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zrem
05-09-2006, 07:56
So, my friend and I are going to start in on this awesomeness, and both of us have nothing. I was wondering if buying two Battle for Macragge boxes would be worth it. There's a complete rule book, templates, and dice in there. Something like a sixty-eight dollar value if bought individually, and the battle for macragge box is only fourty five dollars.

On top of that it also comes with ten space marines, which is the army my friend would be starting. Does anyone know if these come with full weapon choices, and if not what would he do to get the weapons he'd want (and where can I price such things)?

Hellebore
05-09-2006, 08:05
I would only get the BfM if you both plan on getting marines and tyranids respectively.

If your friend wants marines, and you want tyranids, no problem!

The box is a good deal, and it also has the entire 40k 4th edition rules in it, so you would be able to play straight away.

The marine squad only has a flamer and a missile launcher as weapon options, no plasma/lascannon goodness.

Welcome to the game, get out their and start the slaughter (best way to kill things without starting a REAL war).

Hellebore

shutupSHUTUP!!!
05-09-2006, 08:05
Are you set on doing tyrannids? The macragge ultramarines are cheap but they arne't poseable, and come with a flamer and missile launcher so you don't have variety in options. A space mariine tactical sqaud box on the other hand comes with a plasma gun and meltagun on top of the flamer and missile launcher, it is also far more poseable and comes with extra bits like grenades and stuff. A space marine battleforce might be a good place to start since you save a little money on them too.

What army are you interested in?

LoerdofallJoy
05-09-2006, 08:15
Welcome to 40k.

I would second that the battle for McCragge boxset is a good starting point. Go to your local GW and talk to the staff - they're usually very friendly & knowledgeable - if you can get an into-game at the store before you buy that'll help you see if you really like it.

If you like what you see, then then next thing I'd recommend is getting the codex for the army you want to play. That way you can read all the background & see if you like the 'fluff' (that's what we call the background & 'history' of the 41st millenium) for the army you've chosen.

You will also be able to put together small armies (400-500 points) and play with them. You don't need the models at this point - use whatever is to hand and proxy what you want to use (i.e. use stand-in models).

Once you've worked out what works & doesn't with your proxies you can go & buy the models. The reason I say this is that there is a very big tendancy to go a buy the coolest shinyest models availiable which won't make an army & you'll have spent on stuff you can't use (even those of us who've been playing for years fall foul of this!).

Hope you enjoy yourself.

LoaJ

zrem
05-09-2006, 08:23
Personally, I'm interested in starting an Eldar force, but I'm waiting for the new codex before writing up army lists.
I was just looking at the Macragge thing because I don't have the dice, templates, or core rulebook (and I like the small one more than the big one). These three things alone have a combined cost of more than the Battle of Macragge.
The whole "comes with some Space Marines" thing is just a bonus as my friend would be starting a space marine army.

Darkseer
05-09-2006, 08:33
The most important advice anyone can give you:

Start 1 army
collect and paint that 1 army forever more
NEVER be tempted by other armies...this way lies the all consuming madness of GW!

BrainFireBob
05-09-2006, 08:37
Ah, now, Darkseer, I'm not sure if I agree.

Then again, right now I've Marines, Chaos Marines, and Templars- and one hell of a bitz box, which keeps me from starting non-marine based models. I don't want to start another bitz box.


BfM is good for templates et al, correct- and it gives you some terrain pieces as well. Each of you getting one- well, if you're both really decided on it, then go for it. This isn't a cheap hobby. I'm unsure if, given the chance, I'd go into it again.

Darkseer
05-09-2006, 08:55
My friend who has a 10,000pts fully painted Ork army of much incredibleness has shown me the light.

Of course, it's about 11 years too late for me now.

Inq. Veltane
05-09-2006, 09:14
As the US gets BfM much cheaper than the UK (for some strange reason) I'd say go for it, the miniatures really are just a bonus and you can always sell the Nids on ebay if you don't want them...

Scamshouse
05-09-2006, 09:33
The only reason for buying the Big Black rules Book is you get Kill Team rules, Combat Patrol Rules and some extra fluff. I'm pretty sure you could dig most of that up from the internet.

Wish I'd got the BFM just for the crashed Aquilla Lander.

