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Drakkar du Chaos
08-11-2015, 21:59
Are they still needed ? Between Internet and the "one man store" concept i wonder why GW is still trying to expand via physical stores.

What are your thoughts about it ?

DeeKay
08-11-2015, 22:50
Tricky question.

I think that B&M stores still have a place in the UK at least. There is a lot to be said for high street presence, especially if a particular city or town doesn't have an independent LGS. It's more a question of how long can it is profitable for GW to continue this approach as more people learn that GW isn't the only game in town. Our local GW has expanded to the point where it has taken on another staffer and is opening 7 days a week. In the US, my guess is that a more cordial relationship with the LGS community would be a better approach, at least for the short to medium term. Having said that I have never been to the US, so I may be wrong. If someone has a better grasp of the American market, I am happy to be corrected.

So yeah, as far as GW's global policy on B&M, I don't know. Paying more attention to local conditions would be more beneficial as far as I see it.

With regards,
Dan.

Zywus
08-11-2015, 22:50
They are one of the big factions remaining that still makes GW the big guy on the block so they kinda need them still. Though they probably need to revise their models of running them if they aren't going to remain a millstone around their neck.

narradisall
08-11-2015, 22:57
I always wonder if it's worth the exposure for them. I have two within a short drive of where I live and I've never seen them busy in years.

Lots of stores attempt to maintain that high street presence even those that invest heavily online.

My personal opinion is that it isn't worth the investment for them, the independents could do it well enough, but they'd need competitive pricing and better community relations for that to work well.

lbecks
08-11-2015, 23:03
In the US, yes. Their stores have been pushed into low rent strip malls and they only sell products which you can find far cheaper elsewhere. They probably could have created true hobby centers if they planned and invested wisely. They might as well be running mall kiosks now.

RevEv
08-11-2015, 23:29
In the UK no - they are one of the few 'geeky' stores in the high street and still offer a means to promote wargaming beyond the very few FLGS that exist outside of big cities.

Elsewhere, from the evidence presented on this forum, yes! Seems all they do is wind people up so let's get rid and with them the whingers.

Voss
09-11-2015, 01:41
Are they still needed ? Between Internet and the "one man store" concept i wonder why GW is still trying to expand via physical stores.

What are your thoughts about it ?

If they're still functional in Britain, by all means keep them around... in Britain.
Stupid to throw money at a failed model elsewhere, however. At this point I think there is no recovering for GW elsewhere in the world. People just have too many other options. And while it will remain a major company for a while, it won't ever be the bright and shining star that it is on the isles. Too many people have moved on, and GW seems intent on pushing more people away. Grubby little shops aren't going to change that. Stateside particularly, if it isn't battle bunker size (ie, have room for at least four full sized tables) it isn't worth keeping.

TheLionReturns
09-11-2015, 01:52
I have long thought that GW should move from having so many small stores to having a smaller number of flagship stores in the bigger connurbations in the UK, with the focus more firmly on showcasing the hobby than sales. I think there is currently a move from stores being purely direct retail spaces to becoming advertising spaces driving online sales too. I am not sure about other countries as I do not know the various retail cultures, although I suspect a similar approach allied with better relationships with independent stores would go a long way.

lordreaven448
09-11-2015, 02:30
In the US, yes. Their stores have been pushed into low rent strip malls and they only sell products which you can find far cheaper elsewhere. They probably could have created true hobby centers if they planned and invested wisely. They might as well be running mall kiosks now.
They can start doing that once they phase out Warhammer in favor of Space Marine: The game!

Coldhatred
09-11-2015, 02:42
They should close them in the US if they keep them as one man retail stores rather than a multi-staffed hobby store.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Mawduce
09-11-2015, 04:59
I can't speak for the rest of the world, but in the United States their stores are doomed and need to go. Let the third party stores sell their products and STOP TELLING THEM WHAT TO DO OR ORDER! This is America, we don't exactly take kindly to that behavior and if you want to lose our market, fine. But remember, we are the largest consumer market in the world. We are a mountain of money, come join in our mountain. We want your business, but you're going to be an ass about it you can back to England and we'll find an alternative.

