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View Full Version : The next trend



TheBearminator
10-12-2015, 02:55
There was a period where flyers were introduced to the game. Everybody wanted one and almost everyone got one. Some armies, like Dark Eldar, got more than one flyer kit. If the current trend is really big models, (knights and other giant walkers), what could be the next thing? We also see a trend of brand new factions getting into the game.

How do you think it will go from here and what do wish for?

Personally I hope to see other Knight sized models than just walkers. Like a plastic version of the giant IG troop transport, which name I've currently forgotten.

And I've been wondering if we'll ever see themed terrain. Anything but Imperial. There's been a few examples, limited runs and so on, but nothing really serious. I understand it would eat plenty of space on the shelves, so I'm not very hopeful.

Theocracity
10-12-2015, 03:17
Revamped core lines and clampack HQs seem to be a trend these days. I'm also wondering if we'll start seeing more full-on special characters - possibly bundled into larger kits to make up for the low number any one person would normally buy (see Logan Grimnar).

Okuto
10-12-2015, 03:27
Big impractical models and overpriced clampack plastic HQs me thinks.

Also suspect we'll see more redesigns special characters ala Logan *shudders* :rolleyes:

Oddly enough I kinda like the concept of the campaign books(Would never pay the price for one but I read a mate's) but I just wish they were written better(Mont'ka and Kauyon were outright silly at times esp when we get spoiled by forgeworld).

AngryAngel
10-12-2015, 05:34
The huge models does seem to be the current trend. Now don't get me wrong, some larger models I like, but not HUGE models. Not only do they end up being a large money pit, but they end up being either very OP or feasible but too large to want to transport around or store with the army. I don't know why GW doesn't understand the concept of moderation. Release pace is too slow, ok we will turn the dial speed up to 11 !! Game could use some new models, maybe some larger ones, lets make them gigantic and just silly in regular games !!

It is like they jump from one extreme to another and don't really ease into anything. Like maybe focus more on some innovative model/rule designs. Instead they go straight for the sledgehammer like straight forwardness that dulls a game down. It is like they don't understand the concept of a support unit, unless it outright kills, they are lost. Like a larger guard transport/mobile bunker to shoot from, would be an awesome unit. However, no, all they get is mortar tank and toy trucks. I'd love for a battle wagon like vehicle with high front av, moderate side and open topped to shoot from that can hold a larger squad.

Maybe even a vehicle that can buff nearby squads, doesn't really matter how, but has a minor weapon ( as come one, it should , it is war people ) but pays for itself with buffs for the army, maybe some feel no pain because its a medical front line vehicle, transport, ride thing, or helps relay orders for extra orders, or at least the same order given to nearby units if one is ordered with it. Hell, I'd love for some kind of sniper/spotter mechanic for forward units to help for artillery strikes. The game is dull with just, this unit shoots, has no synergy with other units, and all just kills, or moves and drops off people, then kills, or keeps troops from being killed.

Would love if some of those became a trend.

insectum7
10-12-2015, 07:05
Maybe even a vehicle that can buff nearby squads, doesn't really matter how, but has a minor weapon ( as come one, it should , it is war people ) but pays for itself with buffs for the army, maybe some feel no pain because its a medical front line vehicle, transport, ride thing, or helps relay orders for extra orders, or at least the same order given to nearby units if one is ordered with it.

Space Marine command vehicles do some of that, as does Capt. Sicarius. What about that DA Shroud-giving-Land Speedermicallit that grants Interceptor to it's squadron?



Hell, I'd love for some kind of sniper/spotter mechanic for forward units to help for artillery strikes.

A Space Marine Support Formation with spotting Land Speeders does this. Models with Teleport Homers/Homing Beacons essentially spot Deep Strikers.



The game is dull with just, this unit shoots, has no synergy with other units, and all just kills, or moves and drops off people, then kills, or keeps troops from being killed.


Psychic powers like Guide or Enfeeble. Wargear like Markerlights or Auspexes. Techmarines that buff cover and fix vehicles. I wind up using Searchlights all the time. Drop Pods don't kill much, but they sure work well with other units. Triarch Stalkers buffing nearby units. Monolith portal.

I get what you're saying, but it's not like these things don't exist. This is not to mention the not-uncommon attitude that if it isn't super killy, it's a waste of points.

TheBearminator
10-12-2015, 09:29
I lost my interest in space marines ten years ago. Sad thing. Seems like some of the chapters have access to the support stuff I've always wanted for my IG. They if any army could really use them and it would be so fitting. As they suck individually. I'm missing some dynamically in the battlefield. I wanna make use of mines and smoke screens. Why don't we have vehicles that can Kay down pie plates that stays in place during a turn, causing cover saves to units inside and behind them. And so on. Also I think the concept of snipers have always been severely misunderstood in 40k.

