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Gharnukk
23-10-2014, 19:59
Greetings.

This is my first list for Dwarfs in 8th edition. No comp or anything. Is it playable? Please let me know what you think :)

Thane. 153
- BSB.
- Shield.
- Master rune of Grungni

Runesmith. 118
- Shield.
- R. Fire.
- Rune of spellbreaking x 2

Runesmith. 113
- Shield.
- R. Furnace
- 2x R. Spellbreaking x 2

Master Engineer. 70

Master Engineer. 70

28 Longbeards. 467
- Full command
- Great weapons
- 3x R. Sanctuary

12 Quarrellers. 178
- Musician
- Great weapons

24 Hammerers. 460
- Shields
- Full command.
- 2x R. Slowness
- R. Courage

1x Grudge thrower. 135
- R.Burning
- R.Forging
- R. Accuracy

1x Gyrocopter. 80
- Steam Gun

1x Gyrocopter. 80
- Steam Gun

14 Irondrakes. 270
- Full command
- Trollhammer Torpedo

1x Organ Gun. 170
- 2x R.Penetrating

1x Organ Gun. 145
-R.Accuracy

Total Army Cost: 2499

EvanM
23-10-2014, 20:38
Master engineers are really useless compared to simply getting runes on the artillery. So don't take them, just take the rune of rerolling misfires.

Gharnukk
24-10-2014, 11:44
Well I think they have som value :) But I think that my runes will be changed on most of my stuff.

theJ
24-10-2014, 14:50
Well, I'd like to see that Quarreller unit get a bit bigger - 16-20 Quarrellers with Great Weapons can bitchslap away most light flanking forces, while 12 will start losing attacks(and effectiviness) pretty much immediately.
Meanwhile, if you're planning to keep them alive by keeping them out of combat, then there's really not much point to them having Great Weapons at all. Take small numbers without GWs or decent number with, halfmeasures is only really wasting points here.

Also, I can't help but notice a distinct lack of Cannons... They can feel a bit cheesy at times, I know, but there's a reason people are taking them in basically every list ever. The reason being that they wreck monstrous stuff.

Oh, and you'll want the +1S rune on both the Organs(forget which one it is, sorry).

CariadocThorne
24-10-2014, 15:09
Master engineers are really useless compared to simply getting runes on the artillery. So don't take them, just take the rune of rerolling misfires.

The runes won't keep the warmachines from getting shot to bits by poisoned shooting. The engineers probably will.

EvanM
24-10-2014, 15:55
point is that master engineers are expensive. artillery is nice, but with all those runes you could afford either twice the guns or simply take more soldiers (you dont have very many models on the field)

Gharnukk
24-10-2014, 19:42
I dont feel the need of a Cannon. But more bodies I can agree with :)

Fighting Newfoundlander
26-10-2014, 19:04
point is that master engineers are expensive. artillery is nice, but with all those runes you could afford either twice the guns or simply take more soldiers (you dont have very many models on the field)

I'm not sure this really adds up with the ME for the OG. It is a 70 point character instead of 50 points of runes, but it is still a 2 wound character who can move over to a different weapon if the OG is destroyed. In addition a ME and R of Accuracy is the only way to get up to BS5 w/o going to special characters, and that can matter when you still want to be able to use the OG for skirmishers or guys (elves!) in cover, like we were all so used to doing with the old book. But it does make for a very expensive shot, it's true (215 points, ouch).

russellmoo
28-10-2014, 06:56
The only change I would make is to ditch the 2 X r of slowness on the hammerers, and instead use those points to make the hammerers bigger, they will need the extra bodies as Hammerers have a bullseye painted on them due to their high point per model cost and only a 5+ armor save (not to mention any player that has been on the receiving end of a unit of hammerers also will make them a priority)

CountUlrich
01-11-2014, 12:47
Evan you are ignorant. There is nothing more overpowered in the dwarf book than an organ gun + master engineer. One is a must for any competitive dwarf list and a great many run 2.

