread already existed. In other words, there was no need for him to open yet another thread discussing the same thing...

We really don't need multiple threads all discussing the same topic (much like the 3 threads currently on the first page here that all boil down to "how can we change steadfast?")

Saw that thread. Opened one anyway. If you don't like this thread, don't post in it. If you have an emotional attachment to the other thread, go post in that, instead.

If people want to turn this thread into a seething morass of wishlisting I am perfectly fine with that. The name of the thread is "Bretonnia", so post about Bretonnia. What you want, what you don't want, what you like about the faction, where you see it going, et cetera.

Petey
19-06-2014, 15:24
a non sequitur, I've converted a unit of sisters repentia into battle pilgrims with a relique, and I'm trying to build up the impetus to start a Bretonnian plog, but I'm worried that my conversions won't work after the new army book comes out

Ludaman
19-06-2014, 16:25
Quick note: the "New Loen" paint job is actually a miniature they showcased along with the Bret release 10 years ago, have the master class painting guide for it in an old white dwarf

ashc
19-06-2014, 16:41
Indeed, nothing new about that Louen.

charlarino
20-06-2014, 11:12
I'd like to see men at arms upgraded to knights on foot - with a peasant levy fulfilling the role the men at arms fill now it'd be a change to the fluff - but as a long time fan of writers like bernard cornwell I'd like to see men at arms and knights working together more and appreciating what each can bring to a battlefield
Peasant bowmen I'd like to see poison as a purchasable upgrade
Grail knights I'd change to monstrous cavalry and maybe mount them all on hippogryphs or some other heraldic animal that fits the fluff
What I'd find interesting would be a whole unit of green knights (guardians of the lady for example) as well as a green knight champion - maybe as an ambush unit for the brets able to appear in woods as the game progresses

Epicene
20-06-2014, 14:41
195121
Could be nothing. Could be something.

Ludaman
20-06-2014, 15:35
Looks like a store manager has been reading forums

Epicene
20-06-2014, 15:37
We'll know next week either way, really. P:

Ludaman
20-06-2014, 15:46
Nah he says nothing about next week. Just "I don't imagine you'll have a long wait". I think he imagines different than I do, this 10 year wait has felt long to me ;)

Barghest
20-06-2014, 15:56
Maybe he had an unspoken "relatively" in there. "You won't have (relatively) long to wait!"

Epicene
20-06-2014, 15:57
Yes. It feels like forever. I'm buying a battalion box next month anyway, just to have some hobby fuel.
If its not this YEAR for Brets - I might cry.

Voss
20-06-2014, 16:04
Reads like someone trying to get viewers to keep looking at his site. 'Keep posted' is the part that matters, the rest is filler that would have been nigh identical if the poster had asked about beasts or blood angels.

It's a store's Facebook page, you wouldn't expect them to give a potential customer reasons to not be a customer.

Epicene
20-06-2014, 16:07
Reads like someone trying to get viewers to keep looking at his site. 'Keep posted' is the part that matters, the rest is filler that would have been nigh identical if the poster had asked about beasts or blood angels.

Its facebook. I don't need to check it.. its like... there anyway.. in my feed. :P
Matts a nice guy, really. Its actually his holiday atm, but he still chats through the messaging system on FB :)

theshoveller
20-06-2014, 16:41
Looks like a store manager has been reading forums
It does. But if the forums were right, how would we tell the difference?

Epicene
20-06-2014, 16:51
It does. But if the forums were right, how would we tell the difference?

I've snooped about with Worthing before with those kinda questions and I usually get "first I've heard of it" or "I don't know" replies. P:
He could be trolling me. Which would be hilarious, but irritating.

Charistoph
20-06-2014, 17:43
It does make one wonder... If the rumors of 9th Edition this year are true, there's a high probability of no more army books till then, then an army book release right after as we've seen with Orks.

Bretonnians are the last of the 6th Edition books, so a lot really depends on what else they have for release this year, and what they feel the release priority is.

As we've seen, army books sell armies better than anything else, but do they have the models ready, too?

Voss
20-06-2014, 18:20
Its facebook. I don't need to check it.. its like... there anyway.. in my feed. :P


I don't care how the voodoo works, or what monstrosities you have to feed it.

dangermouse425
21-06-2014, 16:08
I've got a Battalion, a box of Knights and two Trebuchets I'm my cupboard, all unassembled. New Bretonnia book would be awesome.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Alojolo
21-06-2014, 16:54
Same here. I've been collecting Bretonnia since 5th edition, so I'll be pretty excited if we do get a new release soon (or relatively soon).

dangermouse425
21-06-2014, 17:21
I'm new to fantasy, started last month!

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Sir_Glonojad
21-06-2014, 18:50
I personally don't believe in Questing/Grail Knights combo set. The style of the Knights is too different, just think about: ragged wodering Knights and paragons of Chivalry, serving the land for decades with the very best armour, the very best (often enchanted) weapons... no.

Still... that's what people said about Black Guard and Execitioners.

Foot KotR/Questing Knights on the other hand seem plausible.

SpanielBear
21-06-2014, 19:39
I personally don't believe in Questing/Grail Knights combo set. The style of the Knights is too different, just think about: ragged wodering Knights and paragons of Chivalry, serving the land for decades with the very best armour, the very best (often enchanted) weapons... no.

Still... that's what people said about Black Guard and Execitioners.

Foot KotR/Questing Knights on the other hand seem plausible.


If they can do sisters of the thorn and Wild Riders as a duel kit, I see no problems with quests and grails.
-Share: Torso, legs, horse.
- ragged cloak for questing knights, lets say a back-banner with grail/fleur-de-lys motif for Grail knights.
-bare heads with scars and beards for the questing knights. Ornate helms for the grail knights.
- Great weapons (hopefully a mix of swords and axes) for the questing knights, lance and shield for the grail knights.
- add various banner and champion options. Shared war-horn for the musician.

£25.50 for five. Job done.

Lastavenger
21-06-2014, 19:46
I would like to see them as seperate units because I'm tired of filling off heraldy shields from barding for QK. Also more horse head variants would be nice.

Ramius4
22-06-2014, 00:23
I personally don't believe in Questing/Grail Knights combo set. The style of the Knights is too different, just think about: ragged wodering Knights and paragons of Chivalry, serving the land for decades with the very best armour, the very best (often enchanted) weapons... no.

Other than weaponry, the only difference between the types of Knights I feel you really need is a different paint job.

Lastavenger
22-06-2014, 05:52
Other than weaponry, the only difference between the types of Knights I feel you really need is a different paint job.

If GW won't change style/weapons of eather unit it will be more differences:
- each build needs different heads
- different backs of knight. Grails have cape, while QK have backpack
- horses for QK shouldn't have heraldy shield on barding, they should also have less ornaments.
- both units use shield but QK use two hands weapon meaning that kit should have 4 arms for each model. Also shields are different
- torso of both versions could be different. QK could have ruged clothsan GK could have good looking.

