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View Full Version : Wood Elves 2400pts - Challenging the Meta...or just plain retarded



Mannfred
16-10-2014, 12:13
Hi,

Basically i'm sure we've seen it all when it comes to Wood Elves but overall I like trying something new and you know trying to surprise people with "the kitchen sink". Anyways here is my take on something that i feel has potential and is possibly quite out there but hopefully we can all work together and maybe find something new?

Analysis is after the list**

Wood Elves - 2400pts

Spell Weaver (Shadow)
Level Four Wizard
Moon Stone of the Hidden Ways
Dispell Scroll

Glade Lord
Asrai Spear
Shield
Elven Steed
Acorn of the Ages

10 Glade Guard
Trueflight Arrows

10 Glade Guard
Trueflight Arrows

25 Eternal Guard (deployed 5 by 5)
Musician
Standard
Gleaming Pennants
Shields

15 Wildwood Rangers (deployed 7-7-1)
Musician

6 War Dancers

7 Wild Riders of Kurnos
Shields

7 Wild Riders of Kurnos (Lord goes here)
Shields

13 Waywatchers (Spell Weaver goes here)

2 Great Eagles

Treeman


So what do you people think about this list?

Here's whats going on my head...please pick at it if u feel u have more insightful ideas...So firstly the army is designed around the acorn of the ages; essentially is the D3 extra woods in addition to the +1 you have already. The idea of the deployment of these "free woods" is to form a center loaded with woods so on an average of 2 woods; and in addition to the free one that can placed anywhere within my half of the table side what u end up getting is three woods placed in close to each other in the center of the board. The one closest one forest closest to u is to be a fear forest; and the other two is to be a venom thicket if ur opponent has no fear causing units.

Now the of this terrain set up is to either force your opponent into the forest from the get go, by him voluntarily setting up his army to walk through the middle OR deploy his army in two wings both avoiding the forest and using the flanks; either of these is desired.

Onto deployment; typically u'd start with ur chaff; two eagles. But instead this list the first two units will be the two wild rider units. Why u'd say? The reason being is those two units have insane movement and by turn 3 they can be anywhere we want them to be (Vanguard and 18' Fast Cav). Most importantly is seeing where your opponent is setting up his chaff. In the first two turns the game will be focused on killing his chaff, yet keeping your own out of harms way. Typically an army has 3 units of chaff; this is just i think an estimate i've come to notice from experince. Correspondingly the 2 units of 10 glade guard are there too kill of these chaff units first. Once their dead; you'll have superior board control.

Waywatchers stay with the army and not ahead of everyone; idea being they want to jump forest later in the game and the spellweaver has to reach them first so look at them to be set up like a skirmish screen infront of targets like ur eternal guard of wildwood rangers.

So in the end how does this army work; the idea is to catch them dead in the forest clump by breaking down steadfast. Hence why u see wierd choices like the treeman. He is prone to cannon death i'll admit. Therefore the thought of potential Level 4 Life maybe a better choice perhaps?

But his damage output starts becomin magic when the unit he is fighting has no steadfast. Yet you still have stubborn so u can fight away no problem. The Treeman also doesn't have much movement hence as i mentioned above the closest forest to ur deployment u want to be a Fear forest; and not a venom thicket. You do not want someone getting poison when they fight the Treeman. And because it's also the closer forest to urself u can combo punch back with the wildwood rangers.

The other chaff units like eagles and wardancers are there merely to keep ur opponent in the forest for that extra turn to get that desired flank charge hence don't throw them away turn 1 or 2 if u don't need too; eagles can stay back. Only when u need to hunt war machines should they move forward.

So essentially if u opponent wants to just go through the forest; attack him turn one; pounce when he doesn't have steadfast and hit him with everything in one go.

I don't think games will work out like that; typically they will just split into two wings and avoid the forest all together. In those scenarios i think that using the eagles for positioning and the wild riders for swift punch as well as aggressively teleporting over to support with waywatchers that u can infact seal off half the army while the other races down to fight what's left behind. What i envisage is like a cat and mouse game where u try to keep the forest between u and whats left on ur opponents side and wait for him to set food in it. If he doesn't u just keep circling. This is also where the chaff comes in handy to either slow him down or make awkward charges that draw him away from u so u can move enough to ensure the forest is always between u and him. The Glade Lord is essentially expendable once he hits that table so i plan to throw him around as if he was chaff like lone charging into units.

This is how i think the list works?

ewar
16-10-2014, 14:48
List looks fine, but I wouldn't exactly call it meta busting - what do you think about it challenges the meta? I also think the investment in Acorn of Ages is dubious. Why would an opponent just march into the wood to get pasted?

If it was me, I would deploy in a refused flank and just go up one side of the battlefield and deal with half your army or hit the units in the woods with overwhelming force. Try it out, I just don't think it will be a strategy that works more than once against the same player. Also, there is quite a lot of analysis on this in the WE tactica if you're interested.

Finally, just so you know, it's against forum rules to write in text speak and is quite annoying for a reader. I don't see how missing off the 'y' and 'o' from u'd honestly saves you a material amount of time, especially if you're punctuating with apostrophes still, seems a bit incongruous!?

ewar
16-10-2014, 14:49
double post

Mannfred
16-10-2014, 23:36
Ummm well i'd like to think that the meta for Wood Elves at the moment was you shoot the person to death, that what i've seen over and over again, nothing that really about running down massed rank units by breaking their steadfast via a forest. I can be wrong i only play in Sydney and maybe it's not a good representation of the meta universally.

Obviously the refused flank deployment has been thought about by me; i suppose i did leave it out but in doing so by you have essentially created more distance between me and my army, which is beneficial for me - id think. Essentially i'd still be keep the forest between me and you. A refused flank basically just provides me with a free flank to move forwards into without fear of being countered cause the main body of ur army is on the other side of the board giving me actually more movement - that would be my analysis.

Again i agree that ur opponent wouldn't volunteer want to go into the forest; but i'd assume the superior movement of the army allows for you to keep the main center forest between the two of you; hence to close the with you, your opponent is forced to go into the forest, or otherwise you can just pick up a cheap 100 VPs win.

ewar
17-10-2014, 11:14
Yeah, sorry I didn't mean to rain on your parade too much!

I think the issue you'll have is that only a newbie will ever try and fight wood elves in a wood. It just doesn't make sense to attack them in there, which leaves you having to advance out and engage as you don't have a huge amount of shooting to force them onto your lines (which is a good thing, bowlines aren't exactly known for their exciting and fun gameplay).

Almost all armies will bring a ranged threat of their own, so getting a 100vp difference and then retreat isn't really an option as you have to either go full avoidance for that to work or be able to take out all their ranged threats. Against my Tomb Kings, for example, I would just hit you with 48" ranged spell damage and bows which ignore the to hit modifiers of being in the woods. Many other armies will also present significant ranged threats like this.

I guess what I'm driving at, is when you look at your battle plan you are paying almost 300 points for the trick of getting some woods of your choice in the middle of the table. Could those 300 points be better spent elsewhere? I would contend yes. Try it out, but when you're playing, treat those woods as a 300 point drop and then think whether that feels expensive or not.