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tenpole
02-09-2006, 09:49
From the thread in this forum BFSP: $45?! Why not? (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=47830) We have been shown that Britian again gets a raw deal by one of its own companies. Battle for skull pass is released for $45 in the states, thats equivalent to 21-22 , yet in the UK we pay 40. I wonder how many other items are significantly lower.

Damien 1427
02-09-2006, 09:53
That'd be the exchange rate at the moment. Also, that's not factoring in VAT.

But Blighty gets screwed over on everything. We make up for it in GW's case by having more stores, and earlier releases.

But then again, if you're paying full retail for the boxed set, your Google-Fu is weak.

tenpole
02-09-2006, 10:11
That'd be the exchange rate at the moment. Also, that's not factoring in VAT.

But Blighty gets screwed over on everything. We make up for it in GW's case by having more stores, and earlier releases.

But then again, if you're paying full retail for the boxed set, your Google-Fu is weak.

Oh yes you are correct. Maelstrom games are selling for 36 delivered.

Darkseer
02-09-2006, 10:23
I haven't bought anything direct from GW in well over a year.

Chuffy
02-09-2006, 10:36
Even if you're not buying direct from Gee-dub, 40 is still a pretty sweet deal.

Still, I've bought it for 32. nyah nyah

philbrad2
02-09-2006, 10:41
Its an old story and not just restricted to GW, there are somethings we pay more for, some we pay less on. Exchange rates are a factor. As DARKSEER says any one buying directly from GW is to my mind playing into their hands, shop around.

I only buy MO bit (even though BWBITS.COM is getting some trade off me) from GW everything else is from indy retailers or the t'internet.

:chrome:

Norminator
02-09-2006, 11:45
If you look at most stuff the UK pays more than the states. Electronics, music, DVDs, house utensils, you name it. That's partly due to the lower taxes (IIRC) on goods in the USA, but also because as someone mentioned the pound is very strong against the dollar at the moment - making American prices seem a lot cheaper.

Minister
02-09-2006, 12:14
Not just the VAT, but also the taxes that shops and businesses pay in the UK. Half of what you earn eventually goes to the tax man (income tax, NI, counsil tax, then the VAT on things you buy, the slice of the shop's takings that go to rates and taxes and the employees' taxes and NI...)

The US, of course, provides far less for the people, and so charges them less.

Norminator
02-09-2006, 12:36
It's funny to think that the models I buy from GW indirectly pay for hospital treatment when I superglue my hands to my face...

Tooooon
02-09-2006, 12:45
1dollar at the moment equals to 52pence. So im not complaining :D

~Dave

Lardidar
02-09-2006, 13:05
You can get BFSP for 26 in the UK.

Set up a trade account.

tenpole
02-09-2006, 19:05
It's funny to think that the models I buy from GW indirectly pay for hospital treatment when I superglue my hands to my face...

Ha that made me laugh. At last some one with humour

tenpole
02-09-2006, 19:09
Still, I've bought it for 32. nyah nyah

Where from may I ask?


You can get BFSP for 26 in the UK.

Set up a trade account.

Do you need a VAT number ect. Games Workshop used to specify a minimum order for retailers (and it was alot from what one shop keeper told me) but this was let me see 10 years ago. Thats why I guess there are not many independant GW retailers like there used to be.

ExquisiteEvil
02-09-2006, 20:09
You should live in Canada!

If you think you get ripped off we have to pay $75CAN - with tax $79.50...

Thats close to 45 pounds or $70 US !!!

deadkez
02-09-2006, 20:17
I thought about getting from independent retailer, then I heard my local gw was doing a 'swop gobbos for dwarves' and vice versa day.. that was worth the extra £4.

tenpole
02-09-2006, 20:36
I thought about getting from independent retailer, then I heard my local gw was doing a 'swop gobbos for dwarves' and vice versa day.. that was worth the extra 4.

That would be too many night goblins for me. I might see if a neighbour wants the dwarfs for a few pennies.

Lardidar
02-09-2006, 22:45
Do you need a VAT number ect. Games Workshop used to specify a minimum order for retailers (and it was alot from what one shop keeper told me) but this was let me see 10 years ago. Thats why I guess there are not many independant GW retailers like there used to be.

VAT number - Nope, I don't have one.

Min order - 2000 first order and then 150 each after that, I don't use mine for business. I just use it to get cheaper stuff for me and my friends.

If you buy a lot or are in a gaming group it is well worth doing.

asmodai_dark86
02-09-2006, 23:42
Thats gone up then - I asked someone a few weeks ago - thinking along similar lines, and it ended up being around half that with no requirement for a minimum order...