GW could do both units in one kit but it would requre changing style at least on of the units.

Sir_Glonojad
22-06-2014, 06:15
@Ramius4: No offence, but You just threw bucketloads of fluff down the sewers.

I think they can be done as a joint set only provided the horse remains the current one. Then the sprues coulde be used to supply enough variety for both units; still, as virtually all the new units have mounts on the sprues I wouldn't count on that.

Ramius4
22-06-2014, 09:13
- each build needs different heads

Not necessarily. Although Grail Knights often incorporate the grail into their heraldry, it doesn't always mean it'll be displayed on the helmet. So helmets are interchangeable, depending on the individual knight. Besides that, I've never been a fan of the current Questing Knights not having helmets. It's not like they lose all their equipment...


- different backs of knight. Grails have cape, while QK have backpack

Again, unecessary. Just because the stuck some capes on the most current Grail Knight models doesn't mean they will again. I do like the stuff piled up on the back of the Questing Knight horses though. It gives them the appearance of carrying everything they own with them.


- horses for QK shouldn't have heraldy shield on barding, they should also have less ornaments.

That's your opinion, not at all supported by fluff. Questing Knights don't lose their heraldry bud. They modify it to incorporate the Fleur de Lys, so it should actually be more ornate, not less.


- both units use shield but QK use two hands weapon meaning that kit should have 4 arms for each model. Also shields are different

Like I said "other than weapons"... See my helmet comments above regarding shields. That being said, it won't shock me if there are grail designs built into helmets and shields for Grail Knights, and Fleur de Lys for Questing Knights. Blank shields are also welcome. Ones with the heraldy sculpted on limit the heraldy designs that you can use.


- torso of both versions could be different. QK could have ruged clothsan GK could have good looking.

Could be, but not necessary.


@Ramius4: No offence, but You just threw bucketloads of fluff down the sewers.

How so? I've got several Grail Knights that are just the Knight of the Realm model with a much more ornate paint job for the heraldry. That's literally all that is required to represent a Grail Knight. And a few Questing Knights converted from the KotR models with great weapons added.

All a person has to do is read the heraldry section to know that's literally all that needs to change on the model (QK great weapon excepted) to represent the various Knights.

That's not to say GW won't have some interesting bits to fit each type. But to act like what I'm saying is blasphemy against the fluff is... silly

Sir_Glonojad
22-06-2014, 09:49
I think I've explained myself in previous posts, and this subject is well described in the background (including novels), but I'll elaborate on my "silly" opinion anyway: Questing Knights are knights-of-the-road, with usually little wealth, torn clothes, dented armour. Their equipment is as practical as possible and they're possibly the most practical knights there are. Helmet crests don't strike me as particularly practical.

Grail Knights are otherworldly paragons of chivalry with loads of successful missions (hence a more elaborate heraldry), the best equipment (often magical and usually elaborate). While some of them are hermit knights, many are stationed in Ducal capitals or at the King's side, so their armour and equipment would be elaborate, maybe even archaic from time to time (when we're talking about some piece of enchanted, sacred armour for example).

I would really rather expect a Grail Knight / Ducal Guard box, with the latter being some new elite non-Grail Knight unit than a Questing Knight/Grail Knight box. Questing Knights I'd rather join with, say, Hermit Knight unit (provided the latter are not treated as a brand of a Grail Knight anymore).

Whatever the way, any combo unit would require significant background alternations or additions IMHO.

Lastavenger
22-06-2014, 10:46
How so? I've got several Grail Knights that are just the Knight of the Realm model with a much more ornate paint job for the heraldry. That's literally all that is required to represent a Grail Knight. And a few Questing Knights converted from the KotR models with great weapons added.

All a person has to do is read the heraldry section to know that's literally all that needs to change on the model (QK great weapon excepted) to represent the various Knights.

That's not to say GW won't have some interesting bits to fit each type. But to act like what I'm saying is blasphemy against the fluff ... silly All my GK/Qk are madefrom kotr kit. I did them while i was studing and buying normal kit would cost me fortune ( kotr kit costed me like more than i spend on anything for week.) For qk I filled off shield from barding and glue some bags, chests, altars, stuff atop of horse (otherwise they would be hard to rank) and paint barding in one color and then adding questing symbols. For knights i used some small shoulder shields that i collected from other knights kits. For normal shields i used ogre ironguts shields, other shoulder shields that i filled to fit on shields and some swords that i glued to them. Heads of my guys are made from kotr box too. I use some ke heads that i greenstuffed facial hairs or eyepatches or kotr heads with cutted top of helmets. Biggest difficulty was doing weapons. I used normal hands with swords from kotr kit but cutted the blade and replaced it with longer and wider from plasticard. Drillingit and pinning helped a lot but after 2 years lot of my qk needs fixing. Some of knights have torches (m@a kit?) Maces (i dont know from where). For those i used hands with lances that i cut off.
My gk are essentially kotr knights that have green stuff cape, head with greenstuffed grails atop of helmets and different painting. Some of them have grail from plasticard glued onto shields.
As you can see (or can't because i don't have access for my army in next months) i know that it would be easy to do such kit. My problem is that i want knights to be more distingtive than they are currently and that would be hard to achive with dual kit.

Urgat
22-06-2014, 10:58
Mmh, by your logic, Ramius, we can just have no kits at all, and use the KotR models for every bretonnian unit, they just need a new sprue with great weapons. That's not very exciting :/
My bro GK models do have much more elaborate helmets than normal knights (considering he has only 5th ed knights, not the "new" kotr), so I can't imagine new GK wouldn't be more blinged up than current KotR. I mean, there's no argument anyway, if there's new GK, there's no doubt they will be more blinged up, that's what GW always did and still does. It doesn't sound like you to defend such an unreasonable argument :confused:


I would really rather expect a Grail Knight / Ducal Guard box, with the latter being some new elite non-Grail Knight unit than a Questing Knight/Grail Knight box. Questing Knights I'd rather join with, say, Hermit Knight unit (provided the latter are not treated as a brand of a Grail Knight anymore).

I don't know what they'll be paired with, but I also expect a GK/new unit dual kit. Can just swap heads, weapons, maybe parts of the horses (additionnal barding parts ala black knights).


My problem is that i want knights to be more distingtive than they are currently and that would be hard to achive with dual kit.
I'm not too worried, all the latest dual kits so far have been pretty well done in that regard, even if I usually don't like dual kits, compare the black knights with the hexwraiths for instance.
Mmh, that being said, the BK/HW exemple shows that GK/QK are perfectly possible, there's not many parts in common between the BK and the HW if you think about it. Is there even anything other than the horse actually? The riders seem 100% different.

King Arthur
22-06-2014, 11:17
Has anybody heard or had any ideas in which we may receive as a new unit? And what changes may occur in the new book.

Lastavenger
22-06-2014, 11:18
Most armies have some kind of kings bodyguards, so what if our King got somthing like kings retiniue?

