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downundercadet07
14-09-2006, 14:00
Hello,

I've played 40k for about 3 years, with tau and biel-tan being my two armies. My dad retired recently, and is thinking about getting into the game. I'd like to have a partner to play against whenever I'm home, so it is good in that respect, but I will probably have to put the army together. Sooo,

I'm thinking about putting together a Crimson Fists army. Mostly because they are rarely seen (at least around where I live), and they have a cool paint scheme. I would like to know if anyone has any advice about fluff inspired army composition, and the good first things to buy for a seed of an army. Right now I know that the Crimson Fists--

Are still pretty small
Have alot of specialists
Are a successor chapter of the Imperial Fists
Send alot of people into the deathwatch
Have a mild dislike for orks

Also-- If an army is painted to a really high standard, would you be opposed to someone who played (not all the time, just for variety) one SM army with the rules of another chapter? I want for him to be able to do that if he decides to play at the clubs around town.

Carnelian
14-09-2006, 14:03
No one could mind you using crimson fist miniatures with vanilla space marine rules. This would allow him the flexibility of choosing his own traits.
It might be a bit more risky if he wanted to use crimson fists to represent Blood Angels or Space Wolves as these have specific miniatures (death company etc.) Still, so long as he asked I'm sure no-one would mind him proxying these models/

UltimateNagash
14-09-2006, 14:05
Hold on, so what you're saying is:

Paint the chapter as one chapter.
Use rules of another.

If your doing that, I say that's OK.

downundercadet07
14-09-2006, 14:20
Alright, good to know. For traits I'm sure that suffer not the alien to live would be a good one (and fun to convert for) but do you think that he should go with the one that lets you take more veterans or more apocatheries? I think that both of them fit the background of the chapter, as I think that most of the survivors were from the first company right?

HQ-- Gotta be a Deathwatch squad, mostly of ex-fists. Conversion ideas?

dean
14-09-2006, 21:12
Firstly look into the Imperial fists metal shoulder pads from mail order and the Imp fist vehicle add ons from forge world. Once upon a time there was a set of Imperial fist Terminator arms. As for the survivors, they were from many different companies but I think they were mostly from the Edit: I cant confirm what company the survivors came from. Anybody have the IA article? I think I said that the current numbers for the chapter are in the 300s with nobody in the first company at this time, or rather all the current members of the 1st are spread throughout the chapter for training puposes.

jfrazell
14-09-2006, 22:01
Why don't you discuss it with him. What would he like to play?

marv335
14-09-2006, 22:11
hmm,
the crimson fists got hosed in this edition with their traits.
(they get to pay points for preferred enemy:orks, and for this upgrade they lose one elite, one fast attack, and one heavy support choice.)
i use them, but i just use them vanilla. i wouldn't use traits on a chapter of legend except for the listed ones

downundercadet07
15-09-2006, 02:14
Thats true marv. Really it will be his choice in the end. But since I have to paint most of the army, there are going to be plenty of veteran squads and a deathwatch squad no matter what!

He considered Guard, but then decided to go with Marines when he found out a little bit more about the Guard tanks.

LordSolar
15-09-2006, 02:28
why? there is nothing wrong with guard tanks they have one thing that marines dont have an abundance of PIE PLATES btw how many people here consider AC guard list chessy i for one dont

n00bLord
15-09-2006, 02:33
I think he is referring to the price of tanks. Well let him choose for himself, but make sure he researches his army.

LordSolar
15-09-2006, 02:41
what are you talking about nOObLord a leman russ cost the exact same as a predator and much less than a land raider

n00bLord
15-09-2006, 03:20
Model count. 1 tank vs 20 guardsmen. Take your pick with the mindset of not being a hobbyist who has cash to blow.

Outlaw289
15-09-2006, 03:44
If he's gonna get an army he's not gonna be in retirement for long! :p

Crimson Fists would be good. If he's gonna have a "fluff" force, he'll need lots of Scouts, Veterans, and a smattering of Devastators. Very few Dreads and Tanks.

However, you'd be better of making a generic force (a little bit of everything army) with C-Fist colors. Good all around list for your dad to break the ice with.

GrimZAG
15-09-2006, 07:48
An army for dad?

Why don't you discuss it with him. What would he like to play?

Exactly

Mojaco
15-09-2006, 12:10
Crimson fists nerfed? Only for tournaments maybe. The traits do fit perfectly with the background. Just use those traits. Great opportunity for orky convertions.

St.Germaine
15-09-2006, 12:28
Mojaco's right. There are WAY too many people out there who missed the point of the traits. I hear comments about how the "CF got nerfed by the traits system" and it's clear that all they're looking at is how effective are the rules going to be for "MY" army. GW has pissed me off a lot lately but I have to stand clearly in their corner on this one. The CFs have a given history in the 40K universe and the chosen traits match up to that history perfectly.

marv335
15-09-2006, 12:55
the crimson fists have rebuilt their chapter strength.
the rynns world tragedy was quite some time ago.

Llothlian
15-09-2006, 13:38
How can anybody say that in game terms CF haven't been screwed? If you are facing any army except orcs (which aren't very common anyway) all you get for your points you HAVE to pay is -3 force org slots. Ya, sounds great.

Sure, it fits the background, but why **** a chapter just to fit the background?

Brother_Bethor
15-09-2006, 19:06
As for the survivors, they were from many different companies but I think they were mostly from the Edit: I cant confirm what company the survivors came from. Anybody have the IA article?

The article does only say that the survivors were less than a company. It doesn't state which it was.

downundercadet07
15-09-2006, 22:24
Thanks for everyone's feedback.

What I meant about the tanks was that when he watched a few games at a local club, and saw how weak tanks were, he decided to go with a no-tank force. That eliminated most armies (I had already ruled out nids and orks, because I wanted to do a human army for once) and left it down to SAFH guard and footslogger marines. He was on the brink between Blood Angels and Crimson fists, but I think that he will go with Crimson fists.

About being screwed or whatnot by the traits-- The most common army that he will fight is me, so I don't think that it is going to be that big of a deal. I'm not so much of a powergamer that I would bring my starcannon death army against the pater familias.