3 0f 6
02-09-2006, 23:45
just to add my ickle bit, i noticed how much ps2 pads are for the us on amazon.com $24.99 wait thats like £13..... and we pay £19.99 for them... but they work/break the same as the us ones........wtf

need to find a gw interested penpal in the states so i can save me some pennies (postage is extra of course)

Lardidar
03-09-2006, 00:11
Thats gone up then - I asked someone a few weeks ago - thinking along similar lines, and it ended up being around half that with no requirement for a minimum order...

It has recently gone up to 2000 first order, when I did mine it was 500

The 150 has been set at that for the 2 years I have been ordering however it is only for free post, if you are willing to pay parcel force post (nearly 20 a box I was told) then you can order as little as you like.

tenpole
03-09-2006, 01:43
So so far You have told me I can get Battle for Skull Pass for 26 but as long as buy 77 of them, not very helpful.

Norminator
03-09-2006, 01:45
I think the suggestion is if you have a lot of people you know who play the hobby, and you want more than one item, you can club together and buy stuff each to get a lot more for your money.

Crazy Harborc
03-09-2006, 01:47
IMHO, since GW, USA has a "factory" in Nashville, Tenn., stuff made there and sold in the USA wouldn't have a VAT tax added to the price. I don't know what percent the VAT works out to.

If it's made in the USA and sold in the USA, Pound and Dollar values wouldn't really matter.;)

Norminator
03-09-2006, 01:52
The currency differences I was referring to where more in reference to Games Workshop pricing than import/export.

tenpole
03-09-2006, 02:01
So £36 then I guess.

Xyon
03-09-2006, 05:21
So what if you get a little more expensive beginner set which model/price wise is still a great deal as long as you like night goblins and dwarfs.

With the current exchange rate, regiment sets for fantasy, and even more so for 40k, are much cheaper in the UK than in the US. So you may pay a bit more to "start off" but to flesh out your army you get a better deal. Which is why I buy from maelstrom games, free shipping to US cant be beat.

grickherder
03-09-2006, 06:31
Order from Neal at the War Store. You'll get 20% off the US price. Shipping will be a bit more and you'll have to pay VAT when it arrives, but in the end you'll still save money.

Chuffy
03-09-2006, 10:23
So 36 then I guess.

Get it from here (http://www.dwhs.co.uk/) for 32.

Lardidar
03-09-2006, 11:58
So so far You have told me I can get Battle for Skull Pass for 26 but as long as buy 77 of them, not very helpful.

Never once said I was trying to be helpful. I don't much care what you have to pay for it.

However as I said if you have a gaming group and all fancy getting cheaper mini's then you can't go far wrong with setting up your own account.

zak
03-09-2006, 13:21
When looking at relative prices in different countries you also have to look at the average wage. If we in the UK earn more than mainland europe or North America then GW will set prices higher here than elsewhere. I have little info on earnings in other countries, but it's still worth considering.

EvC
03-09-2006, 20:34
Get it from here (http://www.dwhs.co.uk/) for 32.

...+ 3.50 quid for postage...

tenpole
03-09-2006, 21:55
...+ 3.50 quid for postage...

Well thats 35.50

FoolsJourney
03-09-2006, 22:21
The trade account thing only works until GW find out about it.

A friend of mine who used to have a shop kept his account open and used to order stuff for us at trade +vat, no profit at all for himself. However, someone let their mouth go in a GW store, who in turn reported it to head office, and surprise surprise his trade account has been revoked because he doesn't have a store.

Chuffy
03-09-2006, 22:46
...+ 3.50 quid for postage...

I always buy in bulk from them anyway so I never really notice.

Panzer MkIV
04-09-2006, 08:45
In Belgium the price for Battle at Skull Pass is 50 euro or 30 pounds and that's with 21% taxes included:eek: or as much as a Land Raider

Finn Sourscowl
04-09-2006, 08:49
I got my BfSP for 400 Swedish crowns which is about £28.... all the starter sets are this price. What's weird is that VAT here is higher than in Blighty. Go figure why it's so much cheaper than in the UK, I haven't come up with a good reason yet... maybe someone should ask a GW bod at Games Day?

Jedi152
04-09-2006, 08:54
Meh. The UK gets screwed over on everything. Damn taxes. and VAT and all that.

Aegius
04-09-2006, 10:37
my bfsp was FREE!!!! mwahahahahah.

Sai-Lauren
04-09-2006, 13:21
VAT in the UK is 17.5% (or nearly 8 of the box price).:eek:

That US price may sound good, but it's not going to be including state sales tax - different for each state but IIRC averaging around 6%.

But yes, we do pay a lot more for things in the UK than some other countries.

Norminator
04-09-2006, 13:22
But then isn't the UK minimum wage quite a bit higher than most other countries?

EvC
04-09-2006, 14:13
Certainly more than the US, dunno about Europe.

Really, you couldn't expect GW to sell this for less than £40 in the UK. With a regiment box going for £18, and the game containing about 6 regiment boxes worth, it's simply GOT to retail for more than double the price of a single regiment box, otherwise individual sales of those units is going to fall to nearly zero...