Mithrilherz
22-06-2014, 12:10
Is there any topic that HASN'T been discussed literally tonnes of time? And even if someone was to refind threads with the same general topics, well then it would just be threadomancy...

Everything has been done. Ranting on forums have been done before. We should go hang ourselves...

On top of this true statement, we should just close down the news and rumour section!
There are no new reliable rumours for a very long time now, since H&H has left.

Basically every thread is filled with wishlisting, whining and personal opinions, but isn't this what internet forums are for?

SpanielBear
22-06-2014, 12:56
Basically every thread is filled with wishlisting, whining and personal opinions

Warseer.

Welcome/Wilkommen/Bienvenue.

Ramius4
22-06-2014, 23:52
Mmh, by your logic, Ramius, we can just have no kits at all, and use the KotR models for every bretonnian unit, they just need a new sprue with great weapons.

It's not that I don't want new kits, or don't think variation will happen if QK/GK are a dual kit. I really just wanted to point out that it's perfectly acceptable to use heraldry alone to differentiate Knights Errant, Knights of the Realm, and/or Grail Knights. The differences in the actual models are merely cosmetic decoration. Equipment, horses, and everything else remains the same (except those Questing Knight great weapons).


It doesn't sound like you to defend such an unreasonable argument :confused:

Keep in mind, my Bretonnian playing days go all the way back to 5th edition. Literally all the Knights were the same (including Questing Knights). The only differences between models were some grail symbols added in on the Grail Knights (and a matching crest on their horse's head). All things that you could just as easily represent using a different paintjob (and still can!)

All that being said, we all know that GW will produce some blinged out models. It's just that for me, they would need to include completely new options to get me to replace (or just add to) my old units. If there were perhaps an option for morning stars or something similar rather than just lances/great weapons, then maybe I'd consider getting some new stuff.

Sir_Glonojad
23-06-2014, 17:50
I'm not too worried, all the latest dual kits so far have been pretty well done in that regard, even if I usually don't like dual kits, compare the black knights with the hexwraiths for instance.
Mmh, that being said, the BK/HW exemple shows that GK/QK are perfectly possible, there's not many parts in common between the BK and the HW if you think about it. Is there even anything other than the horse actually? The riders seem 100% different.
We already have a common horse for GK/QK - the Bretonnian Warhorse. Hence a GK/QK combi unit built that way would include two separate sets of riders :p

Urgat
23-06-2014, 18:51
Keep in mind, my Bretonnian playing days go all the way back to 5th edition. Literally all the Knights were the same (including Questing Knights). The only differences between models were some grail symbols added in on the Grail Knights (and a matching crest on their horse's head). All things that you could just as easily represent using a different paintjob (and still can!)

You sure? My brother has KotR, GK, and paladins (I think they were a unit back then), and they all have different models.


We already have a common horse for GK/QK - the Bretonnian Warhorse. Hence a GK/QK combi unit built that way would include two separate sets of riders :p

But we all know they would have new horse models, if only to cram more stuff on the sprues ;)

Sir_Glonojad
23-06-2014, 19:02
Of course Grail, Questing and Realm Knights had different models in 5th edition. Still, Questing Knights did use more elaborate Grail Knight lances.

Questing Knights had fleur-de-lys sculpted on their crests and Grail Knights had Grails - and crests were also doubled on horses' heads.

To be honest, I have personally "upgraded" some Questing Knights to Grail Knights by using Grail Knight legs and adding crests to the horses' heads. There were only 3 Rank and File Grail Knights and 20 (twenty) Questing Knights; they actually make excellent Knights of the Realm in the 6th edition ;).

Ramius4
23-06-2014, 19:07
You sure? My brother has KotR, GK, and paladins (I think they were a unit back then), and they all have different models.

They were different models. I am just saying that the differences are very very small. For instance, the 5th ed Questing Knight models were exactly the same as Knights of the Realm models (other than being sold under the name of Questing Knights). When I say they were "the same", I mean there was really nothing to distinguish them other than perhaps a fleur de lys symbol, so they were quite interchangeable. Some of them didn't even have the fleur de lys (I own about 15 different ones they made, there were a lot). Most of them are Knights of the Realm and Grail Knights for me now, and you'd never know the difference.

The Grail Knight models had a few grail symbols incoporated into their helmet crests (and the horses had a matching crest), and were a few minor details added on the legs. The primary reason they look so different in pictures is the paintjob.

Other than the small differences, everything but Grail Knight models were interchangeable back then. And that's still true today (with Questing Knight models being the odd man out due to different weaponry).

Urgat
23-06-2014, 20:08
Well yeah, they aren't remarkably different, I'll grant you that. I'd like it to be different now, though. Well, if I had free reins (hahaha I'm so lolz), I'd make them completely different, coz for me, they're all the same, there's no difference if my gobs are charged by kotr, gk or qk. 3+, 2+, dead :p I'd love for GK to become monstrous cavalry with enormous blessed warhorses, stuff like that, to make them more than just variations of the same thing.

Ramius4
23-06-2014, 21:09
Yeah, I can certainly understand that. For me, I think it would take away what's cool about the army though, if they did things like monstrous cavalry or spirit knights (as some have suggested). I love that they're just humans (with the protection of a demi-god), and that there's a logical progression leading up to Grail Knights.

What I wouldn't mind seeing though, is an option for Morning Stars...

Urgat
23-06-2014, 23:05
Mmh, dunno, to me, the "just human" army is pretty well covered by the Empire. I see Brets as the perfect candidate for your fairytale knights army. The whole Lady of the Lake thing lends itself to it quite nicely. I don't like the spirit stuff from the BRB though. Spirit knights? I mean, more knights? I wished they capitalized more on the "lake" aspect of the Lady, with water spirits and elementals, but "bretonnized". Use the old tales, like Melusine, the kelpies, that kind of stuff, it would fit right in.
Fluff-wise, Grail Knights aren't really human anymore anyway, what with their beyond-human skills and strenght, the fact they bleed light, etc. I'd really like for them to become more than what they are now in the rules, the good side equivalents of chaos knights. Plus I'm sure that'd sell like pancakes, humans in ancient runic plates, freaken humongous enchanted weapons, and enormous magical steeds. In the fluff they can slay vampires on their own, they need to have rules and models that reflect how badass they are.

Yes, you can have your morningstars :p I'd rather they get flail options though, they're more cool, and they do have existing rules that sorely want to be used...

Ultimate Life Form
23-06-2014, 23:26
I wished they capitalized more on the "lake" aspect of the Lady, with water spirits and elementals, but "bretonnized". Use the old tales, like Melusine, the kelpies, that kind of stuff, it would fit right in.