On the list i would ditch the 2xslowness on the hammerers for groth (if you need more points change one spelleater to a spellbreaker). Whether hammerers or ironbreakers are a better choice is dependent on your meta. Ironbreakers are significantly better against elves, hammerers are better against high armor/toughness armies. The problem with hammerers is that they die very easily, so groth is important to keep them stubborn to the last man.

Galushi
04-11-2014, 00:27
I'm going to agree with CountUlrich a bit here. Master Engineers are very worth their points on Organ Guns for several reasons. As mentioned it gives you basically +1 BS and misfire reroll similar to the two runes. It also lets you entrench them, giving them cover vs shooting and -1 to be hit in close combat, giving your crew a fighting chance when attacked. I've even charged the Engineer into the attackers the following turn and fought them off, in the case of weak chaff that tried to tie up your artillery.

Taking an engineer frees you up to take even more runes if you want very powerful guns. Can go for +1 Strength or flaming, though I find another +1BS is still the best increase for the cost, statistically. You also couldn't take two identical Accuracy/Forging Organ Guns anyways.

Another benefit I found to taking an Engineer instead of Accuracy/Forging, is that it shifts points from Rare to Hero, allowing you to take more of other amazing rare units such as IronDrakes, or just more organ guns! =)

Mannfred
09-11-2014, 13:32
Don't take longbeards with great weapons...they cost the same as a Hammerers and Hammerers are better.

Rune of penetration is silly. Just take the flaming rune and rune of forging. u get to re roll both artillery dice with furnace rune and it makes organ guns insane.

Rune of Sanctury is a joke. What is it going to save u from..? U don't get ward saves against purple or pit of shades and their what kill u. U already have a 4+ ward with a runesmith. If ur seriously worried upgrade one to a Runelord. And put him there. U need rune of Stoicism that's just it. Hammers don't need slowness. Irondrakes need the slowness so they can keep standing and shooting. Your better off with like the rune of the one eye thing to give every unit within 12' stubborn or the valaya rune. Keep the bsb with 6' of hammers and long beards and ur set.

Master engineers aren't a waste of points but u either take runes or a engineer having both just means u could of bought another if the same war machine which is better. Cause u have two machines instead of one. And ull potentially do more damage. Think about it. A master engineer is really a rune of concealment and a rune of accuracy/furnace combined. Realise how much ur investing.

U dont need double double spell eater....seriously...just scroll and scroll and kill the wizard by turn three.

Mollusk
11-11-2014, 00:15
We are going a little off topic, but it's worth pointing out that the re-roll from the engineer is added value over the rune on organ guns because you can re-roll 2's for extra shots. The rune is misfires only.

moonlapse
16-11-2014, 04:16
Very surprised to see people speaking out against Master Engineers. An Organ Gun with a Master Engineer and Runes of Forging and Accuracy is way better than one with just runes. Yes it's extra points invested - for a massive increase in quality. With the ME, it hits on 3+ at long range and 2+ at short range. You can also reroll if you roll a '2', as stated previously, which is huge. Not only will you average a lot more shots, but the shots you get will hit more often, plus with Entrenchment most chaff will struggle to even hit the crew if they get into combat with them. Respect the MEs!

bloody_knight
28-11-2014, 17:55
engineers are fine. i would definately add a cannon. good character and MC popping

Gharnukk
30-11-2014, 22:16
Had forgotten about this :D ... Good input from all of you except Evan :shifty::p I really made this list for fun. I have not played Dwarfs since 6th edition.
Dont know where I would find the points for a cannon?

