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View Full Version : Holy S***, Marvel, what where you even thinking?!?



Andnore
13-05-2016, 20:12
Ok, just found this story...

Does anyone here read Venom: Space Knight by any chance? Because it's just been caught blatantly stealing from GW.

https://graphicpolicy.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/marvel-tau-1.jpg
https://graphicpolicy.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/marvel-tau-2.jpg
https://graphicpolicy.files.wordpress.com/2016/04/marvel-eldar.jpg

I mean... how do you screw up this bad?! You had one job to do!

Source: https://graphicpolicy.com/2016/04/28/is-that-tau-in-venom-space-knight-paging-gw-lawyers/

ashc
13-05-2016, 20:30
wow, that's... blatant.

shelfunit.
13-05-2016, 20:36
Maybe they're getting some payback for Malekith, Ruler of the dark elves...:shifty:

Denny
13-05-2016, 20:41
1) comics pretty much do this all the time. If you have a large shot of various alien races there will usually be references to Xenomorphs, predators or whatever in the background. I doubt it's more than that. Maybe the artist is a fan. It's worth noting these shots have been blown up but are basically background in the comic.

2) Disney has the most powerful lawyers evil money can buy. Good luck trying to sue them.

Senbei
13-05-2016, 20:58
2) Disney has the most powerful lawyers evil money can buy. Good luck trying to sue them.

It seems like a pretty simple case.... though such things often... aren't. If it does end up in court I suspect theyd settle quietly then remind the artist that he kinda relies on them to pay his mortgage.

Niall78
13-05-2016, 21:37
Looks a pretty blatant rip-off.

Best course of action would be to arm both the GW and Disney legal teams with swords and knives and let them go at each other.

With a bit of luck it will be a double KO.

The bearded one
13-05-2016, 22:59
I've seen this a number of times across the internet and every time I do I'm struck by the.. the smart missile systems which have been shrunk down so they can't hang snugly from the vehicle's sides.

Coasty
14-05-2016, 10:06
So there's a reference to the Tau in a couple of panels. It's not even a rip-off...those are actually Tau vehicles, in Tau livery with Tau insignia. That happens all the time in comics. God only knows how many times the Millennium Falcon has shown up in places where it has no legitimate business, for example.

Tokamak
14-05-2016, 18:41
I'd mainly feel cheated as a reader. It's not like they rendered their own version of a devilfish, they evidently copypasted it from somewhere.

MarcoSkoll
15-05-2016, 02:23
I'd be surprised if this wasn't intended as a homage or shout-out. I doubt any artist or editor would think they could actually steal this brazenly.

It's a little more audacious than most references (which is probably partly why it doesn't work that well*) but it's very common to see designs of vehicles slipping into the background of scenes. As Coasty has already said, there's a lot of times you can see the Millennium Falcon, Starship Enterprise, a Firefly-class transport, a Cylon Basestar, a somewhat modified DeLorean DMC-12 or the like in the back of a scene from a completely different film/show.

* I tend to find people like references for two reasons: Either it serves as validation of something they like, or they get to feel all clever for spotting the reference. (Seeing as we're already talking Marvel, think Captain America in the first Avengers film: "I do! I understood that reference"). But when it's too in-your-face, it rather defeats the feeling clever part.

Voss
15-05-2016, 07:26
Yep. This is an artist's background homage*, and little more. One random X-men issue in the 90s crammed just about every sci-fi alien they could thing of that had a movie or TV show into a single issue.

Someone is trying very hard to curry favor with GW for some reason- and I mean the folks from that website. This is really a non-issue.


*even if the art style makes me cringe

Herzlos
15-05-2016, 08:21
Didn't GW rip Tau off wholesale from elsewhere anyway, just with a new name?

Memnos
15-05-2016, 17:58
I hope they settle this like they did with Blood Bowl.

Let the offending institution off as long as they run with their IP. Disney: Warhammer 40K movies/series would be a 'Shut up and take my money!' moment.

StygianBeach
15-05-2016, 18:13
Didn't GW rip Tau off wholesale from elsewhere anyway, just with a new name?

As far as I know it was inspired by the droid army in Star Wars Episode 1. I would not call it a rip off by a long measure though.

El_Commi
16-05-2016, 09:42
As far as I know it was inspired by the droid army in Star Wars Episode 1. I would not call it a rip off by a long measure though.

I'm thought Tau were released before The Phantom Menance.. I could be wrong though, my knowledge of Star Wars is poor..

*edit*
That was 1999? Jesus.. I didn't think it was so long ago!

mdauben
16-05-2016, 13:46
As far as I know it was inspired by the droid army in Star Wars Episode 1. I would not call it a rip off by a long measure though.
The Tau predate The Phantom Menace by years. At the time of the initial Tau release they were widely regarded as being inspired by Gundam and similar anime.