Sorry I have to disagree again, but I don't think so. The Bretonnian army is a shameless ripoff of the saga of King Arthur, and they can't really introduce too much wacky stuff without ruining the "medieval knight" imagery (the only one they have by the way). Also I think you place too much emphasis on her name; The Lady of the Lake is some sort of nature spirit thingy and the protector of whole Bretonnia, and the fact that she happens to live in a lake does not automatically imply aquatic properties. Note that her champion is a Green Knight with a strong leaf imagery. One would think that he would be blue with fish scales if she valued water so much. There is no need to turn Bretonnia into the long anticipated Fishmen in hopes that the army will finally sell.

Charistoph
24-06-2014, 00:34
Yes, you can have your morningstars :p I'd rather they get flail options though, they're more cool, and they do have existing rules that sorely want to be used...

Morning Stars are far more rare. By comparison, Flails show up everywhere. Oddly enough, they are from the same family of weaponry. If you want a rare weapon to be in the game, the morning star is the highest contender.

Ramius4
24-06-2014, 04:55
Yes, you can have your morningstars :p I'd rather they get flail options though, they're more cool, and they do have existing rules that sorely want to be used...

Morning Stars have rules too, don't they?

Urgat
24-06-2014, 06:51
Sorry I have to disagree again[...].
Happens a lot these days :p Well I disagree too, so let's leave it at that.


Morning Stars are far more rare. By comparison, Flails show up everywhere. Oddly enough, they are from the same family of weaponry. If you want a rare weapon to be in the game, the morning star is the highest contender.
Morning stars are just spiked maces... I'm sure there's dozens of them scattered among the minis :p


Morning Stars have rules too, don't they?

Dunno, maybe, but if that's the case, well, I guess I misunderstood CHaristoph's post above :p What do they do?

Ultimate Life Form
24-06-2014, 11:08
Happens a lot these days :p Well I disagree too, so let's leave it at that.

You just get this impression because in the 99% of cases I agree with you I don't superfluously point it out. :p

Ramius4
24-06-2014, 11:28
What do they do?

+1 Strength in the first round of combat. They're single handed too, so you can use your shield.

They'd give you a nice defensive boost for those occassions when you get charged. Or perhaps as an alternative weapon for Questing Knights would be nice.

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 11:36
As for the nature of the Lady, I strongly suggest reading Wood Elf book for hints. For example Naiads are explicitly mentioned as messengers of the Lady.

I actually made a thread about such information somewhere in the Background section of the forum...

Ramius4
24-06-2014, 11:55
Fluff-wise, Grail Knights aren't really human anymore anyway, what with their beyond-human skills and strenght, the fact they bleed light, etc. I'd really like for them to become more than what they are now in the rules, the good side equivalents of chaos knights.

Just something I see a lot of people say, that they want Grail Knights to be a "Chaos Knight equivalent". Other than the T3 and 1 less armor, they already have been their equivalent for years now. Same stats. And they come with a built in ward save, which easily makes up for 1 less armor. No movement penalties for barding either.

Urgat
24-06-2014, 13:01
Just something I see a lot of people say, that they want Grail Knights to be a "Chaos Knight equivalent"

That is incorrect, at least concerning me: I want them better than chaos knights :p


As for the nature of the Lady, I strongly suggest reading Wood Elf book for hints. For example Naiads are explicitly mentioned as messengers of the Lady.

I actually made a thread about such information somewhere in the Background section of the forum...

I've read that topic. I'ver always seen Ariel as some goddess of the forests, and the Lady as her equivalent for rivers and lakes. Turns out it kindda evolved that way, so I'm rather pleased.

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 13:18
I like that to and I am waiting for some sweet ethereal Naiad models :D

Not to mention this being a much more attractive alternative than all Bretonnian faith being a Wiod Elf hoax.

Vazalaar
24-06-2014, 13:35
As this seems to be a wishlist thread.
Here is mine:


Plastic Questing knights/Grail knight box.
Plastic Trebuchet and something else box.
Plastic Foot Questing knights with a simular equipment rule as the Black Orcs have.
2 Plastic clampacks knight characters one mounted and one on foot.
Army book.



I don't need any fancy fairy/elemental miniatures. I just want more knight miniatures in heroic scale.;)
The above is a small release, but I would be very happy with it.

Alltaken
24-06-2014, 13:53
Im actually liking the more magical aspect, while it remains relatively small. Say mágical grail knights on monstrous cav on rare or naiads on rare and thats it.
Too bad empire allready took demys for them. Anyone else recalls another folk creature that could be a MC?
If they get MC, I wouldnt be surprised if their demys too

From my servoskull

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 14:37
Small release seems impossible considering availability of models (or lack of thereof).

jorgepo
24-06-2014, 14:56
Too bad empire allready took demys for them. Anyone else recalls another folk creature that could be a MC?

Bretonnia has Hippogriffs, Empire has Demigryphs. Hippos fly and have more "horsely" features to their bodies. Flying MC would have to be skirmishing though due to Flying Cavalry rules.

As for me, I would like to see the Bretonnian "purebred" warhorse actually count for something more than free barding. WS4/S4, A2 - something to make them more feared and worthy of being bred as a single-purpose steed of war. Any advantage they have would work well with the lance formation since normally mounts don't get supporting attacks.

Ramius4
24-06-2014, 14:58
Flying MC would have to be skirmishing though due to Flying Cavalry rules.

They already have Pegasus Knights for flying MC.

Which reminds me. Something I have always wanted are Questing and Grail versions of them (other than characters). I just never quite understood why all of them were KoTR.

Alltaken
24-06-2014, 14:59
Bretonnia has Hippogriffs, Empire has Demigryphs. Hippos fly and have more "horsely" features to their bodies. Flying MC would have to be skirmishing though due to Flying Cavalry rules.

As for me, I would like to see the Bretonnian "purebred" warhorse actually count for something more than free barding. WS4/S4, A2 - something to make them more feared and worthy of being bred as a single-purpose steed of war. Any advantage they have would work well with the lance formation since normally mounts don't get supporting attacks.
Arent hippos monster sized? Thats kind of why I didnt mention them. They are allready in the army and not as MC

From my servoskull

Vazalaar
24-06-2014, 15:13
Small release seems impossible considering availability of models (or lack of thereof).

True, but I don't expect GW to update everything. (Yeomen, Hippogryphon, Questing Knight, Grail knights, the Trebuchet and add foot knights (The foot knights are a very low probability).)

dalezzz
24-06-2014, 15:35
I suppose if they did add foot knights empire layers would buy them as well to use as greatswords :) you know it makes sense GW , I needs more greatswords

Charistoph
24-06-2014, 16:08
I suppose if they did add foot knights empire layers would buy them as well to use as greatswords :) you know it makes sense GW , I needs more greatswords

Unless they're priced the same or more.

Of course, the aesthetic of the Bretonnian knight is just more impressive than the Empire's, in my opinion.

dalezzz
24-06-2014, 16:33
I fear no matter the price a box or 2 would find there way into my house .... Assuming they arnt terrible models of course :p

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 18:27
True, but I don't expect GW to update everything. (Yeomen, Hippogryphon, Questing Knight, Grail knights, the Trebuchet and add foot knights (The foot knights are a very low probability).)

