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waikiki
19-09-2014, 06:05
Hey everyone,

So 2 weeks ago my friends suggested we should try to play some warhammer together. They've all had armies from when they where younger and I could borrow one.
Well.... We all got hooked up instantly and I started checking some of my friends army books. Orcs and Goblins look badass! Thats the army I'd really like to start with.

After some ebay searching I managed to get my hands on some Nightgoblins, fanatics, night goblin shaman and savage orcs.
After some puzzling in the army book my first attempt:


30 savage orcs big uns (+handweapons + boss + musi) (355) 1 black orc big boss BSB (115) 40 night goblins (musi / standard / netters / 2 fanatics) (235) 1 night goblin shaman (dispell scroll) (135) 1 doom diver (80)

This leaves me with 80 points left if I counted correctly. Not sure what to spend those on.
Also I'm not sure what weapons to get on the night goblins.
I've read about the black orc BSB but I didnt manage to find any model online that also contains the banner. How does that work?

Please experienced orcs and goblin players out there! Assist me in my more newby stages :D

Lorcryst
19-09-2014, 20:41
Hmmm ...

A Black Orc Battle Standard Bearer is nice to have, but there isn't any official model for it ... you could use the plastic Boss + BSB boxed set and paint it suitably darker to make one tough.

Keep in mind that said BSB should go into the Savages, and those are Frenzied, so they have to test their LD to avoid charging at the first nearest "bait" unit they see ... BO BSB is good there, higher base LD + reroll, nice combo.

The biggest problem, I think, is that your General will be your NG Shaman with his paltry LD6 for the Inspiring Presence bubble ... not a problem for the Savages, but the gobboes tend to run is something sneezes at them, even with BSB rerolls, so they might flee taking your magic with them.

It depends on your budget, but I'd add a Mangler Squig (horribly effective beastie at low points level), but it's not cheap (50 euros from GW for 65 points) ...

Regarding equipment, I'd also add a Standard Bearer in your Savages and a Champion in your Night Goblins (the NG champ is there to accept challenges instead of the shamy), and use either Spears on the NG if you go for a deep unit, Shortbows in you go for a 2 ranks of 20 unit (40 shots WILL manage to wound/kill something, eventually, and with the Little Waagh spell that gives Poisoned Attacks, can be nasty) or Hand Weapon and Shields to get that 6+ parry Ward save ... your choice really, no option is really better than the rest (except the Shortbows with the Poison combo, maybe), but be warned that gobboes hit like a wet paper towel ...

Experiment and don't be afraid to proxy units/models with other things in the beginnings, a proper O&G army quickly reaches lots of models (I have several hundreds myself, still working on them) and that can cost an arm, a leg and a nut ... so trying things first to avoid buying units that you don't like is the right way :shifty:

waikiki
20-09-2014, 07:10
Thanks for the response. Does the Nightgoblin champion count towards my hero points cause im already at 250 and not allowed to take more points into that.

The nightgoblin being my general also bothered me since the BSB cant be it, I'd rather have him being my general I guess. Any solution to that or will it be okay?

Lorcryst
20-09-2014, 07:38
Unit upgrades (champions, banners, musicians, magic banners, weapons) count toward the category of the unit ... so a NG Champion would come out of your Core allotment.

Also note that with the new End Times books, the cap for Lords and Heroes has been raised to 50%, and it's an official update to the basic rules ... you and you gaming group could ignore that tough, since the book is already sold out (GW will reprint it, at least they say so on their website, but when ?).

I honestly would make the Black Orc the General and forget about a BSB at that point level, using the Night Goblins as a bunker for the Shaman and keeping them "hidden" somewhere.

Something like this :

- Black Orc Big Boss, Army General, Talisman of Preservation (4+ Ward Save) (135)
- Night Goblin Shaman, level 2 upgrade, Dispel Scroll (110)

- 30 Savage Orcs Big 'Uns, Full Command Group (champ, mus, banner), additional hand weapons (365)
- 40 Night Goblins, Full Command, Netters, 2 Fanatics, weapons of your choice (245)

- Doom Diver (80)
- Mangler Squig (65)

1000 points on the dot, you'll maybe have some problems with the horrible LD of the gobboes (but that's standard practice for all O&G armies), the Savages will hit like a ton of bricks, the Doom Diver will kill small units quickly and make a dent in bigger units, the Mangler is a very potent threat at that point level (2D6 autohits at S6, owie) that your opponent cannot really ignore, diverting units to kill it while the rest of your army gets into position, or letting it roam freely and facing lots of high S hits, the gobboes are there as a support unit (honestly I'd take Shortbows on them, deploy them 20 wide on two ranks near the Doom Diver and hope for the Gift of the Spider God spell on the shamy), and your General will hit hard, give his LD8 where it is needed (to the Savages, to avoid being baited by chaff) and will have some protection in the form of the Ward Save.

waikiki
20-09-2014, 08:11
Thank you so much for the explanation. I will be getting that composition and when that will eventually be painted ill start looking at expanding it!

Are there any guides on different strategies orc and gob armies can deploy?

