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View Full Version : Woodies advice please!



Ixe
12-09-2006, 22:51
Hey all, I was going to play with Dark Eldar ideas after I finished my 40k Sisters of Battle (in like a year :rolleyes:) but I concluded that I couldn't make the army I want without using Lelith Hesperax, and since I can't stomach special characters, DE are out...

Instead, I want to do Woodies! I don't know ANYTHING about them, except what models/theme I like. And that would be wardancers! Is it feasible/powerful/winningable to make a wardancer army with wardancer lord and a bunch of dancers supported by glade guard, eternal guard, and maybe some waywatchers? Or do I have to take smelly ugly treemen and dryads to be effective? Thanks!

pox
13-09-2006, 04:13
I play on a regular basis, and win, with no tree kin and no treemen. however, its VERY hard to match the sheer damage a full unit of dryads can do with a branchraith backing them up. its still very possible to do it with your main melee units of dancers and eternal guard, backed up by as many units of glade guard you can muster. alot of using the wood elves comes with practice and familiarity with the rules, and you would have to exploit these every chance you got. (eg. glade guard upgraded to scouts with the magic standard of saemrath to slow down enemy units and thus maximize shooting, noble with arrow of doom, etc.)

P.S., there insn't a more beutiful army in the citadel range, the minis are a joy to paint.

Nadir
13-09-2006, 05:50
You certainly dont have to take treekin, dryads or treemen. However they are very effective and rather cheap pointswise if you ask me. But if you dont like em, dont use em! And learn to work with what you have, which is a great list nonetheless.

Especially wardancers, they are killers. How do you feel about wild riders? If your gonna use an all-elf list it will be harder than a mixed one, but it could be more rewarding. I was myself thinking about this approach, but instead I left all my models to rot in a box ;)

god octo
13-09-2006, 16:12
i prefer a mixed army, but you could always do an "Asrai" only army, with no forest spirits and lots of elves. Wardancers are evil on the charge, fully capable of beating ranked elite infantry. Also, dont ever underestimate the archers, as their S4 bonus at short range is lethal. :D

jahorin
13-09-2006, 17:01
with wardancer it always fun to chare heavy cavalry and choose the dance of killing blow. it's real fun i assure you :)

i field a mostly asrai army and it's quite fun to play. waywatcher are almost a must in my armies. include a couple of unit of archers and eternal guards you're almost at 2000 pts. you should include glade riders for support to the eternal guard.

@nadir : i don't find it harder to win with an all elf army. it really depends on how build your army and make sure that unit support each other. you don't need a treeman to win with wood elves.

Ixe
13-09-2006, 17:12
Thanks for the advice all. I haven't seen the rules yet, so could someone give me an idea of what wardancers and glade riders do? The book makes wardancers sound very special- they have like 4 or 5 abilities they can use in combat that make them rock, right? And they are skirmishers?

What about glade riders-- the website says they're super special, but are they really anything more than fast cav who ignore terrain? Or do they even ignore terrain?

Alathir
14-09-2006, 04:12
The glade riders are fast cavalry, movement 9 with longbows and spears. They arent exactly 'super special' but they're ability to march and shoot with no moving and shooting penalty makes them very adept at mage hunting. They are also excellent at negating those pesky ranks, something alot of the wood elf army can't do. But what makes them very special and valuable is their ability to simply flee. Almost all of the wood elf combat units are immune to psychology and therefore denied the ability to setup nice counter charges. The glade riders can fill this role excellently. The glade riders dont ignore terrain but they dont suffer any movement penalties when riding through woods like all wood elf models.

Wardancers are walking soulnadoes of doom. weapon skill 6, 2 attacks each, magic resistance 1 and a constant 6+ ward save. They have four seperate battle dances, one gives them an extra attack (which gives their champion 4 attacks!) another dance gives them killing blow which has been the doom of many ironbreakers and knights ive come across. Another gives them a 4+ Ward save in combat, which is awesome if you get charged. And the final dance makes them strike first, but they lose an attack. You can do the same dance twice in a row.