The Hippogriff just got a new paint job, so it is likely to remain in 3/5cast.

Ludaman
24-06-2014, 18:38
The Hippogriff just got a new paint job, so it is likely to remain in 3/5cast.

It didn't get a new paint job. That's an alternate paint job from the same time the Bret book was released (2005?). There was a entire article on how to paint it in the white dwarf. If you want my opinion, GW changed up the current art to remove the picture of the box art, which says "fine cast", and the association the old color scheme had with it.

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 19:04
Oh. I didn't know that, thanks.

Petey
24-06-2014, 19:20
I bet we'll get a plastic hippogriff this time around, and the ability to take them in units, but if anything the stats will stay the same or get lowered

Ramius4
24-06-2014, 19:36
I bet we'll get a plastic hippogriff this time around

That's the last thing I think we'll get. I expect a smaller release like the Dwarfs and Wood Elves got (3 boxes and a couple characters), and I doubt that a large kit that you can't really sell someone multiples of is going to get re-done. I'm also not counting on a Trebuchet in plastic this time around (although it's more likely than a Hippogriff).

What I do expect though, is to see Mounted Yeomen (dual-kitted with something else), Questing and Grail Knights as plastic kits (most likely a dual-kit). Grail Pilgrims are quite possible, with a Reliquary instead of your typical command parts.


and the ability to take them in units, but if anything the stats will stay the same or get lowered

Well then it wouldn't be a Hippogriff... It would be... Something else entirely.

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 19:39
High Elf Griffon does have both stats and points cost reduced comparing to the Imperial one; both are more cost-effective than the Hippogryff, so a change in one of these directions seems plausible.

Charistoph
24-06-2014, 19:50
That's the last thing I think we'll get. I expect a smaller release like the Dwarfs and Wood Elves got (3 boxes and a couple characters), and I doubt that a large kit that you can't really sell someone multiples of is going to get re-done. I'm also not counting on a Trebuchet in plastic this time around (although it's more likely than a Hippogriff).

Oh, it's possible if one can take it as just a generic monster in Rare. One could then field 3 in an army, one for the Lord, two in Rares. The kit would then have bits of three types of knights, and several heads. The Knights would be geared to KotR, Lord, and the Lion-Heart himself.

It's not like this hasn't happened before, either. Look at the Empire.

Likelihood is in the realm of iffy, though. It really depends on what new units they've made in the last ten-plus years, and what kits they've committed to replacing.


High Elf Griffon does have both stats and points cost reduced comparing to the Imperial one; both are more cost-effective than the Hippogryff, so a change in one of these directions seems plausible.

A later book, with a slight pricing paradigm shift that went into it. So, we'll see.

Urgat
24-06-2014, 20:15
I bet we'll get a plastic hippogriff this time around, and the ability to take them in units

I bet against both. Your stakes?


High Elf Griffon does have both stats and points cost reduced comparing to the Imperial one; both are more cost-effective than the Hippogryff, so a change in one of these directions seems plausible.

It's the other way around, the Imperial griffon is a better beast compared to what griffons have always been. The HE griffon is the regular, pre 8th griffon.
I believe the enormous imperial griffon exists only because they wanted to make a striking, iconic mini for Karl Franz, which does make sense. They obviously had to write rules to fit such a big beast.

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 20:36
Well, both are actually cheaper than the Hippogryph (and IMO the High Elf one is still a tad expensive compared to the Imperial, but wins with the ability to be a mount for a Noble and hence use the Hero slot) and neither has worse stats so I think a safe bet would be that the Hippogryph would also get cheaper (unless its stats and abilities went to the level comparable with the Sun Dragon, which is of course impossible).

Alltaken
24-06-2014, 20:37
Well acording to current releases 1-2 new units part of a dual kit. Only double kits besides heroes and 1 centerpiece, which I guess will be a ridden monster /special or rare alter option, or wierd warmachine /trebuchet (a wierd ram unit? Pushed by peasants? Total wild idea). Probably no new unit size units (neither dwarfs or WE had new MC or MI). We hope for nice sculpts and pretty much balanced book.

At least thats what we've been recieving

From my servoskull

Sir_Glonojad
24-06-2014, 20:40
Well, Dark Elf release was substantially larger than that.

Unless some missing models get a re-release (which is not impossible of course), we should get models to replece :

Grail Knights
Questing Knights
Trebuchet
Battle Pilgrims
Mounted Yeomen.

Even if You do combine Grail and Questing Knights, You still need at least four boxes just to replace missing 3/5cast/metal (sic!) units and potentially 3 new units. Not to mention clampacks/small boxes for a Paladin/lord/BSB option, also missing presently.

Laniston
24-06-2014, 20:43
I'm still holding onto my hope for the male magic users to finally make a return and we get Druids. Shapeshifting, life magic wielding druids.

teclis_16
24-06-2014, 21:12
Unless they're priced the same or more.

Of course, the aesthetic of the Bretonnian knight is just more impressive than the Empire's, in my opinion.

To me Empire seems rather out of place in the old world. Almost everyone else is medieval themed, but the Empire is renaissance and steam punk.

Epicene
24-06-2014, 21:46
I'm still holding onto my hope for the male magic users to finally make a return and we get Druids. Shapeshifting, life magic wielding druids.

Druids were an Avalon thing, really - and thats a long, long dead idea. Male mages totally go against the established fluff.

Though that does raise one question I've had burning into my wee little brain about Bretonnians - What new Lords\Heros will we get?. Will we see Grail, Questing and the Paladins split up into different units. Given that they currently only have 2 Lords and 2 Heroes - I expect that to change so its more in line with other armies.

Petey
24-06-2014, 21:47
I bet against both. Your stakes?



This sounds fun. 2 bets then. The first Hippogriff in plastic, the second that we can take them in units. Each one will have the same bet, a painted man-at-arms. As bretonnian lords, it is only fitting to bet with our real currency. If we're each right about 1 of the 2 we will exchange a man at arms. What do you say?

Urgat
24-06-2014, 21:47
Well, both are actually cheaper than the Hippogryph (and IMO the High Elf one is still a tad expensive compared to the Imperial, but wins with the ability to be a mount for a Noble and hence use the Hero slot) and neither has worse stats so I think a safe bet would be that the Hippogryph would also get cheaper (unless its stats and abilities went to the level comparable with the Sun Dragon, which is of course impossible).

Well, all these lower class flying monsters got cheaper I believe, for example the wyvern got a steap point decrease iirc.


This sounds fun. 2 bets then. The first Hippogriff in plastic, the second that we can take them in units. Each one will have the same bet, a painted man-at-arms. As bretonnian lords, it is only fitting to bet with our real currency. If we're each right about 1 of the 2 we will exchange a man at arms. What do you say?

Deal. But I'll trade a bowman instead of a MaA ;) Painted as well as I can, of course.

