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druchii
06-09-2006, 06:03
I guess no one saw my earlier Ogre Kingdoms list. That, or no one posted because it was too boring. SO I revised the list, including a wider variety of units, and making it just a bit better at killing scary things.


A few things, first:
Would YOU have fun playing against this army?
Will it be competitive, and yet forgiving for new-ish players?
Will I go nuts spending so much time painting so many ogres, and THEN have to pain a ton of weedy gnoblars?

Lord:291
*Ogre Tyrant:291
Heavy Armor
Tenderiser
Kineater

Heroes:310
^1 Ogre Butcher:155
Dispel Scroll

+1 Ogre Butcher:155
Dispel Scroll

Core:998
4 Ogre Bulls:140

^3 Ogre Bulls:105

+3 Ogre Bulls:105

4 Ironguts:192

4 Ironguts:192

*3 Ironguts:144

20 Gnoblars:40

20 Gnoblars:40

20 Gnoblars:40

Special:220
2 Leadbelchers:110
2 Leadbelchers:110

Rare:180
2 Maneaters:180
Great Weapons
Heavy Armor

Total:1999/2000

The tactics are pretty basic. I'm hoping with so many ogres on the table, that my opponent will have some difficult choices with shooting. I expect to see most of it directed towards the Ironguts, but that's ok.

I feel the real strength of the list is the large number of units available to me. With deployment, I've got four units of gnoblars to place before even a single "meaningful" unit is placed.

The maneaters stay. I'm ordering two of the ninja-esque ones, and painting them red and white, like the GI-Joe ninjas.

I opted for kin-eater, because with the average Ld of most ogres, the re-roll to panic tests will help immensely, especially with the large number of ogres present. Although I have thought about swapping this out, for daemon-killer scars, for the reverse effect of Ld disruption.

EDIT: Swapped a unit of 9 gnoblar trappers for an extra Leadbelcher, making the single unit of 3 into two units of 2.

DesertDirge
07-09-2006, 14:18
It's a good list.. nothing much more to say. ;)

Donga666
07-09-2006, 14:59
Druchii: That's a nice all round list! Pleanty of hard hitters and disposable ranking units. I'd run with that one. Maybe 'shoe-horn' in a Gorger for warmachine eating, but not essential.

Grand!

But I don't envy painting 60 gnoblars!

ardude
07-09-2006, 18:54
good list ( but ain't that special rigth:P)

@ donga666 I got 150 skinks in my LM and I'm going to get 200 goblins and 100 orcs, just gonna spray the basic colour (green) and drybrush it a litle and it's as good as done.
( or make sure your front, flank and rear are paint really nicly :D)

druchii
08-09-2006, 05:17
Thank GOD someone replied. Thanks! :D

I thought about a gorger, but I just don't see him doing much. He seems pretty weedy on when he turns up. I'm also rather affraid of him being a large points-sink.

Will he really do that much the turn he pops up, beisdes getting shot to bits?
Not only that, but with only ws3 and 4 attacks, I don't see him putting an end to the sturdier warmachine crews.

Sure he causes fear but I think I'd rather have another stubborn maneater.

Thanks for the replies,
and thanks for massaging my ego.
d

Donga666
08-09-2006, 21:01
good list ( but ain't that special rigth:P)

@ donga666 I got 150 skinks in my LM and I'm going to get 200 goblins and 100 orcs, just gonna spray the basic colour (green) and drybrush it a litle and it's as good as done.
( or make sure your front, flank and rear are paint really nicly :D)

I have 70 odd Bret peasants being ignored and not painted! I hate hords!

Druchii: The gorger is MUCH better than it appears on paper, great for taking out warmachines and holding (small to medium) 'shooty' regiments. Unbreakable and tough. AND special deployment!!!

Crossbows, handguns and warmachines will be the bane of this army (ive seen ten dwarf crossbows make 5 bulls run off by Killing two. That same regiment was killed off in two turns by a 1 Gorger (same game) who went on to eat a runesmith and cannon crew!)

Gorgers rule, I've even considered taking DOW one's in my undivided Chaos Hord!!

WarSmith7
08-09-2006, 21:08
It's good, it's got enough bulls to screen with a Kineater to make sure they don't run, I like it, it seems very well rounded.

One thing, have you considered breaking up your maneaters into 2 seperate, 1 ogre units?

