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WarsmithGarathor94
26-12-2014, 19:01
Hey guys having decided to shelve my csm for a while and bring my daemons back off the shelve after being convinced they are a good army i keep seeing people saying they are op. Now ive got a couple of questions
1) are they alot like tau and eldar when pretty much every unit is decent
2)are they around a similar power level to them

Scammel
26-12-2014, 19:08
Daemons are definitely very powerful and can certainly tussle with the best of them. Not all of their units are fantastic, but there's very few outright bad ones and there's a great deal of versatility in list-building. They're one of the few armies that can pull off CC effectively thanks to their speed, utterly dominate the psychic phase with ease (if that's the route you want to go down) and boast the most potent Monstrous Creatures in the game (again, if that's the route you want to go down - there's plenty of mileage in running Heralds, especially with their loci).

WarsmithGarathor94
26-12-2014, 19:09
Daemons are definitely very powerful and can certainly tussle with the best of them. Not all of their units are fantastic, but there's very few outright bad ones and there's a great deal of versatility in list-building. They're one of the few armies that can pull off CC effectively thanks to their speed, utterly dominate the psychic phase with ease (if that's the route you want to go down) and boast the most potent Monstrous Creatures in the game (again, if that's the route you want to go down - there's plenty of mileage in running Heralds, especially with their loci).

Hmm i still cant see why they are op

druchii
26-12-2014, 19:10
Hey guys having decided to shelve my csm for a while and bring my daemons back off the shelve after being convinced they are a good army i keep seeing people saying they are op. Now ive got a couple of questions
1) are they alot like tau and eldar when pretty much every unit is decent
2)are they around a similar power level to them

1. I definitely would say they are NOT like Eldar in that every unit in the book is pretty good. There are definitely a good chunk of units that suck Some quick examples are bloodletters, skull chariots, and furies.

2. They CAN be abusable with summoning shenanigans, beyond that they rely one one or two power house units that are usually rocking a 3++ and have invisibility.

d

CrownAxe
26-12-2014, 19:15
The are powerful with synergy combos. Any one daemon unit by themselves is not super powerful but when you combine bonuses from rewards like the grimoire, psy powers like invisibilty, and Loci bonuses from heralds you get incredibly powerful units that are hard to deal with and can kill entire armies.

Plus on top of that you should be summoning free daemon units every turn for amazing table control.

WarsmithGarathor94
26-12-2014, 19:17
The are powerful with synergy combos. Any one daemon unit by themselves is not super powerful but when you combine bonuses from rewards like the grimoire, psy powers like invisibilty, and Loci bonuses from heralds you get incredibly powerful units that are hard to deal with and can kill entire armies.

Plus on top of that you should be summoning free daemon units every turn for amazing table control.

While i dont have the models to really summon alot right now i will definately need more lesser daemons then

CrownAxe
26-12-2014, 19:40
While i dont have the models to really summon alot right now i will definately need more lesser daemons then
You don't need a lot unless you really want to commit to summoning. The easiest thing to do is take two 11x pink horrors squads for your troops (since they will generate 2 WC each for their unit size) and that plus the 1d6 per psychic phase is enough to do 1 summon a turn.

The big thing to keep in mind is that summoning is a toolbox. You should be summoning according to what you need at that moment per battle and get the right tool for the right job. With that in mind, Flesh Hounds and Demonettes are the best ones to have for summoning. Flesh Hounds are your bread and butter summon because they are versitile, mobile and the the most bulky unit you can summon plus if you get Chaos Warhounds from WHFB they are a very dollar efficient model. Demonettes are good because they cover some holes that flesh hounds miss with rending and with their +3" run they are great for dropping on objectives at the last second. The only other summons worth considering are Pink Horrors (gives you extra warp charges) and Plaguebearers (can camp objectives with shrouded and can threaten AV12+) but the situations those are needed for are rare I find.

thanoson
26-12-2014, 20:13
I run a mostly nurgle list until I start summoning. Beast of nurgle and plague drones are incredible. Nurgle Dp's with wings boast a hardy 2+ cover save out in the open. Give them a balesword and you have a very effective nob/crisis suit/paladin/centurion/character killer. And Iron Arm on a Unclean One sports a mighty T10.