Petey
24-06-2014, 22:37
Deal. But I'll trade a bowman instead of a MaA ;) Painted as well as I can, of course.

Awesome, do you prefer a bowman to a man at arms? I have enough of each

Ramius4
24-06-2014, 23:02
Oh, it's possible if one can take it as just a generic monster in Rare. One could then field 3 in an army, one for the Lord, two in Rares. The kit would then have bits of three types of knights, and several heads. The Knights would be geared to KotR, Lord, and the Lion-Heart himself.

That's... Never gonna happen. :p


It's not like this hasn't happened before, either. Look at the Empire.

Sure did, and Empire is a hell of a lot more popular of an army.

Charistoph
24-06-2014, 23:56
That's... Never gonna happen. :p

I wouldn't say never, but probability is low.


Sure did, and Empire is a hell of a lot more popular of an army.

What's your point?

Ramius4
25-06-2014, 00:18
What's your point?

I just don't think GW is releasing bigger kits for fantasy at the moment unless it's something they can possibly sell people multiples of. I.e. Treeman. Other than that, Dwarfs and Woodies have all been infantry, cavalry, and the (rather small) Gyrocopter.

I don't know that we can call two army book releases 'a trend', but I do get the impression that they're playing it 'safe' with the less popular armies.

Knifeparty
25-06-2014, 01:06
I'm getting kind of excited for a new Bretonnia release, whenever it may be. I bought an army in 7th edition and it didn't work out for me so I sold it, but I'd like to try my hand at it again.
I think the new book will make some happy and others will be upset because I think whether we want it or not the fluff will change to incorporate some things that may not have been in the past.

Some new units I'd potentially like to see.

Crusader Knights: Possible hatred or something to that degree

Green Knights Champions: Ghostly Knights that were lost in Athel Loren who eventually became champions of the Green Knight and ride with him in times of need.

Warmachine that launches boiling oil: Fires like a flame cannon but is only strength 1 and wound on a 4+, any unit hit by it becomes flammable and units with flaming attacks may re-roll failed wounds.

Elite Woodsmen: Elite Skirmishing bow unit with longbows and possibly great axes.

Mercenary Infantry: Some kind of mercenary for hire unit that is more elite than the average Breton.

Kings Champion: Hero class special character with bonuses in a challenge, a bit like the Emperor's champion from 40K.

Damsels Champions: Knights or Infantry who's sole purpose is to protect Damsels and Prophetess's.

Charistoph
25-06-2014, 01:22
I just don't think GW is releasing bigger kits for fantasy at the moment unless it's something they can possibly sell people multiples of. I.e. Treeman. Other than that, Dwarfs and Woodies have all been infantry, cavalry, and the (rather small) Gyrocopter.

I don't know that we can call two army book releases 'a trend', but I do get the impression that they're playing it 'safe' with the less popular armies.

And the hippogryph could be the Bretonnians Treeman. If they make a Rare version unit, it would fulfill all the same requirements you just mentioned.

And I wouldn't call them less popular, just less supported.

Urgat
25-06-2014, 05:48
Awesome, do you prefer a bowman to a man at arms? I have enough of each

Nah, MaA is fine, my brother's got way too many bowmen already >_<

Epicene
30-06-2014, 18:42
I have to say it - Can anyone else see Pegasus Knights getting 3Wounds, to be brought in line with the games current love of Monstrous units?

Mc1gamer
30-06-2014, 19:02
I don't see higher wounds on Peg Knights, but I'd like to see them get barding, and have less restrictions on how many you can take in a 2500 level game. Don't bet on a new monstrous cav unit. We'd all like it, but we already have the Pegs, so I'm betting they'll revamp slightly the rules to make them more effective (or less costly at their current power level).

Epicene
30-06-2014, 19:05
Don't bet on a new monstrous cav unit. We'd all like it, but we already have the Pegs, so I'm betting they'll revamp slightly the rules to make them more effective (or less costly at their current power level).

I won't bet on one either - we're probably gonna get the Wood Elf treatment and have the models missing replaced with plastic versions with doubled up units where available.

Saying that - can anyone else think of any other 2 Wound units in Warhammer anymore? Pegs seem like the only ones.

Ramius4
30-06-2014, 19:14
Terradons are still 2 Wounds aren't they?

Sir_Glonojad
30-06-2014, 19:21
Terradons are still 2 Wounds aren't they?

Indeed. But considering the price of other comparable MC (Warhawks which are now Eagles Lt, Demigryphs and Juggers) Pegasi are either getting W3 with perhaps a few points rise, or are getting severely cheaper.

Ramius4
30-06-2014, 19:29
Indeed. But considering the price of other comparable MC (Warhawks which are now Eagles Lt, Demigryphs and Juggers) Pegasi are either getting W3 with perhaps a few points rise, or are getting severely cheaper.

Possibly, but I find them fairly priced for the most part as they are. PK combine a bit of everything from the units you mention. Flying Cavalry, Vanguard move, Good armor save, T4, decent hitting power, Ward save, and they can get command models.

Lastavenger
30-06-2014, 19:44
To be honest i could see gw creating hypogryph knights unit or single model with rider in rare. It would be lazy so it is possible. That saidI'm less likely to belive that than year ago. First less armies are getting MC than at begining of 8th. Secondly our beloved king got new paintjob on gw site, i mean gw internet shop.
BTW i would like pegs to become sligtly cheaper and without limits.

Deff Mekz
30-06-2014, 22:46
In light of the new dwarf and wood elf releases I think it's safe to say any new units Brets get will maintain the spirit of the army. I'd be suprised to see more than 3-4 plastic kits drop with the new book with the kits being the following;

Plastic Grail/Questing Knights
Chariot sized plastic trebuchet w/ new ammunition options.
Chariot sized plastic Grail reliquae/War wagon mounted ballistae
Ethereal knights/Mounted Yeomen
Damsel clampack
Duke clampack

I can see the Grail Reliquae being changed into a chariot style unit pushed by 4 Pilgrims ala the corpse cart. This would allow GP to be released in plastic without the release of a new kit. The WW would be pulled by horses and act as a mobile siege weapon. Stylised like the old mordheim cart.

This release would update all the current metal bret units into plastic while adding 3 (If you count the reliquae as a separate unit) units to the army. That's the approach I'd take if I was GW. Brets won't be getting new MC, Peg knights are their MC. Nor will they get foot knights, one of the main Bret weaknesses is their lack of solid infrantry, expect that to stay.

Charistoph
01-07-2014, 00:08
In light of the new dwarf and wood elf releases I think it's safe to say any new units Brets get will maintain the spirit of the army...

But they've had ten-plus years and two Editions to develop them. Look at how much Daemons has changed in that time.

The Reliquae as a Chariot is intriguing, though. What would the current Reliquae be changed to, though?