Losing Command
09-11-2015, 06:13
Wether or not the gaming stores should go is going to differ a lot between locations. But the tiny little one-man stores where there's barely room enough to shuffle past eachother would most definately not be missed here :p
A real gaming store with, you know, room enough for people to actually play the game, could do well in areas where there's no established gaming place already I think.

williamsond
09-11-2015, 07:36
I don't know if they can at the moment as in they have burned a lot of bridges in europe with indy retailers and trying to rebuild those would take a lot of work.

stroller
09-11-2015, 20:56
I'm going to go against the flow here. I think they should continue the model, in the UK at least.

I'm fortunate enough to have a local GW, and two local independents. Warhammer World is within easy reach too. While each of the three is quiet at times, I get more games more often at GW. Because it's GW, obviously I'm playing a GW game. There is more variety at the independents, with emphasis on GW, Magic:The Gathering, Kings of War, Warmahordes, Flames of War, and Infinity leading the pack. However, sometimes there's incompatibility: Fred brings M:TG and I bring FoW.

This issue doesn't arise at GW, so I think it can only feed the GW track. While game choice is limited, I still get a game. That reinforces the cycle, and, I assume, reinforces the spend.

Voss
09-11-2015, 22:51
I don't know if they can at the moment as in they have burned a lot of bridges in europe with indy retailers and trying to rebuild those would take a lot of work.

Oh they did that stateside too, which is why I think they can't rebuild here. But the thing is, their own stores don't really help, either. For most people, they're inaccessible, and paying full price for GW products (if people are willing to buy GW products at all) just isn't a thing more and more people are willing to do.


I can't speak for the rest of the world, but in the United States their stores are doomed and need to go. Let the third party stores sell their products and STOP TELLING THEM WHAT TO DO OR ORDER! This is America, we don't exactly take kindly to that behavior and if you want to lose our market, fine. But remember, we are the largest consumer market in the world. We are a mountain of money, come join in our mountain. We want your business, but you're going to be an ass about it you can back to England and we'll find an alternative.
National pride aside, not taking kindly really isn't the problem. Most American consumers are quite happy to be sheep and most stores are very happy to stuff the sheeple with trash. But from a store perspective, GW has made business with them a bad deal. Lots of things aren't available or not available at normal retail prices. No advertising or knowledge of upcoming products makes planning (and many LGS' are on a tight budget) nigh-impossible. With essentially two product lines that sell in the states (LotR sort of did, a bit, and the hobbit didn't), sticking one in Limbo for more than a year and then setting it on fire and putting it back in Limbo (other than the deluge of samey releases of essentially the same model at ridiculous price points) is beyond intolerable for a business. A reboot that makes customers angry and refusing to explain how it will generate sales isn't doing anyone any favors.

Yrch
10-11-2015, 00:21
do we need store that arent big enough to even have 1 gaming-table?
hell no

but the stores are there to bring people together and bring newbies into the hobby.
what better way to bring people into tabletop than have them play a testgame, paint their first figure and offering them a place where they can learn from veterans and socialize?
a lot of people start either through worth to mouth or because they could activly handle the product instead of buying it blindley and then be left alone with it.

Mawduce
10-11-2015, 02:33
Oh they did that stateside too, which is why I think they can't rebuild here. But the thing is, their own stores don't really help, either. For most people, they're inaccessible, and paying full price for GW products (if people are willing to buy GW products at all) just isn't a thing more and more people are willing to do.


National pride aside, not taking kindly really isn't the problem. Most American consumers are quite happy to be sheep and most stores are very happy to stuff the sheeple with trash. But from a store perspective, GW has made business with them a bad deal. Lots of things aren't available or not available at normal retail prices. No advertising or knowledge of upcoming products makes planning (and many LGS' are on a tight budget) nigh-impossible. With essentially two product lines that sell in the states (LotR sort of did, a bit, and the hobbit didn't), sticking one in Limbo for more than a year and then setting it on fire and putting it back in Limbo (other than the deluge of samey releases of essentially the same model at ridiculous price points) is beyond intolerable for a business. A reboot that makes customers angry and refusing to explain how it will generate sales isn't doing anyone any favors.