Ixe
14-09-2006, 10:37
Nice! I like it when kickass looking models are really awesome on the table...

I think I either want to make a snowy wood elf army with winter camo colors and snow on their bases and such, or an underground army. The underground is a little more iffy, but I was thinking I might make them be grey skinned wood elf cousins who occupy natural caves under Athel Loren- they could have crystals and mushroms and stuff on their bases... I think snow might turn out nicer, though.

WhiteRaven
15-09-2006, 18:25
I'm just starting Woodies as well. Was just waiting for my copy of 7th before I got down to business.

I really like the idea of those Cavern Elves. It would definitely give them a look that I haven't seen before. And give good credit to the fact that you aren't using Treekin and sticking to Asari.

I think the Winter theme would really stand out especially if you had tree's that were covered in snow. Though I suppose the tree's wouldn't be as prevelant since they are so sluggish in the winter.

Good Luck!
WR

Ixe
16-09-2006, 02:46
After looking at the rules, I'm not so sure about not using tree kin... Then again, I'm not so sure about wood elves at all! They have nothing that's terribly high strength except for dragons and treemen- I can't see an all elf army being able to deal with an enemy demon prince or monster.

One thing that makes me really excited is how awesome a wardancer highborn is. He's like 285 points, but he can get a 3+ ward save, rerolling wounds (great with killing blow!), only hit on 6 in challenges. This is a character that will hand most any other character its ass, but without being beardy as hell like chaos lords or vampire counts. He's all about finesse...

What's so good about hail of doom arrows? 3d6 shots is nice, but only once... I can't get excited about it.

Anyway, I can see myself using a list consisting of wardancers (prolly 2 big units) with wardancer lord, glade guard + dryads, maybe an eternal guard block if I have the points, waywatchers, and a treeman.

Where I'm really stuck is what to do with magic! I really don't even know where to start...

Alathir
16-09-2006, 03:51
Hail of doom is pretty much guaranteed to make disappear any unit of light cavalry or skirmishers disappear. Yeah it's only once, but its 3d6 strength 4 arrows!

Be careful of making your wardancer units too large, if there are too many then they can become too unwieldy.

For magic, it depends if you're going to use a spellweaver in 2k games. However, I usually go for a highborn. Anyway, my basic magic setup that I ALWAYS use is at least two lvl 2 spellsingers, both with a scroll each usually. I dont use branchwraiths as it's not in my theme and I dont suppose you will be either if you're going more with an asrai force. You can of course be real mean and give both your spellsingers two scrolls each. The look on your opponents face as you keep on dishing them out is always priceless.

Montroux
17-09-2006, 17:30
what would you equip your highborn with then?

truthsayer
17-09-2006, 17:36
what would you equip your highborn with then?

Im just looking at what to give mine too. Im thinking Daith's Reaper, Helm of the hunt and the stone of the crystal mere riding an elven steed. let him get to combat, a 3+ armour and 3+ ward is nice as is the helms and reapers combined abilities.

Camrion
19-09-2006, 03:53
Ooo, I'm starting wood elves too and intented a mostly Asrai force. However, I can't deny myself Wild Riders of Kurnous and the basic Asrai feels entirely too shooty.

Plus, how can you deny a 140 pt branchwraith that comes with 2 dispel dice and some hitting power for the dryads?

Camrion

Indrid Khold
19-09-2006, 09:36
P.S., there insn't a more beutiful army in the citadel range, the minis are a joy to paint.

I don't know jack about Wood Elves in game terms, but I just wanted to say amen to that, brother!

I like to play eeeevil armies (I save all my virtue and righteousness for real life ;)), but damned if those purdy Wood Elf figures didn't tempt me for a moment to join the Light Side.

Ixe
19-09-2006, 10:30
Wood elves aren't exactly good guys, their theme seems to be based around berserk xenophobia. They kill everyone who comes into Athel Loren whether they're "good" or not. At least, that's what I got from briefly looking at their book.

Ratchet
19-09-2006, 11:15
What would you arm a highborn on a dragon with? I give mine oaken armour, a shield, helm of the hunt, the 3+ ward save brooch and a spear.

