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FalseAngel
01-08-2006, 01:28
I was just wondering (in light of the extremely delayed yet announced codex) what exactly the Inquisitors of the Ordo Xenos do to fight the many xenos out there. The other Ordos have it pretty cut and dry, daemons and psykers/mutants, and have fairly straight forward ways of dealing with such things.

Ordo Malleus has strong psykers and weapons geared to deal with daemons, but hit generally hard enough to deal with other threats. Ordo Hereticus has heavy anti psyker troops that really limit enemy psykers of any kind, have scary things that used to be heretics, and heavy use of flamers and meltas to destroy mutation and hordes of corrupt guard.

My question is, what exactly does the Ordo Xenos do to counter the extremely broad subject of "the alien threat" that ranges from Eldar to Tyranids? Would an extremist actually use the weapons and armor of enemy xenos back at them? Would this truly be very effective over some kind of special bolter ammunition? And how would these tactics be any more effective to the likes of Orks, Tau, or Eldar who are mostly humanoid?

Thank you in advance :)

Khaine's Messenger
01-08-2006, 02:41
My question is, what exactly does the Ordo Xenos do to counter the extremely broad subject of "the alien threat" that ranges from Eldar to Tyranids?

The Ordo Xenos typically concentrates on cataloging and systematically annihilating various threats as they occur; of all the Ordos, they're the most conventional and perhaps most understandable, as they deal mostly with what others might call "foreign intelligence" regarding other major powers' movements.


Would an extremist actually use the weapons and armor of enemy xenos back at them?

It would seem they all do, as the Deathwatch IA article suggests the Inquisition finds this very ironic (mind you, iirc this was before the notion of radicals vs. puritans as outlined by the Inquisitor "RPG").


And how would these tactics be any more effective to the likes of Orks, Tau, or Eldar who are mostly humanoid?

Most of the Inquisitors involved in combatting Orks/Tau/Eldar are more concerned with the metaplot (research into the overall aims of the Necrons, Eldar, etc., the physiological oddities of the Orks...stuff that shows up as background material in codices) or disturbances at the level at which those aliens come into contact with humanity...like traitors, xeno-worshipping cults (like the Khaine cult in Malleus), diplomacy, etc.

I'm not all that hot on the idea of the "Alienhunters" codex, as it may force some wierd artificial distinctions and odd twists, but I hope I'm pleasantly surprised.

Lord Zarkov
01-08-2006, 02:43
OX have been known to use special bolter and heavy bolter ammunition
I would imagine them making good use of flamers as they are simply effective against most Xenos
And yes, radicals certainly use Xenos weapons against them; but this is possibly more frouned upon than daamonhosts

Yarick Zan
01-08-2006, 02:50
well it makes sense if the only thing to beat a xenos is somthing the xenos use themselves. and if they just happen to make that has a bigger punch and a stronger armor id use it. think about it. if you could issue the eqivlanet of a tau pulse rifle to the standard guardsmen it would make the imperium just that much more effective. once again if its for the good of the Imperium then i guess the ends justify the means. like daemonhosts.

nurgleman
01-08-2006, 02:58
Ordos Xenos seems to focus more on destablilizing alien goverments than actually killing them. Occasionally, they will wipe out an xenos cult, but I don't think they actually fight Xenos very often. Oh and radicals will use Xenos technology against Xeonos.

Sgt Biffo
01-08-2006, 03:47
Genestaeler Cults are an example of classic Inquistorial duties.

Decapitation attacks on heirachy of Xenos would be another duty. Scourging Ork spores an fungus on a planet. Psyker Inquisitors could try to counter agianst Eldar scrying...

sulla
01-08-2006, 06:55
Don't just think in game terms... there are plenty of hidden xeno threats within the imperium to worry about before the OX even start to think about alien empires (which they do too, of course).

'Stealer cults, enslavers, lachrymoles, warp vampires, xenotech smugglers and spies...

Promethius
01-08-2006, 10:47
I think its more a case of aggressive information gathering combined with assessing threats and analysing behaviour patterns. The OX want to know how aliens think so that they can fight them more effectively. Understanding an opponents tactics makes them easier to outwit on the battlefield, and capturing live aliens provides opportunities not just for interrogation but also dissection. Why fight an alien face to face when you can wipe them out with chemical or biological weapons?

There are plenty of alien races who the Imperium wants to leave alone for the time being, and the Ordo Xenos also monitor them and make sure that nothing changes - like the watch on the gates of Varl, or the guys who try to predict Waaaghs! in different Ork empires and direct Space Marines to destabilise them before they gain momentum.

I think the OX are the most interesting of the three inquisitorial factions, and am slightly miffed that they were the only one to be missed out!

FalseAngel
01-08-2006, 13:45
Sorry if it sounded like I was asking in game terms, I really didn't mean to. I was mostly going off the fluff I already knew, and alot of the comparison between the three made in the Witch Hunters designers' notes.