You missed the point entirely. A store owner only buys what he or she feels they need to buy. GW dictates the amounts people can buy. If a store owner only feels they need 5 of said item, GW forces them to buy 10 or stop selling GW products. The store owner wants to put up a sale or something, if GW finds out they sold the item outside how they want the item sold, they can no longer sell GW products. Why on earth would a store owner want someone else to dictate how they can run their business? Not to mention the fact the only place you can go online and view a GW product and buy it is on GW's website, and you can't buy a GW item from anywhere overseas outside of GW proper. It's absolute madness the work around people need to do in order achieve said goal. There is a reason why store stop dealing with them, its pure frustration.

If GW got rid of its own stores and let the third party stores do the dirty work they could get mass appeal over a large area without having to spend the money to do, and each store can market as it needs to its meta, instead of some over arching plan that may only work in a few areas in England.

ehlijen
10-11-2015, 05:47
They're not using the stores right, and are sabotaging them with many over ill advised practices as well, but if they're not going to actively try to compete with other games, they need the stores as a recruitment channel.

That's never going to work as is, but the solution, in my opinion, should be to fix that, not give up on the stores.

Herzlos
10-11-2015, 07:51
I have long thought that GW should move from having so many small stores to having a smaller number of flagship stores in the bigger connurbations in the UK, with the focus more firmly on showcasing the hobby than sales. I think there is currently a move from stores being purely direct retail spaces to becoming advertising spaces driving online sales too. I am not sure about other countries as I do not know the various retail cultures, although I suspect a similar approach allied with better relationships with independent stores would go a long way.

I agree with that. If they had a mini whw in our capital I'd probably be playing 40k weekly.

I think they need to go big or get rid of the small stores; 1 man closets in back streets don't offer anything I can't get in an flgs. They need to go back to being hobby centres instead of tiny stores.

ebbwar
10-11-2015, 09:31
In 30 years of gaming, GW stores have always been irrelevant to me and I live in the UK. I'd rather they go so that the prices do not include the 'store tax' to prop up the stores.

williamsond
10-11-2015, 09:44
lets face it you cant even buy most of their product line in the stores these days it has to be ordered in for collection and an extra visit to a terrible retail environment, gone are the days of the random impulse purchase (for me anyway). if i'm going to haev to order it anyway why not just order the whole lot from a online indy and get it delivered to my door and 10-15 % discount.

HappyDad
10-11-2015, 13:47
I used to really look forward to going into my local GW when I was in town at the weekend. I would plan what I wanted to get, and sometimes make an impulse purchase - I started a WFB Empire army that way; and also bought the wife enough orks on one trip to build a moderate 40k army.

It was always exciting to see the latest releases built and sometimes already painted too.

However, as of about 5 years ago or so, the prices just hit the point where I stopped buying in store. I would still pop in to see the new releases and buy paint.

Then they stopped sending stores the new releases - so bang, the biggest reason left to still go in was also gone.

Last time I went in, I asked the manager what he thought of the AoS rumours (you know, that Warhammer was being replaced with a skirmish game on round bases) and he became quite aggressive and said I was a fool and that I should not listen to stupid rumours on the web. He did actually swear at one point. Since then I have avoided going back at all as I don't want to have to face or talk to the chap again.

On top of that, last Christmas I happened to be in the next biggest town around and went to have a look at their GW store. First off just as I got there the one member of staff was shutting up to go to lunch. So I had to wander up and down the road and come back 40 minutes later when he re-opened. Before letting me in, he then asked what I was going to buy, and pretty much laid it out that I was only welcome to enter the store if I was going to buy something. I thought this was absolutely unbelievable. As it happened, I wanted to buy a pot of paint, so an argument was avoided. However, I DID NOT ENJOY that experience at all and I would never visit that store again.