Gharnukk
12-12-2014, 12:28
I have seen that many uses Ironbreakers instead of Hammerers. Is that a better choice? I really like the two attacks
on the Hammerers so maybe put Handweapons and shields on the Longbeards instead?

theJ
12-12-2014, 14:40
Apples and Oranges, Gharnukk.
Hammerers give you large quantities of high strength attacks, allowing them to brutalise just about anything that gets in their way.
Ironbreakers get a crazy good armour save(for infantry, anyway) and an improved parry, allowing them to reliably hold just about any opponent in place pretty much indefinitely.
In theory, anyway.

In practice, Hammerers tend to do their job better than the Ironbreakers do theirs, these days, and that's before you consider that the Ironbreakers, like any anvil, really want the support of a decent hammer to help them actually break the enemy. Unfortionately, they're in an army where nothing has the combination of strength and mobility to do that job well. Hence, in my experience, most tend to go for the Hammerers, who can do their job just fine even without support.

Gharnukk
12-12-2014, 15:11
When I play with my friends there will be just Elves and Skaven. Squishy stuff. But I want to be able to handle all armies so that I can do tournaments and stuff like that.

theJ
12-12-2014, 16:06
Well, against Elves and Skaven, the S6 on the Hammerers is pretty much wasted('cept against the monsters), and the S4 on the Ironbreakers should work just fine against most of what you'll meet. The Hammerers still have a clear offensive advantage due to the extra attacks, but I'd say the Ironbreakers would overall have a little bit of an advantage in those matchups...

...unless your opponent focuses heavily on monsters, anyway. In that case, Hammerers will be leagues ahead, especially considering your lack of cannons(monsters will largely neuter both the S4 attacks and the armour save of the Ironbreakers, but will still get mauled by S6 great weapons).

Gharnukk
12-12-2014, 16:52
They have used Lords on Dragons before. Treemen and Hydras aswell but not tha latest games. And for Skaven a Hellpit :)

CountUlrich
12-12-2014, 18:00
It depends on your meta. Ironbreakers are ~significantly better against elves than hammerers are, hammerers are better against ogres/woc/1+ save stuff.


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Gharnukk
12-12-2014, 19:36
If I play with friends as I mentioned Ironbreakers would be best. But for tornaments I'm thinking Hammerers. Ugh! Tough choice :D

CountUlrich
13-12-2014, 18:55
If I play with friends as I mentioned Ironbreakers would be best. But for tornaments I'm thinking Hammerers. Ugh! Tough choice :D

It really depends on the tournament makeup. Take hammerers to an elf heavy tournament and you may regret it, elves destroy hammerers.


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SuperHappyTime
18-12-2014, 05:42
Greetings.

This is my first list for Dwarfs in 8th edition. No comp or anything. Is it playable? Please let me know what you think :)

Thane. 153
- BSB.
- Shield.
- Master rune of Grungni

Runesmith. 118
- Shield.
- R. Fire.
- Rune of spellbreaking x 2

Runesmith. 113
- Shield.
- R. Furnace
- 2x R. Spellbreaking x 2

Master Engineer. 70

Master Engineer. 70

28 Longbeards. 467
- Full command
- Great weapons
- 3x R. Sanctuary

12 Quarrellers. 178
- Musician
- Great weapons

24 Hammerers. 460
- Shields
- Full command.
- 2x R. Slowness
- R. Courage

1x Grudge thrower. 135
- R.Burning
- R.Forging
- R. Accuracy

1x Gyrocopter. 80
- Steam Gun

1x Gyrocopter. 80
- Steam Gun

14 Irondrakes. 270
- Full command
- Trollhammer Torpedo

1x Organ Gun. 170
- 2x R.Penetrating

1x Organ Gun. 145
-R.Accuracy

Total Army Cost: 2499

Runesmiths: I'd drop the Runes of Furnace and Fire. Where are you putting these? I assume one the LBs and the other with the Qs.

Longbeards: The general train of thought at Bugman's Brewery is to build Warriors with GWs and LBs get Shields.