But one thing strikes me as odd though. From the way GW was putting it, it seemed that Ordo Hereticus dealt with internal problems like cults and such, while the other two were knights in shining armor who came to rescue Imperial citizens from outside threats. It even said that one would be happy to see the OM or OX but would be terrified to see the OH because they might very well find fault in what you were doing and make you repent one way or another. :angel:

I mean, wouldn't a person worshiping xenos be heretic? Thusly more under the jurisdiction of OH? Or is this where the grey area starts to show?

Although, from what everyone seems to be in agreement on with the gathering intelligence and cutting off the head, they sound bloody interesting.

Romanus
01-08-2006, 14:25
heya, the OX is mostly concerned with the routing out of xenos threats to the imperium and the studying and understanding (heretical) of the xenos. A good read for this subject would be the Xenology book by Simon Spurrier and Inquisitor (Xenos, Malleus and Heriticus) by Dan abnett. Also might try giving Warrior Brood by C.S. Goto, but don't like his writing much.

Overall though from the way i see it, is that an Inquisitor is not stuck in any particular Ordos but is able to choose or specialise either way. From the fluff that i've read, many Inquisitors seem to cross the line from Malleus to Hereiticus and it is really only the military arms of the inquisition that determine what threat is being faced by a particular Inquisitor (Malleus-Grey Knights, Hereticus-Sisters, Xenos-Dwath Watch). I'd mainly go with the idea that there more like a forign intelligance (CIA, MI6, ASIO) service in which there primary aim being the acquistion and exploitaion of xenos tech and the combating of espionage within. Lol, without the "official" codex though where mostly grabbing at straws.

Cheers, Romanus

schoon
01-08-2006, 16:52
In short: the Ordo Xenos deals with aliens.

They learn about them, kill them, subvert them, etc. As with all the Inquisitorial Ordos, there are a multitude of factions/ideologies within the Ordo.

Thus, there are puritan Inquisitors that believe that anything "xeno" must be purged, and also radical Inquisitors that believe in using "things xeno" (from technology to actual mercenaries) against them.

Khaine's Messenger
01-08-2006, 19:28
I mean, wouldn't a person worshiping xenos be heretic? Thusly more under the jurisdiction of OH? Or is this where the grey area starts to show?

The Inquisition has little in the way of specific "jurisdiction," really. All Inquisitors have a duty to deal with all the threats other Inquisitors face...it's just that some choose to specialize in an area of expertise, and the major specializations are in the Enemy Within, Without, and Beyond, and each of the Ordos maintains specialized training and knowledge dealing with them...Inquisitors may defer to one another based on the knowledge and experience the other possesses, but there's not hard and fast jurisdictional guideline. Indeed, the fact that these threats co-mingle (chaos-worshipping, daemon-summoning Xenos are actually not that unheard of) is all the more reason for the Inquisition to have broad, unlimited jurisdictional authority.

*EDIT--Example: Commander Farsight. Each of the Ordos actually have formulated opinions (http://uk.games-workshop.com/tau/oshovah/1/) about him, despite the relative insignificance of his existance and the notion that he would fall exclusively under the sway of the Ordo Xenos. Further, note also the strange effects of the Ethereals...with which the Ordo Hereticus are very, very concerned could jump to other races.

Xisor
01-08-2006, 20:32
Things the Ordo Xenos deal with:

- Tracking down the source of the 'man' selling (extremely dangerous) alien artefacts in the underhive. Weapons that come in looking like an exotic minor-alien-race hover-bike, but end up shedding their hull and turning out to be, in fact, the Tau Sniper Drone that just killed the Planetary Govenor, three Adeptus Administratum Envoys, the chief Fabricator of the Cult Mechanicus, and several high ranking guild-family officials before being spotted...
- Routing out Genestealer Cults, and similar parasitic aliens
- Hijacking Rogue Traders to help them conduct illicit research that'll allow them to find a weakness in this new 'Alien of the Week' empire that cropped up in the heart of Segmentum Obscurus...
- The Confounding Troubles of Infinite Rice Pudding
- The insidious influence of Tau Water Caste envoys in 'closer to home' worlds, not just some backwater sand planet with no cares in the galaxy.
- Looking into what's causing many things: The Arrival of the Tyranids, the awakening of the Necrons, the vanishing of the Eldar, the ruins amidst Terra itself that seem a bit unnatural, the steady appearance of Demiurg trade vessels initially on th Eastern Fringe, but now in every Segmentum of the Imperium...

There's alot to do. It's the others that don't have it cut and dry.

As said before, the Ordo Xenos is allowed to be the most conventional. Then again, it's not always as straightforward as it seems: what happens when you have Cults to the (Necron) Machine God springing up on cathedral-worlds manifesting psychic powers willy nilly and defaming the Emperor?