So in answer, yes, I think GW should end their gaming store era - in fact, in my experience, they already have, it is just that they are still paying rent on the buildings!

Allen
10-11-2015, 14:36
NO if they want to survive.
Let's face it, in many geographical areas the only thing that gives GW anagaind edge agaainst its competitors is their network of stores. They work as a social aggregator, a place where people can go and find opponents or simply to chat with people interested in the game, fluff or whatever. The stores are, to put it simply, a one-brand gaming club where people can talk only about GW and play only with GW miniatures and GW rule systems...if you close those stores, people either go underground and play only in their social circle (when and if possible) or go to an independent club/store where they will be exposed to A LOT of other wargaming stuff.

And let's be honest here: GW miniatures are NOT the best on the market, their backgrounds/fluff are NOT the most interesting/creative avalaible and their rule systems are outdated, boring, poorly designed and even more poorly balanced. The only redeeming points are the miniatures: they're not the top-of-the-line products they boast in their investor meetings, but they're quite good nonenthless.


TLDR: close the stores and many people in key geographical areas will be exposed to a lot of competitors that have better products at a more affordable cost. Give to GW-gamer a copy of Tomorrow's War or Force on Force and I doubt he/she will return gladly to WH40K, for example.

DonkeyMan
10-11-2015, 17:57
No. Maybe reduce the amount of stores, but generally I would recommend to keep at least a few.
Though, they might want to rethink their strategy about how to run those. That way they might become more popular again.

Hicks
10-11-2015, 19:38
GW should end the ****** rules, "bigger is better" models and insulting prices. At this point, the stores aren't doing much difference in drawing in new blood I think.

shelfunit.
10-11-2015, 20:03
When GW stores sold a variety of products they were somewhat relevant, sadly now they stock two product lines and the extortionately priced materials to 'Hobby' them with they are essentially useless.

Senbei
10-11-2015, 20:08
Theres no real gaming done in many of the single-staffer stores.... they've killed most of it off to save money. They also moved a number of stores into less-prime locations with less space. This means that theres no real community anymore and you're better off buying on the internet and saving 20 to 30%. There's still a decent amount of gaming in some larger stores, but their current business model (AoS) seems to dislike pick-up gaming.

ebbwar
10-11-2015, 21:47
NO if they want to survive.
Let's face it, in many geographical areas the only thing that gives GW anagaind edge agaainst its competitors is their network of stores. They work as a social aggregator, a place where people can go and find opponents or simply to chat with people interested in the game, fluff or whatever. The stores are, to put it simply, a one-brand gaming club where people can talk only about GW and play only with GW miniatures and GW rule systems...if you close those stores, people either go underground and play only in their social circle (when and if possible) or go to an independent club/store where they will be exposed to A LOT of other wargaming stuff.

And let's be honest here: GW miniatures are NOT the best on the market, their backgrounds/fluff are NOT the most interesting/creative avalaible and their rule systems are outdated, boring, poorly designed and even more poorly balanced. The only redeeming points are the miniatures: they're not the top-of-the-line products they boast in their investor meetings, but they're quite good nonenthless.


TLDR: close the stores and many people in key geographical areas will be exposed to a lot of competitors that have better products at a more affordable cost. Give to GW-gamer a copy of Tomorrow's War or Force on Force and I doubt he/she will return gladly to WH40K, for example.

Or they could close their stores and up their game, thus surviving on an improved product.

ehlijen
10-11-2015, 23:18
Or they could close their stores and up their game, thus surviving on an improved product.

That would need to come with a reduction in operation size, though.

The big thing the stores gave was the implicit promise that GW games were big and that finding opponents and possibly new friends was as easy as turning up in those stores. That tempts an entirely different demographic to those who want a game because their friends are already playing (which is the demographic other games at the moment have to mostly contend with).