Some guy (UK)
05-09-2006, 11:19
I uttterly recommend you read this thread. Some great tips and advice here, and it will help make your decisions much easier:

http://forums.relicnews.com/showthread.php?t=61910

Some of the earlier post sound as if they don't want you to start, but they are there for a reason ;) .

Later, Some Guy

Scythe
05-09-2006, 11:42
Wish I'd got the BFM just for the crashed Aquilla Lander.

Heh, funny. That's the main reason I got the box. Plus the usefull small rulebook and some extra nids for my force.

fracas
05-09-2006, 12:06
if you want eldar, i would not recommend BfM

firstly, i like my rule book hardcover, thus i would go with this. then read it from cover to cover, and repeat. part of the fun of 40k is the fluff and this has enough of the fluff background to whet your appetite.

secondly, buy a set of bases and play them as stand ins to get the hang of the game. meanwhile, save money so that when the new codex comes out, you can afford to get it as well as the army deal. most new release army deals come with a special limited release figure and i think that is kinda cool to have.

if you need models now, get eldar tanks. these models won't change and can be used in both guardian based armies as well as aspect based ones.

insectum7
05-09-2006, 15:41
Battle for Macragge is cheap for what you get, the figures arent as poseable as some of the other minis, but they are pretty detailed. Plus you get that mini rulebook, some terrain and some special counters. Im a 12 year veteran and I'm still thinking of getting the set for its little goodies.

chaos0xomega
05-09-2006, 15:47
Wow, eldar as a first army. Good choice, but a dangerous path nonetheless.

Anyway, I would avoid Battle for Macragge unless you A- want the crashed Aquila bits, B- really really don't want to buy the rulebook(DO IT!), and C- have some use for the extra tyranid pieces.

Instead I would recommend the following: Go buy the hard cover book, you guys can even split it 50/50(cash) or you can be greedy and get it all for yourself. Then buy a Brick of Dice(very nice), and buy a scatter die(I think you can get them online cheap), but whatever you do don't buy GW dice, they are horrible. Oh, and pick up some templates.

Then, tell your friend to buy the Space Marine Battleforce + a chaplain or something(for HQ) and the codex(you are going to need codexes whether you buy macragge or not).

Then, you should get a list of models that will not be changing with the new edition and buy only these. As far as I know, this is limited to skimmers(the tanks), wraithguard, swooping hawks, warp spiders, guardians, rangers(the new minis are already out), and I think the new weapons platform is out too. Also, you may want to pick up the current eldar codex, just to give you a good idea of what you want to do(but don't buy the craftworld eldar codex, it will be useless in a month or so), and it's cheaper than the other books anyway. This way you can start collecting stuff you know that you will want. Also, check out the rumors to find out about possible changes.

Alternatively, you can tell your friend to shove (as punishment for not getting an account on warseer or 40ko, or another 'net fansite forum place), get your own stuff, and make him get the macragge sets himself. Either way works good(for you).

Regardless, I would stay away from the macragge thing, as there really isn't any benefit to you. The macragge rulebook is missing a bunch of stuff that I find very important to the game(like Kill-team and combat patrol), and I think it is missing a bunch of scenario's and stuff as well. Not only that, but you will basically waste money on models that you can't use. Plus, your friend will be stuck with some pretty cruddy mini's.

Inq. Veltane
05-09-2006, 18:04
If you mix the BfM marines into other squads you really can't notice it. I think about 1 in 4 of the marines in the small marine force I have (to be used in my WH army, honestly...I'm not a marine player) are from BfM and they don't stand out. I wouldn't want a whole squad of BfM marines but in other squads they are fine...

TwilightOdyssey
05-09-2006, 18:42
As a relative newcomer to 40K, I can tell you that buying Battle For Macragge was not worth the inital outlay for me, in that neither my son nor I ended up collecting SMs or 'Nids. It would've been more cost effective to just buy the rules, and collect our armies from scratch. Painting the BFM models was good practice, and the initial set of mini-missions were a good starting place to teach the rules in bitesize chunks. Overall, not worth the investment for me, tho.