Scammel
26-12-2014, 20:14
Eh, I don't particularly use Summoning that much. I'm typically too busy distributing buffs and debuffs like crazy, all the while drinking the tears of my opponent when his army-wide massed volley does absolutely nothing to my Bloodthirster.

WarsmithGarathor94
26-12-2014, 21:39
Going to pick up some more nettes bearers and war hounds them. Is it ever worth summoning letters

druchii
26-12-2014, 21:55
Going to pick up some more nettes bearers and war hounds them. Is it ever worth summoning letters

No. They're that bad.

d

CrownAxe
26-12-2014, 21:56
Going to pick up some more nettes bearers and war hounds them. Is it ever worth summoning letters

Not really. If you really need to kill a marine unit I guess but both demonettes and flesh hounds can do that fine.

Latro_
26-12-2014, 23:44
I suggest you by your self a pencil and a good a4 pad if ye gonna play daemons :D

thanoson
27-12-2014, 00:42
I suggest you by your self a pencil and a good a4 pad if ye gonna play daemons :D

true dat. Everything I have has at least a gift or upgrade if they can. Oh, you will appreciate cover.

WarsmithGarathor94
27-12-2014, 07:33
Well ive got an A4 pad and a pen somewhere

Asura Varuna
28-12-2014, 00:33
I'm really enjoying daemons at the moment; far more than my opponents are, to say the least. I originally began a Slannesh detachment as a fluffy addition to my fluffy CSM (CSM may as well always be fluffy considering how pants their codex is). What began as a few boxes of daemonettes and seekers is now a 3.5k collection. Because of the additional units you can spawn, they're probably the best army to have a big collection for.

The best units are:
HQ
Be'lakor - combat monster and buff giver, essential for a strong army
Lord of Change - great model to have for possession; lesser gift gives him S8 so he's a combat beast and good mobility for summoning
Kairos - re-roll that failed grimoire? Check.
Tzeentch Heralds - mobile with a disc and with ML offer a lot of spells from a single slot

Elites
Nothing special going on here, units are situational (such as Flamers) and you're usually better off summoning them.

Troops
Horrors - Take 11/16 as warp charge batteries. 2+ rerollable coving going to ground behind an ADL, remember they can only roll 1 power, even if they generate more than 1 warp charge.

Fast Attack
Flesh Hounds - lots of wounds, fast moving, surprisingly medicore in combat. Take a large unit for screening/tying things up with invisibility. Remember they ignore movement penalties from terrain and and scout to reposition.
Screamers - essential bodyguards for essential heralds. 2+ re-rollable cover with Be'lakor's shrouding and jink. Lamprey's bite is only 1 attack per model at S5 AP 2 with 2d6 against armour.

Heavy Support
Daemon Prince - if you're going with a flying circus, you'll probably have taken Kairos so Tzeentch Princes will be HS. I'm not a massive fan of them, but some people swear by DPs.
Soulgrinder - AV13 walker with S6 AP4 torrent flamer, fleet and +d3" run? It gets in your opponents face fast and wrecks almost anything. Nurgle Grinder with Phlegm is worth a look in if you play with lots of medium height terrain to obscure it and offer 3+ cover saves.

As for power level, they're weaker than Eldar, but have a strong match up against the Tau. They have plenty of dud choices, but they actually have several units that perform each role, so that's to be expected really.

Eldartank
28-12-2014, 04:31
I'm in the process of building my Daemon army. I really like Khorne, so my Daemon army will be almost all Khorne, with a unit or two of Pink Horrors (because I like the way they look). Perhaps my army won't be the most effective, but I'm going more for my own version of cool factor. I want a Daemon army that looks good to me. ;)

I also did a minor conversion to one of my Soul Grinders, giving it a bird beak. That one will have a pink body, as if it originally came from a Herald of Tzeentch. My other (obviously) has the red body of a Khornate Soul Grinder.

WarsmithGarathor94
28-12-2014, 07:41
Had 2 games using my Daemons yesterday and i managed to beat both 30k marines and eldar