Any other advise?

Sinew
19-09-2006, 14:34
They have nothing that's terribly high strength except for dragons and treemenA lack of strength and toughness is, IMO, a deliberate weakness built in to the Wood Elf list. It is compensated for a very flexible, reliable, maneuverable and psychologically robust force. I fought my regular Dark Elf opponent twice shortly after the WE book came out and he took his highborn of a dragon both times. The first time it tore the heart out of my army, and the game was over by turn 4. I suggested a re-match, and we played with the same armies. In the second game I took him apart as comprehensively as he'd taken me apart in the first game. I didn't kill the dragon, but I marginalised it, never let it choose favourable combats and largely left it without much to fight. I don't think any prospective player should let a lack of high Strenght troops deter him/her from giving WE a try.


I usually go for a highbornReally? I'm very interested in this decision, because after pooring over my WE book for hours the only character I can't seem to find a place for is a Highborn. I'd really like to field one, but I can't see any reason to unless it's to get a Dragon on the table. What do you usually take for your Highborn, and why do you find him better than, say, a Noble?

Going back to the central point of the thread, can you make a WE list work without too much 'wood'? I think you can, although Dryads and Wardancers are different troops and shouldn't be treated as like-for-likes. Treekin I could easily do without (although I like and field them, I can see they can easily be replaced) and even Treemen are not mandatory but I couldn't play without the lovely Dryads. If I didn't take any, I'd play a much faster more evasive force, built around Wild Riders, Eagle Riding Nobles and try to avoid having too much stuff on foot. Dryads are great troubleshooters, and without them I'd want to field troops that could really decide when and where to fight.

Ixe
19-09-2006, 15:42
I've been thinking about it, and I've decided that the main weakness of an Arsai only list is monsters. Without immune to psych dryads to negate terror and keep them tied up in combat, and without treemen to give them what-for in close combat, you're sort of stuck. WE can have killing blow up the yin yang with wardancers and waywatchers, but that won't do a bit of good against monsters.

I see two ways to deal with monsters- 1 is to use monsters yourself, like a highborn on a dragon or an ancient treeman, with a treeman or two in support. WE monsters are great because they have ward saves, something a lot of other big dudes lack. The other option is what's mentioned above, which is using immune to psych units to keep them busy. Dryads work very well for this because they are so manueverable as skirmishers- Eternal Guard with a noble leading them would also work because they're stubborn, but you'd have to dupe the monsters into charging them and plodding through the unit for the whole game.

In the end, I don't see a WE force getting by without any monsters, but here's a mostly Arsai list I made- would it work?

Wardancer Highborn- Blades of Loec, Amaranthine Brooch, Annoyance of Nettlings

2x10 Wardancers
1x11 Wardancers (to make up the last 18 pts)

5 Treekin

3x5 Glade Riders

2x5 Waywatchers

2x L2 Spellsinger, 2 dispel scrolls each

The idea is for the wardancers and lord to walk all over an enemy that is march-stopped and harassed by waywatchers and glade riders. The treekin are there to deal with big nasties that aren't really vulnerable to wardancers. I'm really not sure about it, but it seems like an army that would be a lot of fun to paint anyway...

god octo
19-09-2006, 19:24
if you were doing a winter army, you could include dryads, as they are the last spirits to fall into slumber and there is a section of fluff that speaks of "Dark dryads of winter"

Kahadras
19-09-2006, 20:27
Really? I'm very interested in this decision, because after pooring over my WE book for hours the only character I can't seem to find a place for is a Highborn. I'd really like to field one, but I can't see any reason to unless it's to get a Dragon on the table. What do you usually take for your Highborn, and why do you find him better than, say, a Noble?

I dunno. Stick him in a unit of Eternal Guard and give him a great weapon, Amber Pendant, the Helm of the Hunt and a Murder of Spites. Then charge an enemy unit. He gets 5 strength 5 attacks (always striking first) followed by D6 poisoned attacks with a strength of 2. That should make a real mess of the enemy unit then you get the attacks from the Eternal guard on top of that.

Kahadras