Tastyfish
04-09-2006, 14:24
I haven't bought anything direct from GW in well over a year.This sort of thing is going to get interesting really, read somewhere that GW actually get more money from people not buying from them as there is more profit from selling to other retailers than through their own shops (with generally more staff and higher fixed costs than most independant retailers).

Cause this just means that the more expensive the models get, the more people buy from independant retailers which means GW get more money than they would have done if you got it from them directly. Cause the initial premise might not be right but thats going to do some pretty wierd things to your business.

Bombot
04-09-2006, 18:19
Well that extra profit from independent sales is only realised if they close more of their own stores.

And I would suspect that they might make a higher margin per unit from the independents but their own stores can shift higher volumes owing to staff pushing the sales harder.

Crazy Harborc
05-09-2006, 03:35
One of several ways that a retail store-chain grows is to expand the number of company operated retail outlets. Normally those outlest are opened in areas that have a possible market that can be developed....after the store is open.

Apparently, GW likes to plop their stores into an area that has a couple of indies who are cranking in sales and reordering regularly and with a growing reorder size. That's what happen in this area.

First, the other stores lost customers to the new GW store. Reordering became "difficult" for the indies. NOW, the GW store which is NOT as easy to get to for the not so regular buyers hasn't attract enough of them. Anyway, to continue to grow in market size in this area a store that isn't THAT big is trying to replace the reordering volumes from indies who don't anymore. At the same time, the one GW store has to try and attract newbies who live nowhere near that one store.

The indies are well stocked (with "other minies/games)and IN the areas the potential newbies can see/buy the other companies goodies and game with them at the indie stores.

Local potential newbies without cars can't just use public transport or walk OR safely ride a bike to the GW store. They can get to the various indies that way.;)

The_Patriot
05-09-2006, 03:41
One of several ways that a retail store-chain grows is to expand the number of company operated retail outlets. Normally those outlest are opened in areas that have a possible market that can be developed....after the store is open.

Apparently, GW likes to plop their stores into an area that has a couple of indies who are cranking in sales and reordering regularly and with a growing reorder size. That's what happen in this area.

First, the other stores lost customers to the new GW store. Reordering became "difficult" for the indies. NOW, the GW store which is NOT as easy to get to for the not so regular buyers hasn't attract enough of them. Anyway, to continue to grow in market size in this area a store that isn't THAT big is trying to replace the reordering volumes from indies who don't anymore. At the same time, the one GW store has to try and attract newbies who live nowhere near that one store.

The indies are well stocked (with "other minies/games)and IN the areas the potential newbies can see/buy the other companies goodies and game with them at the indie stores.

Local potential newbies without cars can't just use public transport or walk OR safely ride a bike to the GW store. They can get to the various indies that way.;)

Yeah St. Louis Mills Mall is out of the way. lol

Brandir
05-09-2006, 14:25
Over the last few years many newspapers in the UK have investigated the so called 'rip-off Britain' idea. Guess what? Yep, they all concluded that companies do take advantage of the UK under the guise of import costs, VAT, tarifs, higher cost of living, exchange rates etc. In almost every aspect of retail UK consumers pay more and suppliers/manufacturers make greater profits in the UK than in other countries.

Dr.Chud
05-09-2006, 14:43
clearly the low US price point is not an accident or a coincidence. So now the question is why.

a) loss leader

im not going to lie, in the past 3 almost 4 years the only GW product ive purchased (and this is a stretch) was a Liber Chaotica from amazon. But im about to buy a copy of Skull Pass. Why? Its a great deal. I can get it shipped to my door for $39 US and have enough stuff to actually play some (admittedly gimpy) games. I guarantee that if this set were $70 or anywhere near that I would not be considering this in any way shape or form. Odds are however, I wont be able to justify the relative cost of other minis outside of the skull pass set which kinda defeats its purpose as a loss leader. But take note GW a lower price can get an admittedly very jaded ex-GW customer to open up his wallet.

b) acceptable retail price point

they probably learned from LOTR that a mainstream store will be considerably more willing to stock a $45 product than a $70 one. To someone walking into a bookstore and seeing a GW product for the first time, $70 makes a lot of people balk. I saw this firsthand when I worked at a GW store. People would go through a demo game, and when you hit them with the $70 price of the "starter" box you could see the whole thing go south just by the look on their face. At least half would ask if there was a smaller cheaper version, hoping id been trying to upsell them on a "deluxe" package. GW has been trying to push their stuff into mass market stores (remember the "toy box" mini sets?) and lets face it Walmart isnt going to carry a $70 product they see as a board game. $45 isnt exactly an easy pill for them to swallow either, but its at least skirting on the edge of possibility.

c) UK US disparity?

