PDA

View Full Version : need help empire 2000



elmdor
06-08-2014, 00:17
Hey all

First time working on an 8th edition empire list. I want to use infantry and guns! I like it low magic with some bound spells. BTW, this list will probably ally with a HE army that is monster heavy, fast and magic equipped. The HE will do most of the magic phase and flanking for me.

Help me equip and change my list based on models and concepts below. Not sure about items and exact balance of things...

Thanks for your ideas!

Arch lector conversion on foot with two swords (full plate, fencers blade, skaven helm, cloak of Ulric)?

-Captain BSB on foot - items?
-Captain on Pegasus with full plate, charmed shield, shriek blade, helm of stubborn?) - this guy is to kill small things that come for my artillery or hold up large units.
-Witch hunter - mace of helstrum? Other items?
-Scroll caddy wizard?

35 swordsmen, full command
15 halberdiers, full command
10 handgunners, captain, special gun?
8-9 archers
Who should attach to who?

30 greatswords, command, banner of..?
2x cannon
Pistoliers/outriders?

1 helstorm battery or blaster?
1 hurricannum?

EvanM
09-08-2014, 00:25
15 halberdiers isn't a unit, you need 40+ in 8th edition. I run 50. 15 might be a detachment but it's still barely anything.
35 swordsmen is bare minimum for me, 40-50 is better.
Archers are really good in detachments of 5 running around or just to house a wizard.
1-2 cannons is a must include still
Helstorm is really bad now, unless.... no its just bad. Go with helblaster and if you can a master engineer makes a helblaster twice as good.

I'm assuming you are working on an old collection, so I won't suggest demis but if you had either demis or a steam tank they are very good.
A hurricanum is awesome at giving our infantry +1 to hit.

Knights inner circle or reiksguard are also still good.

Greatswords are not as good as they used to be. You need 40 in a unit, probably horde. 30 could be a stubborn bus unit but it's not usually taken.

An arch lector should be kitted to survive. Usually it's best to have 2+ armor if you can get it and a 4+ ward save. Fencers blades is decent, but you will probably be hit on a 4+ instead of a 3+. Not game changing. The cloak of ulric is good but it stupidly says anyone in contact with you is at -1 to hit. So spearmen will be able to hit fine.
Usually people take talisman of pres and armor of meotoric iron for the 1+ 4++ and give up on being hard to hit. You could give him 2 hand weapons to stick with what ur model looks like though.

Witch hunter is best with 2 pistols, nothing else.

Bsb is best to get the best armor save you can and a dawnstone, nothing else.

For the captasus, just vanilla equipment plus a ward save or dawnstone is good, stick with a Lance.

Anyway at your points level (seems like maybe 1000-1500? ) you are okay, but usually empire infantry need to be in blocks of 40 or 50.

And pistoliers and outsiders are also good, just no extra equipment.

Take a lvl 2 light mage as your scroll caddy, that's fine. Keep him with the archers.

Hope that helped

EvanM
09-08-2014, 00:27
If ur not adding any infantry, attach 10-12 halberds to your swordsmen, and the handgunners to the swordsmen. Keep the archers separate as a wizard or even BSB bunker.
But if I could change anything I would get you more troops.
Even proxy-ing your halberds as swordsmen would work, giving you 50 "swordsmen". That's better than 35 and 15 usually.

elmdor
09-08-2014, 19:39
Thanks for the help..so I'm in the market for 10 or 15 more swords

Yes the halberds are to be a detachment for swords. Do they need command? Pros and cons of that?

I'll rexamine the heroes items, I don't think empire heroes really pack a punch but I see the need for survival to confer bonuses as long as possible. I do want to have the arch lector and the witch hunter be able to add a few wounds.

I like the archers as chaff. Any champion? Any upgrades on gunners?

Can the lector and hurricanum and maybe a bound item like the ring provide enough magical support to my horde/guns to be effeftive? Again I think I want to save PD for my HE ally anyway..

Thanks !

EvanM
09-08-2014, 22:16
Detachments are not allowed to take command anyway, so no.
Over half of the units you will face can kill 15 halberdiers in a single round of fighting, probably before they even attack.

Ideally you want 50 swords with a det. Of 25 halberdiers.

Archers are good chaff, no command needed.

Handgunners should be a det. To swords, so no command or upgrades. (you might get another round of shooting from the det stand and shoot rule)

Witch hunter is best for giving a unit MR2, don't forget that. Also make an attempt to assassinate someone.

Arch lector and hurricanum is fine because you are playing alongside high elves who will use all the power dice easily.
Try to get prayers off but just keep the hurri close to the swords + halbs.

Best thing to do with your army is focus on keeping your artillery alive at all costs and shoot the scary stuff first.
A master engineer with the helblaster is almost always worth it, but you can choose not to have one.

Goodluck! Just proxy 15 swords and 10 halbs in your next game!

Mannfred
13-08-2014, 08:48
Have only one unit of 50 Halberds or Swords not this 35 and 15 business....don't use combat detachments, take purely hand gunners as ur detachments...

Archers are nice, and chaff is always useful, do be aware someone can take advantage of u if u place them in front of ur Halberds, and overrun from combat will deny u stand and shoot...

EvanM
13-08-2014, 21:07
Yeah the only way to run combat detachments is if you do griffin formation:

25 swords, then 50 halberds, then 25 swords. Now you have 100 men that can all count the same prayers, rank bonuses, hatred and such without being able to be targeted at the same time by spells and can flank attack single units

Lord Solar Plexus
15-08-2014, 19:54
Theoretically...although you need to see to it that there IS only a single enemy unit.

An Archlector cannot take full plate armour. A 4+ armour save is also rather weak. The -1 to hit and WS 10 certainly helps but still.

15 is a good number for a detachment as long as you are careful to get them into a flank (and that's their role anyways). Only a handful of deathstars can kill 15 models to their flank. I'd also only take one combat detachment, as you can "blade", ie. protect it with the parent. Don't take missile detachments, they make the whole thing too static and mobility is an asset you'll be missing already.

EvanM
15-08-2014, 20:23
15 in the flank is okay but even tiny chaff units nearly beat an empire detachment of 15 so they may be able to keep your detachment from ever flanking