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inq.serge
08-08-2006, 11:19
may i put an tzeentch aspirant with banner, golden eye of tzeentch and mirror o' knowlage ona a mammoth, and if i doo, does the mammoth gain 3+ ward against ranged attacks?

may i also put aeklod hellbrass on top of the mammoth, and does the mammoth gain regeneration then?

and if i have both (if possible), do the mammoth gain 3+ ward save against shooting AND regeneration (to its 12 wounds)?:cheese:

Voltaire
08-08-2006, 12:30
I haven't seen the rules for Mammoths, but I know the Golden Eye of Tzeentch would give it a 3+ ward save against magic missiles. Putting the special character on it is not an option unless the characters rules allow it, which Aeklod Helbrass does not.

TheWarSmith
08-08-2006, 14:19
Aekeld is not a "chaos lord" for his selection choice, so no you cannot.

To the golden eye of tzeentch, yes you can, as he would count as a mount I believe. Ironically enough the marauders in the howdah WITH him would NOT get the ward save though.

Jedi152
08-08-2006, 14:21
The main question here is: Do abilities conferred upon a character by magic items in his possession affect his monstrous mount too?

The answer: I don't know.

inq.serge
08-08-2006, 14:23
but the selection choice say "chaos lord or chaos exalted champ." and the mammoth is not an uppgrade for a char, but a unit which can be joined by a char.

Alathir
08-08-2006, 14:30
The main question here is: Do abilities conferred upon a character by magic items in his possession affect his monstrous mount too?

The answer: I don't know.

If they do it will (in most cases) say so in the item's description. The Wood Elf Stone of Crystal Mere is a good example.

UltimateNagash
08-08-2006, 14:36
Do you mean the rules here: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/mammoth.pdf?
If so, I say you get the 3+ Ward save for the mammoth and the characters, and no, you can't put Aekold on it.

Kriegsherr
08-08-2006, 14:37
but the selection choice say "chaos lord or chaos exalted champ." and the mammoth is not an uppgrade for a char, but a unit which can be joined by a char.

I think you already answered your own question: The magic item only gives a ward save for monstrous mounts, what the mammot clearly is not in my eyes.
I would count it as a chariot, does the 3+ ward save also applies to chariots?

Aekbold hellbrass and all other special chars can only be used as they are presented in the book. They might join units if its allowed, but as said, I see the howdah as an enormous chariot, something special chars have no access to unless they are already equipped with one.

TheWarSmith
08-08-2006, 15:12
They most certainly do, hence the ever popular Tzeentch lord on dragon with golden eye combo, giving the dragon a 3+ save, 3+ ward.

The real question will be: Does the Mammoth count as a "mount"

In these rules, it states that missile fire is determined by the SHOOTER whether it selects the mount or howdah, so I would argue this is not a conventional mount and that since the mammoth is almost like a separate entity, that the ward save is not transferred to the mammoth.

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/mammoth.pdf

Milgram
08-08-2006, 15:12
the mammoth is neither a mount nor a chariot. the marauders and the characters on top may be targeted with missile weapons (only the marauders of course, as long as they are at least 5 models strong), but count as in hard cover. also they can dismount if they wish to do so. these two rules are completely different to a chariot or a monstrous (or normal) mount. so therefore: no 3+ ward save.

as for the spec chars: no, even through this is probably only due to a missing rule. if there was a spec char defined as chaos wizzard or a aspiring champion with standard, it would be allowed, but the lord and exalted choices are bound to the chaos book and the lord/exalted in there. you could btw. take a mounted chaoslord on the mammoth as there is no rule against it oO. depending on the understanding of the rules even a dragon or a chariot, but I think this would go a bit to far.

now you know why some units seem to have 'too much' rules, when they are from GW. it is to avoid such stupid ideas like the dragonmountedtzeentchlordwithgoldeneyeonmammoth. :)

/edit: no offense, the dragon mounted was my idea. :)

TheWarSmith
08-08-2006, 15:20
sooooo, the dragon on top of the mammoth would have a ward save. Would this super tall monstrosity of a rule set allow you to see over large monsters and fly off the mammoth?

Milgram
08-08-2006, 15:42
no, you would still have to dismount from the mammoth.

Latro
08-08-2006, 15:57
sooooo, the dragon on top of the mammoth would have a ward save. Would this super tall monstrosity of a rule set allow you to see over large monsters and fly off the mammoth?

Thanks ... you just gave me the mental image of a Dragon mounting a Mammoth ... :eek:


:eyebrows:

TheWarSmith
08-08-2006, 16:03
And now, be prepared for the unveiling of the newest creation in super monster cross breeds:

The DRAGON MAMMOTH

Milgram
08-08-2006, 17:02
uhm... well... set this up as a character and give him a chariot!

UltimateNagash
08-08-2006, 20:04
Can you have a Dragon or Chariot character on a Mammoth?

TheWarSmith
08-08-2006, 21:24
Read earlier posts. Since it simply says "A chaos lord or exalted champion can ride the throne", it never specifically says he can't have already been mounted.

I'd argue he can't ride a chariot and the mammoth though, as both are things he's put into, where dragons and the like are his own personal upgrade.

Nobody would ever really try this, but it'd be HILARIOUS to see.

Milgram
09-08-2006, 06:45
probably the rule doesn't say anything about this because it is to obvious that the answer is no? :)

samw
09-08-2006, 08:52
probably the rule doesn't say anything about this because it is to obvious that the answer is no? :)

This makes the fatal flaw of applying logic to the actions of GW. :p

Milgram
09-08-2006, 12:14
this are not gw-rules but fw :p

sigur
09-08-2006, 18:49
That's a pretty important point. It's FW's experimental rules. So for once, your opponent has to approve you to use these rules AND these rules definitly aren't made with people who like to cheese out things in mind. So just use the mammoth as it's written there in the pdf. There are way too many possible loopholes and questionable wording in the rules for this creature so it's hard to impossible to give you a definite answer to your questions.

TheWarSmith
10-08-2006, 14:13
I wouldn't have problems w/ somebody bringing a mammoth to the table. It'd give me a HELL of a hard time, but it'd be really interesting. Obviously I wouldn't wanna see the damn thing every game I played with him, but it'd make a really good campaign piece, similar to a special character.