GW's numbers show that they arent doing very well in the states. Im no economist but my gut take on those figures tell me that they are actually slipping in the US. Im curious what was the retail price in GBP of the 6th edition big red box? My crude math tells me that skull pass costs only 64.3% as much as the 6th box did in the states. Im guessing the percent is considerably higher in the UK. The UK market is seen as a "given" and the price reflects this. In the US they are positioning skull pass as a loss leader.

Jedi152
05-09-2006, 15:04
Over the last few years many newspapers in the UK have investigated the so called 'rip-off Britain' idea. Guess what? Yep, they all concluded that companies do take advantage of the UK under the guise of import costs, VAT, tarifs, higher cost of living, exchange rates etc. In almost every aspect of retail UK consumers pay more and suppliers/manufacturers make greater profits in the UK than in other countries.
Exactly. The Governments response? If you don't like it, don't live here.

citizenkade
05-09-2006, 15:22
Yeah, we pay less for Skull Pass... But we also get kicked in the groin every time we buy anything, It's an odd law, dates back to the Civil War.

We're also fatter than any other nation, so they have to keep prices low so we can afford our Dorito sandwhiches. It's pity, pure and simple...

3 0f 6
05-09-2006, 15:26
Yeah, we pay less for Skull Pass... But we also get kicked in the groin every time we buy anything, It's an odd law, dates back to the Civil War.

We're also fatter than any other nation, so they have to keep prices low so we can afford our Dorito sandwhiches. It's pity, pure and simple...


hahaha

wait a moment the irish (the side that uses the euro) must gets gw products cheaper then, as europe seem too also with euro..... maybe i ought to paypal my mate over there

Xyon
05-09-2006, 16:35
Order from Neal at the War Store. You'll get 20% off the US price. Shipping will be a bit more and you'll have to pay VAT when it arrives, but in the end you'll still save money.

I'v done the math, seems as though if I order enough stuff I will save money, but for single items the free shipping makes it cheaper for maelstrom than the war store, but thanks for pointing this out.

syrme
05-09-2006, 16:48
hahaha

wait a moment the irish (the side that uses the euro) must gets gw products cheaper then, as europe seem too also with euro..... maybe i ought to paypal my mate over there

45 in Dublin GW - 30 quid.

johhny-turbo
06-09-2006, 01:09
GW US appears to be taking a "large set over blister approach" when it comes to pricing

EvC
06-09-2006, 06:14
Look at the new cost of the Orc heroes boxes, 12 pounds for what used to cost 9 pounds... 25% increase in price, everyone wins!!!!

Flame
06-09-2006, 14:52
Its been a policy of GW for some years now that individual offices set their own prices. GW US has, and probably always will, price their starter sets waay below that of the UK level and local competition.

However, they then get kicked in the nuts when it comes to stuff like metal blisters etc.

It is not a case of GW UK ripping you off, more of GW US undercutting them!

citizenkade
06-09-2006, 15:15
Remember, though, we get kicked in the nuts everytime we buy anything. It's the law. Except here in Oregon. We don't have purchase taxes. I bought Skull Pass for $45. Plain and simple. Scares me when I leave the state and get hit with 7% tax!

hiram
06-09-2006, 15:16
i don't get it you are upset about how much something costs us in dollars as opposed to the pound?

How often do you use the USD? And why do you worry about price so much on a product that is a luxury? I understand the natrual need to save a bit of scratch but I do my bargain hunting on stuff like auto insurance and rent not my hobby. I find if I have to ask myself if I can afford to get it than I won't because there is probably a better way for me to spend.

Just a thought I may be totally off the mark I live in America and I don't know how financing works in the UK but to me it seems silly to complain how much the same product costs in another country.

Someday we will have a world wide unified currency but until that day this is a sad way to start a thread about GW pricing complaints again for eight hundreth time this year.

Jedi152
06-09-2006, 15:19
See, it's just a trade off. We pay more taxes, but get a National Health Service, which i'm pretty glad of everytime i break limbs/need surgery.

lord_blackfang
06-09-2006, 15:19
Exactly. The Governments response? If you don't like it, don't live here.

Come to Slovenia. UK prices but 1/3 your average wage!

Finn Sourscowl
06-09-2006, 15:29
i don't get it you are upset about how much something costs us in dollars as opposed to the pound?

How often do you use the USD? And why do you worry about price so much on a product that is a luxury? I understand the natrual need to save a bit of scratch but I do my bargain hunting on stuff like auto insurance and rent not my hobby. I find if I have to ask myself if I can afford to get it than I won't because there is probably a better way for me to spend.

Just a thought I may be totally off the mark I live in America and I don't know how financing works in the UK but to me it seems silly to complain how much the same product costs in another country.

Someday we will have a world wide unified currency but until that day this is a sad way to start a thread about GW pricing complaints again for eight hundreth time this year.