So, support units and vehicles. Overall I want more vehicles for my armies (orks have plenty of vehicles that don't have a model, DE have only three ground vehicles in total built from two different chassis).

Not that I think it'll happen. I think it's more likely that we'll see more big kits, as they're getting a lot of attention and can be priced accordingly. I'm sure chaos will get something. Maybe not a chaos Knight, as Forgeworld's has already done that. But a huge deamon engine would be cool. Something that ain't exclusive to one of the gods. DE could get Dais or a gigantic heamonculi creation. And so on.

ToLongDidntRead
10-12-2015, 14:07
I think after the Tidewall sold so well, we'll see fortifications as the next big fad.

Or ET 40k.

Denny
10-12-2015, 14:50
I think after the Tidewall sold so well, we'll see fortifications as the next big fad.

I'm not personally a fan of Fortifications, but I could see this being the case.
Its certainly a logical direction to go in.

Theocracity
10-12-2015, 15:16
I'm not personally a fan of Fortifications, but I could see this being the case.
Its certainly a logical direction to go in.

I wouldn't mind seeing some sort of Ork junkyard / mekshop fortification.

insectum7
10-12-2015, 17:12
I think after the Tidewall sold so well, we'll see fortifications as the next big fad.

Or ET 40k.

Did they not go that route already though? Skyshields and Defence Lines and Imperial Bunkers of various sorts? A lot of that stuff never really gained popularity where I am, with the possibility of the Ageis.

More non-Imperial terrain is always welcome, but I feel like releasing a bunch of terrain may have already had it's fad.

A.T.
10-12-2015, 17:17
More non-Imperial terrain is always welcome, but I feel like releasing a bunch of terrain may have already had it's fad.They could always introduce a 8 by 4 'standard' board size to push sales...

TheBearminator
10-12-2015, 17:19
Did they not go that route already though? Skyshields and Defence Lines and Imperial Bunkers of various sorts? A lot of that stuff never really gained popularity where I am, with the possibility of the Ageis.

More non-Imperial terrain is always welcome, but I feel like releasing a bunch of terrain may have already had it's fad.
What I find strange is that we haven't seen a lot of third party race specific terrain. I've seen quite a few examples of varying quality, but not a whole range, not enough to fill a table.

Edit: Coming up on Kickstarter: space elf pirate city - wargame terrain for your battlefield.

AngryAngel
10-12-2015, 20:17
Space Marine command vehicles do some of that, as does Capt. Sicarius. What about that DA Shroud-giving-Land Speedermicallit that grants Interceptor to it's squadron?



A Space Marine Support Formation with spotting Land Speeders does this. Models with Teleport Homers/Homing Beacons essentially spot Deep Strikers.



Psychic powers like Guide or Enfeeble. Wargear like Markerlights or Auspexes. Techmarines that buff cover and fix vehicles. I wind up using Searchlights all the time. Drop Pods don't kill much, but they sure work well with other units. Triarch Stalkers buffing nearby units. Monolith portal.

I get what you're saying, but it's not like these things don't exist. This is not to mention the not-uncommon attitude that if it isn't super killy, it's a waste of points.

The problem is, these things are relatively few and somewhat dull. Like the space marine command vehicle, is that even in the marine dex, any of them ? Not that I remember, yes forge world can do such but such should be in core books for the game as well. The speeder does do that, and I love it for that, Capt Sicarius is alright and does that as well and really if we're citing examples I can find more to say its in the game, but then again, it also is so rare as to missed or over looked by many.

Yeah they are doing a bit more with some formations, but one spotting formation for land speeders and a whirlwind doesn't great synergy make. This is a very small number of things in the game that synergize with one another.

They are there, in a small way, not really a trend, though I'd like them to be, citing a handful of examples from hundreds of units and thousands of pieces of war gear really just makes my point. The game should be full of such things, not such things being few and far between. Drop pods work with units inside in the same way as people work with their car, that isn't really a synergy I'm speaking of, for in that case every unit in the game synergizes with one another.

Fact remains it isn't a trend, but I'd like it to be which was the reason for my comment. Though I get we need to defend 40k, a bastion of innovative design.

insectum7
10-12-2015, 21:15
Though I get we need to defend 40k, a bastion of innovative design.

I feel a need to question what appears to be egregious and erroneous exaggeration.

What I'm going on is that in one paragraph you say synergy doesn't exist, and in the next sentence ask for a Battle Wagon for Guard. If that's synergy then I would expect my deployment of Grav Cannons firing out the rooftop of Rhinos to fit the bill. Which is very effective, btw. Also reasonably commonplace, since lots of factions feature transports that can be fired from, not to mention the new Tau wall-thing.