Lorcryst
20-09-2014, 09:04
There's a long thread in this section about O&G tactics in 8th ed.

waikiki
22-09-2014, 11:35
What would the first things be to look at when trying to expand the army list? Heroes/lords? Or are there better suggestions?

Lorcryst
22-09-2014, 16:00
It really depends on the direction you want to take and the feelings you have ...

More Night Goblins (Battle for Skull Pass ones on eBay) are good if you want to bulk up some tarpits/bunkers.

More Savage Orcs aren't bad either, a Horde unit of 40~50 packs a mean punch.

More Boyz anyway, Arrer Boyz can be a nasty surprise with their bows (they're bound to hit something once in a while) AND have Choppas, meaning they're no slouches in close combat either.

Chariots, either Goblin Wolf or Orc Boar are good too, nice unit to combo-charge with in the flanks while one of your "main combat blocks" slams in the front. Pump Wagons go in this category too.

Spear Chukkas are cheap as peanuts points-wise, and can do a lot of harm, as well as a second Doom Diver (almost mandatory below 3K) and a couple of Rock Lobbas.

A second Mangler Squig can double the threat, as well as a Giant or two ... the theory here is "target saturation", if you have lots of everything, your opponent should not be able to kill all of it, leaving enough to make a dent in his army.

Black Orcs make a very scary elite unit.

Wolf/Spider cavarly for those nifty Fast Cavalry rules, harassement and general nuisance.

On the topic of spiders, the Arachnarok can be a potent threat too, but it's less durable than it looks, needs a bit of careful playing to get the most of it.

Boar Boyz, Savage or not, make excellent flankers/combo chargers too. The Squig Hoppers are a bit wierd, they're Cavalry on 20mm bases with the Skirmishers rule, and are hugely unreliable, but I find that they add a bit of fun ...

Squig Herds have a nasty bite (2 S4 attacks per squig), but can explode when/where you don't want them ... either go minimum-sized "Squig Bombs" units with them or use a Horde of the blighters with just enough gobboes in there to avoid blowing up too soon.

Trolls. Oh my do I love Trolls, of the three varieties. But in an army with Animosity and generally low leadership, they are rather hit or miss.

You can never go wrong with more characters, goblins have the cheapest heroes and can make a full front rank of only "Mallorian-pattern" Night Goblin Big Bosses with Great Weapons (17 Skaven Slaves or 34 points each), allowing you to "hide" your Shamen in the second rank while still being able to cast spells.

I think the most important points are these : what do you find fun or like the most in the Army Book ? Do you have a good feeling about some units ?
If so, go with your heart.

But, again, be warned that a greenskins army will cost you a pretty penny ... cheap in points, expensive in euros ... don't be afraid to use proxies (or even bits of paper with squares scribbled on them) to test and try new units and comboes.

waikiki
23-09-2014, 20:19
So far after browsing the army book I feel the best kind of strategy I like is by forcing the opponents army to not move forward by sending in mangler squigs and the savage orcs so warmachines have more turns to fire. I think I want to add at least 1 more doom diver 1 rock lobber and some spear chukka's. I feel like I would be needing some more units with alot of movement so I was thinking about goblin wolf riders and wolf chariots. I dont really know which heroes/lords I should be looking at, since the magic items are still a bit unclear to me. For example you suggested Black Orc Big Boss, Army General, Talisman of Preservation (4+ Ward Save) (135) But I cant seem to find the talisman.

so in short I want my army to get alot of movement speed to stop opponents movement quickly so my warmachines can fire alot. Chariots/wolfriders to flank and looking for lords/heroes that complement that plan. I'm not sure if this is a viable strategy and would like some imput.

My friends and I are going to play this friday and im really excited to put my 1000 point army to use. Hopefully the mangler squig will arive in time, else I'd have to proxy that one.

Once again thnx for the great imput!

ftayl5
24-09-2014, 01:51
Looks like a very good 1000 point list. The Mangler Squig and fanatic duo will be funny as and that savage unit with tear apart almost anything.


But I cant seem to find the talisman.

It's in the BRB (big rule book) as a common magic item that all armies can take.

When expanding though, don't overestimate the strength of your warmachines. They're not that strong, not too accurate and can blow up. Also if your opponent has warmachines too he can shoot at them.
I'd get a second doom diver and a couple of spear chukkas. I'd leave the rock lobba out though.
Your main strength will be in your fighting blocks of orcs and other hard hitting units like your chariots and trolls, not your shooting.

waikiki
27-09-2014, 00:43
So today we played 2vs2 and I played my 1000point army for the first time. I'm pretty sure we made alot of mistaked and I didnt position that well yet but I did get a nice feeling of what my units could do.
The Mangler squig had some really nice area control until it got shot down by a big magic attack which had irresistable force. The doom diver overperformed. The savage orcs managed to give alot of punches before eventually going down. I'm not sure what to think of the night goblins tho. They didnt do all that much.

Things I missed:
a savage orc shaman to get acces to the other side of the waagh spells and making the savage orc unit a little stronger.
And I missed some big mobility units

Things to try out for next time:
Thinking about purchasing another doom diver, 2 goblin wolf chariots and perhaps a goblin boss on a giant wolf. This to add some extra mobility.

Thoughts?