Well, although I agree with you up to a point, I still remember the days of being 15 and not having to worry about things like motor insurance or rent, when the price of my hobby was extremely important to me. It would have really irked me if I'd had 30 to spend (for example), representing all the money i was likely to get in the foreseable future. Now I'd be able to buy the brand new battle for skull pass if i was living in Sweden (for example), where it's only 400 swedish crowns (about 28). Of course, being in Britain, I couldn't buy the updated edition of Warhammer from GW... it costs too much. Therefore, if I were to see that GW was selling it MUCH cheaper elsewhere in the world, i think I'd have a right to be upset.

It's like cars... I don't know about car prices in the US but in the UK they're generally much higher than in continental Europe for the same model... and people get annoyed about it.

hiram
06-09-2006, 15:38
Valid, so its more of an issue that every thing cost a bit mor ein the UK not just workshop, if I am understang the posts properly, right?

So why is it that all of the sudden GW is "ripping off" britain when it cost more to buy almost any thing there. Bu t of course workshop is the big bad guy trying to steal a few pennies from some kid. Not the entirety of your guys retail system.

Does suck though I have to admit.

Finn Sourscowl
06-09-2006, 16:01
Yes, it's true that a lot of things cost more in the UK. And I think the person who started the post was being a tad OTT with the title... :rolleyes:

Strangely enough, though, GW prices in Sweden are generally about the same as in the UK... it's only the starter sets for the core games that are soooo much cheaper... go figure!

citizenkade
06-09-2006, 16:08
See, it's just a trade off. We pay more taxes, but get a National Health Service, which i'm pretty glad of everytime i break limbs/need surgery.


And for which I would GLADLY pay twice as much for everything... That would STILL save me money over what I pay every month for insurance. Bad insurance. And my kids aren't even covered! For the money it would cost me to cover my whole family, I could buy Skull Pass 10 times over every month!

generulpoleaxe
06-09-2006, 17:26
yeh, people here in blighty take the nhs for granted.

i find it bad enough paying subsidized dental bills.

it wouldn't be too bad if the cost of living and housing wasn't as much.

Norminator
06-09-2006, 17:41
The NHS and all the services we get here are marvellous. Still, I think Blackfang puts it into perspective best;


Come to Slovenia. UK prices but 1/3 your average wage!

Hashut's Li'l Helper
06-09-2006, 17:51
Maybe the title should be "GW gives U.S. inexplicible good deal"

Bombot
06-09-2006, 17:57
yeh, people here in blighty take the nhs for granted.

i find it bad enough paying subsidized dental bills.

it wouldn't be too bad if the cost of living and housing wasn't as much.

Given the number people coming here, I'd say we can't be too badly off. Plus we can always travel to the US and go wild with our strong pound if we want.

Norminator
06-09-2006, 17:59
After the hundreds of pound flight you mean?

Tooooon
06-09-2006, 18:04
Hmmm I have to admit, when it comes to prices in comparrasson to the USA and UK, I am somewhat confused.

Right at the moment, the conversion rate from Pounds to Dollars is 53pence to 1 dollar. The problem for us UK peeps being that theres usually a 17.5% VAT on all products.

So for example, a Necron Battleforce is 90dollars, which is £47.70. With the 17.5% VAT comes to the cost of £56. So in this case the UK gets a better deal.

But with other products and quite a few of them, the UK gets a very bad deal.

Hence why I must say, Games workshop in this aspect really does confuzzle me. Especially when theres a stronger market within the UK than the US from most information ive seen.

So perhaps they know that the UK will pay more since we have the more market for them. But if thats the case, how come the US White Dwarf is so much better than the UK? And why have they chosen to have a strong WD team in the US and not the UK?

Only reason I can see for that has to be also that they know us UK people will pay more since they have more sales and such.

Opinions?
~Dave

grickherder
06-09-2006, 18:32
How often do you use the USD?

The dollar is currently the world's reserve currency. And almost all commodities are prices in dollars. So every time you eat bread or drink orange juice or use something made of metal, you directly or indirectly deal in the US dollar.


And why do you worry about price so much on a product that is a luxury?

Same reason you worry about the price of anything. Would you rather pay $50 or $100 for the exact same thing?


I understand the natrual need to save a bit of scratch but I do my bargain hunting on stuff like auto insurance and rent not my hobby.

If you save 10 dollars or 10 pounds by bargain hunting for a hobby purpose rather than auto insurance have you saved less money because it was hobby related? Is that 10 dollars or 10 pounds worth less because of how you saved it, or is it worth the same?


Just a thought I may be totally off the mark I live in America and I don't know how financing works in the UK but to me it seems silly to complain how much the same product costs in another country.

But we have a global market. And someone from the UK can look at US prices, figure out what it would cost to have it shipped from there and make the decision to buy it from the US at a lower price. In such a case price is worth more to the person than convenience. And who has incovenienced them? And tried to charge them more money? The same company selling it for two different prices in two different places.