It's why Wyrd and Catalyst (probably others too, but I've only seen them do it in person) have extensive programs to get volutneers trying to recruit at and set up gaming clubs for their games. GW has (had) a major head start with their stores and established presence in the club community, but they're just throwing it away :(

To compete, GW will need either their stores or great engagement with gaming clubs. And given their policies lately, I think the stores are the more likely option to work for them (in as much as either method will still work anyway). Giving up on both will see them fall behind.

Allen
11-11-2015, 09:05
That would need to come with a reduction in operation size, though.

The big thing the stores gave was the implicit promise that GW games were big and that finding opponents and possibly new friends was as easy as turning up in those stores. That tempts an entirely different demographic to those who want a game because their friends are already playing (which is the demographic other games at the moment have to mostly contend with).

It's why Wyrd and Catalyst (probably others too, but I've only seen them do it in person) have extensive programs to get volutneers trying to recruit at and set up gaming clubs for their games. GW has (had) a major head start with their stores and established presence in the club community, but they're just throwing it away :(

To compete, GW will need either their stores or great engagement with gaming clubs. And given their policies lately, I think the stores are the more likely option to work for them (in as much as either method will still work anyway). Giving up on both will see them fall behind.

Quoted for truth.
I started my wargaming experience with GW products because no-one of my friends at the time were interested in playing with little toy soldiers. GW stores were both a place where I was sure to find people to ask suggestions/reviews and a place where I was sure to find people to play with. Only later I realized I could scout the city for independent gaming groups/clubs/stores, but even in that case finding enough people interested in game X or the game Y was (and still is) quite difficult.

GW stores give to anyone ready access to a quite large pool of people with similar interests (GW stuff) and objectives (playing with GW game systems). If I want to play Impetus, or Force on Force, or Black Powder, or Frostgrave, or Beyond the Gates of Antares...well, first I have to find a club/store that support that gaming system and then hope there's enough people interested in that system in order to play it regularly and not one or two times every six months. Also, I have to be really lucky to find a club/store where there are enough people that use that particular system to avoid playing against the same 2-3 guys over and over again. And we're talking about very good products here, quite famous and well-marketed...imagine trying to find opponents if you're interested in playing Fire and Fury or some other very niche-y game system.

ebbwar
11-11-2015, 09:37
That would need to come with a reduction in operation size, though.

The big thing the stores gave was the implicit promise that GW games were big and that finding opponents and possibly new friends was as easy as turning up in those stores. That tempts an entirely different demographic to those who want a game because their friends are already playing (which is the demographic other games at the moment have to mostly contend with).

It's why Wyrd and Catalyst (probably others too, but I've only seen them do it in person) have extensive programs to get volutneers trying to recruit at and set up gaming clubs for their games. GW has (had) a major head start with their stores and established presence in the club community, but they're just throwing it away :(

To compete, GW will need either their stores or great engagement with gaming clubs. And given their policies lately, I think the stores are the more likely option to work for them (in as much as either method will still work anyway). Giving up on both will see them fall behind.

Reduction in operation size, not got a problem with that. As I said, I'd rather not subsidise stuff irrelevant to me like B&M stores.

And engaging more with the community like other companies like Wyrd do, well thats a part of upping their game so to speak.

Allen
11-11-2015, 10:12
Reduction in operation size, not got a problem with that. As I said, I'd rather not subsidise stuff irrelevant to me like B&M stores.

And engaging more with the community like other companies like Wyrd do, well thats a part of upping their game so to speak.


Their game systems are awful, and that's what keep their business floating, not the so-called collectors they talk about during investor meetings. If they want to stay in the market they NEED to design better game systems - WH40K ran past the treshold of boring/uninspired years ago, WHFB has been canned (and was utter garbage anyway), AoS is slightly more interesting but is not being managed effectively...that's it.