Edit- Oh yeah, Gorgers suck so bad, don't take them unless it's within Scrag's circus. At best they arrive on turn 2 to get shot up, at worse they show up at turn 5 and get shot up, neither a great option for a 70+pt. model in my experiance.

druchii
09-09-2006, 15:27
Thanks again for the replies!

I totally forgot about the unbreakable on the gorger.
But it still doesn't remedy the fact that I think he'll still get shot to bits on the turn he arrives.

Coming in on the remaining moves phase means he gets to sit there to deal with an entire turn of enemy planning. With only T4 and 4W I don't suppose he'll be doing much besides getting eaten by shooty units.

Although he IS an option I'll keep in mind, should the money, time and patience surface.

Warsmith7: Yeah, they will either be run as two units of 1, or a unit of two. Mostly as two units of one, although they'll operate as a unit of two. Standing next to eachother, forcing an enemy charging one, to charge both.

So what's the concensus? Daemon-killer scars, or kineater? Both seam appealing to me. While the scars SOUND cooler (ie fluffwise, and modeling wise) but the kineater just seems too good to pass up.

Badgobbla
13-09-2006, 14:11
You seem to forget that when your opponent shoots at your gorger, he isn't shooting at your other units. I've had games where I happily 'sacrificed' my gorger to 'protect' my other units. It just means that your opponent has got another scary unit/monster coming from behind him, while the brunt of the attack should come from the front.

And if they don't shoot your gorger, well, then he can easily kill the odd warmachine/crew.

Ganymede
13-09-2006, 14:28
The list is pretty good, it reminds me a lot of my ogre list, though I opt for a giant instead of the maneater pair, and I go for 2x2 leadbelchers instead of 1x3.

druchii
13-09-2006, 22:04
You seem to forget that when your opponent shoots at your gorger, he isn't shooting at your other units. I've had games where I happily 'sacrificed' my gorger to 'protect' my other units. It just means that your opponent has got another scary unit/monster coming from behind him, while the brunt of the attack should come from the front.

And if they don't shoot your gorger, well, then he can easily kill the odd warmachine/crew.

It isn't that I forgot, just that I don't see more than or two units having to "waste" their shooting on him. Most people, if they "know" it's a waste, will ignore him completely (say, there's a juicy shot lined up).

If not, he WILL be soaking up some fire, but his points just seem better spent elsewhere.


The list is pretty good, it reminds me a lot of my ogre list, though I opt for a giant instead of the maneater pair, and I go for 2x2 leadbelchers instead of 1x3.

I thought about dropping the trappers, to add in another leadbelcher to make two units of two.

It'll be something I've got to fiddle around with.

BigJon
14-09-2006, 10:05
May I make a suggestion. I would drop one of the Leadbelchers (Its hard to do because I love them) and pick up a Bruiser Battle Standard Bearer. With almost no combat rez your going to need that BSB from time to time to hold it together during the hot points.

BigJon

druchii
14-09-2006, 22:47
May I make a suggestion. I would drop one of the Leadbelchers (Its hard to do because I love them) and pick up a Bruiser Battle Standard Bearer. With almost no combat rez your going to need that BSB from time to time to hold it together during the hot points.

BigJon


Do you mean drop a leadbelcher(leaving only 2) AND the trappers?
The single belcher is only 55 points, a FAR cry from the cost of a basic BSB(who is a minimum 155).

I thought about getting a BSB, but I unfortunately couldn't see the point. With so few units in which to hide, I'm affraid of the BSB becoming fodder for warmachines and direct challenges.

Although he IS an ogre, a single well placed cannon/stonethrower or a decent combat character will nix that sexy(lol) BSB super-quick.

Not only that, but what would you suggest I drop to make room for him, and how would I even pretend to protect him?

Thanks!
d

Revlid
16-09-2006, 21:19
I have to question the two Butchers with Dispel Scrolls...
Either take one with two Dispel Scrolls, or two and arm them offensivley, with items such as the Halfling's Cookbook, Skullmantle, or Bangstick...
As has been said, 2x2 Leadbelchers are better than 1x3.

druchii
17-09-2006, 08:24
I have to question the two Butchers with Dispel Scrolls...
Either take one with two Dispel Scrolls, or two and arm them offensivley, with items such as the Halfling's Cookbook, Skullmantle, or Bangstick...
As has been said, 2x2 Leadbelchers are better than 1x3.

I thought about that too.
I'm affraid that with only 6 Dispel Dice, I'll be out-magicked.

Artillery, cavalry, magic, and s4+ shooting really scares my big, flabby ogres.
I can't do much about these things (even including the afforementoned gorger seems perilous.). But I CAN respond to magic.