Also, expect the initial outlay to be closer to $150, unless you already own glues, paints, brushes, small clippers, files, and X-acto blades.

luchog
05-09-2006, 18:52
The most important advice anyone can give you:

Start 1 army
collect and paint that 1 army forever more
NEVER be tempted by other armies...this way lies the all consuming madness of GW!


And since you're an Eldar player, don't get involved in resurrecting old units/lists (aka Harlequins) that can currently only be obtained via eBay, Bartertown, or expensive bitz orders, or your doom will be complete. Sure a unit or two as elites might be tempting, but soon you'll want to complete an entire army of them, and that way lies death and destruction for your bank account and social life (not that you'll have either one, anyway, once you start collecting and painting/converting, regardless of what army you choose).

johhny-turbo
06-09-2006, 01:26
Also if your done with the nids after playing a few BfM scenarios you could always chop them up so your Marine player can get tyranid hunters (if he's gonna play ultramarines)

n00bLord
06-09-2006, 05:04
I kinda like how Nurglitch is like all "Hey play Starship troopers" when he clearly wants to play 40k. Its like "Hey eat some C4!". Let him make his own deciscions,

welcome to the hobby, in moderation it isn't too taxing on your wallet and I find it more worth while than video games. Enjoy your self and don't become a social outcast!

Edit: BTW the Starshiptrooper models don't impress me, not being a fan boy but there not that wonderful.

Z-chan
06-09-2006, 07:56
Yes don't follow me. I flitted in between THREE armies in the span of 4 years and haven't reached 1500 pts with any of them.

Pick an army you really like and stick with it.

Kriegsherr
06-09-2006, 12:10
Hehe.... I only can support the "stick with it!" part, as I collected units from every single army out there in 40k (not to mention WH and the specialist games) in my 12 years of gaming. Must have thrown 10000 of cash out of the window. But it was a fun way of getting rid of my money, so I don't really mind.

Start with a small force, maybe 500 points. And then play. And paint. At the same time.
If you have gained some expierience and finished painting, buy the next 500 points.
Rinse and repeat.

SocketWrench
06-09-2006, 18:43
I've been playing WH40k for close to 8 years now. (last half of second edition). I would have to say that, if there's one thing that is always the driving force in my army building, it's 'do I like the models.' Ultimately every army can be played effectively and most even have a few different styles that can be played relatively effectively, but if you don't like the models you'll never get into the hobby side.

Off topic: I would think that Starship Troopers was cool if there was more than 2 armies, that's it's biggest downfall in my book, so little variety.

Large and Moving Torb
06-09-2006, 22:35
I'm going to have to cast my vote for the Battle for Macragge. I'm assuming you have not played a game of 40k, seen a (whole) game played, have read very little fluff and have little or no experience with other table-top games. With all these assumptions, I'd also guess there's a risk you might not like the game, or the hobby, that much.

Well, BfM covers those downsides pretty well. For the price of a new computer game, you can get into the game and hobby. I'd advise getting sprue clippers along with the BfM box. They really are a must. You don't really need anything else starting out. Clip the models off the sprue, stick 'em together (you don't even need glue) and play a few of the scenarios in the battle book. You can also get a few more to use with just the basic set from the Macragge site. Play each scenario twice with your friend, swapping sides. It shouldn't take long for you to form an opinion.

If you don't like the game, then you are only out $45 (or less if you buy from a discounter), and you can always use the clippers for something else around the house. If you kinda enjoy the game, but not the hobby aspect as much, and don't plan on collecting a 2000 pt army, you can always follow the collection path provided by the online Macragge material. Plus, you'll have terrain and other items you can use as objectives. It beats the hell out of using copies of War and Peace and A History of the American People and various coins for terrain and objectives. You might spend a bit more, but if it's over time, it won't seem unsightly.

If you do enjoy the game and hobby right off, you'll have two armies to practice painting and possibly modeling with. You'll also have the basic rules, templates, dice, rulers and (again) some nice terrain and objective markers.

It's not the way I did it (started in 3rd), but if I was to do it all over I would.

n00bLord
07-09-2006, 03:11
@ Nurglitch, first off I do seem a little edgy in that post, but if you blame the game system, thats an opinion. The hobby's not all about only playing games ya know.

Well if I were you as I had said, research your army.