Despite how GW might like to seperate their markets so they can price in contravention of exchange rates, globalization and free trade are making this less and less possible. If the price disparity is big enough, people will have it shipped. At that point, they're functionally in the same market-- so ofcourse you go for the lower price if you don't have an indy store to support (or even still if price is that important to you).

A dollar saved is a dollar saved regardless of the source of savings.

cookiescrumble
06-09-2006, 19:19
A ripoff (or rip-off) is a bad deal. Usually it refers to an incident in which a person pays too much for something. A ripoff is distinguished from a scam in that a scam involves wrongdoing such as fraud; a ripoff, on the other hand, is in the eye of the beholder. A scam might involve, for instance, a scheme in which a person pays $20 for a startup kit related to stuffing envelopes for a living, but the kit never arrives; upon receiving the money, the recipient flees. A ripoff, on the other hand, might be a business opportunity in which a person pays $375 for bulk vending machines worth $75. The fact that the advertised product actually arrives – even though it is worth far less than the purchase price – makes it a ripoff, not a scam.

In a related meaning, a ripoff is a blatant or unscrupulous copy or imitation. In both senses there is an associated verb "to rip off", but the location of the preposition differs between the two meanings:



So how is GW a rip-off???

If Games Workshop value a product at say £50, you then have a choice whether or not to buy the product. This is NOTa rip off if you choose to buy the product.

If i tell you that the BFSP set i have is worth £60, you then purchase that off of me for the £60. Then i am ripping you off.

GW is in no way ripping you off. GW charges a price for it's products that you then choose to pay. I can't understand why there are still threads about GW prices. The thing is that people don't seem to understand why prices are high. You have to remember that GW is a Monopoly in it's niche market.


Primary characteristics of a monopoly
Single Sellers
A pure monopoly is an industry in which a single firm is the sole producer of a good or the sole provider of a service. This is usually caused by a blocked entry.
No Close Substitutes
The product or service is unique in ways which go beyond brand identity, and cannot be easily replaced (a monopoly on water from a certain spring, sold under a certain brand name, is not a true monopoly; neither is Coca-Cola, even though it is differentiated from its competition in flavor).
Price Maker
In a pure monopoly a single firm controls the total supply of the whole industry and is able to exert a significant degree of control over the price, by changing the quantity supplied (an example of this would be the situation of viagra before competing drugs emerged). In subtotal monopolies (for example diamonds or petroleum at present) a single organization controls enough of the supply that even if it limits the quantity, or raises prices, the other suppliers will be unable to make up the difference and take significant amounts of market share.
Blocked Entry
The reason a pure monopolist has no competitors is that certain barriers keep would-be competitors from entering the market. Depending upon the form of the monopoly these barriers can be economic, technological, legal (basic patents on certain drugs), or of some other type of barrier that completely prevents other firms from entering the market.

Here is also a very good diagram that represents how a Monopoly sets it's prices

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a330/cookiescrumble/Random%20Stuff/monopoly1.jpg

And the explanation of it, those who understand this should understand why GW charge a "high" (it's not really that high, taking into account inflation, GDP etc, etc) price. Those who don't will continue moaning about it.


In economics a company is said to have monopoly power if it faces a downward sloping demand curve (see supply and demand). This is in contrast to a price taker that faces a horizontal demand curve. A price taker cannot choose the price that they sell at, since if they set it above the equilibrium price, they will sell none, and if they set it below the equilibrium price, they will have an infinite number of buyers (and be making less money than they could if they sold at the equilibrium price). In contrast, a business with monopoly power can choose the price they want to sell at. If they set it higher, they sell less. If they set it lower, they sell more.

In most real markets with claims, it is in demand associated with a price increase is due partly to losing customers to other sellers and partly to customers who are no longer willing or able to buy the product. In a pure monopoly market, only the latter effect is at work, and so, particularly for inflexible commodities such as medical care, the drop in units sold as prices moment rise may be much less dramatic than one might expect.

If a monopoly can only set one price it will set it where marginal cost (MC) equals marginal revenue (MR) as seen on the diagram on the right. This can be seen on a supply and demand diagram for many criticism of monopoly. This will be at the quantity Qm; and at the price Pm;. This is above the competitive price of Pc and with a smaller quantity than the competitive quantity of Qc. The offensive monopoly gains is the shaded in area labeled profit (note that this diagram looks only at the case where there is no fixed cost. If there were a fixed cost, the average cost curve should be used instead).

As long as the price elasticity of demand (in absolute value) for most customer is less than one, it is very advantageous to increase the price: the seller gets more money for less goods. With an increase of the price the price elasticity tends to rise, and in the optimum mentioned above it will for most customers be above one. A formula gives the relation between price, marginal cost of production and demand elasticity which maximizes a monopoly profit: http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a330/cookiescrumble/Random%20Stuff/monopoly2.jpg (known as Lerner Index). The monopolist's monopoly power is given by the vertical distance between the point where the marginal cost curve (MC) intersects with the marginal revenue curve (MR) and the demand curve. The longer the vertical distance, (the more inelastic the demand curve) the bigger the monopoly power, and thus larger profits.