Those are the game systems avalaible: clunky, outdated rulesets with balance issues and a very high entry cost for newcomers (and an equally very high management cost for veterans). THAT is the main problem, not their inability to keep in touch with the community. Yes, running focus groups and/or customer surveys could help them greatly. Yes, creating a social team worth of its name could help them greatly in managing their web footprint. Yes, generally interacting more with fans/customers is a good starting point...but it's not the main issue that need to be solved. Their greatest problem is that a lot of their products are, compared to their competitors, high-cost junk - and they don't realize it.

GW's past glories (and a very disturbing, in a certain way sick form of customer loyalty) is what keeps them afloat. In order to bring back the company on safe waters they need to work on their products first, and then on their customers - not the other way around.

mrtn
11-11-2015, 12:00
Sweden is 1500 km from north to south, and even though I live in one of the two cities they have a store in, trying to get a game on one of their tiny demo tables sounds like an awful idea. Not even when I started did that sound even remotely interesting.
As to buying overpriced paints and models I can do that in the FLGS or online.

eron12
11-11-2015, 12:02
Back when I bought from gw one of my major beefs was having to pay more to subsidize stores on the other side of the ocean which couldn't make a profit on their own. The stores are an anchor weighting an already troubled company down even further.

ehlijen
12-11-2015, 00:07
Reduction in operation size, not got a problem with that. As I said, I'd rather not subsidise stuff irrelevant to me like B&M stores.

But will the shareholders like it?


And engaging more with the community like other companies like Wyrd do, well thats a part of upping their game so to speak.
That's easier said then done when every time they open a communications channel it gets filled with bile (see the painting video feedback request thread).
I'm serious when I say GW will likely have an easier time recruiting new gamers through stores than they will trying to woo old fans back through community engagement. I didn't mean that in good way :(

ebbwar
12-11-2015, 09:04
But will the shareholders like it?

If they still get their dividends, they will not a give t*** either way.

SlyRebirth
12-11-2015, 11:11
I think stores are more of a marketing exercise than a sales one these days. I think they're valuable as a place for younger gamers to go where a club or FLGS might be more intimidating. There's still a wow factor going into a store and seeing all the boxes, the models, the table setup. That stuff does have an impact, so I can see it being a useful in bringing new interest into the hobby (or solidifying initial interest).

Plus, much easier to drag parents into a store when passing then try to get them to order something from a website they may not have heard of before. A store brings validation too.

BFalcon
12-11-2015, 13:14
In 30 years of gaming, GW stores have always been irrelevant to me and I live in the UK. I'd rather they go so that the prices do not include the 'store tax' to prop up the stores.

Fully agree - GW stores ought to be profit-making or gone - no more propping them up with online sales. GW would be far better off if they made all websales with a built-in RRP saving instead - it would put them on a far better footing with the FLGS without the need for harsh business terms.

A few core flagship shops would be fine - somewhere people can go and gather, but they should seriously consider shutting any store that can't manage 2 or more staff. One man stores is a recipe for disaster in the long-term (staff get sick, need days off, leave - there needs to be a little built-in capacity for staff changes and illness or the store just won't work. Multiple staff can also share workload and cater for more than a single customer in-store at once, as well as covering lunch and tea breaks.

Kalidane
12-11-2015, 13:43
Retain it in England. Where it always worked.

Not required elsewhere. In fact not even valid elsewhere if they then support indies in North America etc.

BFalcon
12-11-2015, 14:11
Retain it in England. Where it always worked.

Not required elsewhere. In fact not even valid elsewhere if they then support indies in North America etc.

Didn't even work here once the internet age came in...

I've never lived close to a GW store and used to travel for over an hour to get RPG and GW supplies from the "local" FLGS when I started.

Nowadays, GW stores are pretty much redundant - FLGS, clubs and one or two flagship stores would be sufficient. The rest are often surplus to requirements...

The only exceptions to that, I would say, is where no FLGS exist - in which case GW should split off the stores into their own division and allow them to stock OTHER games products to make the impact of a drop in sales of one product far less than they are now.