GW has a habit of not eliminating a use for a model, even if that use and usefulness is vastly changed.

tneva82
01-07-2014, 09:17
But they've had ten-plus years and two Editions to develop them. Look at how much Daemons has changed in that time.

The Reliquae as a Chariot is intriguing, though. What would the current Reliquae be changed to, though?

GW has a habit of not eliminating a use for a model, even if that use and usefulness is vastly changed.

Model's style has changed quite a bit in time though. Anvil has gone from wheels to non-wheels and didn't cauldron in dark elves go from wheels to non wheels to wheels?

Not unheard of them to change style of model completely leaving old models either as odd count as or in need of some converting.

Epicene
02-07-2014, 09:22
This release would update all the current metal bret units into plastic while adding 3 (If you count the reliquae as a separate unit) units to the army. That's the approach I'd take if I was GW. Brets won't be getting new MC, Peg knights are their MC. Nor will they get foot knights, one of the main Bret weaknesses is their lack of solid infrantry, expect that to stay.

Actually - they'd lose the Battle Pilgrims and they're the only Special selection infantry the Bretonnians have. I could see the Pilgrims and Grail Relique being split into separate units, though.

DeathlessDraich
02-07-2014, 10:07
. What would the current Reliquae be changed to, though?




I can see the Grail Reliquae being changed into a chariot style unit pushed by 4 Pilgrims ala the corpse cart.

Not quite a chariot but a Fighting Platform and that's the problem. With the current unit types, it would be categorised wrongly as a Chariot but then in the next ed ...
as the Pieman would say - You heard it here first.:)

Mc1gamer
02-07-2014, 12:05
So, any new news about the release? Its July, so my guess is unless the new WD showcases Brets, we aren't seeing it this month.

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 12:10
So, any new news about the release? Its July, so my guess is unless the new WD showcases Brets, we aren't seeing it this month.

Check the news and rumor forums. Bretonnians aren't coming this summer. Possibly not even in 2014.

Mc1gamer
02-07-2014, 12:14
I have, and while there's no new news supporting their rumored release, I see nothing that says that the rumors are false, or that there's been any kind of push back. Where are you getting that?

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 12:17
I have, and while there's no new news supporting their rumored release, I see nothing that says that the rumors are false, or that there's been any kind of push back. Where are you getting that?

Look for posts from Trains_Get_Robbed, or Darnok (the only two reliable rumor sources that are posting). Both say they're not coming this summer.

PS. Something cannot be "pushed back" if they were never intended to be released yet in the first place.

PPS. Also Hastings... Something 'large and nurgle-y' is coming first.

PPPS... You joined in 2014, so probably don't know who Hastings is. He rarely posts anymore, but he's the king of accurate rumors. If he says something else is coming first. Then something else IS coming first.

Epicene
02-07-2014, 12:52
Look for posts from Trains_Get_Robbed, or Darnok (the only two reliable rumor sources that are posting). Both say they're not coming this summer.

PS. Something cannot be "pushed back" if they were never intended to be released yet in the first place.

PPS. Also Hastings... Something 'large and nurgle-y' is coming first.

PPPS... You joined in 2014, so probably don't know who Hastings is. He rarely posts anymore, but he's the king of accurate rumors. If he says something else is coming first. Then something else IS coming first.

Didn't Darnok also say that Brets were the next Fantasy release? If so, that doesn't mean the Nurgle-y thing is a big release, it could be a one-off and not even for WHFB.

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 12:59
Didn't Darnok also say that Brets were the next Fantasy release?

He never says for certain. He's not really sure when they're coming, and even says that it might not be this year.

There's also this...


All I got regarding Brets is: before 9th, and redundantly saying that Brets aren't this summer -which sucks because I have a vested interest (4K Mouslin force). Regarding the bearer of codices; I havent gotten a confirmed yes or no about Ward writing the book, rather a sly smile and logical speculation saying he will.

The tid bits I do know are either 40K related (which I care nothing for), or a little to far ahead of the timetable currently/to vague to piece together.

Here are Darnok's posts (which go from 'they're next' to 'skeptical' to 'might not see them at all in 2014'.


To (hopefully) clear things up a bit: Brets are the next release for WHF as far as I know, just not in July. The last thread was locked down due to the source being a pack of [censored]. As usual I'll drop more info as soon as I have it (or have info that I'm allowed to share :shifty:).


According to some of the info I have, that is. Even though some of my birdies - and it is them you should thank, not me - have been pretty spot on in the past, I would always suggest a good bit of scepticism. Brets could be further away than I think. If I were you I wouldn't get my hopes up just yet.


I actually think we might not see them at all in 2014.

And Hastings' bombshell.


There's something large & nurgle-y coming first

Epicene
02-07-2014, 13:25
Wasn't there an old rumor we were getting a "Book Of Nurgle" for 40k this year or somesuch? I hope its that, simply for a) I'd love to cling to the futile hope of a Bret release this year and b) It springs hope that we'll see Tzeentch get a book P:

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 13:27
Wasn't there an old rumor we were getting a "Book Of Nurgle" for 40k this year or somesuch?

Not that I'm aware of.

Epicene
02-07-2014, 13:32
Not that I'm aware of.

It was one of the crappier, throw away ones from Natfka's blog of wishlists months ago.

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 13:34
It was one of the crappier, throw away ones from Natfka's blog of wishlists months ago.

Natfka? Then it was never a 'rumor' in the first place. It was a made up lie.

Just an FYI Epicene... You can pretty much ignore 95% of what you see on Natfka or Faeit.

Epicene
02-07-2014, 13:38
Lol, I know - thats why I called it his blog of wishlists :P

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 13:51
Lol, I know - thats why I called it his blog of wishlists :P

This might sound rude, when it's not meant to be, but...

Then why mention it? All these made up rumors only stick around because they keep being brought up and repeated by others. Someone is bound to read that and tell someone else 'hey I hear there's a 40k Book of Nurgle coming'. Etc. etc. etc. ad nauseum.

Epicene
02-07-2014, 14:05
This might sound rude, when it's not meant to be, but...

Then why mention it? All these made up rumors only stick around because they keep being brought up and repeated by others. Someone is bound to read that and tell someone else 'hey I hear there's a 40k Book of Nurgle coming'. Etc. etc. etc. ad nauseum.

Oh, its not rude at all :). Was a weak attempt at pointing out it may not be a large release - seems very unlikely we're going to suddenly start getting separate Chaos powers books for either system, so the current guff about Bretons being the next Fantasy army isn't immediately tossed out the window by that.

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 14:25
seems very unlikely we're going to suddenly start getting separate Chaos powers books for either system,

People have been making that up since long before Warseer existed.


so the current guff about Bretons being the next Fantasy army isn't immediately tossed out the window by that.

By something that's made up? Of course not.

Right now all we know for sure is Darnok and Trains_Get_Robbed (literally the only credible people who have posted rumors about Brets so far) telling us they're not coming this summer. And while there's always a possibility that they're wrong about the timeframe, the fact that both of them are saying it tends to make no Bretonnians this summer much more likely.