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MarcoSkoll
16-05-2016, 14:16
The Tau predate The Phantom Menace by years.
The release dates for these things are quite easy to look up:

- The Phantom Menace was released May 19, 1999 (with the first trailers coming out on November 13 1998).
- The release WD for Tau was UK262, dated October 2001.

While the Tau were in development for a considerable time before they were released, their release and much of their design was after The Phantom Menace. Not that I am by any means presenting that as proof that the droid army had any influence at all on the Tau, just noting that the dates are certainly not proof that they weren't.

StygianBeach
16-05-2016, 14:29
The Tau predate The Phantom Menace by years. At the time of the initial Tau release they were widely regarded as being inspired by Gundam and similar anime.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

I remember reading something in a White Dwarf that the design team wanted the Tau to have an Anime/Japanese theme, I cannot remember when that was though, I thought it was early 2000's.

Are you sure the Tau were first released around 1997 or earlier? I do not remember seeing the Tau in the 1990's.

edit... gah.. Ninjah'd.

mdauben
16-05-2016, 14:30
The release dates for these things are quite easy to look up:

- The Phantom Menace was released May 19, 1999 (with the first trailers coming out on November 13 1998).
- The release WD for Tau was UK262, dated October 2001.

While the Tau were in development for a considerable time before they were released, their release and much of their design was after The Phantom Menace. Not that I am by any means presenting that as proof that the droid army had any influence at all on the Tau, just noting that the dates are certainly not proof that they weren't.

Wow, my memory really messed up there. I would have sworn the first Tau codex came out way before Phantom Menace. [emoji15]

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El_Commi
16-05-2016, 18:34
Wow, my memory really messed up there. I would have sworn the first Tau codex came out way before Phantom Menace. [emoji15]

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Me too.
I remember buying Tau on release. They were my first ever 40k army. I honestly thought Phantom Menance was years later. Still cant believe it was 1999!

Sthenio
17-05-2016, 12:05
That's very very similar to the in-game Devilfish model from Dawn of War: Dark Crusade.

There's paying homage to another intellectual property, then there's straight up borrowing video game assets.

Andnore
17-05-2016, 12:10
That's very very similar to the in-game Devilfish model from Dawn of War: Dark Crusade.

There's paying homage to another intellectual property, then there's straight up borrowing video game assets.

I've seen that argument elsewhere too; it's like they took the assets from Dark Crusade, rescaled them, and put them into the comic.

Denny
17-05-2016, 12:25
An image in a comic being blatantly ripped from another source? I'm sure that never happens. (http://jimsmashextended.blogspot.co.uk/2008/07/greg-land-tracing-swiping-recycling.html)

Nkari
20-05-2016, 08:33
I seriously can not belive ppl are such bad artists that they do a 100% exact copy of someones elses work and pass it off as your own, ESPECIALLY in a huge comic (well atleast their publisher is huge, doubt venom space knight is hugley popular, popular enough to exist tho) but seriously.. have some pride in your work man, ripping off like this just shows your a talentless hack.. =(

Snake Tortoise
20-05-2016, 09:03
Yea, Tau definitely came after The Phantom Menace. I got into the hobby in 1999 and at the time there was definitely no Tau. Even Necrons were just a White Dwarf 'army' with a handful of metal models. I remember thinking of battle droids when I first saw Tau- it was the colour and the vehicles that did it

Finnigan2004
26-05-2016, 01:33
I saw the letter from Marvel's lawyers to GW. It was short and to the point. It read, "Consider this payback for Malekith. If you are really upset, come at us bro. We're not some puny independent author that called something a 'space marine'. We'll crush you like a bug. Sincerely, Marvel Comics."

Khaines Wrath
26-05-2016, 03:34
I saw the letter from Marvel's lawyers to GW. It was short and to the point. It read, "Consider this payback for Malekith. If you are really upset, come at us bro. We're not some puny independent author that called something a 'space marine'. We'll crush you like a bug. Sincerely, Marvel Comics."

That's brilliant, they aren't wrong.

Actually given what I've learnt recently about just how much GW have ripped off wholesale from others, particularly from the author Michael Moorcock my sympathy for them in this case is a big fat zero.

Inquisitor Engel
26-05-2016, 04:53
3rd Edition was September (October?) 1998. Dark Eldar were the "new" army at the time. Tau were way, way later.