But I'd say that internet sales are now making bricks and mortar stores far less important here in the UK.

eron12
12-11-2015, 14:11
Retain it in England. Where it always worked.

Not required elsewhere. In fact not even valid elsewhere if they then support indies in North America etc.

But does it actually work in England or does it just appear to work because the stores are subsidized by online and Indy sales?

Kalidane
12-11-2015, 14:40
Didn't even work here once the internet age came in...

I've never lived close to a GW store and used to travel for over an hour to get RPG and GW supplies from the "local" FLGS when I started.

Nowadays, GW stores are pretty much redundant - FLGS, clubs and one or two flagship stores would be sufficient. The rest are often surplus to requirements...

The only exceptions to that, I would say, is where no FLGS exist - in which case GW should split off the stores into their own division and allow them to stock OTHER games products to make the impact of a drop in sales of one product far less than they are now.

But I'd say that internet sales are now making bricks and mortar stores far less important here in the UK.

Oops. Much like folk in Nottingham, I forgot about the advent of the internet...

BFalcon
12-11-2015, 15:06
Oops. Much like folk in Nottingham, I forgot about the advent of the internet...

Well, Nottingham is kinda different, being their headquarters, I think... I only know what it's like in the rural areas of the UK and they've never really been an impact here (I've been in only a couple in my life). Unless they live close to a city, they're not likely to actually make use of them and, even if they do, will they actually spend the money on those products. Plus the GW stores (from what I've heard and seen) are nowadays hidden away rather than the front-line stores they used to be with more than a single member of staff.

If they surrendered the Specialist Games because of low profits, perhaps they should consider surrendering the stores' incomes to the FLGS, stop supporting them and, instead, spend the money more advertising. In the 90's they had a Space Crusade advert that hit the main TV networks... they could be doing that now on the net and on TV... sell those console games, sell those board games... but, instead, they seem stuck in the pre-net days... it's really weird.

There'll be others on here, who live closer to cities, who will have different points of view - but then there's different points of view in all the countries, so...

I just know that all my stuff (with the exception of my original Space Hulk box and my 2nd edition Elf team for Blood Bowl) came from mail order or FLGS... (As did my first RPG dice set, now I think of it... I had to send off a cheque for those through the post).

BFalcon
12-11-2015, 15:08
(Double Post - lag's playing havoc today)

Kalidane
12-11-2015, 15:17
weird double post sorry

Senbei
12-11-2015, 20:22
But does it actually work in England or does it just appear to work because the stores are subsidized by online and Indy sales?

It did work, for most stores. Then they moved most to smaller shops with no gaming space and fired most staffers.... then it stopped working for most.

Wolf Lord Balrog
12-11-2015, 23:24
I think GW should close most of their brick-and-mortar stores, opening them only on a regional basis, and instead shift their attention and support to the FLGSs. GW's b&m stores routinely struggle to show any profit at all, and give a particularly poor customer experience in their current format. They should be willing to operate far fewer stores, but operate each one at a slight loss with an eye toward being a hobby recruitment center rather than a retail outlet. Let the FLGSs do the heavy-lifting of physical shop-fronts and gaming spaces (they already do here in the US). This is just one of a long list of improvements I could name that GW should make.

sigur
12-11-2015, 23:30
Are they still needed ? ...?

More than ever. They're really, really good for GW and good for wargaming in general.

Bloodknight
12-11-2015, 23:39
In the 90's they had a Space Crusade advert that hit the main TV networks.

That wasn't GW. That was Milton Bradley, GW only designed the game.

Zywus
13-11-2015, 01:03
Regardless of who was responsible for that TV advert, It's truly magnificently cheesy:p
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ERmUzs1O5E

I can't decide if I love the rubbery genesteelers, or the plastic space marine costumes the most. Live action 40k at it's very best.

Bloodknight
13-11-2015, 07:23
The HeroQuest ad was just like that. I think they still had the costumes from their little movies like Inquisitor or Hive Infestation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClfhBZR9-As
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VP7q47BDMBw

BFalcon
13-11-2015, 12:27
That wasn't GW. That was Milton Bradley, GW only designed the game.