Quarrelers: Drop the Musician, it's swift reform counts as moving, so they can't fire. I find Great weapons poor since you don't want the unit getting into combat. If you want more survivabilty vs ranged attacks, Shields prevent a lot of damage (4+ AS). Having a Runesmith in here is a good plan as armor piercing blasts through chaff.

Hammerers: Rune of Slowness is a one trick pony. If they know it's there ahead of time, your opponent will position their units to ensure they get the charge.

Grudge Thrower: Like a lot of people, I'd rather have a Cannon or two

Gyrocopters: Love them. They do better as chaff killers than War Machine hunters though.

Organ Guns and Master Engineers: Here's your reference http://www.bugmansbrewery.com/topic/44088-organ-gun-runes-stats/ . IMHO, using MEs are better than no runes, but adding a single accuracy rune helps. EDIT: Entrenchment doesn't count as cover either, so bonus points there

Gharnukk
18-12-2014, 08:20
Yeah I get that most of the runes are off. I am currently writing an entirely new list :)

CountUlrich
18-12-2014, 12:57
Runesmiths: I'd drop the Runes of Furnace and Fire. Where are you putting these? I assume one the LBs and the other with the Qs.

If he wants 2 spelleaters he has to have one of them.


Longbeards: The general train of thought at Bugman's Brewery is to build Warriors with GWs and LBs get Shields.

with hammerers, yes, but if you run ironbreakers then greatbeards are preferred.


Quarrelers: Drop the Musician, it's swift reform counts as moving, so they can't fire. I find Great weapons poor since you don't want the unit getting into combat. If you want more survivabilty vs ranged attacks, Shields prevent a lot of damage (4+ AS). Having a Runesmith in here is a good plan as armor piercing blasts through chaff.

Actually many dwarven tactics rely upon quarellers in combat, utilizing stubborn from groth, and as such gw option on them is quite popular.


Grudge Thrower: Like a lot of people, I'd rather have a Cannon or two

Actually, runed the way he had it with accuracy and forging, it is an equal of a canon and for cheaper points.



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SuperHappyTime
19-12-2014, 02:13
If he wants 2 spelleaters he has to have one of them.

I should read my rulebook more closely. Only the Rune of Furnace would work though, a rune of fire goes on a weapon, not a talisman.


with hammerers, yes, but if you run ironbreakers then greatbeards are preferred.

He was running Irondrakes, not Ironbreakers. But the Longbeards are his anvil and core tax.


Actually, runed the way he had it with accuracy and forging, it is an equal of a canon and for cheaper points.

Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man. But yes. It's a 15 point difference and will do well enough without a rune of pen vs HE and Skaven

Gharnukk
16-01-2015, 00:09
So, finally managed to write up another list. I hope that it is legal and usable in an friendly enviroment :)

Thane. 153
- BSB.
- Shield.
- Master rune of Grungni

Runesmith. 128
- Shield.
- R. Stone
- R. Spellbreaking
- Fiery ring of Thori

Runesmith. 113
- Shield.
- R. Stone
- 2x R. Spellbreaking

Master Engineer. 70

28 Longbeards. 422
- Full command
- Great weapons

16 Quarrellers. 224
- Great weapons

24 Ironbreakers. 336
- Full command.

Cannon. 145
- R. Forging

Grudge thrower. 130
- R. Accuracy
- R. Forging

1 Gyrocopter. 80
- Steam Gun

1 Gyrocopter. 80
- Steam Gun

14 Irondrakes. 300
- Full command
- Trollhammer Torpedo
- 2x R. Slowness

1 Organ Gun. 145
- R. Accuracy

1 Organ Gun. 170
- R. Accuracy
- R. Forging

Total Army Cost: 2496

Gharnukk
18-01-2015, 09:59
Nothing? Should I take it as a bad sign :shifty:

weenyman
24-01-2015, 20:51
Who is the general? I'm new to dwarves and trying to run 32 thunderers, and 32 X2 warrior Units. What are the tactics behind your list?