And then Hastings (rumor God) said that something "large and nurgle-y is coming first".

Literally everything else you've read is most likely made up.

Vazalaar
02-07-2014, 18:25
It would be a shame if there was no new warhammer armybook release before 2015.
We all know that GW wants our money, but how can they get it if they don't release a new armybook with new plastic sets? Hopefully they don't think that we will spend our money on Warhammer 40K.... .

dalezzz
02-07-2014, 19:38
It would be a shame if there was no new warhammer armybook release before 2015.
We all know that GW wants our money, but how can they get it if they don't release a new armybook with new plastic sets? Hopefully they don't think that we will spend our money on Warhammer 40K.... .


Sometimes I think that's exactly what they think to be honest mate, leaving it so long before releasing anything substantial would be a bad idea I think, interest will fade , people will try other games .....

Ramius4
02-07-2014, 19:41
Sometimes I think that's exactly what they think to be honest mate, leaving it so long before releasing anything substantial would be a bad idea I think, interest will fade , people will try other games .....

There have been several times in my past 21 years of playing that have seen 6+ months without a release. The game is still here folks. No need to panic.

Vazalaar
02-07-2014, 20:07
There have been several times in my past 21 years of playing that have seen 6+ months without a release. The game is still here folks. No need to panic.

I don't panic, but there is no reasonable explanation for not releasing a new armybook before 2015. Which ofcourse we don't know as it is perfect possible that we get a Bretonnia ( or other) armybook august/september.
I don't recall a 6 month time with no Warhammer releases.

Epicene
02-07-2014, 20:16
I don't panic, but there is no reasonable explanation for not releasing a new armybook before 2015. Which ofcourse we don't know as it is perfect possible that we get a Bretonnia ( or other) armybook august/september.
I don't recall a 6 month time with no Warhammer releases.

I've been in this hobby for 22 years and I can't ever remember a time since 4th that this would have happened.

Deff Mekz
02-07-2014, 21:50
Actually - they'd lose the Battle Pilgrims and they're the only Special selection infantry the Bretonnians have. I could see the Pilgrims and Grail Relique being split into separate units, though.

Battle pilgrims could be finecrapped. Although, that is getting increasingly unlikely... In fact with fincrap going away wouldn't that suggest that the release has to contain a Trebuchet, GK/QK, Pilgrims and Mounted Yeomen? No recent release has had finecast models alongside it, please correct me if I'm wrong, so Brets need at least 4 kits... If the Reliquae is converted into a chariot type unit as I expect it will this actually points to a larger release.


Not quite a chariot but a Fighting Platform and that's the problem. With the current unit types, it would be categorised wrongly as a Chariot but then in the next ed ...
as the Pieman would say - You heard it here first.:)

I certinally wouldn't mind Howdah/FP as a new unit type in 9th if it had a defined role.

Ramius4
03-07-2014, 01:15
I don't recall a 6 month time with no Warhammer releases.

I'm talking strictly army book releases, although yes, there have also been several occassions where there have been no miniature releases for that long too (just not as many). Also keep in mind that 'wave releases' are pretty rare nowadays. They happened fairly often 4th through 6th edition, but then there were a lot more holes in the miniature ranges too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warhammer_Army_Book

There's your proof. Release dates for army books all the way back to 4th.

It happens more way more often than you'd like to think. At least once every 3 years historically.


I've been in this hobby for 22 years and I can't ever remember a time since 4th that this would have happened.

If you mean you don't remember the times when there's been 6+ months between army book releases, you have a bad memory.

Charistoph
03-07-2014, 03:19
I don't panic, but there is no reasonable explanation for not releasing a new armybook before 2015. Which ofcourse we don't know as it is perfect possible that we get a Bretonnia ( or other) armybook august/september.
I don't recall a 6 month time with no Warhammer releases.

That having been said, 40K went for quite a spell with no major release between Necrons and 6th. Daemons may have received some WD stuff, if I remember correctly, but that was it.

If they can do it for 40K, they can do it for Fantasy.

But are there any pending lawsuits for Fantasy models right now?

Epicene
03-07-2014, 06:20
If you mean you don't remember the times when there's been 6+ months between army book releases, you have a bad memory.

Not between books, since in the way back GW would slowly release an army over a period of several months and include rules in White Dwarf to cover them before the rulebook release. That kind of staggered release is almost unheard of now, save for the small Chaos release a while ago.

Ramius4
03-07-2014, 16:05
Not between books, since in the way back GW would slowly release an army over a period of several months and include rules in White Dwarf to cover them before the rulebook release. That kind of staggered release is almost unheard of now, save for the small Chaos release a while ago.

They haven't done that sort of release method since early to mid 6th edition. Since then there's been fewer and fewer releases that take more than 1 month. In fact, I can't remember there being a 2 month release during 8th edition since the Dark Elves. There were 2 small 'wave releases' for Chaos, but those were each 1 month things too.

Anyways, as I had pointed out in another thread, the past 15-16 months have seen 7 army books released for Fantasy (the fastest release pace ever). It's been a few years now since we've had one of those 6+ month dry spells. We're due. In fact, since they really don't release 'waves' anymore, I think it's becoming more and more likely as we near the end of the army book cycle.

Mc1gamer
03-07-2014, 18:58
All this points evenly for and against Brets coming out next, but the vibe I'm getting is don't get your hopes up anytime for 2014. Sigh....well I guess I'll keep painting my VC core models for now. I'll be done by the time 9E comes out, Brets are released, or the Sun goes supernova...

MiniatureForge
08-07-2014, 14:32
GW really need to get themselves sorted, the army book is 10 years overdue :( glad to see they're bringing out army books this year though, hopefully if we're in luck it will be bretonnians!

Alltaken
08-07-2014, 15:44
There is no Confirmation of this year or the next, though next seems to be acording to rumor mongers, why so people insist in calling fact their belief is beyond me.

Greyshadow
09-07-2014, 07:40
Hastings comments make it is a good bet they are next, and it would be a reasonable guess to say that it will be later this year.

Malagor
09-07-2014, 08:52
Didn't hastings say next year tho for Bretonnia ?
Still, he has been wrong before and has said that he is working from old info and with GWs release schedule it's a safe bet to ignore what he said.

Greyshadow
09-07-2014, 09:03
Right, I wasn't aware of that. Maybe it will be next year then - at least it sounds as though they are on their way.

Malagor
09-07-2014, 09:15
Still, he admitted to having old info and who knows what GW has got planned these days.
They might just squat Bretonnia for all we know.
I know they have said that they won't do that again but then again they said that 6e 40k was gonna last longer then the other editions and see how that turned out.
As a Bretonnia player naturally I hope they won't.

Urgat
09-07-2014, 09:45
No, the rumour mongers all hinted at Bretonnia coming, they just don't know how soon and lean towards next year now. There's no way they'd squat Bretonnia if they released WE anyway.