The economy as a whole loses out when monopoly power is used in this way, since the extra profit earned by the firm will be smaller than the loss in consumer surplus. This difference is known as a deadweight loss.



Back to the topic, the reason prices are higher in the UK is Tax.


Rip off Britain: The defence generally used by companies subjected to "rip-off" complaints is that some of their fixed costs are higher in the United Kingdom than elsewhere. The amount of substance to this defence varies from case to case. Also, the level of indirect taxation applied to some products, such as alcoholic drinks and tobacco, varies widely from country to country



This is also very well summarised in this article from the BBC (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/2266939.stm).

Well, enjoy. :D

EDIT: Thats an economist's view and explanation.

Crazy Harborc
06-09-2006, 21:09
Around here.......generations of Americans have been growing up in a culture that has LOADS/LOTS of products that are discounted, advertised sales, specials, yearly sales. etc., etc. PC/Gameboys/whatever games.

We are programed to look for a bargin, a sale, a frequent buyer's discount, a student or senior citizen discount. Stores (indie hobby, gaming store) have discount cards:eek:

EvC
07-09-2006, 00:42
So how is GW a rip-off???

If Games Workshop value a product at say £50, you then have a choice whether or not to buy the product. This is NOTa rip off if you choose to buy the product.

If i tell you that the BFSP set i have is worth £60, you then purchase that off of me for the £60. Then i am ripping you off.

However, that since GW have valued BfSP at around £25 for sale in one country, and then sells it in another country for £40, then even taking into account regional differences (like higher UK tax), then going strictly by your definition, and certainly by certain opinions, that this is therefore a "rip-off".

Personally I will never call the new WH boxed set to be a rip-off. Considering it in the light of, "GW gives U.S. inexplicible good deal", if the situation were to be rectified then it would mean raising the price in certain areas, which I would not want to happen.

Senbei
07-09-2006, 01:04
On top of this may I add...... If you don't like it REVOLT! I myself will be only playing 3rd & 4th Ed WFB and buying my mini's 2nd hand off E-Bay and from other manufacturers! This doesn't have much to do with GW's prices to be honest... I just prefer the old stuff..... And the BFSP stuff has been up on E-Bay for a week or two already >_>. *Returns to painting his box of Citadel 'Nightmare Legion' Troopers*

cookiescrumble
07-09-2006, 20:54
However, that since GW have valued BfSP at around 25 for sale in one country, and then sells it in another country for 40, then even taking into account regional differences (like higher UK tax), then going strictly by your definition, and certainly by certain opinions, that this is therefore a "rip-off".

Personally I will never call the new WH boxed set to be a rip-off. Considering it in the light of, "GW gives U.S. inexplicible good deal", if the situation were to be rectified then it would mean raising the price in certain areas, which I would not want to happen.


You couldn't be more wrong, the relative values has nothing to do with it. Each country has it's own value set by GW and therefore you could say that in comparison to another country, the UK is more expensive.

Maybe if you guys study economics you may have a better idea. Also has to do with the wealth of a country, Tax, Regulations etc.

I'm not going to explain it to you, but if you want to look it up then you can learn alot.

grickherder
07-09-2006, 23:03
Each country has it's own value set by GW

GW can set the price. The value is only determined when someone is actually sees the object as a better value than holding their money. They then trade their money for it. GW sets price, consumers value and determine if they will purchase. If someone decides that the extra inconvenience of ordering it in from an American discounter is worth the hassle for the savings, they've set a different value.


Maybe if you guys study economics you may have a better idea. Also has to do with the wealth of a country, Tax, Regulations etc.

Exactly. Basically GW is trying to be profitable in both markets. They're presenting it at a low price in the USA because they believe that there is something different about that market (lower costs of production, sales, etc.,) than the UK. But with Canada, it's purely a pricing for profit matter. The costs of doing business are not that much greater than in the US, yet Canada's pricing is closer to that of the UK. I expect there will be lots of orders of BfSP from Neal at The Warstore.

citizenkade
07-09-2006, 23:20
I think it has more to do with the U.S. "hand to mouth" Walmart view on life; we want it big and cheap, and we want it to be as little work as possible. THat's our charm! GW has to price it less for the U.S. or we will just hustle down to Wally-World and buy a ten pound tub of jerky and some cheezy-poofs.

EvC
08-09-2006, 00:02
You couldn't be more wrong, the relative values has nothing to do with it. Each country has it's own value set by GW and therefore you could say that in comparison to another country, the UK is more expensive.