UndeadKing
26-05-2016, 08:23
Lmao like people actually think gw would have a chance going against marvel hahahaha. GW would be shut down so quick you'd not know they existed. Nerve anyway, nothing about gw is original

jtrowell
26-05-2016, 09:01
To be fair, having Marvel bully GW copyright wise because they are a bigger fish in the pond with better lawyers, while a nice display of karma, still enforce the very system making bigger companies able to bully smaller ones rather that having the law protect everyone egally.

blackcherry
26-05-2016, 13:58
They're also thieves and scoundrels of the highest order when it comes to ripping people off or nicking ideas. Just look at the history of comics and what they've done to avoid paying creators of characters anything in royalties. Then focus on the history of Disney who now own Marvel. It's almost required reading.

GW aren't great, but they pale in comparison to the masters. Marvel just has more cred with people because of the films is all.

The bearded one
30-05-2016, 06:52
To be fair, having Marvel bully GW copyright wise because they are a bigger fish in the pond with better lawyers, while a nice display of karma, still enforce the very system making bigger companies able to bully smaller ones rather that having the law protect everyone egally.

My thoughts exactly. All that this tells us is the absurd nature of the legal system that justice is only determined by how much money you have - even in a blatantly open-and-shut case.

Coasty
02-06-2016, 12:29
My thoughts exactly. All that this tells us is the absurd nature of the legal system that justice is only determined by how much money you have - even in a blatantly open-and-shut case.

I'm pretty sure GW would be completely unable to prove that this was anything other than a nod toward 40K by a fan. The artwork in question has no bearing on the story and is not so significant that it could be claimed Marvel are making money because of it. There's really no case to answer, any more than Ben Aaronovitch could be sued by Jim Butcher for having his character drink a bottle of suspiciously familiar craft ale imported from Chicago in 'Whispers Underground'.

ebbwar
02-06-2016, 19:44
I'm pretty sure GW would be completely unable to prove that this was anything other than a nod toward 40K by a fan. The artwork in question has no bearing on the story and is not so significant that it could be claimed Marvel are making money because of it. There's really no case to answer, any more than Ben Aaronovitch could be sued by Jim Butcher for having his character drink a bottle of suspiciously familiar craft ale imported from Chicago in 'Whispers Underground'.

So, basically what you are saying is this is a non-story.

theredknight
08-06-2016, 03:44
An image in a comic being blatantly ripped from another source? I'm sure that never happens. (http://jimsmashextended.blogspot.co.uk/2008/07/greg-land-tracing-swiping-recycling.html)
very interesting read. thanks for sharing the link

de Selby
08-06-2016, 04:28
"Say what you want about Rob Liefeld, at least that guy screws his own original feet."

Words to live by :D

Denny
09-06-2016, 11:52
very interesting read. thanks for sharing the link

No worries. My biggest peeve is his insistence on using porn stars for so many of his female characters.
It leads to scenes in which a bunch of characters are running away from zombies and are supposed to be screaming . . . but are clearly on the cusp of orgasmic ecstasy.
(Or at least faking it:shifty:)


"Say what you want about Rob Liefeld, at least that guy screws his own original feet."

Words to live by :D

It would be, except . . . (http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-f4J1Ap55F7o/T2Fv-6eMMrI/AAAAAAAADMc/iTbO3fjDol4/s1600/LOLiefeld.jpg)

The Black Shield
09-06-2016, 22:47
Let us list the things GW has ripped off: Tyranids/Aliens, Valkyrie/dropship from Aliens, Space Marines/Starship Troopers. I'm sure we could go on and on with the list.

Andnore
10-06-2016, 09:56
Let us list the things GW has ripped off: Tyranids/Aliens, Valkyrie/dropship from Aliens, Space Marines/Starship Troopers. I'm sure we could go on and on with the list.

Just so we'e clear, you're talking about the book, right?

And while I agree that GWs have ripped off ideas from who knows how many places, this looks more like the artist just did an asset flip using the Dawn of War Sky Ray.

StygianBeach
10-06-2016, 21:26
Let us list the things GW has ripped off: Tyranids/Aliens, Valkyrie/dropship from Aliens, Space Marines/Starship Troopers. I'm sure we could go on and on with the list.

Aliens has inspired all Sci-Fi since it was released. Aliens was a Vietnam movie in space, but I would not say it ripped off Vietnam movies and the dropship was based on the Apache Helicopter.

GW have been inspired by many sources, but to say 'ripped off' is going a bit far.

Bookwrak
16-06-2016, 08:44
Let us list the things GW has ripped off: Tyranids/Aliens, Valkyrie/dropship from Aliens, Space Marines/Starship Troopers. I'm sure we could go on and on with the list.

Considering your list currently has 0 relevant examples, I'm sure it'd be amusig if you did.