I know - but it was their IPs and they should have learned from those games, that advertising and getting into people's homes via the TV (or, by extension, the internet) was the way to sell goods... not relying on a magazine that went direct-only (so eliminating any kids without a credit card since cheques are being phased out) or GW stores only (when their coverage is, as you'd expect, less than global), so freezing out a good many customers.

Zywus: Hey, it was low-budget and 90's... :)

ehlijen
13-11-2015, 21:08
If they still get their dividends, they will not a give t*** either way.

Which they wouldn't. Scaling back operations to what say Wyrd are doing would mean a lot less money moving around overall which'd mean a lot less in money available to pay out dividends with (nor would they be able to borrow as much for that purpose, as they've done in the past).

Being a smaller company actually means almost certainly being worth less. Investors don't really like that.

Allen
16-11-2015, 12:12
But I'd say that internet sales are now making bricks and mortar stores far less important here in the UK.

Brick and mortar stores shouldn't be viewed as commercial ventures by GW, they should be classified as customer branding tools. In many places it's difficult finding a decent amount of opponents for ANY kind of wargame (sometimes it's difficult finding opponents at all), and GW stores (or clubs, as GW should rembrand them) offer the possibility to find likely minded individuals that happen to collect and play the same wargames you have.

That does not mean the stores/clubs shouldn't sell anything, au contraire. Their KPIs and their main focus shouldn't be sales-based, but branding-based: create a developed sense of physical community, promote interest in the hobby, profide ad easily accesible place where you can find tables/scenery/opponents with ease.

Sotek
16-11-2015, 13:11
In 30 years of gaming, GW stores have always been irrelevant to me and I live in the UK. I'd rather they go so that the prices do not include the 'store tax' to prop up the stores.

That's my attitude too. Also considering you can't actually play games there what is the point of them?

Visker
16-11-2015, 13:50
Living in Nottingham is quite handy from the GW perspective as Warhammer World is just round the corner.
Which makes it a fantastic location for gaming with GW Games.
Non-GW Games, not so much unless you're a member of a club or group that has a location/venue.

However, at todays prices... why should I buy directly from GW, if Internet Store X or Little Gaming Shop Y sells it at 10% to 25% cheaper?

I think the GW stores days are numbered.
But how big that number is, I've no idea.

The_Real_Chris
16-11-2015, 13:58
I do't think GW see games as important, and by extension clubs and the like that could be alternative sales outlets. Problem with that too is the clubs tend to tell each other about the cheapest options and what else their is to buy...

Khaines Wrath
17-11-2015, 11:52
For me GW stores were always more useful as places to find a game than as a place to shop. The staff were always nice enough but the prices are just off putting compared to just about any other store online or otherwise that sells GW products.

Just having a place to wander in and know there's a good chance you could get a game, meet new people and face new armies was always convenient and exciting. Just a place to play in general is excellent if like me your lacking in space.

Allen
17-11-2015, 16:43
For me GW stores were always more useful as places to find a game than as a place to shop. The staff were always nice enough but the prices are just off putting compared to just about any other store online or otherwise that sells GW products.

Just having a place to wander in and know there's a good chance you could get a game, meet new people and face new armies was always convenient and exciting. Just a place to play in general is excellent if like me your lacking in space.

That's the reason why GW should focus on building GW "clubs", not GW "stores". They need physical areas where their customer meet, discuss of and play with their products. A lot of people underestimate the power of a mono-brand shop where you can find easily opponents for several kind of games, where campaigns are regularly scheduled and where you can find lots of good looking tables and scenery. It's a powerful recruitment tool...probably THE most powerful recruitment tool GW can develop.

The current shops should be moved to easily reachable locations, in buildings where there's plenty of space, with at least three or four staffers. An area dedicated to shopping should be a no-brainer, but the main focus of the stores shouldn't be selling: it should be brand engagement.