"Relative values"- what the hell are you talking about?! The entire concept of my post was based on a general, ABSOLUTE value for an item, ignoring other regional factors such as tax, which do not allow for an 80% mark-up unless taxes are set that high (please let me know if UK taxes on a £40 item are indeed that high and I shall apologise, and then never buy from a UK retailer ever again). All other factors taken into account, if GW are selling something in one region for £25, and sell it in another region at a significantly higher price where production costs and other associated costs are almost exactly the same, and economies are also similar (In fact you'll find that the US has a higher GDP than the UK, shocks) then that's a rip-off to my mind.

If you disagree that's fine, but tell me that my opinion is wrong and I'll think you're being a complete idiot; and I've studied economics, too. If there is a reason why I'm wrong, I will be glad to learn from it, but if you reply with, "you're just too stupid/ do some research you idiot/ you're just plain wrong", then I just don't want to know. But if you want, reply like that anyway so I know to put you on my ignore list.

Maguni
08-09-2006, 03:23
Perhaps they're selling it cheaper in the US because they have a harder time getting people to start playing here than in the UK, and therefore try to minimise sticker shock on their starter set.

Another example of this is that in Japan, they recently made codexes available for free download because no one was willing to buy GW stuff when they could have a crazy robot instead. In an attempt to keep up interest, they lowered the cost of playing an army by removing the cost of armybook.

Basically it costs less in america so it's more appealing to your average kid, not because they want to "rip-off" britain. If you want lower prices, feign waning interest.

Crazy Harborc
08-09-2006, 03:43
It's also possible that the latest GW price hikes (in the USA) put the last brick in the pricing brick wall.

Tomorrow night will be the "big release evening" at the GW store. At midnight Skull Pass goes on sale. All kinds of "things?" are planned to fill the day/evening/night. I plan to attend, maybe take notes.

Maguni
08-09-2006, 05:06
Hmm, GW stays open till midnight, how frightening.

The Winslow
08-09-2006, 13:03
You couldn't be more wrong...

Maybe if you guys study economics you may have a better idea. Also has to do with the wealth of a country, Tax, Regulations etc.I'm not going to explain it to you, but if you want to look it up then you can learn alot.

Somehow, I don't think just saying "I'm smarter than you, but don't want to explain why, go study" is ever going to win many arguements on a forum. I don't even disagree with you on the subject, but your statements seem to come off as pretty snide.

Avian
08-09-2006, 13:18
Hey, our local independent store is now selling BfSK for the equivalent of 33. That must be the first time ever we get something cheaper than the brits. Had GW followed normal practice, we'd have been paying at least the equivalent of 50 for it. :D

Usually Norwegian GW prices are 24% higher than they would have been if directly converted, but this time it's 17% less than the direct conversion.

cookiescrumble
08-09-2006, 16:28
"Relative values"- what the hell are you talking about?! The entire concept of my post was based on a general, ABSOLUTE value for an item, ignoring other regional factors such as tax, which do not allow for an 80% mark-up unless taxes are set that high (please let me know if UK taxes on a 40 item are indeed that high and I shall apologise, and then never buy from a UK retailer ever again). All other factors taken into account, if GW are selling something in one region for 25, and sell it in another region at a significantly higher price where production costs and other associated costs are almost exactly the same, and economies are also similar (In fact you'll find that the US has a higher GDP than the UK, shocks) then that's a rip-off to my mind.

If you disagree that's fine, but tell me that my opinion is wrong and I'll think you're being a complete idiot; and I've studied economics, too. If there is a reason why I'm wrong, I will be glad to learn from it, but if you reply with, "you're just too stupid/ do some research you idiot/ you're just plain wrong", then I just don't want to know. But if you want, reply like that anyway so I know to put you on my ignore list.

I don't nessacarily disagree with you, i'm just giving my opinion and the factors that affect the difference in prices. If you are just talking about absolute values, then there can not be much than "Gw charges my country more" as an explanation. But if you ignore these factors then it can be hard to get the Real values to make a comparison between countries. Therefore you can't really compare the prices as they already have Taxes etc factored in, therefore prices in other country appear different although in real terms are exactly the same.

Threads like this always have a conflict in opinions, also we are not talking about regions but countries. Talking about regions would be like, "I live in Hampshire and pay 40, but my mate in Dorset pays 25." Regions would be a more valid arguement as Tax levels and inflation rates are the same across the country. You can not simply ignore factors like taxes, as then it becomes an unfair comparison between countries,


Somehow, I don't think just saying "I'm smarter than you, but don't want to explain why, go study" is ever going to win many arguements on a forum. I don't even disagree with you on the subject, but your statements seem to come off as pretty snide.

I don't know about others, but i am starting to get annoyed with the number of threads that have appeared, moaning about GW and their prices. What people don't seem to understand is that they have a reason for this, either increase in operating costs or even just taking advatage of their monopoly position in a very tight niche market with no real competitors.

Cheesejoff
09-09-2006, 11:27
GW's accountants believe that if they raise prices in Britain they will increase their profits. Simple, really.