Xisor

FalseAngel
02-08-2006, 02:14
As said before, the Ordo Xenos is allowed to be the most conventional. Then again, it's not always as straightforward as it seems: what happens when you have Cults to the (Necron) Machine God springing up on cathedral-worlds manifesting psychic powers willy nilly and defaming the Emperor?
Honestly? I'd start with crying myself to sleep... :cries:

FalseAngel
02-08-2006, 02:24
The Inquisition has little in the way of specific "jurisdiction," really. All Inquisitors have a duty to deal with all the threats other Inquisitors face...it's just that some choose to specialize in an area of expertise, and the major specializations are in the Enemy Within, Without, and Beyond, and each of the Ordos maintains specialized training and knowledge dealing with them...Inquisitors may defer to one another based on the knowledge and experience the other possesses, but there's not hard and fast jurisdictional guideline. Indeed, the fact that these threats co-mingle (chaos-worshipping, daemon-summoning Xenos are actually not that unheard of) is all the more reason for the Inquisition to have broad, unlimited jurisdictional authority.

*EDIT--Example: Commander Farsight. Each of the Ordos actually have formulated opinions (http://uk.games-workshop.com/tau/oshovah/1/) about him, despite the relative insignificance of his existance and the notion that he would fall exclusively under the sway of the Ordo Xenos. Further, note also the strange effects of the Ethereals...with which the Ordo Hereticus are very, very concerned could jump to other races.
Ah. Nice find, thank you, and thank you for all of your replies everyone.

Another question, the Ordo Militants of the other two Ordos have very unique soldiers with huge backgrounds all there own; but with the Death Watch I'm a little hazy. They are all troops picked out of the thousand+ chapters of space marines, but do they really have anything any more special about them than the Tyrannic War Vets? Seem to mostly be marines with preferred enemy and special issue rounds. But look at the tremendously powerful Grey Knights, or the holy powers of the Sisters. So, what truly sets the Death Watch apart fluffwise? Why exactly are they chosen from the other chapters rather than being a specialized gene seed all their own?

Lord Zarkov
02-08-2006, 08:15
They are chosen from amoung the best of other chapters and trained to the highest standards as well as being equipped with the best equipment
As well as being trained to use bolters in their pistor grip they are also trained and equipped to enter the battlefield by a number of different methods such as mole machines, grav chutes, drop pods, teleporters, etc

Inq. Veltane
02-08-2006, 09:30
Yeah, at 40k scale the differences in quality between a Death Watch member and a 'normal' Marine don't really show - but at Inquisitor Scale you could see that they were considerably stronger and better. They are kind of like Special Forces - recruited from the best of the rest of the Astrates and then given better training and equipment. As cool as the Grey Knights? Sadly not. As distinctive as the Sisters? No again. But solid and sufficient that a single killteam of them could eradicate an entire Genesteeler Cult? Yes. They don't look that special because we are used to seeing Marines everywhere but, honestly, they are special.

Yarick Zan
02-08-2006, 09:32
well i dont know about the rest of you but whichever inquisitor showed up on my door step i would be sure to mess right in my pants right then and there. any inquisitor is scary. Maellus- daemons, big nasty gribbly daemons that are completely and utterly evil. Herecticus- plain and simple heretics, it means we have issues on my planet and it might turn sour some time. Xenos- aliens. lots of them. and all kinds. scary stuff if you dont know what they can do. might even be nids knocking on your planets door.

and id think the reason would be obvious why they dont have their own chapters for death watch. would you rather have to go through the buisness of training, equiping, housing, etc. etc. a whole chapter of marines which will probably never be at full strength? or would you rather take the cream of the crop, the ones that survive, the ones that can actually survive and keep going and just get better? the ones you dont need to train, the ones who have already proved themselves loyal and devoted to any cause of the emperor under any situation.

oh and the bit about them being as cool as grey knights? i have to ask what could be cooler than an entire chapter of marines that are all psykers and serve the emperor even more zealously than any other chapter of marines. honestly bunches of psykers with guns and armor seem very much cooler than commandos.

oh and khaine i think there is some kind of mandate for the imperium in which inquisitor authority superscedes all else, including the adeptus mechanicus authority, but not that of the emperor. basicly they are the ultimate power in the imperium. their very word is law and they are also judge, jury and executioner.

i wonder if the imperium has ever considerd this: bullpup configurated bolters. would be a more stable firing platform, and it might evel allow for the marines to fire them one handed. that is if you place the trigger and such pretty far forward, and im talking like right under the barrels end almost. might be an interisting concept for somthing later on.

Minister
03-08-2006, 00:10
The point being made on Inquisitors turning up is that, as a rule, if an Inquisitor of the Maleus or Xenos makes his presence known to the public it will be becaus the excriment has already impacted the rotary air impeller, and he represents a half decent chance of your not being ripped to shreds. Of course, you may well not survive the aftermath, but the average citizen will not know anything about that...

By contrast, a Hereticus Inquisitor will most likley make himself known by begining a massive increase in witch hunts and purges. Given the zeal with which these are carred out (not only by the Inquisition but also by others trying to put on a good showing) false aggusations are inevitable, and that's without factoring in malicious intent.


The Deathwatch are unusual in that they are not designed for normal batttlefield use. If an Inquisitor wants Marines to kill off a Tyranid splinter fleet or Ork warbant he sends a message to the nearest chapter and they jump to it, it's what they're trained for after all. Deathwatch are instead trained for missions which might require a bit of subtlty and patience, acting in special operations and providing support which will not ask questions if all else goes pair shaped.