Drop pods work with units inside in the same way as people work with their car, that isn't really a synergy I'm speaking of, for in that case every unit in the game synergizes with one another.

Drop Pods are a delivery system, admittedly that's a pretty simple task. But they sure don't kill much themselves. They can have a homing beacon. I often have the Pod deliver a guy with an Auspex to help reduce cover saves for other people, and will spot the same unit with a Searchlight from a Scouted or Infiltrated Rhino (as granted by Sicarius) if it's night fight. It's potentially a six unit combo for a -2 to a cover save before any weapons are fired. Thankfully not all of those units have to be in on the action, they just have to be around.

Maybe some different examples of "synergy" would help this discussion. I like old Guard rules like off board artillery and such. I miss snipers forcing pinning tests or maybe having a similar but less binary mechanic. Are orders synergistic? Is proximity to officers still a thing? I don't know, I haven't seen Guard in my area for a little while. @Bearminator: I loved Blind grenades in 2nd Ed., the deployment of smoke screens is a cool idea.

Edit: Auto Launchers could affect infantry behind a certain radius from the tank. It's be a little tricky to implement, but it would feel nice to more effectively use vehicles as cover for infantry.

I feel like Guard Formations could really do a lot here, wait and see I suppose.

AngryAngel
12-12-2015, 03:37
I feel a need to question what appears to be egregious and erroneous exaggeration.

What I'm going on is that in one paragraph you say synergy doesn't exist, and in the next sentence ask for a Battle Wagon for Guard. If that's synergy then I would expect my deployment of Grav Cannons firing out the rooftop of Rhinos to fit the bill. Which is very effective, btw. Also reasonably commonplace, since lots of factions feature transports that can be fired from, not to mention the new Tau wall-thing.



Drop Pods are a delivery system, admittedly that's a pretty simple task. But they sure don't kill much themselves. They can have a homing beacon. I often have the Pod deliver a guy with an Auspex to help reduce cover saves for other people, and will spot the same unit with a Searchlight from a Scouted or Infiltrated Rhino (as granted by Sicarius) if it's night fight. It's potentially a six unit combo for a -2 to a cover save before any weapons are fired. Thankfully not all of those units have to be in on the action, they just have to be around.

Maybe some different examples of "synergy" would help this discussion. I like old Guard rules like off board artillery and such. I miss snipers forcing pinning tests or maybe having a similar but less binary mechanic. Are orders synergistic? Is proximity to officers still a thing? I don't know, I haven't seen Guard in my area for a little while. @Bearminator: I loved Blind grenades in 2nd Ed., the deployment of smoke screens is a cool idea.

Edit: Auto Launchers could affect infantry behind a certain radius from the tank. It's be a little tricky to implement, but it would feel nice to more effectively use vehicles as cover for infantry.

I feel like Guard Formations could really do a lot here, wait and see I suppose.


I think we're somewhat talking in the same vein yet at some cross purposes. Auspex is fine, but unless I'm mistaken so close range you pretty much need to be ramming a unit down their throat for the ability to work, thats a very meh synergy, I'd be hoping more for say, units with snipers being able to forego shooting to decrease a barrage scatter by say, inches as their BS if they can see that place being shot. Has some good help, or being able to say add pinning to a shooting attack, say they are adding their own fire and spotting to add in targeting for best effect. Perhaps even bringing back pinning at all in a way to weapons that used to have it and have some way to make pinning matter.

I wasn't really saying the battlewagon for guard was a true synergy, that was more a " I wish they had such a vehicle " thing. Yes they can shoot from a chimera, but two guns from a chimera is a far cry from 20 troops in a tough open topped transport.

Searchlights and night fight in general are rather pointless anymore, as night fight went from very limiting to mild annoyance max one round in most instances.

Smoke, as said forming screens would be a cool idea. Yes the guard still have orders and needing to be close to officers, so there is that. As it is they end up getting the most use from any kind of inter army synergy, but I want more my man. I use all those synergies already and most are pretty decent but some are a little limited, like in orders, some you never really use, leaving most choices as no brainers. I'd like it if being close to officers had some in game effect, better BS, higher LD, as their nearness and orders aid the unit, perhaps, they took the buff aura off lord commissars.

Some of the new guard formations look better for that, but some have little use in small to moderate sized games. As well I wish the synergies were model based and less formation based as sometimes they add in pointless things for the sake of forcing odd units in a list, like the shield platoons needing to have a sentinel squad for zero in game reason.

As I said, I just wish synergy would be the trend. I do however not think a synergy is, buy three rip tides field in a formation to then let them shoot twice in a turn with their main guns, that seems more cheese then synergy, or maybe synergizing cheese ?