I've seen and experienced what ONE good spell (conflagration of doom, anyone?) can do to a unit of naked bulls, or 5+ ironguts.

While the bangstick is good for a chuckle, do d6 s4 hits REALLY warrant dropping a scroll?

The skullmantle seems almost redundant. I don't plan on skimming by on that one point of Ld. Hopefully I'll be outnumbering and kicking some ass :D

The cookbook seems cute. Although it again, seems somewhat redundant. With the initial gut magic spell healing a wound, In the early parts of the game, I'll be throwing troolguts/toothcracker/bullgorger on units, and hopefully regenerating wounds as the rounds go on.


Of all the above "offensive" items, the bangstick seems the most appealing, being majorly thrown at "scary" units (chaos knights?) and I'll definately have to keep that in mind.

I'm going to ammend the main list, 2x2 leadbelchers seems like sage-advice.
d

ps. Thanks again for all the tweaks.

EDIT:

Also, I'm still wondering; what about swapping out the "Kineater" big name, for a set of Daemon-killer scars? Is the tradeoff in panic test reliability worth terror?

Revlid
17-09-2006, 09:11
I thought about that too.
I'm affraid that with only 6 Dispel Dice, I'll be out-magicked.


Each to their own. I generally find that 6 DD+A Scroll is enough defence, and only wastes 25 points against Dwarfs (rather than 50).


While the bangstick is good for a chuckle, do d6 s4 hits REALLY warrant dropping a scroll?

Yes, imo. A Bound Spell has no risk of a miscast, and forces your opponent to either let you damage his fragile missle units or sacrifice a Dispel Dice (or two, if you're lucky) to stop it, letting Braingobblers, Bonecrunchers and buff spells go through more easily.


The skullmantle seems almost redundant. I don't plan on skimming by on that one point of Ld. Hopefully I'll be outnumbering and kicking some ass :D

Brain. Gobbler.
Brain. Gobbler.
Braingobbler.


The cookbook seems cute. Although it again, seems somewhat redundant. With the initial gut magic spell healing a wound, In the early parts of the game, I'll be throwing troolguts/toothcracker/bullgorger on units, and hopefully regenerating wounds as the rounds go on.

I don't really like the cookbook either, but others seem to...


Of all the above "offensive" items, the bangstick seems the most appealing, being majorly thrown at "scary" units (chaos knights?) and I'll definately have to keep that in mind.

Actually, with only S4 I mainly use it on missle units/skirmishers. More likely to get kills and cause a Panic Test, or at least slow down Ogre Casualties from shooting.



Also, I'm still wondering; what about swapping out the "Kineater" big name, for a set of Daemon-killer scars? Is the tradeoff in panic test reliability worth terror?

No.

druchii
18-09-2006, 01:59
1.Each to their own. I generally find that 6 DD+A Scroll is enough defence, and only wastes 25 points against Dwarfs (rather than 50).

2.Yes, imo. A Bound Spell has no risk of a miscast, and forces your opponent to either let you damage his fragile missle units or sacrifice a Dispel Dice (or two, if you're lucky) to stop it, letting Braingobblers, Bonecrunchers and buff spells go through more easily.

3.Brain. Gobbler.
Brain. Gobbler.
Braingobbler.

4.I don't really like the cookbook either, but others seem to...

5.Actually, with only S4 I mainly use it on missle units/skirmishers. More likely to get kills and cause a Panic Test, or at least slow down Ogre Casualties from shooting.

6.No.

Good thoughts, thanks.
1.It might be a thought process brought on by the people I play(or played) against. Magic seems fairly prevalent, with about 8pd being normal. Although after a few games, I might indeed ditch a scroll.

Oh, and I'm not too concerned about "wasting" dwarves, they're only one army out of a whole batch.

2.Good points, which are always true with bound spells.

3.One is fine, thank you very much
I hadn't thought about that.

4.Dirty halflings.

5. Usually I see the bangstick as a ramshackle unit of leadbelchers. I've initially taken them to scare off those annoying skirmishing flanker units, smaller units of scary stuff, etc.

While the bangstick DOES offer more versatility, and the same function, in a different fashion, it runs into one main opposisition: The skull mantle.

Which would be more viable and versatile? While one enhances the combat power of the butcher and his unit, and the single spell of the said butcher, the other adds another "threat-zone" to the playtable.

I'm torn between them.

6.Why?

Thanks, as always.